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Posted to discuss@apachecon.com by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org> on 2005/05/18 10:29:26 UTC
BOF for Forrest
Hello everybody,
I would like whether we, the forrest community, can apply for a
Birds-of-a-Feather session on the ApacheCon EU 05.
The question is whether non-registrants are allowed there?
Ferdinand suggested the following:
"As far as I can tell, we could have two separate meet-ups:
1. Workshop Forrest Views
with Thorsten explaining the concept and practical details of his
Forrest-Views and plenty of opportunity to ask questions.
My hope is that I will have a chance to understand Views after that
which means that we will address people with a limited
understanding of Forrest and Plug-ins.
Duration: ~ 2 hrs?
Questions:
- Thorsten:
= are you still willing to do this
= is my description of entry requirements correct
- All:
= can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
= What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
have this meet-up
2. General Exchange on Forrest
an opportunity for Forrest users and developers to meet and have an
open exchange about Forrest. If we have enough people committed to
participating, we could/should we announce this meeting in our
Forrest session for interested people to join us.
Questions:
= can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
= What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
have this meet-up"
Can you please help us with this question to still have time to arrange
alternatives? TIA!
salu2
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Lars Eilebrecht <la...@eilebrecht.net>.
According to Juan:
> So can we get a "Company Team discount" if three of us request as part
> of ASF?
Yes, of course.
ciao...
--
Lars Eilebrecht
lars@eilebrecht.net
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Juan Jose Pablos <ch...@apache.org>.
Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
>
> Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
> committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
> without such a big sponsor that's not possible. ApacheCon is a
> commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
> the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
> in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
>
> ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
> but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
> presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
> about Apache and related technologies.
I guess their motivations are as well to see some of the people that
produce that software, and that is not only the speakers that produce it.
>
> ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
> commercial conference producer.
It is up to them to decide about the pricing. I found it very unfair not
even give a discount if you are a commiter, you should rethink that
policy. For us it would be something that we get in return for all the
hours that we spent making that to happend.
So can we get a "Company Team discount" if three of us request as part
of ASF?
Or can get paid for two days and get the third for free?
please, just make it easier for us to be a happy persons and develop
better software for YOU.
Cheers,
cheche
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 2005-05-19 at 15:06 +0200, Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
> According to Thorsten:
>
> > I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> > of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
> >
> > I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> > conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> > I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
> Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
> ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
Yeah, I was to fast. Sorry.
> The other two emails you submitted end of March where regarding
> a session proposal for the conference. It was submitted after
> our CFP deadline and actually after our final planning meeting.
> We usually cannot accept proposals received after the deadline
> as this would be unfair to the other people that submitted
> proposals. As far as I remember we answered your email and told
> you that we cannot consider the proposal for ApacheCon Europe.
> If we really didn't sent this email or if it wasn't received
> by you, I'm sorry ... we always receive some unsolicited proposals
> for sessions are the CFP deadline and often we don't have
> to time to answer these or just fall through the cracks.
>
Hmm, ok I *never* received anything as answer for the mentioned mails
for the proposal. I even wrote Ken Coar directly (that was the third
mail) and no answer as well.
No problem in not accepting the proposal because like you said it was
not in time, but I was waiting for a NO or YES. That is the most basic
thing IMO. Ignoring this mails leads to the situation of frustration.
Even if you receive a lot of mails, it *should* be possible to copy n'
paste something like: "sorry your proposal is to late, try next time
within the deadline."
...but like I stated in the previous mail I am not the only one waiting
for an answer of the conference planer (and the case I have in mind was
not like mine).
> > I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> > something for ourself to meet.
> >
> > BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
> > meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
> > why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
> > the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
> > spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
>
> Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
> committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
> without such a big sponsor that's not possible.
I was not talking about free admission but some % off (something like
the group discount). It is the work of the committer that creating the
basis for this conference (the software and communities). If the
committer would not do their work for free the conference would not have
anything to talk about. Did you thought about that?
> ApacheCon is a
> commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
> the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
> in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
>
Again I am not talking about free. ...and yes you get % on the above
mentioned conference if you are staff of e.g. O'Reilly. Committer are
staff of the ASF.
> ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
> but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
> presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
> about Apache and related technologies.
>
Agree.
> Thorsten, as a committer you are probably aware of the ASF hackathon
> that happens at the beginning of the conference (information about
> this was provided some time ago). This event is a get-to-gether of
> developers and open (only) to ASF members and committers. And
> it's free of charge ...
