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Posted to users@cloudstack.apache.org by Josh Davis <cl...@outlook.com> on 2016/02/27 02:00:49 UTC
Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
I have been tinkering about cloudstack but every single guide seems to be centered around the public IPs being NATed to the guest VMs. To be honest the more I think about it the more I get confused so I'm posting here in hopes that someone will guide me through this.
I have tried to pen down what I'm looking for and I hope it's clear enough:- I have a block of public routable IPs which I want to assign to individual VMs- These VMs run linux and are intended to function as web servers- I have no need for inter-VM private interactions except for via the public network- These VMs all reside in a single cloudstack cloud for high availability and resource balancing- The HVs in the cloud are connected to a central SAN running iSCSI- The HVs run XenServer
I'm confused with:- Do I set the guest network as the public IP range?- Internal DNS = Public DNS?- Does the management server need to have access to the storage network?- Why don't I have the option to choose iSCSI when I try to add a primary storage?- Basically everything
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>.
Thanks.
Ron
On 06/03/2016 7:39 AM, Paul Angus wrote:
> Ron,
>
> I've created a Jira Bug for this:
>
> https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-9301
>
> and pasted your description straight in.
>
> I can't pick it up this week, but if no one else does I'll pick it up
> the week after. We do a lot of training around this so we'll have
> various material which I can use.
>
>
>
>
> ShapeBlue <http://www.shapeblue.com>
> Paul Angus
> VP Technology , ShapeBlue
>
> d: *+44 203 617 0528 | s: +44 203 603 0540*
> <tel:+44%20203%20617%200528%20%7C%20s:%20+44%20203%20603%200540>
> | m: *+44 7711 418784* <tel:+44%207711%20418784>
>
> e: *paul.angus@shapeblue.com | t: @cloudyangus*
> <ma...@cloudyangus> | w:
> *www.shapeblue.com* <http://www.shapeblue.com>
>
> a: 53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden London WC2N 4HS UK
>
> Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue
> Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated
> under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda
> is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from
> Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The
> Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue
> Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are
> intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed.
> Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do
> not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related
> companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you
> must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show
> it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have
> received this email in error.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
> Sent: 04 March 2016 14:27
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>
>
> I sent the following on Dec 15 2015 to the dev list
>
>
> To my knowledge no one took any interest at the time but perhaps we
> could work on this or point out where I am too picky.
>
> Ron
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> http://docs.cloudstack.apache.org/en/latest/concepts.html#deployment-architecture-overview
> Network section is really unclear.
>
> In about Physical Networking there are 4 Traffic types defined Guest,
> Management, Public and Storage.
>
> Later on the term "Direct IP range" is used but never defined. "These
> IPs are in the same VLAN as the hosts." is added without any
> explanation of what this means or how this relates to various traffic
> types or any statement about what VLAN the hosts are in or where their
> addresses come from.
>
> In Advanced Networking it says "The hosts in a pod are assigned
> private IP addresses. These are typically RFC1918 addresses."
> Is this different than in Basic Networking? Why is it important in
> Advanced Networking but not required in Basic. Is it not true for both?
>
> In the next paragraph it says:
> "For zones with advanced networking, we recommend provisioning enough
> private IPs for your total number of customers, plus enough for the
> required CloudStack System VMs.
> Typically, about 10 additional IPs are required for the System VMs."
>
> How is this different in Basic Network?
>
> What has the importance of "customers"? They are never defined or
> mentioned earlier and has no relationship to physical hosts as near as
> I can tell from my understanding of "customers" and "hosts".
>
> I am not sure how one decides if you are "typical" or what would make
> your situation require more or less.
> Perhaps it should be a bit more definite "Allow at least 10 IPS for
> the SYSTEM VMs unless you xxx xxx xxx in which case you will need on
> for each yyy"
>
> System VMs are very poorly defined earlier in the Traffic type section.
> "system VMs (VMs used by CloudStack to perform various tasks in the
> cloud), and any other component that communicates directly with the
> CloudStack Management Server. You must configure the IP range for the
> system VMs to use."
> "Various tasks " could hardly be more vague. Surely someone must have
> a list or a count with a link to the reference section.
> The last sentence about assigning IP addresses System VMs is confusing
> in a paragraph about Traffic Types and should be omitted since it will
> be discussed later when IP addresses are discussed.
>
> It seems to me that there should be a reorganization of this section
> with a clear statement of all the things that are true for both Basic
> and Advanced with careful attention paid to vocabulary and proper
> definition of new buzzwords as they are added.
> Then differentiate the handling of Basic vs Advanced in 2 sections
> that are clearly written in a parallel structure and sequence so it is
> easy to see what the difference is.
>
> This is an important section and should be an overview.
> There are too many references to exceptions related to specific
> hardware or hypervisors.
> If these have to be in the overview, they should be as footnotes or
> special sections at the end of the overview.
>
> Some simple diagrams should be included to make the network topology
> and IP address assignments clearer.
> Networking is an important part of Cloudstack and is the source of a
> lot more confusion that the hierarchy of hosts to region which include
> 4 diagrams.
>
>
> I hope that this helps.
>
> Ron
>
> --
> Ron Wheeler
> President
> Artifact Software Inc
> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>
>
>
>
>
> On 03/03/2016 11:33 PM, Sanjeev Neelarapu wrote:
> > Hi Ron,
> >
> > It would be helpful for all the users in the community if you can
> specify what changes needs to be done for the cloudstack documents to
> get way with the confusions about the networking.
> > If you specify what problems you have faced while setting up the
> cloudstack that would also be helpful.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Sanjeev
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
> > Sent: Friday, March 04, 2016 12:32 AM
> > To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
> >
> > I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> > There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me
> for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were
> given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
> > I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> > I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
> >
> > I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in
> a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
> >
> > The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that
> I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the
> truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> > I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
> though I have asked several times.
> >
> > It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and
> someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write the
> code can figure out what to do.
> >
> > The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation
> is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> > They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball
> cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> > They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the
> main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
> >
> > That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
> documentation just because we are all human.
> >
> > They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> > The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a
> developer in order to get this to work.
> >
> > In my case, I really need to get some internal applications
> (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.)
> running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to manage.
> I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of other
> systems - just want simple low volume services to support my
> supporting of their users.
> >
> > I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
> transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers if
> Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and run
> docker nicely.
> >
> > I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at
> Google or Amazon.
> >
> > This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is
> not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by
> mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who
> have to support all of the operations requirements and help developers
> and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
> >
> > Ron
> >
> >
> > On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> >> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
> >>
> >>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
> limited
> >> knowledge of networking concepts.
> >>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> >> every company has different service
> >>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> >> different underlying needs.
> >> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
> >>
> >> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> routable ips"
> >> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage
> routing and
> >> secondary storage
> >> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> configuration
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY
> need some
> >> functionality within an advanced
> >>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need
> to have
> >> a good understanding of layer 2/3
> >>> networking.
> >>>
> >> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I
> skipped basic
> >> zone and used advanced zone
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> --
> Ron Wheeler
> President
> Artifact Software Inc
> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>
> Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related
> services:
> IaaS Cloud Design & Build
> <http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//> | CSForge – rapid
> IaaS deployment framework <http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> CloudStack Consulting <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/> |
> CloudStack Software Engineering
> <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> CloudStack Infrastructure Support
> <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/> | CloudStack
> Bootcamp Training Courses <http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
RE: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Paul Angus <pa...@shapeblue.com>.
Ron,
I've created a Jira Bug for this:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-9301
and pasted your description straight in.
I can't pick it up this week, but if no one else does I'll pick it up the week after. We do a lot of training around this so we'll have various material which I can use.
[ShapeBlue]<http://www.shapeblue.com>
Paul Angus
VP Technology , ShapeBlue
d: +44 203 617 0528 | s: +44 203 603 0540<tel:+44%20203%20617%200528%20|%20s:%20+44%20203%20603%200540> | m: +44 7711 418784<tel:+44%207711%20418784>
e: paul.angus@shapeblue.com | t: @cloudyangus<ma...@cloudyangus> | w: www.shapeblue.com<http://www.shapeblue.com>
a: 53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden London WC2N 4HS UK
[cid:imagebe6be1.png@ae0635ad.43a613a5]
Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error.
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
Sent: 04 March 2016 14:27
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
I sent the following on Dec 15 2015 to the dev list
To my knowledge no one took any interest at the time but perhaps we could work on this or point out where I am too picky.
