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Posted to dev@tapestry.apache.org by Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> on 2006/06/04 16:48:12 UTC
Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts of
Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new Spindle
4T4 core without error.
BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
Geoff
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
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Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com>.
+1 on that idea. Doesn't make sense to have releases competing with each
other over documentation.
On 6/4/06, James Carman <ja...@carmanconsulting.com> wrote:
>
> I'd say that the website should follow what Tomcat does and make it easy
> to
> get to the docs for each release (3.0, 4.0, 4.1, 5.0).
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Geoff Longman [mailto:glongman@gmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2006 12:18 PM
> To: Tapestry development
> Subject: Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
>
> Yes but that is an alpha release right? Are you suggesting that an
> alpha release of 4.1 means that the website will shift focus to 4.1
> over 4.0? Not sure if that should happen until 4.1 goes final.
>
> Anywho, sounds like a topic for everyone needs to get thier two cents in
> on.
>
> :-)
>
> Geoff
>
> On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Because 4.1 should theoretically be getting released this week.
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hmm, I'm not all that up on the website issues. Why would a 4.0.3
> > > release be any different than the 4.0.2 release?
> > >
> > > Geoff
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than
> the
> > > > annotation optional jar + demo application.
> > > >
> > > > As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
> > > > anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the
> ramifications
> > > are
> > > > in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1using
> > > > maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect
> all
> of
> > > the
> > > > changes . (and cleanup some old items)
> > > >
> > > > Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link
> to
> > > each
> > > > release # with its own set of docs)
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> > > > > Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core
> Library
> > > > > shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
> > > > >
> > > > > Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core
> Libraries
> > > > > (this is thankfully a short list):
> > > > >
> > > > > 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not
> > > recognized.
> > > > >
> > > > > 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one
> case
> > > > > - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
> > > > >
> > > > > 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names
> are
> > > > > ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> > > > > classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the
> page
> > > > > or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> > > > > declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of
> the
> > > > > 4.0 rules.
> > > > >
> > > > > In the wild it means that users that use these features will see
> odd
> > > > > warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> > > > > problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not
> possible
> > > > > to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries
> that
> > > > > ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> > > > > work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage -
> the
> > > > > core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
> > > > >
> > > > > Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> > > > > teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of
> this
> > > > > magic stuff isn't costly.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> > > > > Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is
> 98%
> > > > > there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> > > > > problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would
> contain
> > > > > in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
> > > > >
> > > > > Geoff
> > > > >
> > > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very
> > > backwards
> > > > > > compatible.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that
> were
> > > > > marked
> > > > > > for removal in 4.1 though.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work
> or
> > > not
> > > > > but
> > > > > > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in
> eclipse
> > > for
> > > > > so
> > > > > > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since
> my
> > > setup
> > > > > > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've
> been
> > > > > using
> > > > > > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so
> > > far.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or
> > > others
> > > > > but
> > > > > > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will
> have
> > > to be
> > > > > a
> > > > > > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the
> > > additional
> > > > > > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should
> be
> > > on
> > > > > dtds)
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do
> so
> > > now
> > > > > > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but
> 4.1is
> > > > > > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that
> doesn't
> > > > > matter to
> > > > > > > me)
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > > > > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a
> > > Contrib
> > > > > > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for
> me.
> > > > > > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add
> > > extra
> > > > > > > 4.1 goodness.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that
> > > Spindle
> > > > > > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point
> is
> > > moot
> > > > > > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will
> be
> > > for
> > > > > > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile
> 4.1in
> > > > > > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a
> pain
> in
> > > the
> > > > > > > ass.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has
> all
> > > of
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series
> > > versions
> > > > > if
> > > > > > > we
> > > > > > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you
> make
> > > sure
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down
> the
> > > parts
> > > > > of
> > > > > > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the
> new
> > > > > Spindle
> > > > > > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > >
> > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > >
> > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jesse Kuhnert
> > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> >
> > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Jesse Kuhnert
Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
Open source based consulting work centered around
dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
RE: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by James Carman <ja...@carmanconsulting.com>.
I'd say that the website should follow what Tomcat does and make it easy to
get to the docs for each release (3.0, 4.0, 4.1, 5.0).
-----Original Message-----
From: Geoff Longman [mailto:glongman@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 04, 2006 12:18 PM
To: Tapestry development
Subject: Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Yes but that is an alpha release right? Are you suggesting that an
alpha release of 4.1 means that the website will shift focus to 4.1
over 4.0? Not sure if that should happen until 4.1 goes final.