>
Yeah, nice. I guess (hope) we will meet there. ;-)
> If you do not consider this sufficient, then I'm afraid you may
> want to consider organizing something yourself.
>
That is not the point. See above.
>
> > If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
> > not directly from the ASF, right?
>
> ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
> commercial conference producer.
>
>
Ok.
>
> My $0.02
>
> ciao...
Thanks for answering. :)
...and sorry if my mail was a wee bit harsh. I guess it was the
frustration not getting any answer and having to pay the normal
admission. Next time I will submit a proposal in time. ;-)
Hope that you guys can arrange a small discount for committers that
would be very welcome. ...again I do not expect it to be free. ;-) Then
I could come for a day or two. I do not live in Germany anymore so going
there will be not very cheap.
No hard feelings.
salu2
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
> According to Thorsten:
>
>
>>I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
>>of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>>
>>I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
>>conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
>>I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
>
> Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
> ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
That took nearly 15 hours! You're fired!
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Juan Jose Pablos <ch...@apache.org>.
Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
>
> Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
> committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
> without such a big sponsor that's not possible. ApacheCon is a
> commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
> the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
> in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
>
> ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
> but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
> presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
> about Apache and related technologies.
I guess their motivations are as well to see some of the people that
produce that software, and that is not only the speakers that produce it.
>
> ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
> commercial conference producer.
It is up to them to decide about the pricing. I found it very unfair not
even give a discount if you are a commiter, you should rethink that
policy. For us it would be something that we get in return for all the
hours that we spent making that to happend.
So can we get a "Company Team discount" if three of us request as part
of ASF?
Or can get paid for two days and get the third for free?
please, just make it easier for us to be a happy persons and develop
better software for YOU.
Cheers,
cheche
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 2005-05-19 at 15:06 +0200, Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
> According to Thorsten:
>
> > I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> > of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
> >
> > I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> > conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> > I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
> Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
> ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
Yeah, I was to fast. Sorry.
> The other two emails you submitted end of March where regarding
> a session proposal for the conference. It was submitted after
> our CFP deadline and actually after our final planning meeting.
> We usually cannot accept proposals received after the deadline
> as this would be unfair to the other people that submitted
> proposals. As far as I remember we answered your email and told
> you that we cannot consider the proposal for ApacheCon Europe.
> If we really didn't sent this email or if it wasn't received
> by you, I'm sorry ... we always receive some unsolicited proposals
> for sessions are the CFP deadline and often we don't have
> to time to answer these or just fall through the cracks.
>
Hmm, ok I *never* received anything as answer for the mentioned mails
for the proposal. I even wrote Ken Coar directly (that was the third
mail) and no answer as well.
No problem in not accepting the proposal because like you said it was
not in time, but I was waiting for a NO or YES. That is the most basic
thing IMO. Ignoring this mails leads to the situation of frustration.
Even if you receive a lot of mails, it *should* be possible to copy n'
paste something like: "sorry your proposal is to late, try next time
within the deadline."
...but like I stated in the previous mail I am not the only one waiting
for an answer of the conference planer (and the case I have in mind was
not like mine).
> > I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> > something for ourself to meet.
> >
> > BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
> > meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
> > why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
> > the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
> > spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
>
> Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
> committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
> without such a big sponsor that's not possible.
I was not talking about free admission but some % off (something like
the group discount). It is the work of the committer that creating the
basis for this conference (the software and communities). If the
committer would not do their work for free the conference would not have
anything to talk about. Did you thought about that?
> ApacheCon is a
> commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
> the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
> in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
>
Again I am not talking about free. ...and yes you get % on the above
mentioned conference if you are staff of e.g. O'Reilly. Committer are
staff of the ASF.
> ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
> but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
> presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
> about Apache and related technologies.
>
Agree.
> Thorsten, as a committer you are probably aware of the ASF hackathon
> that happens at the beginning of the conference (information about
> this was provided some time ago). This event is a get-to-gether of
> developers and open (only) to ASF members and committers. And
> it's free of charge ...
>
Yeah, nice. I guess (hope) we will meet there. ;-)
> If you do not consider this sufficient, then I'm afraid you may
> want to consider organizing something yourself.
>
That is not the point. See above.
>
> > If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
> > not directly from the ASF, right?
>
> ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
> commercial conference producer.
>
>
Ok.
>
> My $0.02
>
> ciao...