Ron
------------------------------------
http://docs.cloudstack.apache.org/en/latest/concepts.html#deployment-architecture-overview
Network section is really unclear.
In about Physical Networking there are 4 Traffic types defined Guest, Management, Public and Storage.
Later on the term "Direct IP range" is used but never defined. "These IPs are in the same VLAN as the hosts." is added without any explanation of what this means or how this relates to various traffic types or any statement about what VLAN the hosts are in or where their addresses come from.
In Advanced Networking it says "The hosts in a pod are assigned private IP addresses. These are typically RFC1918 addresses."
Is this different than in Basic Networking? Why is it important in Advanced Networking but not required in Basic. Is it not true for both?
In the next paragraph it says:
"For zones with advanced networking, we recommend provisioning enough private IPs for your total number of customers, plus enough for the required CloudStack System VMs.
Typically, about 10 additional IPs are required for the System VMs."
How is this different in Basic Network?
What has the importance of "customers"? They are never defined or mentioned earlier and has no relationship to physical hosts as near as I can tell from my understanding of "customers" and "hosts".
I am not sure how one decides if you are "typical" or what would make your situation require more or less.
Perhaps it should be a bit more definite "Allow at least 10 IPS for the SYSTEM VMs unless you xxx xxx xxx in which case you will need on for each yyy"
System VMs are very poorly defined earlier in the Traffic type section.
"system VMs (VMs used by CloudStack to perform various tasks in the cloud), and any other component that communicates directly with the CloudStack Management Server. You must configure the IP range for the system VMs to use."
"Various tasks " could hardly be more vague. Surely someone must have a list or a count with a link to the reference section.
The last sentence about assigning IP addresses System VMs is confusing in a paragraph about Traffic Types and should be omitted since it will be discussed later when IP addresses are discussed.
It seems to me that there should be a reorganization of this section with a clear statement of all the things that are true for both Basic and Advanced with careful attention paid to vocabulary and proper definition of new buzzwords as they are added.
Then differentiate the handling of Basic vs Advanced in 2 sections that are clearly written in a parallel structure and sequence so it is easy to see what the difference is.
This is an important section and should be an overview.
There are too many references to exceptions related to specific hardware or hypervisors.
If these have to be in the overview, they should be as footnotes or special sections at the end of the overview.
Some simple diagrams should be included to make the network topology and IP address assignments clearer.
Networking is an important part of Cloudstack and is the source of a lot more confusion that the hierarchy of hosts to region which include 4 diagrams.
I hope that this helps.
Ron
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
On 03/03/2016 11:33 PM, Sanjeev Neelarapu wrote:
> Hi Ron,
>
> It would be helpful for all the users in the community if you can specify what changes needs to be done for the cloudstack documents to get way with the confusions about the networking.
> If you specify what problems you have faced while setting up the cloudstack that would also be helpful.
>
> Thanks,
> Sanjeev
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2016 12:32 AM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>
> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>
> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>
> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even though I have asked several times.
>
> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can figure out what to do.
>
> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>
> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with documentation just because we are all human.
>
> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer in order to get this to work.
>
> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>
> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1 transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>
> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google or Amazon.
>
> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support all of the operations requirements and help developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>>
>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
>> every company has different service
>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
>> different underlying needs.
>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>>
>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
>> secondary storage
>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
>>
>>
>>
>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
>> functionality within an advanced
>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>>> networking.
>>>
>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
>> zone and used advanced zone
>>
>>
>>
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services:
IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//> | CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/> | CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/> | CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>.
I sent the following on Dec 15 2015 to the dev list
To my knowledge no one took any interest at the time but perhaps we
could work on this or point out where I am too picky.
Ron
------------------------------------
http://docs.cloudstack.apache.org/en/latest/concepts.html#deployment-architecture-overview
Network section is really unclear.
In about Physical Networking there are 4 Traffic types defined
Guest, Management, Public and Storage.
Later on the term "Direct IP range" is used but never defined. "These
IPs are in the same VLAN as the hosts." is added without any explanation
of what this means or how this relates to various traffic types or any
statement about what VLAN the hosts are in or where their addresses come
from.
In Advanced Networking it says "The hosts in a pod are assigned private
IP addresses. These are typically RFC1918 addresses."
Is this different than in Basic Networking? Why is it important in
Advanced Networking but not required in Basic. Is it not true for both?
In the next paragraph it says:
"For zones with advanced networking, we recommend provisioning enough
private IPs for your total number of customers, plus enough for the
required CloudStack System VMs.
Typically, about 10 additional IPs are required for the System VMs."
How is this different in Basic Network?
What has the importance of "customers"? They are never defined or
mentioned earlier and has no relationship to physical hosts as near as I
can tell from my understanding of "customers" and "hosts".
I am not sure how one decides if you are "typical" or what would make
your situation require more or less.
Perhaps it should be a bit more definite "Allow at least 10 IPS for the
SYSTEM VMs unless you xxx xxx xxx in which case you will need on for
each yyy"
System VMs are very poorly defined earlier in the Traffic type section.
"system VMs (VMs used by CloudStack to perform various tasks in the
cloud), and any other component that communicates directly with the
CloudStack Management Server. You must configure the IP range for the
system VMs to use."
"Various tasks " could hardly be more vague. Surely someone must have a
list or a count with a link to the reference section.
The last sentence about assigning IP addresses System VMs is confusing
in a paragraph about Traffic Types and should be omitted since it will
be discussed later when IP addresses are discussed.
It seems to me that there should be a reorganization of this section
with a clear statement of all the things that are true for both Basic
and Advanced with careful attention paid to vocabulary and proper
definition of new buzzwords as they are added.
Then differentiate the handling of Basic vs Advanced in 2 sections that
are clearly written in a parallel structure and sequence so it is easy
to see what the difference is.
This is an important section and should be an overview.
There are too many references to exceptions related to specific hardware
or hypervisors.
If these have to be in the overview, they should be as footnotes or
special sections at the end of the overview.
Some simple diagrams should be included to make the network topology and
IP address assignments clearer.
Networking is an important part of Cloudstack and is the source of a lot
more confusion that the hierarchy of hosts to region which include 4
diagrams.
I hope that this helps.
Ron
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
On 03/03/2016 11:33 PM, Sanjeev Neelarapu wrote:
> Hi Ron,
>
> It would be helpful for all the users in the community if you can specify what changes needs to be done for the cloudstack documents to get way with the confusions about the networking.
> If you specify what problems you have faced while setting up the cloudstack that would also be helpful.
>
> Thanks,
> Sanjeev
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2016 12:32 AM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>
> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>
> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>
> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even though I have asked several times.
>
> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can figure out what to do.
>
> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>
> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with documentation just because we are all human.
>
> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer in order to get this to work.
>
> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>
> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1 transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>
> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google or Amazon.
>
> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support all of the operations requirements and help developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>>
>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
>> every company has different service
>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
>> different underlying needs.
>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>>
>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
>> secondary storage
>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
>>
>>
>>
>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
>> functionality within an advanced
>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>>> networking.
>>>
>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
>> zone and used advanced zone
>>
>>
>>
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
RE: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Sanjeev Neelarapu <sa...@accelerite.com>.
Hi Ron,
It would be helpful for all the users in the community if you can specify what changes needs to be done for the cloudstack documents to get way with the confusions about the networking.
If you specify what problems you have faced while setting up the cloudstack that would also be helpful.
Thanks,
Sanjeev
-----Original Message-----
From: Ron Wheeler [mailto:rwheeler@artifact-software.com]
Sent: Friday, March 04, 2016 12:32 AM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even though I have asked several times.
It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can figure out what to do.
The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with documentation just because we are all human.
They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer in order to get this to work.
In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1 transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and run docker nicely.
I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google or Amazon.
This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support all of the operations requirements and help developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
Ron
On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>
>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> every company has different service
>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> different underlying needs.
> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>
> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
> secondary storage
> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
>
>
>
>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
> functionality within an advanced
>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> networking.
>>
> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
> zone and used advanced zone
>
>
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
DISCLAIMER
==========
This e-mail may contain privileged and confidential information which is the property of Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business. It is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, retain, copy, print, distribute or use this message. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender and delete all copies of this message. Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business does not accept any liability for virus infected mails.
RE: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Glenn Wagner <gl...@shapeblue.com>.
