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Posted to user@struts.apache.org by Riyad Kalla <rs...@email.arizona.edu> on 2004/04/24 17:20:58 UTC
Struts Development seems slow, info?
Hey guys,
I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a 1.2 release:
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major&bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=substring&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailreporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywords=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to them, but I
noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at
a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on
these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal
at all (slow)....
And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is waining
interest in Struts and the devs are working on other things, or if the
devs have always been this bad about communication?
Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will be) but if
Struts development support is slowing down and people are starting to
look else where, I'd just like to know for future-time-investment sake.
Thanks!
Riyad
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Riyad Kalla <rs...@email.arizona.edu>.
You know I just did this same query, but used a resolution of "Fixed,
Closed and Resolved" and got 728 bugs... WHEW WEEE!
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=RESOLVED&bug_status=VERIFIED&bug_status=CLOSED&email1=&emailtype1=substring&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailreporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&version=1.1+Final&version=Nightly+Build&short_desc=&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywords=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=Reuse+same+sort+as+last+time
Niall Pemberton wrote:
>Running a bugzilla query against Struts 1.1 and the nightly with a
>"Resolution" of "FIXED" shows 359 bugs - looks good to me :-)
>
>and this bug:
>
> http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=28150
>
>took 11 hours to get applied from being submitted!
>
>When Struts 1 beta was released the servlet spec was 2.2. Since then (about
>3 years I think) Servlet 2.3, Servlet 2.4 the JSTL and Java Server Faces
>have all come along - in the next few years who knows what the best
>technology will be to deploy - but it won't be the same as today (even if
>its still Struts) and your going to have to continually re-invest in the new
>stuff that comes along - all you can do today is decided whats the best
>solution now.
>
>Niall
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Riyad Kalla" <rs...@email.arizona.edu>
>To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <us...@struts.apache.org>
>Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:20 PM
>Subject: Struts Development seems slow, info?
>
>
>
>
>>Hey guys,
>>I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a 1.2 release:
>>
>>
>>
>http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major&bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=substring&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailreporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywords=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
>
>
>>and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to them, but I
>>noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at
>>a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on
>>these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal
>>at all (slow)....
>>
>>And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
>>anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is waining
>>interest in Struts and the devs are working on other things, or if the
>>devs have always been this bad about communication?
>>
>>Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will be) but if
>>Struts development support is slowing down and people are starting to
>>look else where, I'd just like to know for future-time-investment sake.
>>
>>Thanks!
>>Riyad
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>>For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
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>
>
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RE: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Steve Raeburn <sr...@apache.org>.
Don't worry, I didn't take your comments in a negative way.
It is worth listening to what's happening on the dev list, then you'll
know as much as anyone what's happening. There are no offline
discussions, everything happens in public, via the dev-list.
Steve
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Riyad Kalla [mailto:rsk@email.arizona.edu]
> Sent: April 24, 2004 2:26 PM
> To: Struts Users Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
>
>
> Steve,
> Thanks so much for the reply. I wanted to clarify that I READ
> day-in and
> day-out those typical "whats going on with this project? I HATE YOU"
> emails, and I really didn't intend mine to sound that way. I
> was really
> just curious about what was going on because I was new to the list
> (thanks for the tip abou subscribing to dev, I'll do that today!)
>
...
>
>
> Best wishes,
> Riyad
>
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
>
>
>
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Riyad Kalla <rs...@email.arizona.edu>.
Steve,
Thanks so much for the reply. I wanted to clarify that I READ day-in and
day-out those typical "whats going on with this project? I HATE YOU"
emails, and I really didn't intend mine to sound that way. I was really
just curious about what was going on because I was new to the list
(thanks for the tip abou subscribing to dev, I'll do that today!)
comments below:
Steve Raeburn wrote:
>Also, perhaps the question you should be asking is, "How can *I* help
>speed things up?"
