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Posted to users@openoffice.apache.org by Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com> on 2012/05/24 17:50:45 UTC
Is there a way to do this...
I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is always
such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the world over what
kind of font I want to use, etc.
One problem I often have is something like this...
For instance, in the following sentence:
-----
He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
-----
There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation marks. In
this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to enjoy
reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the spot and hit
the spacebar all the time.
I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very well and
then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an apostrophe and an end
quotation mark.
I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and would
really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the 1000+
corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual fix, heh.
Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself and get
ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem well enough for
someone to actually be able to help me).
JB
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Niall Martin <ni...@rndmartin.cix.co.uk>.
There are others. I use Textpad, and find it does what I want to do.
Best wishes
On 27 May 2012 at 13:07, Tony wrote:
Send reply to: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
Date sent: Sun, 27 May 2012 13:07:56 +0200
Subject: Re: Is there a way to do this...
From: Tony <ab...@gmail.com>
To: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
> I often typeset books, but prefer to save them as pure text and open
> them in Vim
> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vim_%28text_editor%29>+Solarized<https:/
> /github.com/altercation/vim-colors-solarized>before I bring them into
> OpenOffice or InDesign or whatever.
>
> Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet, and lets me get
> rid of your type of problems with ease. It can be a bit tricky at
> first though, but learning it is well worth it - and even if you're
> dumb like me (I'm not saying you are though) - it will quickly become
> second nature. Like for your problem I'd just type:
>
> :%s/,"/, "/g
>
> and press enter. Good luck!
>
> Tony
>
> On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because
> > odt is always such a nice smaller file size and I have all the
> > control in the world over what kind of font I want to use, etc.
> >
> > One problem I often have is something like this...
> >
> > For instance, in the following sentence:
> >
> > -----
> > He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build
> > cabins." -----
> >
> > There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning
> > quotation marks. In this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this
> > and I'll not be able to enjoy reading the book if I have to stop
> > every 5 seconds to click on the spot and hit the spacebar all the
> > time.
> >
> > I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work
> > very well and then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between
> > an apostrophe and an end quotation mark.
> >
> > I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions
> > and would really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can
> > do the 1000+ corrrections for me and I can get back to the
> > occassional manual fix, heh.
> >
> > Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on
> > myself and get ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the
> > problem well enough for someone to actually be able to help me).
> >
> >
> > JB
> >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: ooo-users-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: ooo-users-help@incubator.apache.org
> >
> >
>
Niall Martin
Phone 0131 4678468
Please reply to: niall<at>rndmartin.cix.co.uk
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Dwayne Henderson <it...@gmail.com>.
Another vote for Vim. Afrotrap better recognize.
--Dwayne
On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 8:40 PM, Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>wrote:
> 2012/5/27 Tony <ab...@gmail.com>:
> >Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet
>
> I'm not sure all those Emacs guys agree… :P
>
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>
Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Scooter C <sc...@scootersdesk.com>.
Good Evening JB-Ima Afrotrap,
IF you know what direction you want to go in, it would be fairly simple.
Buy a book or primer..
I started in the BASIC language, but its a dead language now.
Although it gave me a starting point 40 years ago, when there was only
scientific languages that were totally out of my league or comprehension
and barely remembered now. Its like Latin, very few people know it or
can speak it.
I'm sure many on this list would have a better suggestion of where to
start, if they know where you want to go.
Take Care.
Scooter
College Park, MD USA
Ima Afrotrap wrote on 5/27/2012 6:48 PM:
> On Sunday, 27 May 2012 16:40 Dwayne Henderson wrote:
>> Emacs excels at things like bidirectional communications with co-operating
>> processes, which is good for embedding things in (or marrying things to)
>> the editor, like a shell, a REPL or a debugger. You need any of that,
>> Afrotrap?
>>
>> Vim has a better text editing interface - period. As for Vi - we all know
>> it sucks - but this never was about Vi.
>>
>> --Dwayne
>>
> I've always had trouble egtting past a certain part(?) of some things. For
> instance, I aced math all the way through geometry and then 15 years later while
> trying to go to community college I did it again until I got to calculus and
> physics...it was like being in a nice '65 GTO doing about 120 mph and suddenly a
> 10 foot thick block wall pops up in front of you with no braking room. I stuck
> with the courses for another week but it did no good as I just kept getting
> farther and farther lost.
>
> I've tried to learn (online and with books, can't afford school anymore since
> I live on a disability check) programming in C++ for Linux, Python and Ruby. I'd
> give my right cod to learn to program and especially to try it with a machine
> language because I'm so sick and tired of the bloat languages are causing
> anymore, but again I get lost pretty quickly and frustrated.