Thanks for answering. :)
...and sorry if my mail was a wee bit harsh. I guess it was the
frustration not getting any answer and having to pay the normal
admission. Next time I will submit a proposal in time. ;-)
Hope that you guys can arrange a small discount for committers that
would be very welcome. ...again I do not expect it to be free. ;-) Then
I could come for a day or two. I do not live in Germany anymore so going
there will be not very cheap.
No hard feelings.
salu2
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Lars Eilebrecht wrote:
> According to Thorsten:
>
>
>>I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
>>of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>>
>>I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
>>conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
>>I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
>
> Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
> ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
That took nearly 15 hours! You're fired!
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Lars Eilebrecht <la...@eilebrecht.net>.
According to Thorsten:
> I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>
> I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> I reckon this one will not be different. :(
Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
The other two emails you submitted end of March where regarding
a session proposal for the conference. It was submitted after
our CFP deadline and actually after our final planning meeting.
We usually cannot accept proposals received after the deadline
as this would be unfair to the other people that submitted
proposals. As far as I remember we answered your email and told
you that we cannot consider the proposal for ApacheCon Europe.
If we really didn't sent this email or if it wasn't received
by you, I'm sorry ... we always receive some unsolicited proposals
for sessions are the CFP deadline and often we don't have
to time to answer these or just fall through the cracks.
> I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> something for ourself to meet.
>
> BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
> meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
> why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
> the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
> spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
without such a big sponsor that's not possible. ApacheCon is a
commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
about Apache and related technologies.
Thorsten, as a committer you are probably aware of the ASF hackathon
that happens at the beginning of the conference (information about
this was provided some time ago). This event is a get-to-gether of
developers and open (only) to ASF members and committers. And
it's free of charge ...
If you do not consider this sufficient, then I'm afraid you may
want to consider organizing something yourself.
> If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
> not directly from the ASF, right?
ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
commercial conference producer.
My $0.02
ciao...
--
Lars Eilebrecht - "Imagination is more important
lars@eilebrecht.net - than knowledge." (Albert Einstein)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Lars Eilebrecht <la...@eilebrecht.net>.
According to Thorsten:
> I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>
> I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> I reckon this one will not be different. :(
Your last email regarding BOFs was submitted by you to the
ApacheCon planners 18 May and answered by me today (at 1:30 am).
The other two emails you submitted end of March where regarding
a session proposal for the conference. It was submitted after
our CFP deadline and actually after our final planning meeting.
We usually cannot accept proposals received after the deadline
as this would be unfair to the other people that submitted
proposals. As far as I remember we answered your email and told
you that we cannot consider the proposal for ApacheCon Europe.
If we really didn't sent this email or if it wasn't received
by you, I'm sorry ... we always receive some unsolicited proposals
for sessions are the CFP deadline and often we don't have
to time to answer these or just fall through the cracks.
> I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> something for ourself to meet.
>
> BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
> meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
> why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
> the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
> spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
Sure, it would be great if we could find a sponsor to give every
committer or even every Apache user free admission to the conference, but
without such a big sponsor that's not possible. ApacheCon is a
commercial tech conference and therefore there is a few for attending
the conference ... like with any other tech conference. Do you get
in for free at O'Reilly or JavaOne conferences? No, you don't.
ApacheCon is not just a social get-to-gether of committers or members,
but a conference that provides intense lectures, tutorials, and
presentations to Apache users. It's there for people to learn something
about Apache and related technologies.
Thorsten, as a committer you are probably aware of the ASF hackathon
that happens at the beginning of the conference (information about
this was provided some time ago). This event is a get-to-gether of
developers and open (only) to ASF members and committers. And
it's free of charge ...
If you do not consider this sufficient, then I'm afraid you may
want to consider organizing something yourself.
> If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
> not directly from the ASF, right?
ApacheCon is organized by the ASF in coorporation with a
commercial conference producer.
My $0.02
ciao...
--
Lars Eilebrecht - "Imagination is more important
lars@eilebrecht.net - than knowledge." (Albert Einstein)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
Le 20 mai 05, à 13:52, Ben Laurie a écrit :
> ...There is no split-up going on, since _only_ Cocoon want the extra
> day, currently...
And it's only a small number of people from the Cocoon project that
will be there a day early, AFAIK they have arranged something
themselves for the few people that will be there.
-Bertrand
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Henning Schmiedehausen wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I don't want a third day, nor am I annoyed that it does not get
> organized by the conference.