Anywho, sounds like a topic for everyone needs to get thier two cents in on.
:-)
Geoff
On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Because 4.1 should theoretically be getting released this week.
>
> On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hmm, I'm not all that up on the website issues. Why would a 4.0.3
> > release be any different than the 4.0.2 release?
> >
> > Geoff
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than the
> > > annotation optional jar + demo application.
> > >
> > > As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
> > > anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
> > >
> > > I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the ramifications
> > are
> > > in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1 using
> > > maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect all
of
> > the
> > > changes . (and cleanup some old items)
> > >
> > > Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link
to
> > each
> > > release # with its own set of docs)
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> > > > Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
> > > > shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
> > > >
> > > > Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core
Libraries
> > > > (this is thankfully a short list):
> > > >
> > > > 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not
> > recognized.
> > > >
> > > > 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one
case
> > > > - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
> > > >
> > > > 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
> > > > ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> > > > classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
> > > > or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> > > > declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of
the
> > > > 4.0 rules.
> > > >
> > > > In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
> > > > warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> > > > problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not
possible
> > > > to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
> > > > ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> > > > work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
> > > > core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
> > > >
> > > > Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> > > > teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of
this
> > > > magic stuff isn't costly.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> > > > Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is
98%
> > > > there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> > > > problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would
contain
> > > > in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
> > > >
> > > > Geoff
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very
> > backwards
> > > > > compatible.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that
were
> > > > marked
> > > > > for removal in 4.1 though.
> > > > >
> > > > > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or
> > not
> > > > but
> > > > > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in
eclipse
> > for
> > > > so
> > > > > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my
> > setup
> > > > > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've
been
> > > > using
> > > > > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so
> > far.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or
> > others
> > > > but
> > > > > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have
> > to be
> > > > a
> > > > > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the
> > additional
> > > > > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be
> > on
> > > > dtds)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so
> > now
> > > > > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but
4.1is
> > > > > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't
> > > > matter to
> > > > > > me)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > > > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a
> > Contrib
> > > > > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for
me.
> > > > > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add
> > extra
> > > > > > 4.1 goodness.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that
> > Spindle
> > > > > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is
> > moot
> > > > > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be
> > for
> > > > > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile
4.1in
> > > > > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain
in
> > the
> > > > > > ass.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all
> > of
> > > > the
> > > > > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series
> > versions
> > > > if
> > > > > > we
> > > > > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make
> > sure
> > > > the
> > > > > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the
> > parts
> > > > of
> > > > > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new
> > > > Spindle
> > > > > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > >
> > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > >
> > > >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > >
> > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jesse Kuhnert
> Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
>
> Open source based consulting work centered around
> dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
>
>
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
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Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com>.
Yes but that is an alpha release right? Are you suggesting that an
alpha release of 4.1 means that the website will shift focus to 4.1
over 4.0? Not sure if that should happen until 4.1 goes final.
Anywho, sounds like a topic for everyone needs to get thier two cents in on.
:-)
Geoff
On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Because 4.1 should theoretically be getting released this week.
>
> On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hmm, I'm not all that up on the website issues. Why would a 4.0.3
> > release be any different than the 4.0.2 release?
> >
> > Geoff
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than the
> > > annotation optional jar + demo application.
> > >
> > > As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
> > > anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
> > >
> > > I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the ramifications
> > are
> > > in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1 using
> > > maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect all of
> > the
> > > changes . (and cleanup some old items)
> > >
> > > Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link to
> > each
> > > release # with its own set of docs)
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> > > > Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
> > > > shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
> > > >
> > > > Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core Libraries
> > > > (this is thankfully a short list):
> > > >
> > > > 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not
> > recognized.
> > > >
> > > > 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one case
> > > > - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
> > > >
> > > > 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
> > > > ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> > > > classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
> > > > or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> > > > declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of the
> > > > 4.0 rules.
> > > >
> > > > In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
> > > > warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> > > > problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not possible
> > > > to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
> > > > ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> > > > work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
> > > > core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
> > > >
> > > > Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> > > > teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of this
> > > > magic stuff isn't costly.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> > > > Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is 98%
> > > > there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> > > > problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would contain
> > > > in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
> > > >
> > > > Geoff
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very
> > backwards
> > > > > compatible.