>
> It's similar with other things but I never know what particular
> subject/job/whatever-I-should-call-it it will happen with until I start at it. I
> also have a kinda messed up memory, so, when I did take a curious look at Vi and
> emacs a few years ago, it took all of about an hour +/- on each just piddling
> around to know I would be lost using them.
>
> So, I mainly stick with gui stuff and once in a while ask how to get a little
> thing done. Oh well....life in the woods, heh.
>
>
>
> JB
>
>
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>.
On Sunday, 27 May 2012 16:40 Dwayne Henderson wrote:
> Emacs excels at things like bidirectional communications with co-operating
> processes, which is good for embedding things in (or marrying things to)
> the editor, like a shell, a REPL or a debugger. You need any of that,
> Afrotrap?
>
> Vim has a better text editing interface - period. As for Vi - we all know
> it sucks - but this never was about Vi.
>
> --Dwayne
>
I've always had trouble egtting past a certain part(?) of some things. For
instance, I aced math all the way through geometry and then 15 years later while
trying to go to community college I did it again until I got to calculus and
physics...it was like being in a nice '65 GTO doing about 120 mph and suddenly a
10 foot thick block wall pops up in front of you with no braking room. I stuck
with the courses for another week but it did no good as I just kept getting
farther and farther lost.
I've tried to learn (online and with books, can't afford school anymore since
I live on a disability check) programming in C++ for Linux, Python and Ruby. I'd
give my right cod to learn to program and especially to try it with a machine
language because I'm so sick and tired of the bloat languages are causing
anymore, but again I get lost pretty quickly and frustrated.
It's similar with other things but I never know what particular
subject/job/whatever-I-should-call-it it will happen with until I start at it. I
also have a kinda messed up memory, so, when I did take a curious look at Vi and
emacs a few years ago, it took all of about an hour +/- on each just piddling
around to know I would be lost using them.
So, I mainly stick with gui stuff and once in a while ask how to get a little
thing done. Oh well....life in the woods, heh.
JB
--
Man is a religious animal. He is the only religious animal. He is the only
animal that has the True Religion...several of them. -Mark Twain
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by David B Teague sr <da...@comporium.net>.
On 5/27/2012 5:21 PM, James Knott wrote:
> David B Teague sr wrote:
>> I don't know about power of Vim
> http://www.unilever.com/brands/hygieneandwelbeing/aroundthehouse/articles/cleansolutionsfromvim.aspx
> ;-)
>
> Actually, it's about what gets the job done. Vi & Vim are on just
> about all Linux & Unix systems, whereas, as you mentioned, Emacs has
> to be specifically installed. For quick updates to config files etc.,
> as simple editor, such as Vi(m) is all that's needed.
Yes that is a fact. Vi and Vim are small, simple, and powerful. I
learned vi specifically for when the gui didn't load. It is so much
better than ed. But for programming and production, my personal
preference is almost any other text editor.
Note that I have not used vim. I retired from active Unix/Linux
management in 2000. I seem to recall vim was 'out there' but I didn't
use it.
I still prefer OO.o or LO to get my "today's" job done.
LOL.
DBTsr
--
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is.
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Dwayne Henderson <it...@gmail.com>.
Emacs excels at things like bidirectional communications with co-operating
processes, which is good for embedding things in (or marrying things to)
the editor, like a shell, a REPL or a debugger. You need any of that,
Afrotrap?
Vim has a better text editing interface - period. As for Vi - we all know
it sucks - but this never was about Vi.
--Dwayne
On Sun, May 27, 2012 at 11:21 PM, James Knott <ja...@rogers.com>wrote:
> David B Teague sr wrote:
>
>> I don't know about power of Vim
>>
> http://www.unilever.com/**brands/hygieneandwelbeing/**
> aroundthehouse/articles/**cleansolutionsfromvim.aspx<http://www.unilever.com/brands/hygieneandwelbeing/aroundthehouse/articles/cleansolutionsfromvim.aspx> ;-)
>
> Actually, it's about what gets the job done. Vi & Vim are on just about
> all Linux & Unix systems, whereas, as you mentioned, Emacs has to be
> specifically installed. For quick updates to config files etc., as simple
> editor, such as Vi(m) is all that's needed.
>
>
> ------------------------------**------------------------------**---------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: ooo-users-unsubscribe@**incubator.apache.org<oo...@incubator.apache.org>
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>
>
Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by James Knott <ja...@rogers.com>.
