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Posted to dev@struts.apache.org by Vic Cekvenich <ce...@portalvu.com> on 2004/06/27 20:02:09 UTC
nominate ?
There are knowledgeable people currently active on user list, people
that wrote books, tutorials and papers, people that are writing
frameworks and extensions on Struts, should you want more activity, if
the current commit-ers are busy.
It's the right thing to do, I can think of about 10 one could nominate,
this would increase the patch activity I think. At least one could start
nurturing people. Many people active in the past are not active now,
such as David W.
Also, I know current developers don't think so, but * preception* is
that patches get ignored.
.V
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Michael Rassmussen <ra...@gmail.com>.
Just to add a little tidbit here, for anyone using eclipse,
downloading maven and the mavenide plugin (found on
eclipseplugincentral.com) will make your maven build unbelievably
simple. You just install it, point it to the maven idirectory in its
preferences, right click on the project.xml file and click run. It
just goes. Gets everything and builds correctly. Couldn't be easier.
I think similar plugins exist for other IDEs. Well worth checking
out if you have moved beyond vi/emacs.
Michael
On Mon, 28 Jun 2004 08:08:52 -0700, Michael McGrady
<mi...@michaelmcgrady.com> wrote:
>
> I too would be happy to help if someone were to guide me through the Maven
> process and take a little time to get me past the "admin" stuff.
>
>
> At 06:51 AM 6/28/2004, Mark Lowe wrote:
> >Okay joe I'm compiled, maven seemed to keep me in ignorant bliss while
> >downloading all the dependancies. I must have last tried when the
> >validator stuff was still in the way.
> >
> >
> >Thanks
> >
> >Mark
> >
> >On 28 Jun 2004, at 13:42, Joe Germuska wrote:
> >
> >>At 10:59 AM +0200 6/28/04, Mark Lowe wrote:
> >>>Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph and
> >>>I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the silly
> >>>amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is installed, and
> >>>I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear instructions on how
> >>>to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in. Regrettably the
> >>>building struts had become more difficult than submitting patches.
> >>
> >>I have put the commons-validator-1.1.3.jar on cvs.apache.org, the
> >>"nightly builds" repository. This means that as of now, you should
> >>simply be able to run maven and do a build with no other preparation.
> >>
> >>So, if it's a standard maven build, do you need more instructions? If
> >>not, can you give it a try and confirm that there aren't any other
> >>configuration things that I may have done a while ago but am forgetting
> >>to mention now?
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >> Joe
> >>
> >>--
> >>Joe Germuska Joe@Germuska.com http://blog.germuska.com
> >>"In fact, when I die, if I don't hear 'A Love Supreme,' I'll turn back;
> >>I'll know I'm in the wrong place."
> >> - Carlos Santana
> >>
> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >>For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> >
> >
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> >
> >
>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Michael McGrady <mi...@michaelmcgrady.com>.
I too would be happy to help if someone were to guide me through the Maven
process and take a little time to get me past the "admin" stuff.
At 06:51 AM 6/28/2004, Mark Lowe wrote:
>Okay joe I'm compiled, maven seemed to keep me in ignorant bliss while
>downloading all the dependancies. I must have last tried when the
>validator stuff was still in the way.
>
>
>Thanks
>
>Mark
>
>On 28 Jun 2004, at 13:42, Joe Germuska wrote:
>
>>At 10:59 AM +0200 6/28/04, Mark Lowe wrote:
>>>Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph and
>>>I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the silly
>>>amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is installed, and
>>>I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear instructions on how
>>>to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in. Regrettably the
>>>building struts had become more difficult than submitting patches.
>>
>>I have put the commons-validator-1.1.3.jar on cvs.apache.org, the
>>"nightly builds" repository. This means that as of now, you should
>>simply be able to run maven and do a build with no other preparation.
>>
>>So, if it's a standard maven build, do you need more instructions? If
>>not, can you give it a try and confirm that there aren't any other
>>configuration things that I may have done a while ago but am forgetting
>>to mention now?