>
>
Nope, I'm pretty sure my original question is what I wanted to ask :D
>Here's a couple of ideas:
>
>- Try out the Stuts 1.2.0 release and report back any problems, or
>(hopefully) report how stable and reliable it is for your applications.
>- Get the source code and try applying some of those patches that you've
>seen on the bug reports. Let us know whether they work for you.
>
>There *has* been a first 1.2.x release, it's just not considered
>production quality so we're aiming for a 1.2.1 release that hopefully
>will be. Ted & Martin, particularly, put a lot of effort into getting
>that release out, so it's not like there's nothing going on here :-)
>
>
Very cool I didn't know this. After hitting bugzilla with those queries
I'm REALLY stoked for 1.2.x (800 bug fixes? Wow -- note I realize bugs
== features in bugzilla and not all of those were defects)
>One of the misconceptions about supplying patches is that once a patch
>has been submitted, that's the end of the job. However, a committer
>still has to:
> 1) understand the original bug report and be able to reproduce the
>problem
> 2) apply the patch and *test* it for himself
>this can be quite a lot of work, even if you the patch works as
>advertised (not all do).
>
>If you also go through that process and report back that it works for
>you, the committers' confidence in the patch is increased. We still have
>to do our own testing, but if your results match ours, then we can be
>reasonably confident that the patch is good.
>
>
Yes I see your point, sorry for drawing such rash conclusions.
>To address your points, specifically:
>
>
>
>>>(a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at a time and
>>>
>>>
>
>I don't think that's uncommon in any software project. Some things get
>fixed quickly because they're easy or urgent; others take a while. Only
>recently, I noticed a bug for Mozilla that has been open for 4 *years*
>:-) That doesn't mean Mozilla is a bad product or isn't being actively
>developed, just that they had other priorities.
>
>
Again, definately right. What triggered the questions was that I was
using THAT list as a gauge to see when 1.2 was comming out, and for the
last month (maybe more) that list has closed 1 bug and added 2... so I
was like "what the heck's going on here with progress?". I had no idea
about the already closed bugs, OR the dev lists... again, it was an
uneducated comment on my part.
>
>
>>>(b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on these
>>>
>>>
>bugs and
>
>So only a few people are doing all the work? And you wonder why
>everything isn't done immediately!
>
>
Oh absolutely, I just figured with Struts being such a high profile
project that there would be more people. So combined with my comment
above, I thought most of the devs had gone onto something else, or
stopped contributing... either way I was wrong and you are all working
very hard.
>
>
>>>(c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal at all
>>>
>>>
>(slow)....
>
>I don't agree with you on this (or maybe I misunderstand). Communication
>on the Struts project seems to be very good, to me. We have an excellent
>user list, an active developer list and lots of communication via
>bugzilla. Don't forget that some discussion about open issues may move
>from bugzilla to the dev list, or the user list. It's worth monitoring
>dev, if you're interested in where things are going.
>
>
This is my mistake, I should have checked the lists.
>Lastly, don't forget that nobody gets paid to develop Struts. We all
>have to work full-time jobs to make a living. Struts is what we do for
>relaxation on the weekends :-)
>
>
We ALL appreciate it, but this is also what probably all of us on this
list, along with 20,000 other developers around the globe do on our
weekends and for relaxaction and I think we would be thrilled if a
community formed around any of our hobby projects (not to say Struts is
a hobby, but you get the point).
>Now everyone repeat after me, "The next version will be released 'When
>It's Ready'" ;-)
>
>
That's fine by me, I almost went crazy trying to convince the NetBeans
development team to adopt a release cycle like the Jakarta projects:
release when the bugs are fixed. Then I finally realized that my efforts
were equivalent to putting a saddle on a rock and trying to ride it in a
race.
Again I really appreciate the reply, I'll get myself up to speed more
approrpiately before asking sweeping questions like that in the future.