David B Teague sr wrote:
> I don't know about power of Vim
http://www.unilever.com/brands/hygieneandwelbeing/aroundthehouse/articles/cleansolutionsfromvim.aspx
;-)
Actually, it's about what gets the job done. Vi & Vim are on just about
all Linux & Unix systems, whereas, as you mentioned, Emacs has to be
specifically installed. For quick updates to config files etc., as
simple editor, such as Vi(m) is all that's needed.
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by David B Teague sr <da...@comporium.net>.
On 5/27/2012 4:12 PM, James Knott wrote:
> Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>>> Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet
>> I'm not sure all those Emacs guys agree… :P
>
> Emacs is an editor too??? ;-)
I will tell you when I put Emacs up on our Unix systems after the
faculty had been using Vi, there was a mad rush to learn and to use it
instead of Vi.
I don't know about power of Vim, as it is a distant descendant of Vi,
and it's been far too long for any of this to have much meaning, but I
assure you, no one liked Vi.
Today I stick to the GUI OO.o and LO.
David
--
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is.
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by James Knott <ja...@rogers.com>.
Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>> Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet
> I'm not sure all those Emacs guys agree… :P
Emacs is an editor too??? ;-)
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/27 Tony <ab...@gmail.com>:
>Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet
I'm not sure all those Emacs guys agree… :P
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Tony <ab...@gmail.com>.
I often typeset books, but prefer to save them as pure text and open them
in Vim <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vim_%28text_editor%29>+Solarized<https://github.com/altercation/vim-colors-solarized>before
I bring them into OpenOffice or InDesign or whatever.
Vim is the most powerful text editor on the planet, and lets me get rid of
your type of problems with ease. It can be a bit tricky at first though,
but learning it is well worth it - and even if you're dumb like me (I'm not
saying you are though) - it will quickly become second nature. Like for
your problem I'd just type:
:%s/,"/, "/g
and press enter. Good luck!
Tony
On Thu, May 24, 2012 at 5:50 PM, Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is
> always
> such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the world over
> what
> kind of font I want to use, etc.
>
> One problem I often have is something like this...
>
> For instance, in the following sentence:
>
> -----
> He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
> -----
>
> There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation
> marks. In
> this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to
> enjoy
> reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the spot
> and hit
> the spacebar all the time.
>
> I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very
> well and
> then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an apostrophe and
> an end
> quotation mark.
>
> I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and would
> really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the 1000+
> corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual fix, heh.
>
> Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself
> and get
> ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem well enough
> for
> someone to actually be able to help me).
>
>
> JB
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: ooo-users-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: ooo-users-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/25 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
> On Thursday, 24 May 2012 16:21 Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>> 2012/5/24 Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>:
>> > 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
>
> <snip>
>
>> >> Here are some more cut and pasted straight from the e-book examples
>> >> (note also not just the comma, but it happens with a period):
>> >>
>> >> -----
>> >> said Jonnie."Don't you follow
>> >>
>> >> “You can have my other four horses,”
>> >
>> > I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another
>> > story.
>> >
>> >> said Jonnie to Chrissie."Don't eat them;
>> >> they're trained.” He paused."Unless you get awful hungry, of course,
>> >> like in the winter.”
>> >>
>> >> "I’ve been investigating a suspicion of conspiracy to sabotage
>> >> transport,” said Terl."Kept me busy for the last three weeks.”
>> >> -----
>> >>
>> >> I hope I'm showing everything necessary to see the problem better. If
>> >> you want even more examples, just holler and I'll cut and paste a page
>> >> if it's not too big.
>> >>
>> >>
>
> <snip>
>
>>
>> In your example, this seems to work:
>> ☒ Regular expressions
>>
>> Search for: (.|,|:|;)("|“)([:alnum:])
>> Replace with: $1 $2$3
>>
>> Things inside parentheses are ”memorised”, so the string found in the
>> first parenthesis can be called with $1 in the Replace with field and
>> so on.
>>
>> So first I search for one of . , : ; followed by either a " or a “
>> (not a ”) followed by an alphanumeric character (a-z, A-Z, 0-9).
>> For example ."D is found. It will be replaced by the result of the
>> first pair of parentheses followed by a space followed by the two last
>> pair of parentheses, in this case . "D.
>>
>> Try it out and see if it works for you. You can always use the undo
>> button to undo a ”Replace All”, for example.
>> If it doesn't work in all cases, maybe you can try to modify it or
>> write back and tell us (or at least me…) what went wrong. I am sure
>> there is some cases that I didn't think of…
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Johnny Rosenberg
>
> Okay, that seemed to work except that it put an extra space in front of
> anything with a comma or apostrophe, which was an easy fix in itself for the
> most part.
So there was obviously something that I didn't think about after all.