Hi Josh,
Once you have done that , could you paste your management server logs to pastbin,
We are looking at the time around the deployment of the system vm's, if there is a failure it will be an exception (ERROR message)
Regards
Glenn
Regards,
Glenn Wagner
glenn.wagner@shapeblue.com
www.shapeblue.com
2nd Floor, Oudehuis Centre, 122 Main Rd, Somerset West, Cape Town 7130South Africa
@shapeblue
-----Original Message-----
From: Sanjeev Neelarapu [mailto:sanjeev.neelarapu@accelerite.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 10 May 2016 8:44 AM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: RE: System VMs keeps failing to start
Hi Josh,
Since you are using clustered management server with HA, make sure that you have set the global setting parameter "host" to the load balance/virtual IP address. If not, please set , restart management server and destroy system vms.
Best Regards,
Sanjeev N
Chief Product Engineer, Accelerite
Off: +91 40 6722 9368 | EMail: sanjeev.neelarapu@accelerite.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Abhinandan Prateek [mailto:abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com]
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2016 4:46 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
System VM connect back to management server on port 8250. Some of the other ports to be aware of are here : https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Ports+used+by+CloudStack
On 04/03/16, 4:28 PM, "cloudstackhelp@outlook.com" <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>Before I dig through that I was just wondering if maybe it's really just a networking issue. Here's how my network is setup right now:
>
>
>a. Management server cluster running galera sitting behind a gateway that NATs port 8080 to a HAproxy load balancer. All public traffic that is a result from MS requests get allowed through. Everything else is rejected.
>
>
>b. Xenserver HVs with 4 NICs connected to 4 different switches:
>
>1. L3 switch with connection to internet (public subnet)
>
>2. L2 switch for management network which is connected to the MS
>cluster and the secondary NFS share (192.168.2.0/24)
>
>3. L2 switch for storage network where the EQL SAN sits on
>(192.168.10.0/24)
>
>4. L2 switch for the guest network (10.10.1.0/16)
>
>
>I'm not too sure if I'm doing stuff wrongly.
>
>
>Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:07 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
>above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service,
>rename the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go
>through their life cycle... stop the management server and post that.
>Whatever works best for you.
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina"
>> <ae...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
>> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
>> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify
>> what part of the process is failing...
>>
>> Ahmad E
>>
>> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
>> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for
>> > each
>> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a
>> dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud
>> link local network but the link status is <none>
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > Josh
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
>> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Josh,
>> >
>> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)?
>> > If so, I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management
>> > server and
>> the
>> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
>> public
>> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
>> I
>> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted
>> > CloudStack will try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again
>> > (so no worries should be had there). If you're able to time it
>> > correctly, you can stop the management service before the system
>> > vm's get shut down and log into them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
>> > that would be a good first step.
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Ron and all,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this
>> >> may
>> take
>> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems
>> >> to
>> want
>> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I
>> >> can't
>> start
>> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My
>> >> networks are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating.
>> >> Sending this via phone.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
>> details:
>> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Thanks in advance!
>> >>
>> >> Josh
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me
>> >> for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were
>> >> given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple
>> >> domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>> >>
>> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack
>> >> in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>> >>
>> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear
>> >> that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure
>> >> out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept
>> >> even though I have asked several times.
>> >>
>> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and
>> >> someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write
>> >> the code can figure out what to do.
>> >>
>> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user
>> >> documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball
>> >> cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of
>> >> the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>> >>
>> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> >> documentation just because we are all human.
>> >>
>> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in
>> >> the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a
>> >> developer in order to get this to work.
>> >>
>> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications
>> >> (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.)
>> >> running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to
>> >> manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of
>> >> other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>> >>
>> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> >> transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers
>> >> if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and
>> >> run docker nicely.
>> >>
>> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at
>> >> Google or Amazon.
>> >>
>> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it
>> >> is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance
>> >> by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins
>> >> who have to support all of the operations requirements and help
>> >> developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
>> >>
>> >> Ron
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>> >>>
>> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
>> limited
>> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the
>> >>>> fact that
>> >>> every company has different service
>> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate
>> >>>> very
>> >>> different underlying needs.
>> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>> >>>
>> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> >> routable ips"
>> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage
>> >>> routing
>> and
>> >>> secondary storage
>> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> >> configuration
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY
>> >>>> need
>> some
>> >>> functionality within an advanced
>> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you
>> >>>> need to
>> >> have
>> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> >>>> networking.
>> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I
>> >>> skipped
>> >> basic
>> >>> zone and used advanced zone
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Ron Wheeler
>> >> President
>> >> Artifact Software Inc
>> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>> >>
>> >>
>>
Regards,
Abhinandan Prateek
abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com
www.shapeblue.com
53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden, London WC2N 4HSUK @shapeblue
DISCLAIMER
==========
This e-mail may contain privileged and confidential information which is the property of Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business. It is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, retain, copy, print, distribute or use this message. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender and delete all copies of this message. Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business does not accept any liability for virus infected mails.
RE: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Timothy Lothering <tl...@datacentrix.co.za>.
Hi Josh,
To send a smaller file, you could clear the log file and wait for 2 or 3 iterations of the SSVMs to spin up and fail:
1. Stop Cloudstack Management Service
2. Stop Cloudstack Usage Service
3. Copy off the /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log file to another location
4. Truncate the /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log file
5. Start the CloudStack Management Service
You can tail the /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log file to keep an eye on it, also have your Hypervisor console open to monitor if the SSVM Templates are being copied over etc. Let the SSVMs cycle 5 or so times, stop the management service and paste us the /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log logs.
There are a number of things which could cause this (as mentioned by previous posters) Networking, Secondary Storage etc. Lets see what the logs have to say.
Kind Regards,
Timothy Lothering
-----Original Message-----
From: Sanjeev Neelarapu [mailto:sanjeev.neelarapu@accelerite.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 10 May 2016 8:44 AM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: RE: System VMs keeps failing to start
Hi Josh,
Since you are using clustered management server with HA, make sure that you have set the global setting parameter "host" to the load balance/virtual IP address. If not, please set , restart management server and destroy system vms.
Best Regards,
Sanjeev N
Chief Product Engineer, Accelerite
Off: +91 40 6722 9368 | EMail: sanjeev.neelarapu@accelerite.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Abhinandan Prateek [mailto:abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com]
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2016 4:46 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
System VM connect back to management server on port 8250. Some of the other ports to be aware of are here : https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Ports+used+by+CloudStack
On 04/03/16, 4:28 PM, "cloudstackhelp@outlook.com" <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>Before I dig through that I was just wondering if maybe it's really just a networking issue. Here's how my network is setup right now:
>
>
>a. Management server cluster running galera sitting behind a gateway that NATs port 8080 to a HAproxy load balancer. All public traffic that is a result from MS requests get allowed through. Everything else is rejected.
>
>
>b. Xenserver HVs with 4 NICs connected to 4 different switches:
>
>1. L3 switch with connection to internet (public subnet)
>
>2. L2 switch for management network which is connected to the MS
>cluster and the secondary NFS share (192.168.2.0/24)
>
>3. L2 switch for storage network where the EQL SAN sits on
>(192.168.10.0/24)
>
>4. L2 switch for the guest network (10.10.1.0/16)
>
>
>I'm not too sure if I'm doing stuff wrongly.
>
>
>Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:07 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
>above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service,
>rename the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go
>through their life cycle... stop the management server and post that.
>Whatever works best for you.
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina"
>> <ae...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
>> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
>> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify
>> what part of the process is failing...
>>
>> Ahmad E
>>
>> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
>> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for
>> > each
>> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a
>> dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud
>> link local network but the link status is <none>
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > Josh
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
>> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Josh,
>> >
>> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)?
>> > If so, I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management
>> > server and
>> the
>> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
>> public
>> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
>> I
>> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted
>> > CloudStack will try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again
>> > (so no worries should be had there). If you're able to time it
>> > correctly, you can stop the management service before the system
>> > vm's get shut down and log into them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
>> > that would be a good first step.
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Ron and all,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this
>> >> may
>> take
>> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems
>> >> to
>> want
>> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I
>> >> can't
>> start
>> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My
>> >> networks are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating.
>> >> Sending this via phone.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
>> details:
>> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Thanks in advance!