>>
>>Thanks
>> Joe
>>
>>--
>>Joe Germuska Joe@Germuska.com http://blog.germuska.com
>>"In fact, when I die, if I don't hear 'A Love Supreme,' I'll turn back;
>>I'll know I'm in the wrong place."
>> - Carlos Santana
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>>For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>
>
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>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Mark Lowe <ma...@boxstuff.com>.
Okay joe I'm compiled, maven seemed to keep me in ignorant bliss while
downloading all the dependancies. I must have last tried when the
validator stuff was still in the way.
Thanks
Mark
On 28 Jun 2004, at 13:42, Joe Germuska wrote:
> At 10:59 AM +0200 6/28/04, Mark Lowe wrote:
>> Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph
>> and I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the
>> silly amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is
>> installed, and I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear
>> instructions on how to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in.
>> Regrettably the building struts had become more difficult than
>> submitting patches.
>
> I have put the commons-validator-1.1.3.jar on cvs.apache.org, the
> "nightly builds" repository. This means that as of now, you should
> simply be able to run maven and do a build with no other preparation.
>
> So, if it's a standard maven build, do you need more instructions? If
> not, can you give it a try and confirm that there aren't any other
> configuration things that I may have done a while ago but am
> forgetting to mention now?
>
> Thanks
> Joe
>
> --
> Joe Germuska Joe@Germuska.com http://blog.germuska.com
> "In fact, when I die, if I don't hear 'A Love Supreme,' I'll turn
> back; I'll know I'm in the wrong place."
> - Carlos Santana
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Joe Germuska <Jo...@Germuska.com>.
At 10:59 AM +0200 6/28/04, Mark Lowe wrote:
>Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph
>and I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the
>silly amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is
>installed, and I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear
>instructions on how to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in.
>Regrettably the building struts had become more difficult than
>submitting patches.
I have put the commons-validator-1.1.3.jar on cvs.apache.org, the
"nightly builds" repository. This means that as of now, you should
simply be able to run maven and do a build with no other preparation.
So, if it's a standard maven build, do you need more instructions?
If not, can you give it a try and confirm that there aren't any other
configuration things that I may have done a while ago but am
forgetting to mention now?
Thanks
Joe
--
Joe Germuska
Joe@Germuska.com
http://blog.germuska.com
"In fact, when I die, if I don't hear 'A Love Supreme,' I'll turn
back; I'll know I'm in the wrong place."
- Carlos Santana
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Building Struts with Maven (was Re: nominate ?)
Posted by Joe Germuska <Jo...@Germuska.com>.
As one of the people interested in making Maven work for Struts, I'll
just jump in here.
First, it's true that Ant is "the official" build tool for Struts
1.2.x -- it's the thing to use to make releases, etc, and nothing
should be committed that breaks it.
That said, once you have Maven going, you can certainly use it to
compile a Struts JAR that is equally usable to one built by Ant.
Also, as far as I can tell, the Cactus tests run equally well in
Maven -- I have some problems running tests that use cookies in both
Ant and Maven, and have never gotten any feedback from any other
users about it. (To run Cactus tests with Maven, you do have to set
some of the properties in build.properties.)
>Maven disadvantages (to me)
>>>From a 'nurturing the community' perspective, the cost of 'converting' vs.
>the cost of 'starting from scratch' can be more than we can afford right
>now. We seemed to have a lot more participation before the attempt to
>Mavenize began.
I can't believe that the presence of Maven files has scared people
away. I don't have a better explanation for why participation seems
lower than before (not sure I share the perception either) but the
Ant stuff hasn't gone away and hasn't been deprecated.
>I know I've found myself in several "states of mind" (if you will) when
>considering making changes/patches:
> - I don't want to make changes that could break the Maven build.
> - I know how to do foo in Ant, but what is the Maven equivalent?
> - If I add something to the Maven build process, will I get it correct on
>the Ant side?
>
>I absolutely HATE the feeling of intimidation by my lack of knowledge of the
>toolset and rather than pull my hair out learning yet 'another neat tool'
>(pun indented) I (like others I'm sure) find myself fading into the
>background and do simple things here and there where I can.