I would like to correct it, but right now I haven't got the time.
Going away over the weekend and have some things to do before that. I
am sure (almost, at least) that there is a solution that behaves
better than the one I made. Maybe someone else have a better one?
Kind regards
Johnny Rosenberg
ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ
> At least now I'll have far, far fewer of these to stop me during my
> reading so I can 'fix' the ones that are now few and far between (there was
> 3300+ 'fixed' by your solution and 963 'fixed' by mine afterward and I see very
> few that neither of ours got to).
>
> Thank you very much for this help as it's made things a hell of a lot easier
> on me now. Hopefully one day scanners will get good enough to not make such
> awful mistakes, but I won't hold my breath, heh.
>
> Take care and thanks again.
>
>
> JB
>
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>.
On Thursday, 24 May 2012 16:21 Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
> 2012/5/24 Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>:
> > 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
<snip>
> >> Here are some more cut and pasted straight from the e-book examples
> >> (note also not just the comma, but it happens with a period):
> >>
> >> -----
> >> said Jonnie."Don't you follow
> >>
> >> “You can have my other four horses,”
> >
> > I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another
> > story.
> >
> >> said Jonnie to Chrissie."Don't eat them;
> >> they're trained.” He paused."Unless you get awful hungry, of course,
> >> like in the winter.”
> >>
> >> "I’ve been investigating a suspicion of conspiracy to sabotage
> >> transport,” said Terl."Kept me busy for the last three weeks.”
> >> -----
> >>
> >> I hope I'm showing everything necessary to see the problem better. If
> >> you want even more examples, just holler and I'll cut and paste a page
> >> if it's not too big.
> >>
> >>
<snip>
>
> In your example, this seems to work:
> ☒ Regular expressions
>
> Search for: (.|,|:|;)("|“)([:alnum:])
> Replace with: $1 $2$3
>
> Things inside parentheses are ”memorised”, so the string found in the
> first parenthesis can be called with $1 in the Replace with field and
> so on.
>
> So first I search for one of . , : ; followed by either a " or a “
> (not a ”) followed by an alphanumeric character (a-z, A-Z, 0-9).
> For example ."D is found. It will be replaced by the result of the
> first pair of parentheses followed by a space followed by the two last
> pair of parentheses, in this case . "D.
>
> Try it out and see if it works for you. You can always use the undo
> button to undo a ”Replace All”, for example.
> If it doesn't work in all cases, maybe you can try to modify it or
> write back and tell us (or at least me…) what went wrong. I am sure
> there is some cases that I didn't think of…
>
>
> Kind regards
>
> Johnny Rosenberg
Okay, that seemed to work except that it put an extra space in front of
anything with a comma or apostrophe, which was an easy fix in itself for the
most part. At least now I'll have far, far fewer of these to stop me during my
reading so I can 'fix' the ones that are now few and far between (there was
3300+ 'fixed' by your solution and 963 'fixed' by mine afterward and I see very
few that neither of ours got to).
Thank you very much for this help as it's made things a hell of a lot easier
on me now. Hopefully one day scanners will get good enough to not make such
awful mistakes, but I won't hold my breath, heh.
Take care and thanks again.
JB
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>.
On Sunday, 27 May 2012 05:47 M Henri Day wrote:
> 2012/5/27 Doug Hovelson <do...@msn.com>
>
> > For up-to-date grammar (American style anyway) I use the Associated Press
> > Stylebook, the Chicago Manual of Style for particularly vexing questions.
> > However, Yahoo has an excellent style guide for writing on the Internet
> > that is also different from the aforementioned guides. TO me it comes
> > down to how much you value readability -- I value it a lot, being
> > someone eking out a living as a writer, publicist, journalist, etc. --
> > how much effort you're willing to put into proofreading and ultimately
> > how much you respect your reader's right to expect reasonably
> > intelligible prose from you the writer. Also of primary consideration of
> > course - how much are you being paid to produce said writing...As Elmore
> > Leonard said, "Anybody who writes and doesn't get paid for it is a fool"
> > or something like that. Say I, as I write away for nothing here...
> >
> > Doug Hovelson
> >
> >
> > doughovelson@msn.com
> >
> > Minneapolis > To: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
> >
> > > From: glgxg@sbcglobal.net
> > > Subject: Re: Is there a way to do this...
> > > Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 17:44:59 -0700
> > >
> > > On 05/25/2012 04:03 AM, Alec McAllister wrote:
> > > > Fowler tackles this in the "Stops" section.
> > > >
> > > > He mentions two schools of thought, which he calls the conventional
> > > > and the logical, with the latter punctuating according to sense, i.e.
