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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> on 2012/10/02 00:06:38 UTC
New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Hi,
On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:49 PM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Finally, if elected (and assuming the IPMC still exists), I'd serve
> for at most two years before calling for a re-election, or possibly
> much less if I don't find enough free cycles to perform the duty as
> well as it should.
As already mentioned on private@ earlier, this time is now approaching
due to a change I didn't yet foresee in February: We're expecting our
first baby to be born in December. :-)
In practice this means that the amount of time and energy I have for
the Incubator has unfortunately already started decreasing (we're
buying a new home and moving back to Finland at least for a while) and
will likely drop close to zero in December. Thus it is time to start
considering the election of a new PMC chair for the Incubator.
Before calling for an election vote I'd like to open the discussion
for nominations and more generic thoughts about the future of the
Incubator. In the past few quarters we've done a reasonably good job
on improving the flow of the Incubator and getting many troubled or
otherwise stuck podlings moving forward again. However, there's still
a lot that could be done. What do you think the Incubator should be
like?
Just like I've carved the IPMC chair role to a rather activist form
that seems to have helped address the most pressing issues we had
earlier this year, I would expect the next IPMC chair to make the role
their own. How do you see that and the other Incubator roles, IPMC
member, mentor, champion, shepherd, etc., evolving?
Please share your thoughts on the future of the Incubator and nominate
people you think could best help us reach that vision!
Let's leave the discussion open for at least a few weeks before
conducting the election later this month. That should give us a
resolution to change the IPMC chair in time for the November board
meeting, and a chance for me to still work together with the elected
new chair during November to make sure that the transition goes
smoothly.
PS. Even though this is a personnel issue, I don't see any particular
reason for at least all of this discussion to happen on private@. Feel
free to use private@ for parts of the discussion if appropriate.
PPS. It would be nice if we could use Apache Steve for the election. Volunteers?
BR,
Jukka Zitting
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>.
Hi,
On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 12:06 AM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Let's leave the discussion open for at least a few weeks before
> conducting the election later this month.
Seems like we have one great nominee in Benson and emerging consensus
on electing him as the next IPMC chair.
Unless anything new comes up by tomorrow, I will to start a vote on
private@ to confirm this consensus.
BR,
Jukka Zitting
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Karl Wright <da...@gmail.com>.
Congratulations, Jukka! You've done a fantastic job!
Karl
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 6:06 PM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2012 at 11:49 PM, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Finally, if elected (and assuming the IPMC still exists), I'd serve
>> for at most two years before calling for a re-election, or possibly
>> much less if I don't find enough free cycles to perform the duty as
>> well as it should.
>
> As already mentioned on private@ earlier, this time is now approaching
> due to a change I didn't yet foresee in February: We're expecting our
> first baby to be born in December. :-)
>
> In practice this means that the amount of time and energy I have for
> the Incubator has unfortunately already started decreasing (we're
> buying a new home and moving back to Finland at least for a while) and
> will likely drop close to zero in December. Thus it is time to start
> considering the election of a new PMC chair for the Incubator.
>
> Before calling for an election vote I'd like to open the discussion
> for nominations and more generic thoughts about the future of the
> Incubator. In the past few quarters we've done a reasonably good job
> on improving the flow of the Incubator and getting many troubled or
> otherwise stuck podlings moving forward again. However, there's still
> a lot that could be done. What do you think the Incubator should be
> like?
>
> Just like I've carved the IPMC chair role to a rather activist form
> that seems to have helped address the most pressing issues we had
> earlier this year, I would expect the next IPMC chair to make the role
> their own. How do you see that and the other Incubator roles, IPMC
> member, mentor, champion, shepherd, etc., evolving?
>
> Please share your thoughts on the future of the Incubator and nominate
> people you think could best help us reach that vision!
