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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> on 2011/08/24 00:09:41 UTC
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re: [Discussion]
dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
On 2011-08-23 3:37 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> Does it matter? The English list is getting very little traffic.
There were 56 posts to users@openoffice.org in the last week. Traffic is highest after a new
release. Here is a list by month for 2011: Jan 409 Feb 290 Mar 366 Apr 197 May
218 Jun 233 Jul 123 Aug 160
> A note was sent today asking about interest. I've seen zero affirmative
> responses.
You have now. How much response do you expect in six hours (working hours in NA) ?
> So I don't think any of the lists will get much traffic.
> But it makes sense to JFDI and move on to more important things.
They will when you have a new release.
I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
_________________________________
Larry I. Gusaas
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." - Edgard Varese
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re:
[Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Tue, 2011-08-23 at 19:38 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 7:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
> > On Tue, 2011-08-23 at 18:21 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> >> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > On 2011-08-23 3:37 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Does it matter? The English list is getting very little traffic.
> >> >
> >> > There were 56 posts to users@openoffice.org in the last week. Traffic is
> >> > highest after a new release. Here is a list by month for 2011: Jan 409
> >> > Feb 290 Mar 366 Apr 197 May 218 Jun 233 Jul 123 Aug 160
> >> >
> >>
> >> So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
> >> alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
> >> thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
> >>
> >> >> A note was sent today asking about interest. I've seen zero affirmative
> >> >> responses.
> >> >
> >> > You have now. How much response do you expect in six hours (working hours in
> >> > NA) ?
> >> >
> >>
> >> So that is one.
> >>
> >> >> So I don't think any of the lists will get much traffic.
> >> >> But it makes sense to JFDI and move on to more important things.
> >> >
> >> > They will when you have a new release.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Forums will still dominate.
> >>
> >> > I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
> >> >
> >>
> >> That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
> >>
> >> I think we have similar goals.
> >
> > Finally - actually I do not know what you goals are and more importantly
> > I do not know what the overall goal of what is happening here is.
> >
> > That is not rhetorical, are we just sunsetting the OO.o project are we
> > setting up to become OSS-Symphony or are we building a user facing
> > product...it makes a difference as to what needs to be done now.
> >
>
> Honestly?
Yes honestly would be good.
> We're bikeshedding while waiting for the SVN dump to be
> loaded. But we should probably use this time to get Bugzilla migrated
> to Apache, since we're going to be hurting if we don't have that in a
> few more weeks.
Agreed.
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re:
[Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 7:25 PM, drew <dr...@baseanswers.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 2011-08-23 at 18:21 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
>> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On 2011-08-23 3:37 PM Rob Weir wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Does it matter? The English list is getting very little traffic.
>> >
>> > There were 56 posts to users@openoffice.org in the last week. Traffic is
>> > highest after a new release. Here is a list by month for 2011: Jan 409
>> > Feb 290 Mar 366 Apr 197 May 218 Jun 233 Jul 123 Aug 160
>> >
>>
>> So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
>> alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
>> thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
>>
>> >> A note was sent today asking about interest. I've seen zero affirmative
>> >> responses.
>> >
>> > You have now. How much response do you expect in six hours (working hours in
>> > NA) ?
>> >
>>
>> So that is one.
>>
>> >> So I don't think any of the lists will get much traffic.
>> >> But it makes sense to JFDI and move on to more important things.
>> >
>> > They will when you have a new release.
>> >
>>
>> Forums will still dominate.
>>
>> > I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
>> >
>>
>> That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
>>
>> I think we have similar goals.
>
> Finally - actually I do not know what you goals are and more importantly
> I do not know what the overall goal of what is happening here is.
>
> That is not rhetorical, are we just sunsetting the OO.o project are we
> setting up to become OSS-Symphony or are we building a user facing
> product...it makes a difference as to what needs to be done now.
>
Honestly? We're bikeshedding while waiting for the SVN dump to be
loaded. But we should probably use this time to get Bugzilla migrated
to Apache, since we're going to be hurting if we don't have that in a
few more weeks.
Of course, it is worth having a discussion about high importance/lower
urgency things, like our long term support strategy, but that should
probably occur in its own thread.
>
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re:
[Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by drew <dr...@baseanswers.com>.
On Tue, 2011-08-23 at 18:21 -0400, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On 2011-08-23 3:37 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> >>
> >> Does it matter? The English list is getting very little traffic.
> >
> > There were 56 posts to users@openoffice.org in the last week. Traffic is
> > highest after a new release. Here is a list by month for 2011: Jan 409
> > Feb 290 Mar 366 Apr 197 May 218 Jun 233 Jul 123 Aug 160
> >
>
> So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
> alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
> thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
>
> >> A note was sent today asking about interest. I've seen zero affirmative
> >> responses.