> > > > putting the stops outside the inverted commas except when they
> > > > actually form part of the quotation.
> > > >
> > > > The former appears to be more common in the USA and the latter in the
> > > > UK, although neither has ever been completely uniform in either
> > > > place.
> > > >
> > > > I was taught to punctuate according to sense during my education in
> > > > UK schools, during my Degree in English, during my training as an
> > > > English teacher and throughout my career as a teacher in the UK ...
> > > > so it has probably been completely superseded by whatever haphazard
> > > > punctuation (or lack of it) happens to be current on this week's most
> > > > fashionable chat-site. :-(
> > > >
> > > > Alec McAllister Leeds, UK
> > >
> > > OK, you win. :-)
>
> I hold with Alec McAllister here - and with those who abhor top-posting,
> which I regard as an abomination.... [?]
>
> Henri
+1
JB
--
Man is a religious animal. He is the only religious animal. He is the only
animal that has the True Religion...several of them. -Mark Twain
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by M Henri Day <mh...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/27 Doug Hovelson <do...@msn.com>
>
> For up-to-date grammar (American style anyway) I use the Associated Press
> Stylebook, the Chicago Manual of Style for particularly vexing questions.
> However, Yahoo has an excellent style guide for writing on the Internet
> that is also different from the aforementioned guides. TO me it comes down
> to how much you value readability -- I value it a lot, being someone eking
> out a living as a writer, publicist, journalist, etc. -- how much effort
> you're willing to put into proofreading and ultimately how much you respect
> your reader's right to expect reasonably intelligible prose from you the
> writer. Also of primary consideration of course - how much are you being
> paid to produce said writing...As Elmore Leonard said, "Anybody who writes
> and doesn't get paid for it is a fool" or something like that. Say I, as I
> write away for nothing here...
>
> Doug Hovelson
>
>
> doughovelson@msn.com
>
>
> Minneapolis > To: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
> > From: glgxg@sbcglobal.net
> > Subject: Re: Is there a way to do this...
> > Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 17:44:59 -0700
> >
> > On 05/25/2012 04:03 AM, Alec McAllister wrote:
> > > Fowler tackles this in the "Stops" section.
> > >
> > > He mentions two schools of thought, which he calls the conventional
> > > and the logical, with the latter punctuating according to sense, i.e.
> > > putting the stops outside the inverted commas except when they
> > > actually form part of the quotation.
> > >
> > > The former appears to be more common in the USA and the latter in the
> > > UK, although neither has ever been completely uniform in either
> > > place.
> > >
> > > I was taught to punctuate according to sense during my education in
> > > UK schools, during my Degree in English, during my training as an
> > > English teacher and throughout my career as a teacher in the UK ...
> > > so it has probably been completely superseded by whatever haphazard
> > > punctuation (or lack of it) happens to be current on this week's most
> > > fashionable chat-site. :-(
> > >
> > > Alec McAllister Leeds, UK
> >
> > OK, you win. :-)
>
I hold with Alec McAllister here - and with those who abhor top-posting,
which I regard as an abomination.... [?]
Henri
RE: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Doug Hovelson <do...@msn.com>.
For up-to-date grammar (American style anyway) I use the Associated Press Stylebook, the Chicago Manual of Style for particularly vexing questions. However, Yahoo has an excellent style guide for writing on the Internet that is also different from the aforementioned guides. TO me it comes down to how much you value readability -- I value it a lot, being someone eking out a living as a writer, publicist, journalist, etc. -- how much effort you're willing to put into proofreading and ultimately how much you respect your reader's right to expect reasonably intelligible prose from you the writer. Also of primary consideration of course - how much are you being paid to produce said writing...As Elmore Leonard said, "Anybody who writes and doesn't get paid for it is a fool" or something like that. Say I, as I write away for nothing here...
Doug Hovelson
doughovelson@msn.com
Minneapolis > To: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
> From: glgxg@sbcglobal.net
> Subject: Re: Is there a way to do this...
> Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 17:44:59 -0700
>
> On 05/25/2012 04:03 AM, Alec McAllister wrote:
> > Fowler tackles this in the "Stops" section.
> >
> > He mentions two schools of thought, which he calls the conventional
> > and the logical, with the latter punctuating according to sense, i.e.
> > putting the stops outside the inverted commas except when they
> > actually form part of the quotation.
> >
> > The former appears to be more common in the USA and the latter in the
> > UK, although neither has ever been completely uniform in either
> > place.
> >
> > I was taught to punctuate according to sense during my education in
> > UK schools, during my Degree in English, during my training as an
> > English teacher and throughout my career as a teacher in the UK ...