>> >>
>> >> Josh
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me
>> >> for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were
>> >> given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple
>> >> domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>> >>
>> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack
>> >> in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>> >>
>> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear
>> >> that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure
>> >> out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept
>> >> even though I have asked several times.
>> >>
>> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and
>> >> someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write
>> >> the code can figure out what to do.
>> >>
>> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user
>> >> documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball
>> >> cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of
>> >> the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>> >>
>> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> >> documentation just because we are all human.
>> >>
>> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in
>> >> the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a
>> >> developer in order to get this to work.
>> >>
>> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications
>> >> (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.)
>> >> running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to
>> >> manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of
>> >> other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>> >>
>> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> >> transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers
>> >> if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and
>> >> run docker nicely.
>> >>
>> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at
>> >> Google or Amazon.
>> >>
>> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it
>> >> is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance
>> >> by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins
>> >> who have to support all of the operations requirements and help
>> >> developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
>> >>
>> >> Ron
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>> >>>
>> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
>> limited
>> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the
>> >>>> fact that
>> >>> every company has different service
>> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate
>> >>>> very
>> >>> different underlying needs.
>> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>> >>>
>> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> >> routable ips"
>> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage
>> >>> routing
>> and
>> >>> secondary storage
>> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> >> configuration
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY
>> >>>> need
>> some
>> >>> functionality within an advanced
>> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you
>> >>>> need to
>> >> have
>> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> >>>> networking.
>> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I
>> >>> skipped
>> >> basic
>> >>> zone and used advanced zone
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Ron Wheeler
>> >> President
>> >> Artifact Software Inc
>> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>> >>
>> >>
>>
Regards,
Abhinandan Prateek
abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com
www.shapeblue.com
53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden, London WC2N 4HSUK @shapeblue
DISCLAIMER
==========
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Timothy Lothering
Solutions Architect
Managed Services
T: +27877415535
F: +27877415100
C: +27824904099
E: tlothering@datacentrix.co.za
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RE: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Sanjeev Neelarapu <sa...@accelerite.com>.
Hi Josh,
Since you are using clustered management server with HA, make sure that you have set the global setting parameter "host" to the load balance/virtual IP address. If not, please set , restart management server and destroy system vms.
Best Regards,
Sanjeev N
Chief Product Engineer, Accelerite
Off: +91 40 6722 9368 | EMail: sanjeev.neelarapu@accelerite.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Abhinandan Prateek [mailto:abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com]
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2016 4:46 PM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
System VM connect back to management server on port 8250. Some of the other ports to be aware of are here : https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Ports+used+by+CloudStack
On 04/03/16, 4:28 PM, "cloudstackhelp@outlook.com" <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>Before I dig through that I was just wondering if maybe it's really just a networking issue. Here's how my network is setup right now:
>
>
>a. Management server cluster running galera sitting behind a gateway that NATs port 8080 to a HAproxy load balancer. All public traffic that is a result from MS requests get allowed through. Everything else is rejected.
>
>
>b. Xenserver HVs with 4 NICs connected to 4 different switches:
>
>1. L3 switch with connection to internet (public subnet)
>
>2. L2 switch for management network which is connected to the MS
>cluster and the secondary NFS share (192.168.2.0/24)
>
>3. L2 switch for storage network where the EQL SAN sits on
>(192.168.10.0/24)
>
>4. L2 switch for the guest network (10.10.1.0/16)
>
>
>I'm not too sure if I'm doing stuff wrongly.
>
>
>Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:07 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
>above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service,
>rename the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go
>through their life cycle... stop the management server and post that.
>Whatever works best for you.
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina"
>> <ae...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
>> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
>> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify
>> what part of the process is failing...
>>
>> Ahmad E
>>
>> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
>> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for
>> > each
>> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a
>> dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud
>> link local network but the link status is <none>
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > Josh
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
>> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Josh,
>> >
>> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)?
>> > If so, I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management
>> > server and
>> the
>> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
>> public
>> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
>> I
>> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted
>> > CloudStack will try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again
>> > (so no worries should be had there). If you're able to time it
>> > correctly, you can stop the management service before the system
>> > vm's get shut down and log into them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
>> > that would be a good first step.
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Ron and all,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this
>> >> may
>> take
>> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems
>> >> to
>> want
>> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I
>> >> can't
>> start
>> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My
>> >> networks are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating.
>> >> Sending this via phone.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
>> details:
>> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP:
>> >> null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Thanks in advance!
>> >>
>> >> Josh
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me
>> >> for different clients back in the days when c-class networks were
>> >> given out from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple
>> >> domains including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>> >>
>> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack
>> >> in a small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>> >>
>> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear
>> >> that I can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure
>> >> out the truth sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept
>> >> even though I have asked several times.
>> >>
>> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and
>> >> someone who can write it down so that someone who did not write
>> >> the code can figure out what to do.
>> >>
>> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user
>> >> documentation is that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball
>> >> cases that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of
>> >> the main flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>> >>
>> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> >> documentation just because we are all human.
>> >>
>> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in
>> >> the topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a
>> >> developer in order to get this to work.
>> >>
>> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications
>> >> (accounting, SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.)
>> >> running on virtual machines in an environment that is easy to
>> >> manage. I want to support clients who I am supporting as users of
>> >> other systems - just want simple low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>> >>
>> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> >> transaction per second on a busy day I may get down to 2 servers
>> >> if Cloudstack works well and allows me to manage test servers and
>> >> run docker nicely.
>> >>
>> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at
>> >> Google or Amazon.
>> >>
>> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it
>> >> is not but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance
>> >> by mid-market companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins
>> >> who have to support all of the operations requirements and help
>> >> developers and application support teams test and keep production systems running.
>> >>
>> >> Ron
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>> >>>
>> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
>> limited
>> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the
>> >>>> fact that
>> >>> every company has different service
>> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate
>> >>>> very
>> >>> different underlying needs.
>> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>> >>>
>> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> >> routable ips"
>> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage
>> >>> routing
>> and
>> >>> secondary storage
>> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> >> configuration
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY
>> >>>> need
>> some
>> >>> functionality within an advanced
>> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you
>> >>>> need to
>> >> have
>> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> >>>> networking.
>> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I
>> >>> skipped
>> >> basic
>> >>> zone and used advanced zone
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Ron Wheeler
>> >> President
>> >> Artifact Software Inc
>> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>> >>
>> >>
>>
Regards,
Abhinandan Prateek
abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com
www.shapeblue.com
53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden, London WC2N 4HSUK @shapeblue
DISCLAIMER
==========
This e-mail may contain privileged and confidential information which is the property of Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business. It is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you are not the intended recipient, you are not authorized to read, retain, copy, print, distribute or use this message. If you have received this communication in error, please notify the sender and delete all copies of this message. Accelerite, a Persistent Systems business does not accept any liability for virus infected mails.
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Abhinandan Prateek <ab...@shapeblue.com>.
System VM connect back to management server on port 8250. Some of the other ports to be aware of are here : https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Ports+used+by+CloudStack
On 04/03/16, 4:28 PM, "cloudstackhelp@outlook.com" <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>Hi,
>
>
>Before I dig through that I was just wondering if maybe it's really just a networking issue. Here's how my network is setup right now:
>
>
>a. Management server cluster running galera sitting behind a gateway that NATs port 8080 to a HAproxy load balancer. All public traffic that is a result from MS requests get allowed through. Everything else is rejected.
>
>
>b. Xenserver HVs with 4 NICs connected to 4 different switches:
>
>1. L3 switch with connection to internet (public subnet)
>
>2. L2 switch for management network which is connected to the MS cluster and the secondary NFS share (192.168.2.0/24)
>
>3. L2 switch for storage network where the EQL SAN sits on (192.168.10.0/24)
>
>4. L2 switch for the guest network (10.10.1.0/16)
>
>
>I'm not too sure if I'm doing stuff wrongly.
>
>
>Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:07 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
>above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service, rename
>the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go through their
>life cycle... stop the management server and post that. Whatever works best
>for you.
>
>On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
>> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
>> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify what
>> part of the process is failing...
>>
>> Ahmad E
>>
>> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
>> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each
>> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated
>> NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local
>> network but the link status is <none>
>> >
>> >
>> > Thanks
>> >
>> > Josh
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
>> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hey Josh,
>> >
>> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
>> > I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and
>> the
>> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
>> public
>> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
>> I
>> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
>> > try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
>> > had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
>> > management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
>> > them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
>> > that would be a good first step.