>
> I just wanted to suggest that, if there is interest from more than just
> one group, we should try and coordinate together. If there is just a
> bunch of Cocoon guys and maybe three or four more, than it should be
> possible to put all in one room and not "the cocoon people there and the
> rest somewhere else".
I don't understand what you're suggesting that we haven't already said
we'd do.
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Henning Schmiedehausen <hp...@intermeta.de>.
Hi,
I don't want a third day, nor am I annoyed that it does not get
organized by the conference.
I just wanted to suggest that, if there is interest from more than just
one group, we should try and coordinate together. If there is just a
bunch of Cocoon guys and maybe three or four more, than it should be
possible to put all in one room and not "the cocoon people there and the
rest somewhere else".
Sorry if that came out wrong. It was not intended to be a criticism of
the conference organization. Merely a suggestion.
Regards
Henning
On Fri, 2005-05-20 at 12:52 +0100, Ben Laurie wrote:
> Henning Schmiedehausen wrote:
> > :-(
> >
> > I think that it is not a good thing to "split up Apache people" all over
> > the city.
> >
> > I'd come though I'm not a cocoon guy. Let's simply start a poll.
>
> We already have a two day ASF-wide hackathon. If people want the
> hackathon to be three days, that's fine, but I have to know that before
> we book the venue, obviously.
>
> Deciding at the last minute that you want an extra day and then getting
> annoyed that it wasn't pre-arranged is hardly reasonable.
>
> There is no split-up going on, since _only_ Cocoon want the extra day,
> currently. As I've already stated, if there's a widespread desire for an
> extra day, then I can probably arrange it. To date, people have been
> quite happy with two days.
>
--
Dipl.-Inf. (Univ.) Henning P. Schmiedehausen INTERMETA GmbH
hps@intermeta.de +49 9131 50 654 0 http://www.intermeta.de/
RedHat Certified Engineer -- Jakarta Turbine Development
Linux, Java, perl, Solaris -- Consulting, Training, Engineering
4 - 8 - 15 - 16 - 23 - 42
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Henning Schmiedehausen wrote:
> :-(
>
> I think that it is not a good thing to "split up Apache people" all over
> the city.
>
> I'd come though I'm not a cocoon guy. Let's simply start a poll.
We already have a two day ASF-wide hackathon. If people want the
hackathon to be three days, that's fine, but I have to know that before
we book the venue, obviously.
Deciding at the last minute that you want an extra day and then getting
annoyed that it wasn't pre-arranged is hardly reasonable.
There is no split-up going on, since _only_ Cocoon want the extra day,
currently. As I've already stated, if there's a widespread desire for an
extra day, then I can probably arrange it. To date, people have been
quite happy with two days.
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Henning Schmiedehausen <hp...@intermeta.de>.
:-(
I think that it is not a good thing to "split up Apache people" all over
the city.
I'd come though I'm not a cocoon guy. Let's simply start a poll.
Regards
Henning
On Fri, 2005-05-20 at 12:20 +1000, Torsten Curdt wrote:
> > Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
> > isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
> > wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
> >
> > They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
>
> We found a local company sponsering a meeting room
> including internet access and coffee on sunday :)
>
> ...but I don't think it is big enough for any other
> parties. How many people would be for a sunday hackathon
> is the question...
>
> cheers
> --
> Torsten
--
Dipl.-Inf. (Univ.) Henning P. Schmiedehausen INTERMETA GmbH
hps@intermeta.de +49 9131 50 654 0 http://www.intermeta.de/
RedHat Certified Engineer -- Jakarta Turbine Development
Linux, Java, perl, Solaris -- Consulting, Training, Engineering
4 - 8 - 15 - 16 - 23 - 42
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@apache.org>.
> Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
> isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
> wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
>
> They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
We found a local company sponsering a meeting room
including internet access and coffee on sunday :)
...but I don't think it is big enough for any other
parties. How many people would be for a sunday hackathon
is the question...
cheers
--
Torsten
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 2005-05-21 at 11:39 +1000, David Crossley wrote:
> Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> > Ferdinand Soethe wrote:
> > > Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> > >
> > > > cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> > > > Torsten Curdt has a room and passed my details to a possible sponsor for
> > > > a room. He wants to know how many people want to attend this happening.
> > > > I thought we can have here a small introduction of forrest and then go
> > > > hacking. :)
> > >
> > > Being now to all this, does hackaton always mean that you hack
> > > (develop) code or does it also include f2f-design sessions?
> > >
> > > In my mind there are a number of issues hat would benefit a lot from
> > > having an f2f discussion for a proper design while implementing the
> > > stuff is rather secondary.