> > so it has probably been completely superseded by whatever haphazard
> > punctuation (or lack of it) happens to be current on this week's most
> > fashionable chat-site. :-(
> >
> > Alec McAllister Leeds, UK
>
> OK, you win. :-)
>
> ...
>
>
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>
Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by NoOp <gl...@sbcglobal.net>.
On 05/25/2012 04:03 AM, Alec McAllister wrote:
> Fowler tackles this in the "Stops" section.
>
> He mentions two schools of thought, which he calls the conventional
> and the logical, with the latter punctuating according to sense, i.e.
> putting the stops outside the inverted commas except when they
> actually form part of the quotation.
>
> The former appears to be more common in the USA and the latter in the
> UK, although neither has ever been completely uniform in either
> place.
>
> I was taught to punctuate according to sense during my education in
> UK schools, during my Degree in English, during my training as an
> English teacher and throughout my career as a teacher in the UK ...
> so it has probably been completely superseded by whatever haphazard
> punctuation (or lack of it) happens to be current on this week's most
> fashionable chat-site. :-(
>
> Alec McAllister Leeds, UK
OK, you win. :-)
...
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RE: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Alec McAllister <t....@leeds.ac.uk>.
Fowler tackles this in the "Stops" section.
He mentions two schools of thought, which he calls the conventional and the logical, with the latter punctuating according to sense, i.e. putting the stops outside the inverted commas except when they actually form part of the quotation.
The former appears to be more common in the USA and the latter in the UK, although neither has ever been completely uniform in either place.
I was taught to punctuate according to sense during my education in UK schools, during my Degree in English, during my training as an English teacher and throughout my career as a teacher in the UK ... so it has probably been completely superseded by whatever haphazard punctuation (or lack of it) happens to be current on this week's most fashionable chat-site. :-(
Alec McAllister
Leeds, UK
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mike Scott [mailto:mike@scottsonline.org.uk]
> Sent: 25 May 2012 08:34
> To: ooo-users@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Is there a way to do this...
>
> On 24/05/12 23:17, Doug wrote:
> > On 05/24/2012 05:04 PM, Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
> >
> > /snip/
> >> I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe
> >> another story.
> >
> > It is standard American usage to put a comma inside, rather than
> > outside, a close quote. This differs from British usage.
>
> ?? I don't think so.
>
> He said, "hello." "Goodbye," she replied.
>
> is precisely the usage I was taught many years ago in my "English English"
> education. I'll see what Partridge and Fowler have to say if I can find them :-)
>
>
>
> --
> Mike Scott
> Harlow, Essex, England
>
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Mike Scott <mi...@scottsonline.org.uk>.
On 24/05/12 23:17, Doug wrote:
> On 05/24/2012 05:04 PM, Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>
> /snip/
>> I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another
>> story.
>
> It is standard American usage to put a comma inside, rather than outside, a
> close quote. This differs from British usage.
?? I don't think so.
He said, "hello." "Goodbye," she replied.
is precisely the usage I was taught many years ago in my "English
English" education. I'll see what Partridge and Fowler have to say if I
can find them :-)
--
Mike Scott
Harlow, Essex, England
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Doug <dm...@optonline.net>.
On 05/24/2012 05:04 PM, Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
/snip/
> I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another
> story.
It is standard American usage to put a comma inside, rather than outside, a
close quote. This differs from British usage.
/snip/
--doug
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/24 Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>:
> 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
>> On Thursday, 24 May 2012 10:55 Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>>> 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
>>> > I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is
>>> > always such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the
>>> > world over what kind of font I want to use, etc.
>>> >
>>> > One problem I often have is something like this...
>>> >
>>> > For instance, in the following sentence:
>>> >
>>> > -----
>>> > He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
>>> > -----
>>> >
>>> > There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation
>>> > marks.
>>>
>>> When you say ”apostrophe”, do you actually mean ”comma”? Because I
>>> can't see an apostrophe directly followed by a quotation mark in that
>>> example sentence.
>>>
>>
>> Oops! Sorry, yes, I meant comma.
>>
>>
>>> > In
>>> > this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to
>>> > enjoy reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the
>>> > spot and hit the spacebar all the time.
>>> >
>>> > I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very
>>> > well and then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an
>>> > apostrophe and an end quotation mark.
>>> >
>>> > I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and
>>> > would really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the
>>> > 1000+ corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual
>>> > fix, heh.
>>> >
>>> > Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself
>>> > and get ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem
>>> > well enough for someone to actually be able to help me).
