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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by jan i <ja...@apache.org> on 2015/01/26 13:17:33 UTC
[nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Hi
Several private emails, during the previous vote (meaning too late to
change anything), have persuaded me to reconsider. Self nomination is
generally not a good thing, but Andrea has asked me specifically to send
this mail, to stop any confusion (or rumors) about my role.
I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
limit.
I promise to do the chair duties as defined by ASF, everything else depends
on the PMC.
I think Dennis will make a good chair/PMC, he is a lot better connected to
AOO than me while I am relatively well connected within apache (have a look
at people.apache.org)
Just avoid any misunderstandings, LABS (which is a very very silent
project) elected me as chair earlier this month and I am also spending
hours developing Corinthia.
I prefer not to enter into a debate about the qualifications of Dennis and
me, the community knows us both (I have not changed since I resigned).
I hope our community get a working PMC with a lot more activity.
rgds
jan i
--
Sent from My iPad, sorry for any misspellings.
Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 9:37 AM, RA Stehmann
<an...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de> wrote:
> On 26.01.2015 15:20, Rob Weir wrote:
>> On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 7:17 AM, jan i <ja...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> Several private emails, during the previous vote (meaning too late to
>>> change anything), have persuaded me to reconsider. Self nomination is
>>> generally not a good thing, but Andrea has asked me specifically to send
>>> this mail, to stop any confusion (or rumors) about my role.
>>>
>>> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
>>> limit.
>>>
>>
>> But is there a limit on how many times one can vocally resign from a
>> community before one loses credibility?
>>
>
> Not one or two times, not seven times and not seven multiplied by
> seventyseven times.
>
Specifically, I'm asking about when someone repeatedly shows an
attitude of "If you don't do it my way I will resign". I'm concerned
that this temprement is not very conducive to being a PMC Chair. The
attitude, more than the numbers, is what matters. The repetition, of
course, confirms the attitude.
Regards,
-Rob
> Kind regards
> Michael
>
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by RA Stehmann <an...@rechtsanwalt-stehmann.de>.
On 26.01.2015 15:20, Rob Weir wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 7:17 AM, jan i <ja...@apache.org> wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> Several private emails, during the previous vote (meaning too late to
>> change anything), have persuaded me to reconsider. Self nomination is
>> generally not a good thing, but Andrea has asked me specifically to send
>> this mail, to stop any confusion (or rumors) about my role.
>>
>> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
>> limit.
>>
>
> But is there a limit on how many times one can vocally resign from a
> community before one loses credibility?
>
Not one or two times, not seven times and not seven multiplied by
seventyseven times.
Kind regards
Michael
Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 7:17 AM, jan i <ja...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi
>
> Several private emails, during the previous vote (meaning too late to
> change anything), have persuaded me to reconsider. Self nomination is
> generally not a good thing, but Andrea has asked me specifically to send
> this mail, to stop any confusion (or rumors) about my role.
>
> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
> limit.
>
But is there a limit on how many times one can vocally resign from a
community before one loses credibility?
-Rob
> I promise to do the chair duties as defined by ASF, everything else depends
> on the PMC.
>
> I think Dennis will make a good chair/PMC, he is a lot better connected to
> AOO than me while I am relatively well connected within apache (have a look
> at people.apache.org)
>
> Just avoid any misunderstandings, LABS (which is a very very silent
> project) elected me as chair earlier this month and I am also spending
> hours developing Corinthia.
>
> I prefer not to enter into a debate about the qualifications of Dennis and
> me, the community knows us both (I have not changed since I resigned).
>
> I hope our community get a working PMC with a lot more activity.
>
> rgds
> jan i
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from My iPad, sorry for any misspellings.
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 01/26/2015 01:17 PM, schrieb jan i:
> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
> limit.
I'm happy to see that you are available for the chair. :-)
Marcus
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 01/26/2015 05:24 PM, schrieb Andrea Pescetti:
> So: Rob, Juergen, Marcus, Kay, you declined your nomination before we
> compiled the final list of nominees last round. Have you changed your
> mind? If so, please nominate yourself within the next three days.
I'm sorry but my situation hasn't changed. So, I'm not available for the
PMC chair.
Marcus
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
On 26/01/2015 Rob Weir wrote:
> So my concern was your statement "I'll start a vote soon, while it
> lasts", when there has not been a call for nominations, nor a 3-day
> period of time.
Fair. You all get three days. But no more than that, please. We are
really in need for a solution.
> It sounds like someone has solicited up nominations
> via private emails.
I have no problems to admit that, since vote on the only candidate could
not be considered successful and I wished to avoid to vote with zero
candidates, I asked other nominees to reconsider in the order in which
they had declined. I stopped as soon as I found one, but indeed I'll
give everyone else the opportunity to reconsider. And others to join.
I'll only put a condition: either nominate yourself (at this point,
preferred) or get approval by your nominee BEFORE sending in the nomination.
> Let's do this in public.
So: Rob, Juergen, Marcus, Kay, you declined your nomination before we
compiled the final list of nominees last round. Have you changed your
mind? If so, please nominate yourself within the next three days.
And if other people want to join the nominees, please do. Including
Louis obviously.
> So let's be fair and have an
> actual open "call for nominations" if we're going to have a 2nd round
> of this, and not just rush to a vote based on backroom discussions.
With three days, you won't have the "None of the above" options. Three
days (after 26 days!) are enough to consider this to be fair for any
definition of fair. We already discussed the voting procedure back at
the time and I'm not going to revisit it unless there are objections.
> Thanks!
In exchange, I ask everybody to be constructive and polite. Note that I
may be offline for (relatively) long periods due to travel in the next
days, so I may not be able to start or close the vote in a timely fashion.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 9:59 AM, Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org> wrote:
> Rob Weir wrote:
>>
>> I must have missed it, but when did you call for nominations? And
>> how long are we giving to nominations?