Even as resident Maven apologist, none of these should be concerns.
Maven is not yet the official build tool for Struts, and it won't be
until it does everything the current Ant build does and there is no
reason for concerns like this. Some might argue that Maven also
shouldn't be official until they finally cut a 1.0 release -- I
wouldn't make that argument, but I might not fight it very vigorously
either. The only thing which is fragile (and which I think has
broken again since last winter when I got it working) is using Maven
to run the Cactus tests. But still, I should hope that no one is
letting that slow them down.
Finally, remember that Maven can run any Ant task. The "maven.xml"
file in the project root directory can be extended with custom goals
which can be nearly 100% direct copies of stuff from a build.xml
file. In fact, given that we have build.xml broken into multiple
files, you could probably simply use an antcall task in maven.xml and
not even copy anything.
But still, I consider Maven a "shortcut" for people who want to work
with the source and build it, but who aren't necessarily interested
in making official releases, building the Struts web site, etc. (I
would like to see it get closer to that, but I haven't had much time
to put into it myself.)
That said, I don't see any reason why someone who wants to submit
patches can't do develop them using Maven instead of Ant.
Joe
--
Joe Germuska
Joe@Germuska.com
http://blog.germuska.com
"In fact, when I die, if I don't hear 'A Love Supreme,' I'll turn
back; I'll know I'm in the wrong place."
- Carlos Santana
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>.
Sorry, I failed to mention that I run $ant dist prior to running Tomcat.
--
James Mitchell
Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
EdgeTech, Inc.
678.910.8017
AIM: jmitchtx
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Mitchell" <jm...@apache.org>
To: "Struts Developers List" <de...@struts.apache.org>
Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 8:46 AM
Subject: Re: nominate ?
> I can sympathize.
>
> Our build/test process for Struts is pretty complex, and began (i think)
> while maven was just a twinkle in someone's eye;) At this point, I (just
me
> talking) am ignoring the Maven side of things for now. Our Maven setup
> comes no where close to what the regular ant build script does. So if you
> want to go that route for building/testing, that is what I (and I'm sure
> others) are doing.
>
> Here's a very brief overview of what I do:
> I use Eclipse to get the latest from CVS, and setup the project with only
> the following for source paths:
> /src/share
> /src/test
> /src/examples
> /src/example
>
> I tell Eclipse to build to (default output folder):
> /target/example/WEB-INF/classes/
>
> If I want to test things in Tomcat, I add this at the bottom of the
> server.xml (just above the ending </Host>)
>
> <Context path="struts-example"
> docBase="D:/home/jmitchell/cvs/jakarta-struts/target/example" debug="0"/>
> <Context path="struts-examples"
> docBase="D:/home/jmitchell/cvs/jakarta-struts/target/examples" debug="0"/>
>
> I use cygwin, like so:
> $ cd /cygdrive/d/home/jmitchell/apache_home/jakarta-tomcat-5.0.25/bin
> $ ./catalina.sh jpda start
> $ tail -f ../logs/catalina.out
>
> This allows me to debug (hot replacement and everything) the app so I can
> try new stuff without the 5 minute wait for Ant to rebuild/redeploy.
>
> I have to change the output folder for the project to run one example app
or
> the other. I'm sure there is a better way to do that, but it works for
me.
>
> Maven disadvantages (to me)
> From a 'nurturing the community' perspective, the cost of 'converting' vs.
> the cost of 'starting from scratch' can be more than we can afford right
> now. We seemed to have a lot more participation before the attempt to
> Mavenize began.
>
> I know I've found myself in several "states of mind" (if you will) when
> considering making changes/patches:
> - I don't want to make changes that could break the Maven build.
> - I know how to do foo in Ant, but what is the Maven equivalent?
> - If I add something to the Maven build process, will I get it correct on
> the Ant side?
>
> I absolutely HATE the feeling of intimidation by my lack of knowledge of
the
> toolset and rather than pull my hair out learning yet 'another neat tool'
> (pun indented) I (like others I'm sure) find myself fading into the
> background and do simple things here and there where I can.