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > JB
>>>
>>> I tried your example with and without regular expressions and it
>>> worked easily in both cases. Can you give another example that
>>> contains every case where you need to add a space AND every case where
>>> you don't want an extra space?
>>> If the end quotation mark is the same character as the beginning
>>> quotation mark, then it will be very difficult to create a regular
>>> expression that is able to know which one is which. If there always is
>>> a space, period or a comma after the end quotation mark, I can see a
>>> way, though. I need to know the exact rules to create something that
>>> actually works in every situation that is likely to show up.
>>>
>>>
>>> Kind regards
>>>
>>> Johnny Rosenberg
>>
>> Here are some more cut and pasted straight from the e-book examples (note also
>> not just the comma, but it happens with a period):
>>
>> -----
>> said Jonnie."Don't you follow
>>
>> “You can have my other four horses,”
>
> I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another story.
>
>> said Jonnie to Chrissie."Don't eat them;
>> they're trained.” He paused."Unless you get awful hungry, of course, like in the
>> winter.”
>>
>> "I’ve been investigating a suspicion of conspiracy to sabotage transport,” said
>> Terl."Kept me busy for the last three weeks.”
>> -----
>>
>> I hope I'm showing everything necessary to see the problem better. If you want
>> even more examples, just holler and I'll cut and paste a page if it's not too
>> big.
>>
>>
>> JB
>
> I noticed that sometimes “ and ” is used, and sometimes there is just
> a ". Is this what happens or did something just happen when copying
> the text to your post?
>
> I did some experimenting and found that the tricky part (for me who is
> not that experienced with regular expressions) is that some lines
> start with a quotation mark, either " or “.
>
> Let me know if there really is a mix of ", “ and ” in the real text.
>
>
> Kind regards
>
> Johnny Rosenberg
> ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ
In your example, this seems to work:
☒ Regular expressions
Search for: (.|,|:|;)("|“)([:alnum:])
Replace with: $1 $2$3
Things inside parentheses are ”memorised”, so the string found in the
first parenthesis can be called with $1 in the Replace with field and
so on.
So first I search for one of . , : ; followed by either a " or a “
(not a ”) followed by an alphanumeric character (a-z, A-Z, 0-9).
For example ."D is found. It will be replaced by the result of the
first pair of parentheses followed by a space followed by the two last
pair of parentheses, in this case . "D.
Try it out and see if it works for you. You can always use the undo
button to undo a ”Replace All”, for example.
If it doesn't work in all cases, maybe you can try to modify it or
write back and tell us (or at least me…) what went wrong. I am sure
there is some cases that I didn't think of…
Kind regards
Johnny Rosenberg
ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
> On Thursday, 24 May 2012 10:55 Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
>> 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
>> > I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is
>> > always such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the
>> > world over what kind of font I want to use, etc.
>> >
>> > One problem I often have is something like this...
>> >
>> > For instance, in the following sentence:
>> >
>> > -----
>> > He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
>> > -----
>> >
>> > There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation
>> > marks.
>>
>> When you say ”apostrophe”, do you actually mean ”comma”? Because I
>> can't see an apostrophe directly followed by a quotation mark in that
>> example sentence.
>>
>
> Oops! Sorry, yes, I meant comma.
>
>
>> > In
>> > this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to
>> > enjoy reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the
>> > spot and hit the spacebar all the time.
>> >
>> > I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very
>> > well and then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an
>> > apostrophe and an end quotation mark.
>> >
>> > I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and
>> > would really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the
>> > 1000+ corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual
>> > fix, heh.
>> >
>> > Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself
>> > and get ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem
>> > well enough for someone to actually be able to help me).
>> >
>> >
>> > JB
>>
>> I tried your example with and without regular expressions and it
>> worked easily in both cases. Can you give another example that
>> contains every case where you need to add a space AND every case where
>> you don't want an extra space?
>> If the end quotation mark is the same character as the beginning
>> quotation mark, then it will be very difficult to create a regular
>> expression that is able to know which one is which. If there always is
>> a space, period or a comma after the end quotation mark, I can see a
>> way, though. I need to know the exact rules to create something that
>> actually works in every situation that is likely to show up.
>>
>>
>> Kind regards
>>
>> Johnny Rosenberg
>
> Here are some more cut and pasted straight from the e-book examples (note also
> not just the comma, but it happens with a period):
>
> -----
> said Jonnie."Don't you follow
>
> “You can have my other four horses,”
I find it odd to have a comma inside a quote, but that's maybe another story.
> said Jonnie to Chrissie."Don't eat them;
> they're trained.” He paused."Unless you get awful hungry, of course, like in the
> winter.”
