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Posted to users@tapestry.apache.org by Daniel Honig <da...@gmail.com> on 2005/02/11 03:58:39 UTC

Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown presentation needed

I'm going to have to put together a Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown 
presentation in the short future and I know this is something other 
people have done.  If you'd be willing to send what you have along you 
can e-mail them to daniel.honig@gmail.com, I'm sure there has been 
plenty of banter on this list so no need to really start a new thread....



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Re: Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown presentation needed

Posted by Daniel Honig <da...@gmail.com>.
Couldn't agree more with all of your comments.  Thank you very much Eric.


On Fri, 11 Feb 2005 05:34:00 -0500, Erik Hatcher
<er...@ehatchersolutions.com> wrote:
> 
> On Feb 10, 2005, at 9:58 PM, Daniel Honig wrote:
> 
> > I'm going to have to put together a Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown
> > presentation in the short future and I know this is something other
> > people have done.  If you'd be willing to send what you have along you
> > can e-mail them to daniel.honig@gmail.com, I'm sure there has been
> > plenty of banter on this list so no need to really start a new
> > thread....
> 
> Hopefully this isn't the start of a long nasty thread...  For fun I
> added the following bullet points to a "Struts 101" titled slide as a
> joke as I started a Tapestry presentation:
> 
>         * "Object" oriented
>         * Hey, it's MY model, not yours!
>         * Reusable components: taglibs
>         * I love XDoclet :)
>         * @deprecated
> 
> By "object" oriented (facetiously) I mean that Struts prefers you split
> actions and data (Action and ActionForm), thus splitting what true OO
> is all about (encapsulation of data and behavior).  Sure, it can be
> hacked to be together but it goes against the grain.  Similarly, Struts
> wants your "model" as ActionForm beans - it doesn't want your real
> model.  Everything needs to be a String (or boolean) for the
> presentation tier (hence my rants against TextField requiring a
> String!).
> 
> Taglibs are essentially parameterized includes, not true components in
> the Tapestry sense.
> 
> Ah, and we're back to XDoclet - again its a nice solution for an ugly
> problem.  I'd rather not have it in the picture at all.
> 
> And most importantly for teams considering using Struts - why?  It is
> basically deprecated.  Choose a more vibrant framework.  Even the
> Struts folks are going to JSF and using the Struts project as a way to
> fill in the gaps and enhance JSF.
> 
>         Erik
> 
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>

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Re: Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown presentation needed

Posted by Erik Hatcher <er...@ehatchersolutions.com>.
On Feb 10, 2005, at 9:58 PM, Daniel Honig wrote:

> I'm going to have to put together a Tapestry Vs. Struts smackdown 
> presentation in the short future and I know this is something other 
> people have done.  If you'd be willing to send what you have along you 
> can e-mail them to daniel.honig@gmail.com, I'm sure there has been 
> plenty of banter on this list so no need to really start a new 
> thread....

Hopefully this isn't the start of a long nasty thread...  For fun I 
added the following bullet points to a "Struts 101" titled slide as a 
joke as I started a Tapestry presentation:

	* "Object" oriented
	* Hey, it's MY model, not yours!
	* Reusable components: taglibs
	* I love XDoclet :)
	* @deprecated

By "object" oriented (facetiously) I mean that Struts prefers you split 
actions and data (Action and ActionForm), thus splitting what true OO 
is all about (encapsulation of data and behavior).  Sure, it can be 
hacked to be together but it goes against the grain.  Similarly, Struts 
wants your "model" as ActionForm beans - it doesn't want your real 
model.  Everything needs to be a String (or boolean) for the 
presentation tier (hence my rants against TextField requiring a 
String!).

Taglibs are essentially parameterized includes, not true components in 
the Tapestry sense.

Ah, and we're back to XDoclet - again its a nice solution for an ugly 
problem.  I'd rather not have it in the picture at all.

And most importantly for teams considering using Struts - why?  It is 
basically deprecated.  Choose a more vibrant framework.  Even the 
Struts folks are going to JSF and using the Struts project as a way to 
fill in the gaps and enhance JSF.

	Erik


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