> >
> > +1 for design discussion *and* hacking (basic prototyping if you
> > want) ;-)
> >
> > We can as well doing the workshop on here.
>
> The face-to-face is a great opportunity to get on the same
> wavelength with the design side of things. Some bugfixing would
> be good though.
>
+1 for bugfixes as well. :)
> Remember to keep the dev mailing list informed, either at the time
> or summarise later. Decisions in ASF projects are supposed to happen
> on the mailing list.
>
+1
Yes, you are so right, I was thinking the same thing when reading the
mail again.
Actually it is crucial that all f2f discussions and all proposals for
design will instantly go back to the list that the formal process is
valid.
We will not make any decisions on the design side but rather proposals
that then have to be discussed on the list. That is why I see as well to
quick prototype designs to better propose them.
> > > > ASF hackaton
> > > > Would be nice to attend that if possible with as many forrest committer
> > > > as possible. Here we could hack together some mayor features for forrest
> > > > because we could talk face to face and coordination should be easy.
> > >
> > > I'm unclear about the difference to the cocoon/forrest hackathon?
> >
> > :) One is from the ASFCon the other is our private arrangement. The one
> > from ASF only committers and members are allowed. The other is open to
> > public (I guess there will be some limitation by the room regarding the
> > max quantity of person).
>
> The main ASF-wide hackathon prior to the actual conference
> is an excellent event. It is mainly about infrastructure issues
> (which include a lot of different topics). It is also about
> cross-project issues. Basically do anything that you want there.
> It is a great chance to get to know other people beyond your project.
>
> At last year's US ApacheCon, this hackthon was held in a huge room
> with plenty of space. Some people gathered there to do other things,
> e.g. i got together with the Gregor from Lenya to help them get
> their project website established; Leo and Stefano from Gump designed
> a new database structure; i helped Vadim from Cocoon to update
> his ASF statistics website from forrest-0.5. The hackathon was two
> days long, though the first day might have been informal.
>
> --David
That sounds excellent I will be on all possible hackatons. :)
@cheche I reckon I see you there (we do not have to pay for that). ;-) I
hope to meet ferdinand, ross and nicola (et.al.) there as well.
salu2
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by David Crossley <cr...@apache.org>.
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> Ferdinand Soethe wrote:
> > Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> >
> > > cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> > > Torsten Curdt has a room and passed my details to a possible sponsor for
> > > a room. He wants to know how many people want to attend this happening.
> > > I thought we can have here a small introduction of forrest and then go
> > > hacking. :)
> >
> > Being now to all this, does hackaton always mean that you hack
> > (develop) code or does it also include f2f-design sessions?
> >
> > In my mind there are a number of issues hat would benefit a lot from
> > having an f2f discussion for a proper design while implementing the
> > stuff is rather secondary.
>
> +1 for design discussion *and* hacking (basic prototyping if you
> want) ;-)
>
> We can as well doing the workshop on here.
The face-to-face is a great opportunity to get on the same
wavelength with the design side of things. Some bugfixing would
be good though.
Remember to keep the dev mailing list informed, either at the time
or summarise later. Decisions in ASF projects are supposed to happen
on the mailing list.
> > > ASF hackaton
> > > Would be nice to attend that if possible with as many forrest committer
> > > as possible. Here we could hack together some mayor features for forrest
> > > because we could talk face to face and coordination should be easy.
> >
> > I'm unclear about the difference to the cocoon/forrest hackathon?
>
> :) One is from the ASFCon the other is our private arrangement. The one
> from ASF only committers and members are allowed. The other is open to
> public (I guess there will be some limitation by the room regarding the
> max quantity of person).
The main ASF-wide hackathon prior to the actual conference
is an excellent event. It is mainly about infrastructure issues
(which include a lot of different topics). It is also about
cross-project issues. Basically do anything that you want there.
It is a great chance to get to know other people beyond your project.
At last year's US ApacheCon, this hackthon was held in a huge room
with plenty of space. Some people gathered there to do other things,
e.g. i got together with the Gregor from Lenya to help them get
their project website established; Leo and Stefano from Gump designed
a new database structure; i helped Vadim from Cocoon to update
his ASF statistics website from forrest-0.5. The hackathon was two
days long, though the first day might have been informal.
--David
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Fri, 2005-05-20 at 12:58 +0200, Ferdinand Soethe wrote:
>
> Thorsten Scherler wrote:
>
> > I got an answer from torsten, his question is:
> > How many people would be for a sunday hackathon is the question...