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Ron and all,
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may
>> take
>> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to
>> want
>> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't
>> start
>> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
>> >> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
>> >> phone.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>> >>
>> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
>> details:
>> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Thanks in advance!
>> >>
>> >> Josh
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
>> >> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
>> >> from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
>> >> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>> >>
>> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
>> >> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>> >>
>> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
>> >> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
>> >> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
>> >> though I have asked several times.
>> >>
>> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
>> >> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
>> >> figure out what to do.
>> >>
>> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
>> >> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
>> >> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
>> >> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>> >>
>> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> >> documentation just because we are all human.
>> >>
>> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
>> >> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
>> >> in order to get this to work.
>> >>
>> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
>> >> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
>> >> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
>> >> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
>> >> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>> >>
>> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> >> transaction per second on a busy day
>> >> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
>> >> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>> >>
>> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
>> >> or Amazon.
>> >>
>> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
>> >> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
>> >> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
>> >> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
>> >> support teams test and keep production systems running.
>> >>
>> >> Ron
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>> >>>
>> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
>> limited
>> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
>> >>> every company has different service
>> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
>> >>> different underlying needs.
>> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>> >>>
>> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> >> routable ips"
>> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing
>> and
>> >>> secondary storage
>> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> >> configuration
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need
>> some
>> >>> functionality within an advanced
>> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
>> >> have
>> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> >>>> networking.
>> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
>> >> basic
>> >>> zone and used advanced zone
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Ron Wheeler
>> >> President
>> >> Artifact Software Inc
>> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>> >>
>> >>
>>
Regards,
Abhinandan Prateek
abhinandan.prateek@shapeblue.com
www.shapeblue.com
53 Chandos Place, Covent Garden, London WC2N 4HSUK
@shapeblue
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by cl...@outlook.com.
Hi,
Before I dig through that I was just wondering if maybe it's really just a networking issue. Here's how my network is setup right now:
a. Management server cluster running galera sitting behind a gateway that NATs port 8080 to a HAproxy load balancer. All public traffic that is a result from MS requests get allowed through. Everything else is rejected.
b. Xenserver HVs with 4 NICs connected to 4 different switches:
1. L3 switch with connection to internet (public subnet)
2. L2 switch for management network which is connected to the MS cluster and the secondary NFS share (192.168.2.0/24)
3. L2 switch for storage network where the EQL SAN sits on (192.168.10.0/24)
4. L2 switch for the guest network (10.10.1.0/16)
I'm not too sure if I'm doing stuff wrongly.
Josh
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 2:07 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service, rename
the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go through their
life cycle... stop the management server and post that. Whatever works best
for you.
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify what
> part of the process is failing...
>
> Ahmad E
>
> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each
> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated
> NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local
> network but the link status is <none>
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Josh
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hey Josh,
> >
> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
> > I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and
> the
> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
> public
> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
> I
> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
> > try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
> > had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
> > management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
> > them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
> > that would be a good first step.
> >
> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Ron and all,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may
> take
> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to
> want
> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't
> start
> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
> >> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
> >> phone.
> >>
> >>
> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
> >>
> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
> >>
> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
> details:
> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
> >>
> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
> >>
> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance!
> >>
> >> Josh
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
> >> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
> >> from massive ranges of free numbers.
> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
> >> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
> >>
> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
> >> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
> >>
> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
> >> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
> >> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
> >> though I have asked several times.
> >>
> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
> >> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
> >> figure out what to do.
> >>
> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
> >> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
> >> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
> >> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
> >>
> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
> >> documentation just because we are all human.
> >>
> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
> >> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
> >> in order to get this to work.
> >>
> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
> >> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
> >> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
> >> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
> >> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
> >>
> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
> >> transaction per second on a busy day
> >> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
> >> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
> >>
> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
> >> or Amazon.
> >>
> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
> >> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
> >> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
> >> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
> >> support teams test and keep production systems running.
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >>
> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
> >>>
> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
> limited
> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> >>> every company has different service
> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> >>> different underlying needs.
> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
> >>>
> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> >> routable ips"
> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing
> and
> >>> secondary storage
> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> >> configuration
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need
> some
> >>> functionality within an advanced
> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
> >> have
> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
> >>>> networking.
> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
> >> basic
> >>> zone and used advanced zone
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Ron Wheeler
> >> President
> >> Artifact Software Inc
> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
> >>
> >>
>
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Ahmad Emneina <ae...@gmail.com>.
If you see any exceptions, I'd ideally like to see a few hundred lines
above and below. It might be easiest to stop the management service, rename
the log file. Restart the service, observe the system vm's go through their
life cycle... stop the management server and post that. Whatever works best
for you.
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:43 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
> It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely:
> /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
> Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify what
> part of the process is failing...
>
> Ahmad E
>
> > On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <
> cloudstackhelp@outlook.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each
> component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated
> NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local
> network but the link status is <none>
> >
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > Josh
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <
> aemneina@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hey Josh,
> >
> > Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
> > I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and
> the
> > public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your
> public
> > network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud.
> I
> > recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
> > try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
> > had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
> > management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
> > them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
> > that would be a good first step.
> >
> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Ron and all,
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
> >> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may
> take
> >> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to
> want
> >> to keep going on until it crashes.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't
> start
> >> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
> >> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
> >> phone.
> >>
> >>
> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
> >>
> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
> >>
> >> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error
> details:
> >> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
> >>
> >> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> >> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
> >>
> >> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> >> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks in advance!
> >>
> >> Josh
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
> >> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> >> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
> >> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
> >> from massive ranges of free numbers.
> >> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
> >> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> >> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
> >>
> >> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
> >> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
> >>
> >> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
> >> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
> >> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> >> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
> >> though I have asked several times.
> >>
> >> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
> >> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
> >> figure out what to do.
> >>
> >> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
> >> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> >> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
> >> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> >> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
> >> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
> >>
> >> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
> >> documentation just because we are all human.
> >>
> >> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
> >> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> >> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
> >> in order to get this to work.
> >>
> >> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
> >> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
> >> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
> >> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
> >> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
> >>
> >> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
> >> transaction per second on a busy day
> >> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
> >> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
> >>
> >> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
> >> or Amazon.
> >>
> >> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
> >> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
> >> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
> >> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
> >> support teams test and keep production systems running.
> >>
> >> Ron
> >>
> >>
> >>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> >>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
> >>>
> >>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
> limited
> >>> knowledge of networking concepts.
> >>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> >>> every company has different service
> >>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> >>> different underlying needs.
> >>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
> >>>
> >>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> >> routable ips"
> >>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing
> and
> >>> secondary storage
> >>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> >> configuration
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need
> some
> >>> functionality within an advanced
> >>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
> >> have
> >>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
> >>>> networking.
> >>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
> >> basic
> >>> zone and used advanced zone
> >>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Ron Wheeler
> >> President
> >> Artifact Software Inc
> >> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> >> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> >> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
> >>
> >>
>
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by cl...@outlook.com.
It's really huge. Which part am I looking for exactly?
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 1:38 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely: /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify what part of the process is failing...
Ahmad E
> On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local network but the link status is <none>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Hey Josh,
>
> Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
> I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and the
> public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your public
> network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud. I
> recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
> try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
> had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
> management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
> them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
> that would be a good first step.
>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Ron and all,
>>
>>
>>
>> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may take
>> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to want
>> to keep going on until it crashes.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't start
>> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>>
>>
>>
>> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
>> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
>> phone.
>>
>>
>> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>>
>> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>>
>> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>>
>> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>>
>> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>>
>>
>> Thanks in advance!
>>
>> Josh
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
>> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
>> from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
>> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>>
>> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
>> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>>
>> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
>> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
>> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
>> though I have asked several times.
>>
>> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
>> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
>> figure out what to do.
>>
>> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
>> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
>> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
>> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>>
>> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> documentation just because we are all human.
>>
>> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
>> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
>> in order to get this to work.
>>
>> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
>> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
>> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
>> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
>> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>>
>> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> transaction per second on a busy day
>> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
>> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>>
>> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
>> or Amazon.
>>
>> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
>> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
>> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
>> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
>> support teams test and keep production systems running.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>>>
>>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
>>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
>>> every company has different service
>>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
>>> different underlying needs.