>
> Maven advantages (to me)
> To Maven's credit, the concept is simply brilliant. You create a single
(or
> shared as commons does) config file(s) and all of a sudden, you can "build
> from scratch" in 2 minutes instead of an hour, which is about what it
takes
> if you have to manually download and setup jar references, etc). Lately,
I
> am "getting to know" Maven over on jakarta-commons-sandbox/resources.
>
> As detailed above, Maven acceptance seems easier (to me) if the project
was
> created with Maven in mind. No special hacks or workarounds are needed.
It
> seems straight-forward and simple.
>
>
> Thanks for letting me vent ;)
>
> --
> James Mitchell
> Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
> EdgeTech, Inc.
> 678.910.8017
> AIM: jmitchtx
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Lowe" <ma...@boxstuff.com>
> To: "Struts Developers List" <de...@struts.apache.org>
> Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 4:59 AM
> Subject: Re: nominate ?
>
>
> > Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph and
> > I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the silly
> > amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is installed,
> > and I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear instructions on
> > how to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in. Regrettably the
> > building struts had become more difficult than submitting patches.
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > On 27 Jun 2004, at 20:02, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
> >
> > > There are knowledgeable people currently active on user list, people
> > > that wrote books, tutorials and papers, people that are writing
> > > frameworks and extensions on Struts, should you want more activity, if
> > > the current commit-ers are busy.
> > > It's the right thing to do, I can think of about 10 one could
> > > nominate, this would increase the patch activity I think. At least one
> > > could start nurturing people. Many people active in the past are not
> > > active now, such as David W.
> > > Also, I know current developers don't think so, but * preception* is
> > > that patches get ignored.
> > >
> > > .V
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
>
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> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>
>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by James Mitchell <jm...@apache.org>.
I can sympathize.
Our build/test process for Struts is pretty complex, and began (i think)
while maven was just a twinkle in someone's eye;) At this point, I (just me
talking) am ignoring the Maven side of things for now. Our Maven setup
comes no where close to what the regular ant build script does. So if you
want to go that route for building/testing, that is what I (and I'm sure
others) are doing.
Here's a very brief overview of what I do:
I use Eclipse to get the latest from CVS, and setup the project with only
the following for source paths:
/src/share
/src/test
/src/examples
/src/example
I tell Eclipse to build to (default output folder):
/target/example/WEB-INF/classes/
If I want to test things in Tomcat, I add this at the bottom of the
server.xml (just above the ending </Host>)
<Context path="struts-example"
docBase="D:/home/jmitchell/cvs/jakarta-struts/target/example" debug="0"/>
<Context path="struts-examples"
docBase="D:/home/jmitchell/cvs/jakarta-struts/target/examples" debug="0"/>
I use cygwin, like so:
$ cd /cygdrive/d/home/jmitchell/apache_home/jakarta-tomcat-5.0.25/bin
$ ./catalina.sh jpda start
$ tail -f ../logs/catalina.out
This allows me to debug (hot replacement and everything) the app so I can
try new stuff without the 5 minute wait for Ant to rebuild/redeploy.
I have to change the output folder for the project to run one example app or
the other. I'm sure there is a better way to do that, but it works for me.
Maven disadvantages (to me)
>From a 'nurturing the community' perspective, the cost of 'converting' vs.
the cost of 'starting from scratch' can be more than we can afford right
now. We seemed to have a lot more participation before the attempt to
Mavenize began.
I know I've found myself in several "states of mind" (if you will) when
considering making changes/patches:
- I don't want to make changes that could break the Maven build.
- I know how to do foo in Ant, but what is the Maven equivalent?
- If I add something to the Maven build process, will I get it correct on
the Ant side?
I absolutely HATE the feeling of intimidation by my lack of knowledge of the
toolset and rather than pull my hair out learning yet 'another neat tool'
(pun indented) I (like others I'm sure) find myself fading into the
background and do simple things here and there where I can.