Best wishes,
Riyad
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RE: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Steve Raeburn <sr...@apache.org>.
p.s. The fact that you're hassling us for a release in IMHO, A Good
Thing (tm). It's when nobody cares anymore, that I'll get worried :-)
Steve
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RE: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Steve Raeburn <sr...@apache.org>.
Also, perhaps the question you should be asking is, "How can *I* help
speed things up?"
Here's a couple of ideas:
- Try out the Stuts 1.2.0 release and report back any problems, or
(hopefully) report how stable and reliable it is for your applications.
- Get the source code and try applying some of those patches that you've
seen on the bug reports. Let us know whether they work for you.
There *has* been a first 1.2.x release, it's just not considered
production quality so we're aiming for a 1.2.1 release that hopefully
will be. Ted & Martin, particularly, put a lot of effort into getting
that release out, so it's not like there's nothing going on here :-)
One of the misconceptions about supplying patches is that once a patch
has been submitted, that's the end of the job. However, a committer
still has to:
1) understand the original bug report and be able to reproduce the
problem
2) apply the patch and *test* it for himself
this can be quite a lot of work, even if you the patch works as
advertised (not all do).
If you also go through that process and report back that it works for
you, the committers' confidence in the patch is increased. We still have
to do our own testing, but if your results match ours, then we can be
reasonably confident that the patch is good.
To address your points, specifically:
>> (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at a time and
I don't think that's uncommon in any software project. Some things get
fixed quickly because they're easy or urgent; others take a while. Only
recently, I noticed a bug for Mozilla that has been open for 4 *years*
:-) That doesn't mean Mozilla is a bad product or isn't being actively
developed, just that they had other priorities.
>> (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on these
bugs and
So only a few people are doing all the work? And you wonder why
everything isn't done immediately!
>> (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal at all
(slow)....
I don't agree with you on this (or maybe I misunderstand). Communication
on the Struts project seems to be very good, to me. We have an excellent
user list, an active developer list and lots of communication via
bugzilla. Don't forget that some discussion about open issues may move
from bugzilla to the dev list, or the user list. It's worth monitoring
dev, if you're interested in where things are going.
Lastly, don't forget that nobody gets paid to develop Struts. We all
have to work full-time jobs to make a living. Struts is what we do for
relaxation on the weekends :-)
Now everyone repeat after me, "The next version will be released 'When
It's Ready'" ;-)
Steve
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Riyad Kalla [mailto:rsk@email.arizona.edu]
> Sent: April 24, 2004 12:10 PM
> To: Struts Users Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
>
>
>
>
> Niall Pemberton wrote:
>
> >Running a bugzilla query against Struts 1.1 and the nightly with a
> >"Resolution" of "FIXED" shows 359 bugs - looks good to me :-)
> >
> >
> Ahh your query is a lot more impressive than mine ;)
>
> >and this bug:
> >
> > http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=28150
> >
> >took 11 hours to get applied from being submitted!
> >
> >When Struts 1 beta was released the servlet spec was 2.2.
> Since then (about
> >3 years I think) Servlet 2.3, Servlet 2.4 the JSTL and Java
> Server Faces
> >have all come along - in the next few years who knows what the best
> >technology will be to deploy - but it won't be the same as
> today (even if
> >its still Struts) and your going to have to continually
> re-invest in the new
> >stuff that comes along - all you can do today is decided
> whats the best
> >solution now.
> >
> >
> Yes this is certainly true. But I felt we were at an apex right now,
> between Old/New... JSF being the new golden child that I
> haven't really
> seen anyone use yet so we could figure out if it really was
> going to be
> "all that"... I was just curious. Thank you for the feedback.
>
> >Niall
> >
> >
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Riyad Kalla" <rs...@email.arizona.edu>
> >To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <us...@struts.apache.org>
> >Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:20 PM
> >Subject: Struts Development seems slow, info?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>Hey guys,
> >>I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a
> 1.2 release:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=UNCO
> NFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED
> &bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major
> &bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=sub
> string&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailr
> eporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfield
> from=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&s
> hort_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwor
> dssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywor
> ds=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&valu
> e0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
> >
> >
> >>and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to
> them, but I
> >>noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out
> for months at
> >>a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and
> over again on
> >>these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not
> very verbal
> >>at all (slow)....