>
> I'd like to attend if my hosts will extend my accommodation (Likely)
>
>
> > cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> > Torsten Curdt has a room and passed my details to a possible sponsor for
> > a room. He wants to know how many people want to attend this happening.
> > I thought we can have here a small introduction of forrest and then go
> > hacking. :)
>
> Being now to all this, does hackaton always mean that you hack
> (develop) code or does it also include f2f-design sessions?
>
> In my mind there are a number of issues hat would benefit a lot from
> having an f2f discussion for a proper design while implementing the
> stuff is rather secondary.
>
+1 for design discussion *and* hacking (basic prototyping if you
want) ;-)
We can as well doing the workshop on here.
> > ASF hackaton
> > Would be nice to attend that if possible with as many forrest committer
> > as possible. Here we could hack together some mayor features for forrest
> > because we could talk face to face and coordination should be easy.
>
> I'm unclear about the difference to the cocoon/forrest hackathon?
>
:) One is from the ASFCon the other is our private arrangement. The one
from ASF only committers and members are allowed. The other is open to
public (I guess there will be some limitation by the room regarding the
max quantity of person).
> > non-registered BOF session
> > The workshop that Ferdinand suggested. Johannes was trying to contact
> > the university which sounds pretty well and offered room in his company.
> > Is there are good public transportation connection to where you work?
> > Maybe there are as well some students interested to attend it.
>
> Yes, it would be very nice to have a room for this.
>
> > registered BOF session
> > Like the non-registered BOF session but organized by the ASF.
>
> pls note that this in my view was meant to be a general exchange for
> people to come and ask more questions ...
>
That means only registered people can attend this.
> > Possible timeline:
> > 17.07 - sunday - cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> > 18.08 - monday - ASF hackaton
>
> > 19.08 - tuesday - (non-)registered BOF session
> I was thinking to have this in the evening so that people can attend
> after work and we are not parallel to any conf activities.
> In that case we should not have it on Tueday because at least two
> people will be off to Johannes presentation for UI-professionals.
>
Ups, my bet.
> Since I'd like to schedule the official Forrest-BOF on Wednesday (after our
> presentation) I'd suggest the workshop to happen Thur or Fri.
> Of course if there are only rooms available on Tuesday, that would be
> a different story.
>
Hmm, it's really depends how long I stay whether I can get some kind of
discount. If not I guess I will only go half day besides the hackatons.
> Thanks to Thorsten and Johannes for traing to find something.
>
:) actually we have to thank torsten curdt for that and not me. ;-)
> --
> Ferdinand Soethe
>
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ferdinand Soethe <sa...@soethe.net>.
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> I got an answer from torsten, his question is:
> How many people would be for a sunday hackathon is the question...
I'd like to attend if my hosts will extend my accommodation (Likely)
> cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> Torsten Curdt has a room and passed my details to a possible sponsor for
> a room. He wants to know how many people want to attend this happening.
> I thought we can have here a small introduction of forrest and then go
> hacking. :)
Being now to all this, does hackaton always mean that you hack
(develop) code or does it also include f2f-design sessions?
In my mind there are a number of issues hat would benefit a lot from
having an f2f discussion for a proper design while implementing the
stuff is rather secondary.
> ASF hackaton
> Would be nice to attend that if possible with as many forrest committer
> as possible. Here we could hack together some mayor features for forrest
> because we could talk face to face and coordination should be easy.
I'm unclear about the difference to the cocoon/forrest hackathon?
> non-registered BOF session
> The workshop that Ferdinand suggested. Johannes was trying to contact
> the university which sounds pretty well and offered room in his company.
> Is there are good public transportation connection to where you work?
> Maybe there are as well some students interested to attend it.
Yes, it would be very nice to have a room for this.
> registered BOF session
> Like the non-registered BOF session but organized by the ASF.
pls note that this in my view was meant to be a general exchange for
people to come and ask more questions ...
> Possible timeline:
> 17.07 - sunday - cocoon/forrest- hackaton
> 18.08 - monday - ASF hackaton
> 19.08 - tuesday - (non-)registered BOF session
I was thinking to have this in the evening so that people can attend
after work and we are not parallel to any conf activities.
In that case we should not have it on Tueday because at least two
people will be off to Johannes presentation for UI-professionals.
Since I'd like to schedule the official Forrest-BOF on Wednesday (after our
presentation) I'd suggest the workshop to happen Thur or Fri.