>
> Let's leave the discussion open for at least a few weeks before
> conducting the election later this month. That should give us a
> resolution to change the IPMC chair in time for the November board
> meeting, and a chance for me to still work together with the elected
> new chair during November to make sure that the transition goes
> smoothly.
>
> PS. Even though this is a personnel issue, I don't see any particular
> reason for at least all of this discussion to happen on private@. Feel
> free to use private@ for parts of the discussion if appropriate.
>
> PPS. It would be nice if we could use Apache Steve for the election. Volunteers?
>
> BR,
>
> Jukka Zitting
>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Alexei Fedotov <al...@gmail.com>.
+1 (non-binding) for Benson for being a nice and practical guy
On Fri, Oct 5, 2012 at 5:06 PM, Davanum Srinivas <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Fri, Oct 5, 2012 at 9:04 AM, Matt Hogstrom <ma...@hogstrom.org> wrote:
>
> > I prefer simple. I'd rather see nominations and votes done via-email
> with
> > IPMC votes noted as (binding).
> >
> > My +1 for nominating Benson.
> >
> > On Oct 2, 2012, at 10:07 AM, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Indeed, but that might be better done if/when Steve is enhanced to
> > > support private (as opposed to secret) votes, as hopefully that would
> > > not require the same overhead.
> >
> >
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> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com
>
Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Davanum Srinivas <da...@gmail.com>.
+1 for nominating Benson.
On Fri, Oct 5, 2012 at 9:04 AM, Matt Hogstrom <ma...@hogstrom.org> wrote:
> I prefer simple. I'd rather see nominations and votes done via-email with
> IPMC votes noted as (binding).
>
> My +1 for nominating Benson.
>
> On Oct 2, 2012, at 10:07 AM, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Indeed, but that might be better done if/when Steve is enhanced to
> > support private (as opposed to secret) votes, as hopefully that would
> > not require the same overhead.
>
>
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>
--
Davanum Srinivas :: http://davanum.wordpress.com
Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Matt Hogstrom <ma...@hogstrom.org>.
I prefer simple. I'd rather see nominations and votes done via-email with IPMC votes noted as (binding).
My +1 for nominating Benson.
On Oct 2, 2012, at 10:07 AM, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Indeed, but that might be better done if/when Steve is enhanced to
> support private (as opposed to secret) votes, as hopefully that would
> not require the same overhead.
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 2 October 2012 10:20, Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 6:49 PM, Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name> wrote:
>> Volunteers for what? To use Steve you'll need
>
> To start with a volunteer to list the requirements you just listed.
> Thanks! :-) From your points it looks like we'd also need a few vote
> counters/monitors and the rest is something I should be able to
> coordinate with root@.
>
> On 2 October 2012 00:00, Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Seems a bit premature. Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
>> So far we have none.
>
> I'm pretty confident that we'll get some good candidates. I have some
> in mind, but wanted to leave the discussion open for now before
> starting to nominate people.
>
> If only one candidate appears or a consensus arises among multiple
> nominees (like it did earlier this year), there's of course no need
> for a more complicated voting process.
>
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 10:49 AM, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Also is there any reason to vote in secret?
>> AFAIK all other PMC chair votes are just held on the private list.
>>
>> Using Steve (as currently implemented) involves quite a bit of overhead.
>
> My main motivation for bringing Steve up is that a part of the
> motivation to turn that code into a TLP was to make it easier for
> people both inside and outside of Apache to use. The IPMC chair
> election would be a nice opportunity to showcase the system in action.
Indeed, but that might be better done if/when Steve is enhanced to
support private (as opposed to secret) votes, as hopefully that would
not require the same overhead.
> If it indeed is too much overhead, then let's scrap the idea and fall
> back to a normal vote on private@.
>
> BR,
>
> Jukka Zitting
>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Jukka Zitting <ju...@gmail.com>.
Hi,
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 6:49 PM, Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name> wrote:
> Volunteers for what? To use Steve you'll need
To start with a volunteer to list the requirements you just listed.