>>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>>>
>>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> routable ips"
>>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
>>> secondary storage
>>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> configuration
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
>>> functionality within an advanced
>>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
>> have
>>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>>>> networking.
>>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
>> basic
>>> zone and used advanced zone
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ron Wheeler
>> President
>> Artifact Software Inc
>> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>>
>>
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Ahmad Emneina <ae...@gmail.com>.
Josh, can you share the logs off the management server. Namely: /var/log/cloudstack/management/management-server.log
Post as much as you can to pastebin or similar. That'll help identify what part of the process is failing...
Ahmad E
> On Mar 3, 2016, at 12:44 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local network but the link status is <none>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Hey Josh,
>
> Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
> I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and the
> public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your public
> network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud. I
> recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
> try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
> had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
> management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
> them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
> that would be a good first step.
>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Ron and all,
>>
>>
>>
>> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
>> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may take
>> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to want
>> to keep going on until it crashes.
>>
>>
>>
>> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't start
>> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>>
>>
>>
>> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
>> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
>> phone.
>>
>>
>> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>>
>> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>>
>> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>>
>> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
>> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>>
>> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
>> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>>
>>
>> Thanks in advance!
>>
>> Josh
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
>> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
>> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
>> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
>> from massive ranges of free numbers.
>> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
>> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
>> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>>
>> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
>> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>>
>> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
>> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
>> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
>> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
>> though I have asked several times.
>>
>> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
>> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
>> figure out what to do.
>>
>> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
>> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
>> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
>> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
>> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
>> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>>
>> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
>> documentation just because we are all human.
>>
>> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
>> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
>> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
>> in order to get this to work.
>>
>> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
>> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
>> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
>> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
>> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>>
>> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
>> transaction per second on a busy day
>> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
>> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>>
>> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
>> or Amazon.
>>
>> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
>> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
>> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
>> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
>> support teams test and keep production systems running.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>>
>>> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
>>> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>>>
>>>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
>>> knowledge of networking concepts.
>>>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
>>> every company has different service
>>>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
>>> different underlying needs.
>>> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>>>
>>> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
>> routable ips"
>>> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
>>> secondary storage
>>> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
>> configuration
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
>>> functionality within an advanced
>>>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
>> have
>>> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>>>> networking.
>>> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
>> basic
>>> zone and used advanced zone
>>
>>
>> --
>> Ron Wheeler
>> President
>> Artifact Software Inc
>> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
>> skype: ronaldmwheeler
>> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>>
>>
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by cl...@outlook.com.
Nothing's being spun up on the HVs. I'm using separate networks for each component (public, management, guest, storage). They all have a dedicated NIC each. On the HVs it seems like CS created its own cloud link local network but the link status is <none>
Thanks
Josh
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:39 PM -0800, "Ahmad Emneina" <ae...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hey Josh,
Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and the
public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your public
network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud. I
recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
that would be a good first step.
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Ron and all,
>
>
>
> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may take
> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to want
> to keep going on until it crashes.
>
>
>
> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't start
> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>
>
>
> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
> phone.
>
>
> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>
> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>
> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>
> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>
> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
> from massive ranges of free numbers.
> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>
> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>
> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
> though I have asked several times.
>
> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
> figure out what to do.
>
> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>
> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
> documentation just because we are all human.
>
> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
> in order to get this to work.
>
> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>
> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
> transaction per second on a busy day
> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>
> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
> or Amazon.
>
> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
> support teams test and keep production systems running.
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> > Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
> >
> >> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
> > knowledge of networking concepts.
> >> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> > every company has different service
> >> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> > different underlying needs.
> > Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
> >
> > - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> routable ips"
> > - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
> > secondary storage
> > - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> configuration
> >
> >
> >
> >> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
> > functionality within an advanced
> >> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
> have
> > a good understanding of layer 2/3
> >> networking.
> >>
> > I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
> basic
> > zone and used advanced zone
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Ron Wheeler
> President
> Artifact Software Inc
> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>
>
Re: System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by Ahmad Emneina <ae...@gmail.com>.
Hey Josh,
Are you seeing the VM's being spun up on the backend (hypervisor)? If so,
I'd imagine its a communication issue between the management server and the
public interface on the system vm. If you use VLAN tagging for your public
network, make sure the VLAN is trunked to your hypervisors in the cloud. I
recommend you stop the management service. Once restarted CloudStack will
try to recycle those vm's and spin them up again (so no worries should be
had there). If you're able to time it correctly, you can stop the
management service before the system vm's get shut down and log into
them... make sure the respective interfaces can reach their next hops...
that would be a good first step.
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 12:32 PM, <cl...@outlook.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Ron and all,
>
>
>
> You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my
> installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may take
> a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to want
> to keep going on until it crashes.
>
>
>
> I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't start
> the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
>
>
>
> Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks
> are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via
> phone.
>
>
> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>
> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
>
> Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
>
> Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null,
> private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>
> Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details:
> null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
>
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
> Josh
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <
> rwheeler@artifact-software.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
> There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
> different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
> from massive ranges of free numbers.
> I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
> including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
> I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
>
> I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
> small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
>
> The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
> can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
> sufficiently well to actually fix it.
> I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
> though I have asked several times.
>
> It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
> who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
> figure out what to do.
>
> The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
> that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
> They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
> that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
> They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
> flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
>
> That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
> documentation just because we are all human.
>
> They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
> topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
> The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
> in order to get this to work.
>
> In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
> SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
> machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
> clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
> low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
>
> I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
> transaction per second on a busy day
> I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
> manage test servers and run docker nicely.
>
> I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
> or Amazon.
>
> This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
> but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
> companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
> all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
> support teams test and keep production systems running.
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> > Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
> >
> >> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
> > knowledge of networking concepts.
> >> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> > every company has different service
> >> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> > different underlying needs.
> > Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
> >
> > - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> routable ips"
> > - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
> > secondary storage
> > - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> configuration
> >
> >
> >
> >> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
> > functionality within an advanced
> >> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
> have
> > a good understanding of layer 2/3
> >> networking.
> >>
> > I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
> basic
> > zone and used advanced zone
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Ron Wheeler
> President
> Artifact Software Inc
> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>
>
System VMs keeps failing to start
Posted by cl...@outlook.com.
Hi Ron and all,
You mentioned that SVMs need to be started. I'm finding that my installation keeps looping the command "Creating system VMs (this may take a while)". Right now, it's done its 70th cycle (s-70-VM) and seems to want to keep going on until it crashes.
I'm thinking I should just kill the process but I'm worried I can't start the process again later. Is there a way to re-run this again later on?
Why is it failing to start the VMs? Why is everything null? My networks are starting fine. Apologies for the lack of formating. Sending this via phone.
Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details: null1004 Mar 2016 04:27:04
Secondary Storage Vm creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details: null1904 Mar 2016 04:27:00
Console proxy up in zone: Public Cloud, proxy: v-72-VM, public IP: null, private IP: N/A1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
Console proxy creation failure. zone: Public Cloud, error details: null1004 Mar 2016 04:26:34
Thanks in advance!
Josh
On Thu, Mar 3, 2016 at 11:02 AM -0800, "Ron Wheeler" <rw...@artifact-software.com> wrote:
I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
from massive ranges of free numbers.
I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
sufficiently well to actually fix it.
I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
though I have asked several times.
It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
figure out what to do.
The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
documentation just because we are all human.
They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
in order to get this to work.
In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
transaction per second on a busy day
I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
manage test servers and run docker nicely.
I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
or Amazon.
This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
support teams test and keep production systems running.
Ron
On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>
>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> every company has different service
>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> different underlying needs.
> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>
> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
> secondary storage
> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
>
>
>
>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
> functionality within an advanced
>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> networking.
>>
> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
> zone and used advanced zone
>
>
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>.
I have been using Linux and the Internet since the mid 1990s.
There are still 3 consecutively numbered C class registered to me for
different clients back in the days when c-class networks were given out
from massive ranges of free numbers.
I have set up small ISP operations for clients with multiple domains
including web sites, e-mail servers, fileservers, etc.
I have done this on SCO , Mandrake, CentOS 4 to 7.
I should not have to struggle to figure out how set up Cloudstack in a
small configuration with a few servers and a single public IP.
The documentation on networking is jumbled about and so unclear that I
can only point out why it is not clear but can not figure out the truth
sufficiently well to actually fix it.