> >>
> >>And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
> >>anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if
> there is waining
> >>interest in Struts and the devs are working on other
> things, or if the
> >>devs have always been this bad about communication?
> >>
> >>Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will
> be) but if
> >>Struts development support is slowing down and people are
> starting to
> >>look else where, I'd just like to know for
> future-time-investment sake.
> >>
> >>Thanks!
> >>Riyad
> >>
> >>------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------
> >>To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> >>For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> >For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
> >
> >
> >
>
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>
>
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Riyad Kalla <rs...@email.arizona.edu>.
Niall Pemberton wrote:
>Running a bugzilla query against Struts 1.1 and the nightly with a
>"Resolution" of "FIXED" shows 359 bugs - looks good to me :-)
>
>
Ahh your query is a lot more impressive than mine ;)
>and this bug:
>
> http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=28150
>
>took 11 hours to get applied from being submitted!
>
>When Struts 1 beta was released the servlet spec was 2.2. Since then (about
>3 years I think) Servlet 2.3, Servlet 2.4 the JSTL and Java Server Faces
>have all come along - in the next few years who knows what the best
>technology will be to deploy - but it won't be the same as today (even if
>its still Struts) and your going to have to continually re-invest in the new
>stuff that comes along - all you can do today is decided whats the best
>solution now.
>
>
Yes this is certainly true. But I felt we were at an apex right now,
between Old/New... JSF being the new golden child that I haven't really
seen anyone use yet so we could figure out if it really was going to be
"all that"... I was just curious. Thank you for the feedback.
>Niall
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Riyad Kalla" <rs...@email.arizona.edu>
>To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <us...@struts.apache.org>
>Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:20 PM
>Subject: Struts Development seems slow, info?
>
>
>
>
>>Hey guys,
>>I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a 1.2 release:
>>
>>
>>
>http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major&bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=substring&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailreporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywords=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
>
>
>>and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to them, but I
>>noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at
>>a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on
>>these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal
>>at all (slow)....
>>
>>And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
>>anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is waining
>>interest in Struts and the devs are working on other things, or if the
>>devs have always been this bad about communication?
>>
>>Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will be) but if
>>Struts development support is slowing down and people are starting to
>>look else where, I'd just like to know for future-time-investment sake.
>>
>>Thanks!
>>Riyad
>>
>>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>>For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
>
>
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Niall Pemberton <ni...@blueyonder.co.uk>.
Running a bugzilla query against Struts 1.1 and the nightly with a
"Resolution" of "FIXED" shows 359 bugs - looks good to me :-)
and this bug:
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=28150
took 11 hours to get applied from being submitted!
When Struts 1 beta was released the servlet spec was 2.2. Since then (about
3 years I think) Servlet 2.3, Servlet 2.4 the JSTL and Java Server Faces
have all come along - in the next few years who knows what the best
technology will be to deploy - but it won't be the same as today (even if
its still Struts) and your going to have to continually re-invest in the new
stuff that comes along - all you can do today is decided whats the best
solution now.
Niall
----- Original Message -----
From: "Riyad Kalla" <rs...@email.arizona.edu>
To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <us...@struts.apache.org>
Sent: Saturday, April 24, 2004 4:20 PM
Subject: Struts Development seems slow, info?