>
>
> All of this started on January 1st and we can't go on and discuss forever.
> Everybody has had the opportunity to nominate and be nominated. We need
> something that converges. People who are stopping the process must realize
> they are damaging the project by reiterating the same discussions. If we
> vote, I would add an option "None of the above" and ask that people who
> prefer that one are constructive and suggest some concretely verified
> different options.
>
>> And can we have an explanation
>> why the results of the last vote were just ignored?
>
>
> Vote was canceled, in agreement with the only candidate, since the number of
> binding -1 votes (especially compared to the number of voters) was making it
> clear that I couldn't conclude we had consensus. This is basically what I
> wrote at the time http://markmail.org/message/jlwujrial43unk4j ; maybe I
> don't understand your question, but I'm confident I didn't do anything
> wrong.
>
> We don't even need a formal vote. There are projects that are able to change
> their Chair with a 3-day discussion on the private list. Here we chose to do
> everything in public, with the obvious noise that comes with it. And this
> requires constructive attitude.
>
So my concern was your statement "I'll start a vote soon, while it
lasts", when there has not been a call for nominations, nor a 3-day
period of time. It sounds like someone has solicited up nominations
via private emails. Let's do this in public. Yes, we had discussion
before, but some of the candidates who previously dropped out seem to
now be back in, due to these private conversations. Maybe others
would emerge if we did this openly. So let's be fair and have an
actual open "call for nominations" if we're going to have a 2nd round
of this, and not just rush to a vote based on backroom discussions.
Thanks!
-Rob
>
> Regards,
> Andrea.
>
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
Rob Weir wrote:
> I must have missed it, but when did you call for nominations? And
> how long are we giving to nominations?
All of this started on January 1st and we can't go on and discuss
forever. Everybody has had the opportunity to nominate and be nominated.
We need something that converges. People who are stopping the process
must realize they are damaging the project by reiterating the same
discussions. If we vote, I would add an option "None of the above" and
ask that people who prefer that one are constructive and suggest some
concretely verified different options.
> And can we have an explanation
> why the results of the last vote were just ignored?
Vote was canceled, in agreement with the only candidate, since the
number of binding -1 votes (especially compared to the number of voters)
was making it clear that I couldn't conclude we had consensus. This is
basically what I wrote at the time
http://markmail.org/message/jlwujrial43unk4j ; maybe I don't understand
your question, but I'm confident I didn't do anything wrong.
We don't even need a formal vote. There are projects that are able to
change their Chair with a 3-day discussion on the private list. Here we
chose to do everything in public, with the obvious noise that comes with
it. And this requires constructive attitude.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Rob Weir <ro...@robweir.com>.
On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 9:10 AM, Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org> wrote:
> jan i wrote:
>>
>> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
>> limit.
>
>
> (Answering both messages in one)
>
> OK, so we have two candidates, which is great!
>
I must have missed it, but when did you call for nominations? And
how long are we giving to nominations? And can we have an explanation
why the results of the last vote were just ignored?
-Rob
> Thank you Dennis.
> Thank you Jan.
>
> I appreciate the availability of both of you and your sense of
> responsibility. Your candidacy will hopefully be met by the PMC with a large
> participation in the vote and with a positive, constructive, attitude.
>
> I'll start a vote soon, while it lasts... and again, thank you both for
> helping move this project forward. OpenOffice needs people like you.
>
> Regards,
> Andrea.
>
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
jan i wrote:
> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
> limit.
(Answering both messages in one)
OK, so we have two candidates, which is great!
Thank you Dennis.
Thank you Jan.
I appreciate the availability of both of you and your sense of
responsibility. Your candidacy will hopefully be met by the PMC with a
large participation in the vote and with a positive, constructive, attitude.
I'll start a vote soon, while it lasts... and again, thank you both for
helping move this project forward. OpenOffice needs people like you.
Regards,
Andrea.
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Re: [nomination] Apache openoffice chair
Posted by Alexandro Colorado <jz...@oooes.org>.
I hav
On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 6:17 AM, jan i <ja...@apache.org> wrote:
> Hi
>
> Several private emails, during the previous vote (meaning too late to
> change anything), have persuaded me to reconsider. Self nomination is
> generally not a good thing, but Andrea has asked me specifically to send
> this mail, to stop any confusion (or rumors) about my role.
>
> I am available, if the community wants me as chair (and PMC) without time
> limit.
>
> I promise to do the chair duties as defined by ASF, everything else depends
> on the PMC.
>
> I think Dennis will make a good chair/PMC, he is a lot better connected to
> AOO than me while I am relatively well connected within apache (have a look
> at people.apache.org)
>
> Just avoid any misunderstandings, LABS (which is a very very silent
> project) elected me as chair earlier this month and I am also spending
> hours developing Corinthia.
>
> I prefer not to enter into a debate about the qualifications of Dennis and
> me, the community knows us both (I have not changed since I resigned).
>
> I hope our community get a working PMC with a lot more activity.
>
> rgds
> jan i
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from My iPad, sorry for any misspellings.
>
I have to second your nomination, I know your work and I know that you are
very focused on improving the open source community. Also that you are very
invested with communities beyond the OpenOffice one, and have helped in
infra for Apache. You are more than qualified to be n the PMC since you
have a great deal of knowledge on how Apache as a whole works. I do however
want to turn this into a question, what makes you go deeper into OpenOffice
and if you will have enough time to complete whatever task you will take
upon. However this is not to challenge your nomination just make sure that
there is a plan and vision with having this position.
--
Alexandro Colorado
Apache OpenOffice Contributor
882C 4389 3C27 E8DF 41B9 5C4C 1DB7 9D1C 7F4C 2614