I still don't know where the sources for the drawings are kept even
though I have asked several times.
It needs a team approach with someone who knows the truth and someone
who can write it down so that someone who did not write the code can
figure out what to do.
The biggest problem with programmers writing the user documentation is
that they are so caught up in the exceptions and special cases.
They spent a lot of time figuring out how to handle these oddball cases
that they feel that these triumphs must be on the front page.
They forget to explain the 95% case and lace the description of the main
flow with notes about these interesting exceptions.
That is not just true for Cloudstack but is a general problem with
documentation just because we are all human.
They also forget that the user does not want to be an expert in the
topic but wants to know enough to get the thing running.
The user has a lot of other problems and does not to become a developer
in order to get this to work.
In my case, I really need to get some internal applications (accounting,
SCM, issue tracking, Maven repo, 20 web sites etc.) running on virtual
machines in an environment that is easy to manage. I want to support
clients who I am supporting as users of other systems - just want simple
low volume services to support my supporting of their users.
I only expect to have 4 servers, one NIC per machine to support 1
transaction per second on a busy day
I may get down to 2 servers if Cloudstack works well and allows me to
manage test servers and run docker nicely.
I do not want to know enough to be the network administrator at Google
or Amazon.
This should not be hard to implement and from what I have seen it is not
but the networking docs are a major barrier to acceptance by mid-market
companies - 300-1000 users with 1 or 2 System Admins who have to support
all of the operations requirements and help developers and application
support teams test and keep production systems running.
Ron
On 03/03/2016 6:22 AM, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>
>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
> knowledge of networking concepts.
>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> every company has different service
>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> different underlying needs.
> Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
>
> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
> secondary storage
> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
>
>
>
>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
> functionality within an advanced
>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>> networking.
>>
> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
> zone and used advanced zone
>
>
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Vadim <va...@ant.ee>.
I wouldn't recommend to skip basic zone set-up. It is much simpler to
start with it to get basic knowledge of CS net configuration process. I
also had many troubles during set-up, but remembering those days I would
say - I didn't have enough knowledge of hypervisor network layer at that
time. Process is a bit different for different hypervisors (I have tried
KVM and XenServer). I would also recommend to put management server with
database on VM and make snapshots before configuration. Then you only
need to revert configuration if something went wrong. After couple (of
tens) times I got XLS with all the steps and desired configuration
parameters for production.
Vadim.
On 2016-03-03 13:22, Mario Giammarco wrote:
> Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>
>> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a
>> limited
> knowledge of networking concepts.
>
>> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
> every company has different service
>
>> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
> different underlying needs.Not agree. Even with good knowledge
> documentation is confusing because:
>
> - it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of
> routable ips"
> - it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing
> and
> secondary storage
> - it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host
> configuration
>
>> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need
>> some
> functionality within an advanced
>
>> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to
>> have
> a good understanding of layer 2/3
>
>> networking.
> I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped
> basic
> zone and used advanced zone
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Mario Giammarco <mg...@gmail.com>.
Simon Weller <sw...@...> writes:
>
> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited
knowledge of networking concepts.
>
> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that
every company has different service
> requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very
different underlying needs.
>
Not agree. Even with good knowledge documentation is confusing because:
- it assumes you are always in the use case of "I have plenty of routable ips"
- it forgets to say that two system vms are create to manage routing and
secondary storage
- it does not say that cloudstack manager can rewrite your host configuration
> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some
functionality within an advanced
> zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have
a good understanding of layer 2/3
> networking.
>
I was able to make my cloudstack network working only when I skipped basic
zone and used advanced zone
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>.
I would be willing to work with someone who really knows the networking
to fix the docs.
I have made specific suggestions about what I think needs to be changed
but it does require input from someone who actually understands
Cloudstack networking to properly fix the docs.
It would also be helpful to have the sources to the drawings. I could
not find them in the git project but perhaps I did not look in all
possible places.
Ron
On 27/02/2016 5:56 PM, Simon Weller wrote:
> I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited knowledge of networking concepts.
>
> In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that every company has different service requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very different underlying needs.
>
> It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some functionality within an advanced zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have a good understanding of layer 2/3 networking.
>
> If all you want to do is place public IP addresses on VMs directly, then a basic zone is what you want. If you want to build complicated relationships between VMs using separate L2 segments (with L3 routing within ACS), then you'll need advanced networking. Advanced networking does open up a lot of exciting possibilities, including various SDN controllers, native VXLAN (on KVM), GRE and many more options.
>
> Before you dive into the more specialized areas of ACS networking, it's always best to start with something simple, so you can get your head around some of the general concepts.
>
> So Ron, to answer your questions more directly:
>
> Basic Zone guest network is what you use for public ips. Basic zone is very simple and doesn't offering any physical private from public traffic separation. That's where security groups come in (Think AWS style networking here). Now you can use multiple interfaces though I believe, although I've never tried that before.
>
> In terms of DNS, you can use the same DNS server for both. I wasn't actually aware basic zone gave you this option. Normally this is used for split DNS, where you may have internal records not exposed publicly.
>
> As Lucian pointed out, ISCSI should be an available option under XenServer when you create the primary storage.
> There should be no need for your primary storage network to need to talk to the management server. The secondary storage network will need to be able to talk to the management server when you pre-seed the XenServer specific templates during setup.
>
> All of our clouds are advanced networking based, so team, feel free to jump in if I've stated anything incorrectly ;-)
>
> - Si
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________
> From: Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>
> Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2016 8:13 AM
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>
> I am also stuck trying to sort out networking so Josh has my sympathies.
>
> The networking docs are really confusing.
> They wander from general to specific.
> They mix the general architecture with specific hardware discussions
> without any context for the switch or any explanation of why the
> hardware specific note needs to be known to everyone.
>
> I have earlier made specific suggestions about how reorganize the docs
> but no one seems to be working in this area.
>
> I think that part of the problem is that the larger organizations have
> dedicated network experts who are working in networking everyday whereas
> smaller organizations have generalists and once the network is set up,
> it runs on its own for years until you want to do something like Cloudstack.
>
> To help this type of user, the docs need to be reorganized and simplified.
>
> The Shapeblue article is much better than the Cloudstack docs.
> It is great that it is available but the official docs should be improved.
>
> I did ask where the drawing sources are located but did not get a response.
>
> Ron
>
>
> On 27/02/2016 3:27 AM, Nux! wrote:
>> Hello Josh,
>>
>> Networking is the single biggest cause of headaches with Cloudstack, once you get it right the rest is easier.
>> I recommend to read http://www.shapeblue.com/understanding-cloudstacks-physical-networking-architecture/
>>
>> >From what you described, it looks like what you need is either a Basic Zone or Advanced Zone with Security Groups.
>>
>> I have a ACS+Xenserver setup and when I go to Infrastructure > Primary Storage I definitely see "iscsi" as an option in the storage type.
>>
>> HTH
>> Lucian
>>
>> --
>> Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
>>
>> Nux!
>> www.nux.ro
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Josh Davis" <cl...@outlook.com>
>>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
>>> Sent: Saturday, 27 February, 2016 01:00:49
>>> Subject: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>>> I have been tinkering about cloudstack but every single guide seems to be
>>> centered around the public IPs being NATed to the guest VMs. To be honest the
>>> more I think about it the more I get confused so I'm posting here in hopes that
>>> someone will guide me through this.
>>> I have tried to pen down what I'm looking for and I hope it's clear enough:- I
>>> have a block of public routable IPs which I want to assign to individual VMs-
>>> These VMs run linux and are intended to function as web servers- I have no need
>>> for inter-VM private interactions except for via the public network- These VMs
>>> all reside in a single cloudstack cloud for high availability and resource
>>> balancing- The HVs in the cloud are connected to a central SAN running iSCSI-
>>> The HVs run XenServer
>>> I'm confused with:- Do I set the guest network as the public IP range?- Internal
>>> DNS = Public DNS?- Does the management server need to have access to the
>>> storage network?- Why don't I have the option to choose iSCSI when I try to add
>>> a primary storage?- Basically everything
>
> --
> Ron Wheeler
> President
> Artifact Software Inc
> email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
> skype: ronaldmwheeler
> phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
>
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Simon Weller <sw...@ena.com>.
I do agree that the docs are confusing, especially if you have a limited knowledge of networking concepts.
