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Posted to users@httpd.apache.org by ht...@karsites.net on 2006/01/13 19:34:29 UTC
[users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Hi all.
Quote from the Apache homepage:
"Apache has been the most popular web server on the Internet
since April of 1996. The November 2005 Netcraft Web Server
Survey found that more than 70% of the web sites on the
Internet are using Apache, thus making it more widely used
than all other web servers combined."
As Apache now runs almost 3/4's of the internet, I was
wondering if there is such a thing as a Certified Apache
Administrator (CAA)?
I think it would be a great way of showing competence as an
Apache admin, if there was such a qualification.
Any thoughts on this one?
Regards Keith
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by ht...@karsites.net.
Well, I'm not sure about running an Apache qualification
myself. Maybee ACA would be better than CAA, which would
conflict with the aviation CAA of the UK.
In theory, theory and practice are the same;
In practice they are not.
On Sat, 14 Jan 2006, Emmanuel E wrote:
> To: users@httpd.apache.org
> From: Emmanuel E <em...@gmx.net>
> Subject: Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
>
> We could start one. What do you say?
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: <ht...@karsites.net>
> To: <us...@httpd.apache.org>
> Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 12:04 AM
> Subject: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
>
>
> >
> > Hi all.
> >
> > Quote from the Apache homepage:
> >
> > "Apache has been the most popular web server on the Internet
> > since April of 1996. The November 2005 Netcraft Web Server
> > Survey found that more than 70% of the web sites on the
> > Internet are using Apache, thus making it more widely used
> > than all other web servers combined."
> >
> > As Apache now runs almost 3/4's of the internet, I was
> > wondering if there is such a thing as a Certified Apache
> > Administrator (CAA)?
> >
> > I think it would be a great way of showing competence as an
> > Apache admin, if there was such a qualification.
> >
> > Any thoughts on this one?
> >
> > Regards Keith
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > The official User-To-User support forum of the Apache HTTP Server
> > Project.
> > See <URL:http://httpd.apache.org/userslist.html> for more info.
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@httpd.apache.org
> > " from the digest: users-digest-unsubscribe@httpd.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@httpd.apache.org
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by Emmanuel E <em...@gmx.net>.
We could start one. What do you say?
----- Original Message -----
From: <ht...@karsites.net>
To: <us...@httpd.apache.org>
Sent: Saturday, January 14, 2006 12:04 AM
Subject: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
>
> Hi all.
>
> Quote from the Apache homepage:
>
> "Apache has been the most popular web server on the Internet
> since April of 1996. The November 2005 Netcraft Web Server
> Survey found that more than 70% of the web sites on the
> Internet are using Apache, thus making it more widely used
> than all other web servers combined."
>
> As Apache now runs almost 3/4's of the internet, I was
> wondering if there is such a thing as a Certified Apache
> Administrator (CAA)?
>
> I think it would be a great way of showing competence as an
> Apache admin, if there was such a qualification.
>
> Any thoughts on this one?
>
> Regards Keith
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> The official User-To-User support forum of the Apache HTTP Server Project.
> See <URL:http://httpd.apache.org/userslist.html> for more info.
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@httpd.apache.org
> " from the digest: users-digest-unsubscribe@httpd.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@httpd.apache.org
>
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by ht...@karsites.net.
Ok - I take your points raised as being relevant and valid :-)
Keith
> You can't seperate the security, performance, robustness
> of httpd from the operating system it's deployed to, which
> is why I suggest that stand-alone httpd certification
> would be somewhat useless. Also consider that HOW httpd
> is deployed, locations of logs, access control/htpasswd
> files, content, etc. along with scripting languages and
> how those are deployed is all part and parcel with how the
> OS vendor distributes Apache httpd, if using the vendor's
> distribution.
>
> Believe me, I've landed in plenty of Apache distributions
> by OS vendors and become completely lost in the 'mess'
> they created :-)
>
> Bill
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by "William A. Rowe, Jr." <wr...@rowe-clan.net>.
httpd2@karsites.net wrote:
> Some interesting points William.