> >
> > You have now. How much response do you expect in six hours (working hours in
> > NA) ?
> >
>
> So that is one.
>
> >> So I don't think any of the lists will get much traffic.
> >> But it makes sense to JFDI and move on to more important things.
> >
> > They will when you have a new release.
> >
>
> Forums will still dominate.
>
> > I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
> >
>
> That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
>
> I think we have similar goals.
Finally - actually I do not know what you goals are and more importantly
I do not know what the overall goal of what is happening here is.
That is not rhetorical, are we just sunsetting the OO.o project are we
setting up to become OSS-Symphony or are we building a user facing
product...it makes a difference as to what needs to be done now.
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org
[Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com>.
On 2011-08-23 5:08 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:49 PM, Larry Gusaas<la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Perhaps you should compare to the LibreOffice user support list since they
>> have active development. There were 335 post to that list in the last week.
> Do you have any reason to think that with a new release, that support
> questions to forum and mailing lists would not increase by a similar
> factor? Contrary any other evidence that would be the most natural
> assumption.
Of course both would increase. Did I ever suggest otherwise. Do you want to not give support to
the large number of people who prefer to use mailing lists? There is a need for both types of
support.
> Stick around a few more days. Every week or so we get another thread suggesting that we
> should create more mailing lists. Support lists are list the latest reincarnation of this..
> So it is relevant that this tendency, unopposed, led to hundreds of lists for OOo.
Nice try at re-iterating your red herring. It is still not relevant to providing support to users.
_________________________________
Larry I. Gusaas
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." - Edgard Varese
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org
[Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:49 PM, Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On 2011-08-23 4:21 PM Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>> So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
>> alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
>> thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
>
> Perhaps you should compare to the LibreOffice user support list since they
> have active development. There were 335 post to that list in the last week.
>
Do you have any reason to think that with a new release, that support
questions to forum and mailing lists would not increase by a similar
factor? Contrary any other evidence that would be the most natural
assumption.
>>> I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
>>
>> That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
>
> Neither does your repeated negativity about mailing lists. Or your throwing
> in red herrings like the number of mailing lists OOo has, most of which
> aren't support lists.
>
Stick around a few more days. Every week or so we get another thread
suggesting that we should create more mailing lists. Support lists
are list the latest reincarnation of this.. So it is relevant that
this tendency, unopposed, led to hundreds of lists for OOo.
-Rob
> _________________________________
> Larry I. Gusaas
> Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
> Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
> "An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind
> theirs." - Edgard Varese
>
>
>
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org
[Was: Re: [Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg-XMD5yJDbdMReXY1tMh2IBg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com>.
On 2011-08-23 4:21 PM Rob Weir wrote:
> So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
> alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
> thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
Perhaps you should compare to the LibreOffice user support list since they have active
development. There were 335 post to that list in the last week.
>> I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
> That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
Neither does your repeated negativity about mailing lists. Or your throwing in red herrings
like the number of mailing lists OOo has, most of which aren't support lists.
_________________________________
Larry I. Gusaas
Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
"An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind theirs." - Edgard Varese
Re: users-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org [Was: Re:
[Discussion] dev-JNqQRFIbOJOM4zKIHC2jIg@public.gmane.org]
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Tue, Aug 23, 2011 at 6:09 PM, Larry Gusaas <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 2011-08-23 3:37 PM Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>> Does it matter? The English list is getting very little traffic.
>
> There were 56 posts to users@openoffice.org in the last week. Traffic is
> highest after a new release. Here is a list by month for 2011: Jan 409
> Feb 290 Mar 366 Apr 197 May 218 Jun 233 Jul 123 Aug 160
>
So the English support forum has 613 *active threads* for August
alone. In many cases that multiplies out to multiple posts per
thread. So the forum traffic dwarfs the mailing list traffic.
>> A note was sent today asking about interest. I've seen zero affirmative
>> responses.
>
> You have now. How much response do you expect in six hours (working hours in
> NA) ?
>
So that is one.
>> So I don't think any of the lists will get much traffic.
>> But it makes sense to JFDI and move on to more important things.
>
> They will when you have a new release.
>
Forums will still dominate.
> I am very pleased to hear that providing user support is not important.
>
That really doesn't add to the conversation, Larry.
I think we have similar goals. Support is important. The question is
how best to do it. If all we're doing is considering the merits of
different access methods to support, without looking at the
implications of fragmenting the repositories and the resulting
knowledge base, then we are doing a poor job at thinking this through.
Remember the best support site is the one that allows the user to
answer their own question, without signing up for a mailing list or
posting to a forum. We should be looking at how we can prevent user
support questions.
>
> _________________________________
> Larry I. Gusaas
> Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan Canada
> Website: http://larry-gusaas.com
> "An artist is never ahead of his time but most people are far behind
> theirs." - Edgard Varese
>
>
>