Maven advantages (to me)
To Maven's credit, the concept is simply brilliant. You create a single (or
shared as commons does) config file(s) and all of a sudden, you can "build
from scratch" in 2 minutes instead of an hour, which is about what it takes
if you have to manually download and setup jar references, etc). Lately, I
am "getting to know" Maven over on jakarta-commons-sandbox/resources.
As detailed above, Maven acceptance seems easier (to me) if the project was
created with Maven in mind. No special hacks or workarounds are needed. It
seems straight-forward and simple.
Thanks for letting me vent ;)
--
James Mitchell
Software Engineer / Open Source Evangelist
EdgeTech, Inc.
678.910.8017
AIM: jmitchtx
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Lowe" <ma...@boxstuff.com>
To: "Struts Developers List" <de...@struts.apache.org>
Sent: Monday, June 28, 2004 4:59 AM
Subject: Re: nominate ?
> Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph and
> I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the silly
> amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is installed,
> and I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear instructions on
> how to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in. Regrettably the
> building struts had become more difficult than submitting patches.
>
> Mark
>
> On 27 Jun 2004, at 20:02, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
>
> > There are knowledgeable people currently active on user list, people
> > that wrote books, tutorials and papers, people that are writing
> > frameworks and extensions on Struts, should you want more activity, if
> > the current commit-ers are busy.
> > It's the right thing to do, I can think of about 10 one could
> > nominate, this would increase the patch activity I think. At least one
> > could start nurturing people. Many people active in the past are not
> > active now, such as David W.
> > Also, I know current developers don't think so, but * preception* is
> > that patches get ignored.
> >
> > .V
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>
>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Mark Lowe <ma...@boxstuff.com>.
Give me some pointers on building struts with all that maven gumph and
I'd get involved with patch submission. I just haven't had the silly
amount of time required to configure everything. Maven is installed,
and I've the source checked out. Point me to some clear instructions on
how to get the f&^%er built and I'd gladly pitch in. Regrettably the
building struts had become more difficult than submitting patches.
Mark
On 27 Jun 2004, at 20:02, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
> There are knowledgeable people currently active on user list, people
> that wrote books, tutorials and papers, people that are writing
> frameworks and extensions on Struts, should you want more activity, if
> the current commit-ers are busy.
> It's the right thing to do, I can think of about 10 one could
> nominate, this would increase the patch activity I think. At least one
> could start nurturing people. Many people active in the past are not
> active now, such as David W.
> Also, I know current developers don't think so, but * preception* is
> that patches get ignored.
>
> .V
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
>
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Re: nominate ?
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
I would agree that both the reality and perception is that patches for enhancements are not often applied. But, throwing bodies at the problem is not the solution. People have to *want* to work on a project like Struts. Really, really, want it, and be willing to work for it. Candidates have to be ready and able to do what needs to be done and to make the time to do it. If someone were eager to have more of the enhancement patches applied, they'd be posting patches or "works for me" comments to the reports and cross-posting arguments on DEV as to why we should apply them. Anyone who did that, and who's been an active member of the community for six months or more, would definitely be (and have been) nominated.
In the past, when we have nominated people who did not follow this mold, they helped for a while, but soon fell away. Committers cannot be made, Committers must make themselves.
I'm sure moving to a Maven development environment will help increase participation. Now that Commons 1.1.3 is rolled, we can do Struts 1.2.1. With a stable release out the door, we can start on the reorganization for the 1.3.x series, which will be optimized for Maven and lighter-weight subproject releases.
Personally, I think creating subprojects will help even more than Maven. As it stands, moving the development of Struts 1.x forward is an exercise in frustration. We're being strangled by a gossamer web of dependencies.
-Ted.
On Sun, 27 Jun 2004 13:02:09 -0500, Vic Cekvenich wrote:
> There are knowledgeable people currently active on user list,
> people that wrote books, tutorials and papers, people that are
> writing frameworks and extensions on Struts, should you want more
> activity, if the current commit-ers are busy.
> It's the right thing to do, I can think of about 10 one could
> nominate, this would increase the patch activity I think. At least
> one could start nurturing people. Many people active in the past
> are not active now, such as David W.
> Also, I know current developers don't think so, but * preception*
> is that patches get ignored.
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