>
> "I’ve been investigating a suspicion of conspiracy to sabotage transport,” said
> Terl."Kept me busy for the last three weeks.”
> -----
>
> I hope I'm showing everything necessary to see the problem better. If you want
> even more examples, just holler and I'll cut and paste a page if it's not too
> big.
>
>
> JB
I noticed that sometimes “ and ” is used, and sometimes there is just
a ". Is this what happens or did something just happen when copying
the text to your post?
I did some experimenting and found that the tricky part (for me who is
not that experienced with regular expressions) is that some lines
start with a quotation mark, either " or “.
Let me know if there really is a mix of ", “ and ” in the real text.
Kind regards
Johnny Rosenberg
ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>.
On Thursday, 24 May 2012 10:55 Johnny Rosenberg wrote:
> 2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
> > I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is
> > always such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the
> > world over what kind of font I want to use, etc.
> >
> > One problem I often have is something like this...
> >
> > For instance, in the following sentence:
> >
> > -----
> > He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
> > -----
> >
> > There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation
> > marks.
>
> When you say ”apostrophe”, do you actually mean ”comma”? Because I
> can't see an apostrophe directly followed by a quotation mark in that
> example sentence.
>
Oops! Sorry, yes, I meant comma.
> > In
> > this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to
> > enjoy reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the
> > spot and hit the spacebar all the time.
> >
> > I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very
> > well and then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an
> > apostrophe and an end quotation mark.
> >
> > I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and
> > would really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the
> > 1000+ corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual
> > fix, heh.
> >
> > Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself
> > and get ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem
> > well enough for someone to actually be able to help me).
> >
> >
> > JB
>
> I tried your example with and without regular expressions and it
> worked easily in both cases. Can you give another example that
> contains every case where you need to add a space AND every case where
> you don't want an extra space?
> If the end quotation mark is the same character as the beginning
> quotation mark, then it will be very difficult to create a regular
> expression that is able to know which one is which. If there always is
> a space, period or a comma after the end quotation mark, I can see a
> way, though. I need to know the exact rules to create something that
> actually works in every situation that is likely to show up.
>
>
> Kind regards
>
> Johnny Rosenberg
Here are some more cut and pasted straight from the e-book examples (note also
not just the comma, but it happens with a period):
-----
said Jonnie."Don't you follow
“You can have my other four horses,” said Jonnie to Chrissie."Don't eat them;
they're trained.” He paused."Unless you get awful hungry, of course, like in the
winter.”
"I’ve been investigating a suspicion of conspiracy to sabotage transport,” said
Terl."Kept me busy for the last three weeks.”
-----
I hope I'm showing everything necessary to see the problem better. If you want
even more examples, just holler and I'll cut and paste a page if it's not too
big.
JB
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Re: Is there a way to do this...
Posted by Johnny Rosenberg <gu...@gmail.com>.
2012/5/24 Ima Afrotrap <af...@gmail.com>:
> I often copy and paste from e-book formats into odt simply because odt is always
> such a nice smaller file size and I have all the control in the world over what
> kind of font I want to use, etc.
>
> One problem I often have is something like this...
>
> For instance, in the following sentence:
>
> -----
> He had just said wearily,"There's no timber down there to build cabins."
> -----
>
> There's no 'space' between the apostrophe and the beginning quotation marks.
When you say ”apostrophe”, do you actually mean ”comma”? Because I
can't see an apostrophe directly followed by a quotation mark in that
example sentence.
> In
> this particular e-book, there is a *LOT* of this and I'll not be able to enjoy
> reading the book if I have to stop every 5 seconds to click on the spot and hit
> the spacebar all the time.
>
> I looked at the find/replace, but when I tried that it didn't work very well and
> then I had to *delete* a space when it put it *between an apostrophe and an end
> quotation mark.
>
> I don't understand well enough how to use the regular expressions and would
> really like to be able to use the find/replace so it can do the 1000+
> corrrections for me and I can get back to the occassional manual fix, heh.
>
> Does anyone have any idea how I can do this to make it easier on myself and get
> ahead with actual reading? (hopefully I described the problem well enough for
> someone to actually be able to help me).
>
>
> JB
I tried your example with and without regular expressions and it
worked easily in both cases. Can you give another example that
contains every case where you need to add a space AND every case where
you don't want an extra space?
If the end quotation mark is the same character as the beginning
quotation mark, then it will be very difficult to create a regular
expression that is able to know which one is which. If there always is
a space, period or a comma after the end quotation mark, I can see a
way, though. I need to know the exact rules to create something that
actually works in every situation that is likely to show up.
Kind regards
Johnny Rosenberg
ジョニー・ローゼンバーグ
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