Thanks! :-) From your points it looks like we'd also need a few vote
counters/monitors and the rest is something I should be able to
coordinate with root@.
On 2 October 2012 00:00, Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Seems a bit premature. Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
> So far we have none.
I'm pretty confident that we'll get some good candidates. I have some
in mind, but wanted to leave the discussion open for now before
starting to nominate people.
If only one candidate appears or a consensus arises among multiple
nominees (like it did earlier this year), there's of course no need
for a more complicated voting process.
On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 10:49 AM, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Also is there any reason to vote in secret?
> AFAIK all other PMC chair votes are just held on the private list.
>
> Using Steve (as currently implemented) involves quite a bit of overhead.
My main motivation for bringing Steve up is that a part of the
motivation to turn that code into a TLP was to make it easier for
people both inside and outside of Apache to use. The IPMC chair
election would be a nice opportunity to showcase the system in action.
If it indeed is too much overhead, then let's scrap the idea and fall
back to a normal vote on private@.
BR,
Jukka Zitting
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 2 October 2012 00:00, Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 6:49 PM, Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name> wrote:
>> Jukka Zitting wrote on Tue, Oct 02, 2012 at 00:06:38 +0200:
>>> PPS. It would be nice if we could use Apache Steve for the election. Volunteers?
>
>
> Seems a bit premature. Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
> So far we have none.
Also is there any reason to vote in secret?
AFAIK all other PMC chair votes are just held on the private list.
Using Steve (as currently implemented) involves quite a bit of overhead.
>>
>> Volunteers for what? To use Steve you'll need
>>
>> a) root@ to start the webapp
>>
>> b) volunteer vote counters (monitors)
>>
>> c) list of email addresses of the electorate
>>
>> (I think that's all; see ~voter/bin/make_issue.pl)
>>
>> No special karma is needed to start a vote.
>>
>> Daniel
>> (BTW, I'm sure all PMC members know this, but for the benefit of other
>> list readers I'll remind that the vote is for a _recommendation_ to the
>> Apache Board, who is not obligated to accept it)
>>
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>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
Hi Benson,
Thank you for the kind nomination. I'm not sure I have the time or energy for
these duties anymore, plus my goal would still be to retire the Incubator :)
and I think the folks around here actually want to see it continue on.
If it does continue you, and you're at the helm, I am confident, as I was
with Jukka, that I'll be able to work within its system to shepherd in projects
from time to time.
Thanks!
Cheers,
Chris
On Oct 3, 2012, at 3:40 AM, Benson Margulies wrote:
> I nominate Chris Mattmann. He's been a positive presence in the
> incubator for years. It seems to me that the IPMC char has to both
> guide the work of the group and also channel the Foundation's policies
> and the board's wants and needs, and he is well-position to do all
> these things.
>
> On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:09 AM, Dan Haywood
> <da...@haywood-associates.co.uk> wrote:
>> On 3 October 2012 07:47, Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
>>>
>>> Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
>>> has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
>>> IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
>>> and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
>>> chair.
>>>
>>
>> +1 on that. Benson has been mentoring the podling I work on (Isis), and
>> I've appreciated his no-nonsense guidance and support.
>>
>> Dan
>
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++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com>.
I nominate Chris Mattmann. He's been a positive presence in the
incubator for years. It seems to me that the IPMC char has to both
guide the work of the group and also channel the Foundation's policies
and the board's wants and needs, and he is well-position to do all
these things.
On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 4:09 AM, Dan Haywood
<da...@haywood-associates.co.uk> wrote:
> On 3 October 2012 07:47, Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>>
>> Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
>>
>> Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
>> has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
>> IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
>> and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
>> chair.
>>
>
> +1 on that. Benson has been mentoring the podling I work on (Isis), and
> I've appreciated his no-nonsense guidance and support.
>
> Dan
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com>.