> Hey guys,
> I've been looking at this for a while as an indicator of a 1.2 release:
>
http://issues.apache.org/bugzilla/buglist.cgi?bug_status=UNCONFIRMED&bug_status=NEW&bug_status=ASSIGNED&bug_status=REOPENED&bug_severity=Blocker&bug_severity=Critical&bug_severity=Major&bug_severity=Normal&bug_severity=Minor&email1=&emailtype1=substring&emailassigned_to1=1&email2=&emailtype2=substring&emailreporter2=1&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&changedin=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&product=Struts&short_desc=&short_desc_type=allwordssubstr&long_desc=&long_desc_type=allwordssubstr&bug_file_loc=&bug_file_loc_type=allwordssubstr&keywords=&keywords_type=anywords&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=&cmdtype=doit&order=bugs.bug_id
>
> and MOST of these bugs actually have solutions attached to them, but I
> noticed that (a) they don't seem to be getting closed out for months at
> a time and (b) I see the same developer name(s) over and over again on
> these bugs and (c) the communication over the bugs are not very verbal
> at all (slow)....
>
> And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering if
> anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is waining
> interest in Struts and the devs are working on other things, or if the
> devs have always been this bad about communication?
>
> Not to say that JSF is the future (I have no idea what will be) but if
> Struts development support is slowing down and people are starting to
> look else where, I'd just like to know for future-time-investment sake.
>
> Thanks!
> Riyad
>
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RE: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Steve Raeburn <sr...@apache.org>.
Fixed. Thanks for pointing it out.
I'd like to think that it was someone who just had problems editing the
page, rather than anything deliberate.
But just in case, Mr. 200-148-19-85.dsl.telesp.net.br, we know who you
are!!
Steve
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michael McGrady [mailto:mike@michaelmcgrady.com]
> Sent: April 25, 2004 7:53 PM
> To: Struts Users Mailing List; Struts Users Mailing List
> Subject: Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
>
>
> Someone has trashed the StrutsCatalog on the StrutsWiki.
> What's up with
> that? How do we contact a person to roll the wiki back to
> b.c. (before creep)?
>
>
>
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
On Sun, 25 Apr 2004 19:53:14 -0700, Michael McGrady wrote:
> Someone has trashed the StrutsCatalog on the StrutsWiki. What's up
> with that? How do we contact a person to roll the wiki back to
> b.c. (before creep)?
Whenever you have a definite issue to report with anything relating to the Struts project, the best thing is to file a report in Bugzilla.
Whenever you are unsure if something is an issue, or want to discuss whether and how something might be changed, the best thing is to post to the Dev list.
-Ted.
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Michael McGrady <mi...@michaelmcgrady.com>.
Someone has trashed the StrutsCatalog on the StrutsWiki. What's up with
that? How do we contact a person to roll the wiki back to b.c. (before creep)?
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Riyad Kalla <rs...@email.arizona.edu>.
Wow Ted, that was a very detailed (and interesting) update and roadmap
for Struts! I'm excited to see so much innovation still occuring even
after you've 'solved the problem' so to speak. Thank you for taking the
time to reply in such detail!
Ted Husted wrote:
>On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 08:20:58 -0700, Riyad Kalla wrote:
>
>
>>And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering
>>if anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is
>>waining interest in Struts and the devs are working on other
>>things, or if the devs have always been this bad about
>>communication?
>>
>>
>
>I don't know if we are "bad" about communication, but, yes, it's always been like this :)
>
>At any given time, there may be one to five of us that are doing most of the work. Which ones it is lately changes over time. A couple of years ago, Craig used to make nearly all of the source code commits. Nowadays several us make them, and everyone pitches in where they can. But, yes, it is the same-old, same-old around here :)
>
>Our formal release have always been few and between. It was over a year to the first 1.0 release, and then something like a year and a half to the 1.1 release. We've already made the first 1.2.x release, and the second will be along as soon as the Commons Validator stabilizes. So, we're actually improving on that score.
>
>Of late, some of our energy has been directed to elevating Struts to a top-level project. Once we have a stable 1.2.x release out the door, we start subdividing the project so that we don't have to release everything at once. We plan on having separate subprojects for the Core, Taglibs, and some other goodies. One of the things that have kept the releases far between is that we have to have everything just right all at once in order to release anything at all. No easy task for a web framework that people describe as being "larger than many J2EE containers".