Of course if there are only rooms available on Tuesday, that would be
a different story.
Thanks to Thorsten and Johannes for traing to find something.
--
Ferdinand Soethe
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
On Fri, 2005-05-20 at 10:42 +0200, Nicola Ken Barozzi wrote:
> Ben Laurie wrote:
> ...
> > Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
> > isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
> > wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
> >
> > They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
>
> It would be cool to get together on this! WDOT?
>
I got an answer from torsten, his question is:
How many people would be for a sunday hackathon is the question...
Thinking about the dates and the stuff I would like to do there with you
guys here are some concrete thoughts.
I would be up for the two days hackaton and an extended BOF session.
Events:
cocoon/forrest- hackaton
Torsten Curdt has a room and passed my details to a possible sponsor for
a room. He wants to know how many people want to attend this happening.
I thought we can have here a small introduction of forrest and then go
hacking. :)
ASF hackaton
Would be nice to attend that if possible with as many forrest committer
as possible. Here we could hack together some mayor features for forrest
because we could talk face to face and coordination should be easy.
non-registered BOF session
The workshop that Ferdinand suggested. Johannes was trying to contact
the university which sounds pretty well and offered room in his company.
Is there are good public transportation connection to where you work?
Maybe there are as well some students interested to attend it.
registered BOF session
Like the non-registered BOF session but organized by the ASF.
Possible timeline:
17.07 - sunday - cocoon/forrest- hackaton
18.08 - monday - ASF hackaton
19.08 - tuesday - (non-)registered BOF session
WDYT?
salu2
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Nicola Ken Barozzi <ni...@apache.org>.
Ben Laurie wrote:
...
> Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
> isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
> wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
>
> They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
It would be cool to get together on this! WDOT?
--
Nicola Ken Barozzi nicolaken@apache.org
- verba volant, scripta manent -
(discussions get forgotten, just code remains)
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>
> I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
> I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> something for ourself to meet.
Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ben Laurie <be...@algroup.co.uk>.
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
> of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
>
> I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
> conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
> I reckon this one will not be different. :(
>
> I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
> something for ourself to meet.
Cocoon wanted an extra day on the hackathon - unfortunately, the venue
isn't ours for an extra day, so I couldn't do that. If lots of people
wanted an extra day, then I'd happily organise an alternate venue.
They decided to organise the extra day themselves.
--
http://www.apache-ssl.org/ben.html http://www.thebunker.net/
"There is no limit to what a man can do or how far he can go if he
doesn't mind who gets the credit." - Robert Woodruff
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Johannes Schaefer <jo...@uidesign.de>.
<snip>
> Since we cannot get a room at the conference for non-delegates (which
> again is understandable because they have to be paid for somehow) we
> need to find an alternative.
>
> We could check out if any of the hotels have a room we would be able to
> use. Once I know where I am staying I can look into that.
>
> Does anyone in the area know of any other possabilities?
I'm looking into it right now (i.e. sent emails).
One option would be to meet at the company I'm
working for, but this is rather far from the
conference. We might borrow a beamer, so any
room would do.
There are some academic buildings in the center,
I'll try what I can do ...
Johannes
>
> Ross
>
>
>
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Ross Gardler <rg...@apache.org>.
Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
> meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
> why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
> the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
> spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
Those contributing to the conference *directly* get an exceptionally
good deal, far better than I could possibly have hoped for.
My background is in academic conferences, in these instances even
speakers pay a full registration fee, so this is a major improvement in
my eyes. The ASF have to find ways of paying for all the physical
infrastructure and other overheads that it has, this conference is one
of those ways.
I understand your frustration, all I can say is propose a session next
time. You will be ecstatic with the deal you get then.
No back to the point:
Since we cannot get a room at the conference for non-delegates (which
again is understandable because they have to be paid for somehow) we
need to find an alternative.
We could check out if any of the hotels have a room we would be able to
use. Once I know where I am staying I can look into that.
Does anyone in the area know of any other possabilities?
Ross
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
I reckon this one will not be different. :(
I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
something for ourself to meet.
BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
not directly from the ASF, right?
No offense but the organization is to not really helpful in answering
questions and helping (unless so many other conferences I attended).
salu2
On Wed, 2005-05-18 at 10:29 +0200, Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> Hello everybody,
>
> I would like whether we, the forrest community, can apply for a
> Birds-of-a-Feather session on the ApacheCon EU 05.
>
> The question is whether non-registrants are allowed there?