Briefly ...
The process that produced Jukka was not a pretty one, and I was rather
ashamed of myself by the end of it. So, if any other qualified
candidate is available, my inclination is to defer to them. However,
it's not for me to tell the community what to do. If the community
prefers to run an election, by whatever means, I won't argue.
Net: I'm flattered by the nomination and willing to take the job. I
would continue with Jukka's process; I don't have any other schemes up
my sleeve.
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Mark Struberg <st...@yahoo.de>.
+1 Benson is really good candidate!
LieGrue,
strub
----- Original Message -----
> From: Dan Haywood <da...@haywood-associates.co.uk>
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Cc:
> Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 10:09 AM
> Subject: Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
>
> On 3 October 2012 07:47, Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
>>
>> Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
>> has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
>> IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
>> and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
>> chair.
>>
>
> +1 on that. Benson has been mentoring the podling I work on (Isis), and
> I've appreciated his no-nonsense guidance and support.
>
> Dan
>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Dan Haywood <da...@haywood-associates.co.uk>.
On 3 October 2012 07:47, Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
>
> Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
> has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
> IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
> and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
> chair.
>
+1 on that. Benson has been mentoring the podling I work on (Isis), and
I've appreciated his no-nonsense guidance and support.
Dan
Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Christian Grobmeier <gr...@gmail.com>.
On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 8:47 AM, Bertrand Delacretaz
<bd...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 1:00 AM, Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> ...Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
>> So far we have none...
>
> Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
With Benson saying "Yes" and Chris M. saying "No" I give my +1 to
Benson. Otherwise it would have been difficult, with two such great
candidates for the role.
And Jukka: you really changed something here which I have not believed
that it could happen. Thank you for teaching me!
Cheers
Christian
> Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
> has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
> IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
> and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
> chair.
>
> -Bertrand
>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 1:00 AM, Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> ...Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
> So far we have none...
Let's fix this: I nominate Benson Margulies as Incubator PMC chair.
Benson's been actively involved in the Incubator for quite a while,
has mentored several projects, and (despite longish emails sometimes
IIRC ;-) has shown great ability to work in a non-confrontational way
and help things go forward. I think he'd make a great Incubator PMC
chair.
-Bertrand
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Benson Margulies <bi...@gmail.com>.
On Mon, Oct 1, 2012 at 6:49 PM, Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name> wrote:
> Jukka Zitting wrote on Tue, Oct 02, 2012 at 00:06:38 +0200:
>> PPS. It would be nice if we could use Apache Steve for the election. Volunteers?
Seems a bit premature. Let's see if we have more than one candidate.
So far we have none.
>
> Volunteers for what? To use Steve you'll need
>
> a) root@ to start the webapp
>
> b) volunteer vote counters (monitors)
>
> c) list of email addresses of the electorate
>
> (I think that's all; see ~voter/bin/make_issue.pl)
>
> No special karma is needed to start a vote.
>
> Daniel
> (BTW, I'm sure all PMC members know this, but for the benefit of other
> list readers I'll remind that the vote is for a _recommendation_ to the
> Apache Board, who is not obligated to accept it)
>
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Re: New challenges (Was: NOMINATIONS for Incubator PMC Chair)
Posted by Daniel Shahaf <d....@daniel.shahaf.name>.
Jukka Zitting wrote on Tue, Oct 02, 2012 at 00:06:38 +0200:
> PPS. It would be nice if we could use Apache Steve for the election. Volunteers?
Volunteers for what? To use Steve you'll need
a) root@ to start the webapp
b) volunteer vote counters (monitors)
c) list of email addresses of the electorate
(I think that's all; see ~voter/bin/make_issue.pl)
No special karma is needed to start a vote.
Daniel
(BTW, I'm sure all PMC members know this, but for the benefit of other
list readers I'll remind that the vote is for a _recommendation_ to the
Apache Board, who is not obligated to accept it)
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