In terms of the complexity, a lot of that has to do with the fact that every company has different service requirements and ACS needs to be flexible enough to accommodate very different underlying needs.
It's always best to start with a basic zone, unless you REALLY need some functionality within an advanced zone. As soon as you move into advanced zone networking, you need to have a good understanding of layer 2/3 networking.
If all you want to do is place public IP addresses on VMs directly, then a basic zone is what you want. If you want to build complicated relationships between VMs using separate L2 segments (with L3 routing within ACS), then you'll need advanced networking. Advanced networking does open up a lot of exciting possibilities, including various SDN controllers, native VXLAN (on KVM), GRE and many more options.
Before you dive into the more specialized areas of ACS networking, it's always best to start with something simple, so you can get your head around some of the general concepts.
So Ron, to answer your questions more directly:
Basic Zone guest network is what you use for public ips. Basic zone is very simple and doesn't offering any physical private from public traffic separation. That's where security groups come in (Think AWS style networking here). Now you can use multiple interfaces though I believe, although I've never tried that before.
In terms of DNS, you can use the same DNS server for both. I wasn't actually aware basic zone gave you this option. Normally this is used for split DNS, where you may have internal records not exposed publicly.
As Lucian pointed out, ISCSI should be an available option under XenServer when you create the primary storage.
There should be no need for your primary storage network to need to talk to the management server. The secondary storage network will need to be able to talk to the management server when you pre-seed the XenServer specific templates during setup.
All of our clouds are advanced networking based, so team, feel free to jump in if I've stated anything incorrectly ;-)
- Si
________________________________________
From: Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>
Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2016 8:13 AM
To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
Subject: Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
I am also stuck trying to sort out networking so Josh has my sympathies.
The networking docs are really confusing.
They wander from general to specific.
They mix the general architecture with specific hardware discussions
without any context for the switch or any explanation of why the
hardware specific note needs to be known to everyone.
I have earlier made specific suggestions about how reorganize the docs
but no one seems to be working in this area.
I think that part of the problem is that the larger organizations have
dedicated network experts who are working in networking everyday whereas
smaller organizations have generalists and once the network is set up,
it runs on its own for years until you want to do something like Cloudstack.
To help this type of user, the docs need to be reorganized and simplified.
The Shapeblue article is much better than the Cloudstack docs.
It is great that it is available but the official docs should be improved.
I did ask where the drawing sources are located but did not get a response.
Ron
On 27/02/2016 3:27 AM, Nux! wrote:
> Hello Josh,
>
> Networking is the single biggest cause of headaches with Cloudstack, once you get it right the rest is easier.
> I recommend to read http://www.shapeblue.com/understanding-cloudstacks-physical-networking-architecture/
>
> >From what you described, it looks like what you need is either a Basic Zone or Advanced Zone with Security Groups.
>
> I have a ACS+Xenserver setup and when I go to Infrastructure > Primary Storage I definitely see "iscsi" as an option in the storage type.
>
> HTH
> Lucian
>
> --
> Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
>
> Nux!
> www.nux.ro
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Josh Davis" <cl...@outlook.com>
>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Sent: Saturday, 27 February, 2016 01:00:49
>> Subject: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>> I have been tinkering about cloudstack but every single guide seems to be
>> centered around the public IPs being NATed to the guest VMs. To be honest the
>> more I think about it the more I get confused so I'm posting here in hopes that
>> someone will guide me through this.
>> I have tried to pen down what I'm looking for and I hope it's clear enough:- I
>> have a block of public routable IPs which I want to assign to individual VMs-
>> These VMs run linux and are intended to function as web servers- I have no need
>> for inter-VM private interactions except for via the public network- These VMs
>> all reside in a single cloudstack cloud for high availability and resource
>> balancing- The HVs in the cloud are connected to a central SAN running iSCSI-
>> The HVs run XenServer
>> I'm confused with:- Do I set the guest network as the public IP range?- Internal
>> DNS = Public DNS?- Does the management server need to have access to the
>> storage network?- Why don't I have the option to choose iSCSI when I try to add
>> a primary storage?- Basically everything
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Ron Wheeler <rw...@artifact-software.com>.
I am also stuck trying to sort out networking so Josh has my sympathies.
The networking docs are really confusing.
They wander from general to specific.
They mix the general architecture with specific hardware discussions
without any context for the switch or any explanation of why the
hardware specific note needs to be known to everyone.
I have earlier made specific suggestions about how reorganize the docs
but no one seems to be working in this area.
I think that part of the problem is that the larger organizations have
dedicated network experts who are working in networking everyday whereas
smaller organizations have generalists and once the network is set up,
it runs on its own for years until you want to do something like Cloudstack.
To help this type of user, the docs need to be reorganized and simplified.
The Shapeblue article is much better than the Cloudstack docs.
It is great that it is available but the official docs should be improved.
I did ask where the drawing sources are located but did not get a response.
Ron
On 27/02/2016 3:27 AM, Nux! wrote:
> Hello Josh,
>
> Networking is the single biggest cause of headaches with Cloudstack, once you get it right the rest is easier.
> I recommend to read http://www.shapeblue.com/understanding-cloudstacks-physical-networking-architecture/
>
> >From what you described, it looks like what you need is either a Basic Zone or Advanced Zone with Security Groups.
>
> I have a ACS+Xenserver setup and when I go to Infrastructure > Primary Storage I definitely see "iscsi" as an option in the storage type.
>
> HTH
> Lucian
>
> --
> Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
>
> Nux!
> www.nux.ro
>
> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Josh Davis" <cl...@outlook.com>
>> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Sent: Saturday, 27 February, 2016 01:00:49
>> Subject: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
>> I have been tinkering about cloudstack but every single guide seems to be
>> centered around the public IPs being NATed to the guest VMs. To be honest the
>> more I think about it the more I get confused so I'm posting here in hopes that
>> someone will guide me through this.
>> I have tried to pen down what I'm looking for and I hope it's clear enough:- I
>> have a block of public routable IPs which I want to assign to individual VMs-
>> These VMs run linux and are intended to function as web servers- I have no need
>> for inter-VM private interactions except for via the public network- These VMs
>> all reside in a single cloudstack cloud for high availability and resource
>> balancing- The HVs in the cloud are connected to a central SAN running iSCSI-
>> The HVs run XenServer
>> I'm confused with:- Do I set the guest network as the public IP range?- Internal
>> DNS = Public DNS?- Does the management server need to have access to the
>> storage network?- Why don't I have the option to choose iSCSI when I try to add
>> a primary storage?- Basically everything
--
Ron Wheeler
President
Artifact Software Inc
email: rwheeler@artifact-software.com
skype: ronaldmwheeler
phone: 866-970-2435, ext 102
Re: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
Posted by Nux! <nu...@li.nux.ro>.
Hello Josh,
Networking is the single biggest cause of headaches with Cloudstack, once you get it right the rest is easier.
I recommend to read http://www.shapeblue.com/understanding-cloudstacks-physical-networking-architecture/
>From what you described, it looks like what you need is either a Basic Zone or Advanced Zone with Security Groups.
I have a ACS+Xenserver setup and when I go to Infrastructure > Primary Storage I definitely see "iscsi" as an option in the storage type.
HTH
Lucian
--
Sent from the Delta quadrant using Borg technology!
Nux!
www.nux.ro
----- Original Message -----
> From: "Josh Davis" <cl...@outlook.com>
> To: users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Sent: Saturday, 27 February, 2016 01:00:49
> Subject: Really really confused about Cloudstack networking
> I have been tinkering about cloudstack but every single guide seems to be
> centered around the public IPs being NATed to the guest VMs. To be honest the
> more I think about it the more I get confused so I'm posting here in hopes that
> someone will guide me through this.
> I have tried to pen down what I'm looking for and I hope it's clear enough:- I
> have a block of public routable IPs which I want to assign to individual VMs-
> These VMs run linux and are intended to function as web servers- I have no need
> for inter-VM private interactions except for via the public network- These VMs
> all reside in a single cloudstack cloud for high availability and resource
> balancing- The HVs in the cloud are connected to a central SAN running iSCSI-
> The HVs run XenServer
> I'm confused with:- Do I set the guest network as the public IP range?- Internal
> DNS = Public DNS?- Does the management server need to have access to the
> storage network?- Why don't I have the option to choose iSCSI when I try to add
> a primary storage?- Basically everything