>
>We have been moving forward with some exciting changes. The "composable request processor" we have ready to release with the 1.3.x series will open a lot of doors for a lot teams. The "Struts Chain" component makes it very easy for teams to decide exactly how the request is processed. Essentially, Struts will become a framework for writing frameworks. I also think that people will find (as I have) that the Commons Chain is a wonderful way to write a business facade.
>
>The recent addition of "wild card" mappings is also very exciting. Wildcards makes it possible for people to write much smaller configuration files. I think I've also convinced Don Brown to add his scriptable Action to the core distribution, so you will be able to write Actions using any BSF language, like Python.
>
>What I'm most excited about is the increasing number of high-quality patches we've been receiving and applying. The enhanced support for modules in Struts 1.2.x came directly from a developer, along with several others we've applied lately. The wiki is really taking off too, which, I think, is the best proof of a vital community.
>
>Yes, the dev work does seem glacial at times. As others have mentioned, it's a volunteer project, so after we've put in a full days work, we try to find another hour to work on Struts. But we do keep chipping away. (Or, as my mother used to say, we keep on keeping on.) It is true that a lot of the Committers are quite busy right now, and so it may be time to bring in new blood. But, again, that's nothing we haven't done before.
>
>Stay tuned :)
>
>-Ted.
>
>http://freeroller.net/page/TedHusted/Weblog
>
>
>
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Re: Struts Development seems slow, info?
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 24 Apr 2004 08:20:58 -0700, Riyad Kalla wrote:
> And I know that all projects work differently, so I was wondering
> if anyone knew or heard (maybe even from the dev list) if there is
> waining interest in Struts and the devs are working on other
> things, or if the devs have always been this bad about
> communication?
I don't know if we are "bad" about communication, but, yes, it's always been like this :)
At any given time, there may be one to five of us that are doing most of the work. Which ones it is lately changes over time. A couple of years ago, Craig used to make nearly all of the source code commits. Nowadays several us make them, and everyone pitches in where they can. But, yes, it is the same-old, same-old around here :)
Our formal release have always been few and between. It was over a year to the first 1.0 release, and then something like a year and a half to the 1.1 release. We've already made the first 1.2.x release, and the second will be along as soon as the Commons Validator stabilizes. So, we're actually improving on that score.
Of late, some of our energy has been directed to elevating Struts to a top-level project. Once we have a stable 1.2.x release out the door, we start subdividing the project so that we don't have to release everything at once. We plan on having separate subprojects for the Core, Taglibs, and some other goodies. One of the things that have kept the releases far between is that we have to have everything just right all at once in order to release anything at all. No easy task for a web framework that people describe as being "larger than many J2EE containers".
We have been moving forward with some exciting changes. The "composable request processor" we have ready to release with the 1.3.x series will open a lot of doors for a lot teams. The "Struts Chain" component makes it very easy for teams to decide exactly how the request is processed. Essentially, Struts will become a framework for writing frameworks. I also think that people will find (as I have) that the Commons Chain is a wonderful way to write a business facade.
The recent addition of "wild card" mappings is also very exciting. Wildcards makes it possible for people to write much smaller configuration files. I think I've also convinced Don Brown to add his scriptable Action to the core distribution, so you will be able to write Actions using any BSF language, like Python.
What I'm most excited about is the increasing number of high-quality patches we've been receiving and applying. The enhanced support for modules in Struts 1.2.x came directly from a developer, along with several others we've applied lately. The wiki is really taking off too, which, I think, is the best proof of a vital community.
Yes, the dev work does seem glacial at times. As others have mentioned, it's a volunteer project, so after we've put in a full days work, we try to find another hour to work on Struts. But we do keep chipping away. (Or, as my mother used to say, we keep on keeping on.) It is true that a lot of the Committers are quite busy right now, and so it may be time to bring in new blood. But, again, that's nothing we haven't done before.
Stay tuned :)
-Ted.
http://freeroller.net/page/TedHusted/Weblog
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