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Posted to dev@subversion.apache.org by Michael Schmitt <sc...@TI.Uni-Trier.DE> on 2003/06/20 09:32:15 UTC
User-friendly message
Hi,
I tested svn 0.24.2 today. Unfortunately, the error messages are still
confusing.
me@here:~/Platform> svn commit overview.php
Sending overview.php
svn: Transaction is out of date
svn: Commit failed (details follow):
svn: out of date: `/Platform/overview.php' in txn `170'
svn: Your commit message was left in a temporary file:
svn: '/home/me/Platform/svn-commit.2.tmp'
Why doesn't SVN state something like this:
me@here:~/Platform> svn commit overview.php
Failure: `/Platform/overview.php' has been modified in the repository.
Please update your working copy with `svn update /Platform/overview.php`.
Your commit message was left in '/home/me/Platform/svn-commit.2.tmp'
The current message is too long, misleading, and contains redundancy.
Common users should not have to bother about the internal repository
structure, so terms like "transaction", "txn 170" do not make much sense
here. (Of course, this is just my personal opinion)
Kind regards,
Michael
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Re: User-friendly message
Posted by Branden Robinson <br...@deadbeast.net>.
On Fri, Jun 20, 2003 at 06:16:55PM -0700, Steven Brown wrote:
> > From: Branko Cibej [mailto:brane@xbc.nu]
>
> > I'm sooo tired of people complaining about "confusing" error messages
> > that are described in the documentation. RTFM already.
>
> In defense, the first time I saw Subversion report an error I thought
> it was probably some sort of internal uncaught exception / bug from
> the way it looked. That there're enough people complaining they are
> "confusing" for you to become tired of hearing it might mean
> something. :)
I must concur. I feel the same way about Subversion's error messages.
But I don't raise a stink about it because, hey, it's still alpha.
I hereby grant the Subversion developers a nag token. If the
newbie-friendly error message situation hasn't been addressed by the
time Subversion is frozen enough for 1.0 that error messages aren't
likely to change further, feel free to nag me to contribute on this
front. I believe I have two qualifications for this job:
1) I have a nitpicky, lawyerly mind
2) I don't understand much about Subversion internals at all, so
I am a member of the audience that the error messages (part
of them, anyway) should be addressing.
I have no objection at all to svn errors having some sort of expert
information trailing the newbie message. I feel error messages need to
serve both audiences adequately. Making them useless for the svn
developers isn't going to help anyone.
--
G. Branden Robinson | "Why do we have to hide from the
Free Software Developer | police, Daddy?"
branden@deadbeast.net | "Because we use vi, son. They use
http://deadbeast.net/~branden/ | emacs."
Re: User-friendly message
Posted by Ben Collins-Sussman <su...@collab.net>.
Branko Čibej <br...@xbc.nu> writes:
> If you omit this information, an administrator won't be able to use
> svnlook to see what's in txn 170. The cure is worse than the problem.
>
> I'm sooo tired of people complaining about "confusing" error messages
> that are described in the documentation. RTFM already.
The best solution is an error message that meets both criteria:
1. makes a huge, unambiguous statement that a specific file has
changed in the repository.
2. provides a footnote with the txn number, for admins.
I don't think these are mutually exclusive things.
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Re: User-friendly message
Posted by Branko Čibej <br...@xbc.nu>.
Steven Brown wrote:
>
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Branko Cibej [mailto:brane@xbc.nu]
>>Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 1:45 PM
>>To: Michael Schmitt
>>Cc: Subversion Developer's Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: User-friendly message
>>
>>
>
>
>
>>I'm sooo tired of people complaining about "confusing" error messages
>>that are described in the documentation. RTFM already.
>>
>>
>
>In defense, the first time I saw Subversion report an error I thought it was probably some sort of internal uncaught exception / bug from the way it looked. That there're enough people complaining they are "confusing" for you to become tired of hearing it might mean something. :)
>
>
Yeah, you have a point there... but hey, patches are welcome. :-)
--
Brane Čibej <br...@xbc.nu> http://www.xbc.nu/brane/
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RE: User-friendly message
Posted by Steven Brown <sw...@ucsd.edu>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Branko Cibej [mailto:brane@xbc.nu]
> Sent: Friday, June 20, 2003 1:45 PM
> To: Michael Schmitt
> Cc: Subversion Developer's Mailing List
> Subject: Re: User-friendly message
> I'm sooo tired of people complaining about "confusing" error messages
> that are described in the documentation. RTFM already.
In defense, the first time I saw Subversion report an error I thought it was probably some sort of internal uncaught exception / bug from the way it looked. That there're enough people complaining they are "confusing" for you to become tired of hearing it might mean something. :)
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Re: User-friendly message
Posted by Branko Čibej <br...@xbc.nu>.
Michael Schmitt wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I tested svn 0.24.2 today. Unfortunately, the error messages are still
> confusing.
>
> me@here:~/Platform> svn commit overview.php
> Sending overview.php
> svn: Transaction is out of date
> svn: Commit failed (details follow):
> svn: out of date: `/Platform/overview.php' in txn `170'
> svn: Your commit message was left in a temporary file:
> svn: '/home/me/Platform/svn-commit.2.tmp'
>
> Why doesn't SVN state something like this:
>
> me@here:~/Platform> svn commit overview.php
> Failure: `/Platform/overview.php' has been modified in the repository.
> Please update your working copy with `svn update
> /Platform/overview.php`.
> Your commit message was left in '/home/me/Platform/svn-commit.2.tmp'
>
> The current message is too long, misleading, and contains redundancy.
Huh? What redundancy, and how misleading? BTW, _your_ proposal is
anything but short and concise.
> Common users should not have to bother about the internal repository
> structure, so terms like "transaction", "txn 170"
If you omit this information, an administrator won't be able to use
svnlook to see what's in txn 170. The cure is worse than the problem.
> do not make much sense here. (Of course, this is just my personal
> opinion)
I'm sooo tired of people complaining about "confusing" error messages
that are described in the documentation. RTFM already.
--
Brane Čibej <br...@xbc.nu> http://www.xbc.nu/brane/
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