>
> Ferdinand suggested the following:
> "As far as I can tell, we could have two separate meet-ups:
>
> 1. Workshop Forrest Views
>
> with Thorsten explaining the concept and practical details of his
> Forrest-Views and plenty of opportunity to ask questions.
>
> My hope is that I will have a chance to understand Views after that
> which means that we will address people with a limited
> understanding of Forrest and Plug-ins.
>
> Duration: ~ 2 hrs?
>
> Questions:
>
> - Thorsten:
>
> = are you still willing to do this
> = is my description of entry requirements correct
>
> - All:
>
> = can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
> without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
>
> = What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
> have this meet-up
>
> 2. General Exchange on Forrest
>
> an opportunity for Forrest users and developers to meet and have an
> open exchange about Forrest. If we have enough people committed to
> participating, we could/should we announce this meeting in our
> Forrest session for interested people to join us.
>
> Questions:
>
> = can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
> without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
>
> = What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
> have this meet-up"
>
> Can you please help us with this question to still have time to arrange
> alternatives? TIA!
>
> salu2
> email message attachment, "Forwarded message - BOF for Forrest"
> On Wed, 2005-05-18 at 10:29 +0200, Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > what is the procedure to apply for a room for additional and BOF
> > meeting at ApacheCon. We'd like to have a BOF on Forrest and possibly
> > one other meeting.
> >
> > Is it possible for non-registrants to participate
> > in these?
> >
> > --
> > Ferdinand Soethe
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: discuss-unsubscribe@ApacheCon.Com
> For additional commands, e-mail: discuss-help@ApacheCon.Com
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)
Re: BOF for Forrest
Posted by Thorsten Scherler <th...@apache.org>.
I have to admit that I am *really* disappointed about the communication
of the conference planer and the whole organization of this conference.
I personally have send three mails (other threads) before to the
conference but still waiting for an answer (and I am not the only one).
I reckon this one will not be different. :(
I guess that means we should follow the cocoon example and organize
something for ourself to meet.
BTW if we do so I guess I will not even attend the conference but only
meet up with the people of the forrest community. I cannot understand
why committers do not get discounts for the conference and having to pay
the fee by myself it is just *too* much money. It is a petty but who can
spend 800€ + traveling cost + ...
If my understanding is correct the organization of this conference is
not directly from the ASF, right?
No offense but the organization is to not really helpful in answering
questions and helping (unless so many other conferences I attended).
salu2
On Wed, 2005-05-18 at 10:29 +0200, Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> Hello everybody,
>
> I would like whether we, the forrest community, can apply for a
> Birds-of-a-Feather session on the ApacheCon EU 05.
>
> The question is whether non-registrants are allowed there?
>
> Ferdinand suggested the following:
> "As far as I can tell, we could have two separate meet-ups:
>
> 1. Workshop Forrest Views
>
> with Thorsten explaining the concept and practical details of his
> Forrest-Views and plenty of opportunity to ask questions.
>
> My hope is that I will have a chance to understand Views after that
> which means that we will address people with a limited
> understanding of Forrest and Plug-ins.
>
> Duration: ~ 2 hrs?
>
> Questions:
>
> - Thorsten:
>
> = are you still willing to do this
> = is my description of entry requirements correct
>
> - All:
>
> = can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
> without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
>
> = What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
> have this meet-up
>
> 2. General Exchange on Forrest
>
> an opportunity for Forrest users and developers to meet and have an
> open exchange about Forrest. If we have enough people committed to
> participating, we could/should we announce this meeting in our
> Forrest session for interested people to join us.
>
> Questions:
>
> = can anybody suggest a place that is open for people
> without conf registration (perhaps even has a beamer?)
>
> = What evenings of the conference would you prefer to
> have this meet-up"
>
> Can you please help us with this question to still have time to arrange
> alternatives? TIA!
>
> salu2
> email message attachment, "Forwarded message - BOF for Forrest"
> On Wed, 2005-05-18 at 10:29 +0200, Thorsten Scherler wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > what is the procedure to apply for a room for additional and BOF
> > meeting at ApacheCon. We'd like to have a BOF on Forrest and possibly
> > one other meeting.
> >
> > Is it possible for non-registrants to participate
> > in these?
> >
> > --
> > Ferdinand Soethe
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: discuss-unsubscribe@ApacheCon.Com
> For additional commands, e-mail: discuss-help@ApacheCon.Com
--
thorsten
"Together we stand, divided we fall!"
Hey you (Pink Floyd)