>
>>Could Sun/HP/IBM/RedHat develop a curriculum/certification
>>for complete server administration, including Apache? I
>>suspect they not only could, but currently do have some
>>credentials around Server Administration - which must
>>include dns, sendmail, httpd and the dozens of other
>>services which must be locked down.
>
> Well, I thought a 'real' apache web server was supposed to
> be a dedicated machine, not running other services that you
> mention above.
Certainly I would prefer seperate boxes, or seperate VM's, in any production
environment...
> So that would imply a minimal system, only running the
> Apache daemon, and nothing else that is not required to
> support the web server. This machine would be made as secure
> as possible, and regular security updates applied.
None the less, you can't do that without intimate knowledge of the specific
operating system you deploy httpd on. Do ACL's apply? Does SELinux lockdown
apply? Does chroot apply?
You can't seperate the security, performance, robustness of httpd from the
operating system it's deployed to, which is why I suggest that stand-alone
httpd certification would be somewhat useless. Also consider that HOW httpd
is deployed, locations of logs, access control/htpasswd files, content, etc.
along with scripting languages and how those are deployed is all part and
parcel with how the OS vendor distributes Apache httpd, if using the vendor's
distribution.
Believe me, I've landed in plenty of Apache distributions by OS vendors and
become completely lost in the 'mess' they created :-)
Bill
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by ht...@karsites.net.
Some interesting points William.
> Could Sun/HP/IBM/RedHat develop a curriculum/certification
> for complete server administration, including Apache? I
> suspect they not only could, but currently do have some
> credentials around Server Administration - which must
> include dns, sendmail, httpd and the dozens of other
> services which must be locked down.
Well, I thought a 'real' apache web server was supposed to
be a dedicated machine, not running other services that you
mention above.
So that would imply a minimal system, only running the
Apache daemon, and nothing else that is not required to
support the web server. This machine would be made as secure
as possible, and regular security updates applied.
There are dozens of other services that need to be locked
down securely, but I do not see what relevance they have in
running a dedicated web server. Maybe I'm missing something
somewhere?
Regards
Keith
In theory, theory and practice are the same;
In practice they are not.
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Administrator qualification
Posted by "William A. Rowe, Jr." <wr...@rowe-clan.net>.
httpd2@karsites.net wrote:
>
> "Apache has been the most popular web server on the Internet
> since April of 1996. The November 2005 Netcraft Web Server
> Survey found that more than 70% of the web sites on the
> Internet are using Apache, thus making it more widely used
> than all other web servers combined."
>
> As Apache now runs almost 3/4's of the internet, I was
> wondering if there is such a thing as a Certified Apache
> Administrator (CAA)?
Proposals and thoughts have been raised to the project, and never warmly
received. You will note that the ASF takes a 'hands off' approach to those
who develop books, applications and other deriviative 'products' of ASF
project's software.
> I think it would be a great way of showing competence as an
> Apache admin, if there was such a qualification.
Here's the crux; I should trust you (as a 'CAA') to handle my $250,000 Sun box,
constituing $2mm revenue/annum? As an Apache admin, you probably have liberal
root access to this box. Your 'CAA' credential implies it's safe in your hands.
BUT do I trust you to configure the *box* to run Apache httpd? Seriously, your
knowledge of Linux doesn't imply you know how to lock down a Sun box. This sort
of credential loses all context when you consider the role of an Apache admin.
Could Sun/HP/IBM/RedHat develop a curriculum/certification for complete server
administration, including Apache? I suspect they not only could, but currently
do have some credentials around Server Administration - which must include dns,
sendmail, httpd and the dozens of other services which must be locked down.
And any of that sort of program would speak to a one specific kernel and server
deployment strategy, that corresponds to the OS you've installed out of the box.
So in short, the query's been raised before, and dismissed, and is unlikely to
ever come to some 'ASF Approved' curriculum/credential. But outside parties do
extend ASF materials in all sorts of directions; they just need to observe the
ASF's ownership of the 'Apache' mark, feather and so forth.
Bill
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