> > > > >
> > > > > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were
> > > > marked
> > > > > for removal in 4.1 though.
> > > > >
> > > > > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or
> > not
> > > > but
> > > > > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse
> > for
> > > > so
> > > > > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my
> > setup
> > > > > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been
> > > > using
> > > > > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so
> > far.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or
> > others
> > > > but
> > > > > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have
> > to be
> > > > a
> > > > > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the
> > additional
> > > > > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be
> > on
> > > > dtds)
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so
> > now
> > > > > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1is
> > > > > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't
> > > > matter to
> > > > > > me)
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > > > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a
> > Contrib
> > > > > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> > > > > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add
> > extra
> > > > > > 4.1 goodness.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that
> > Spindle
> > > > > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is
> > moot
> > > > > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be
> > for
> > > > > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1in
> > > > > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in
> > the
> > > > > > ass.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all
> > of
> > > > the
> > > > > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series
> > versions
> > > > if
> > > > > > we
> > > > > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make
> > sure
> > > > the
> > > > > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the
> > parts
> > > > of
> > > > > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new
> > > > Spindle
> > > > > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > >
> > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > >
> > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jesse Kuhnert
> Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
>
> Open source based consulting work centered around
> dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
>
>
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com>.
Because 4.1 should theoretically be getting released this week.
On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hmm, I'm not all that up on the website issues. Why would a 4.0.3
> release be any different than the 4.0.2 release?
>
> Geoff
>
> On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than the
> > annotation optional jar + demo application.
> >
> > As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
> > anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
> >
> > I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the ramifications
> are
> > in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1 using
> > maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect all of
> the
> > changes . (and cleanup some old items)
> >
> > Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link to
> each
> > release # with its own set of docs)
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> > > Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
> > > shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
> > >
> > > Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core Libraries
> > > (this is thankfully a short list):
> > >
> > > 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not
> recognized.
> > >
> > > 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one case
> > > - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
> > >
> > > 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
> > > ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> > > classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
> > > or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> > > declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of the
> > > 4.0 rules.
> > >
> > > In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
> > > warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> > > problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not possible
> > > to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
> > > ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> > > work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
> > > core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
> > >
> > > Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> > > teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of this
> > > magic stuff isn't costly.
> > >
> > >
> > > These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> > > Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is 98%
> > > there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> > > problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would contain
> > > in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
> > >
> > > Geoff
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very
> backwards
> > > > compatible.
> > > >
> > > > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were
> > > marked
> > > > for removal in 4.1 though.
> > > >
> > > > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or
> not
> > > but
> > > > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse
> for
> > > so
> > > > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my
> setup
> > > > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been
> > > using
> > > > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so
> far.
> > > >
> > > > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or
> others
> > > but
> > > > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have
> to be
> > > a
> > > > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the
> additional
> > > > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be
> on
> > > dtds)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so
> now
> > > > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1is
> > > > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > > > >
> > > > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't
> > > matter to
> > > > > me)
> > > > >
> > > > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a
> Contrib
> > > > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> > > > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add
> extra
> > > > > 4.1 goodness.
> > > > >
> > > > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that
> Spindle
> > > > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is
> moot
> > > > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be
> for
> > > > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > > > >
> > > > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1in
> > > > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in
> the
> > > > > ass.
> > > > >
> > > > > Geoff
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all
> of
> > > the
> > > > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series
> versions
> > > if
> > > > > we
> > > > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make
> sure
> > > the
> > > > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the
> parts
> > > of
> > > > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new
> > > Spindle
> > > > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > >
> > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > >
> > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jesse Kuhnert
> > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> >
> > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Jesse Kuhnert
Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
Open source based consulting work centered around
dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com>.
Hmm, I'm not all that up on the website issues. Why would a 4.0.3
release be any different than the 4.0.2 release?
Geoff
On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than the
> annotation optional jar + demo application.
>
> As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
> anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
>
> I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the ramifications are
> in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1 using
> maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect all of the
> changes . (and cleanup some old items)
>
> Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link to each
> release # with its own set of docs)
>
> On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> > Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
> > shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
> >
> > Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core Libraries
> > (this is thankfully a short list):
> >
> > 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not recognized.
> >
> > 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one case
> > - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
> >
> > 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
> > ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> > classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
> > or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> > declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of the
> > 4.0 rules.
> >
> > In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
> > warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> > problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not possible
> > to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
> > ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> > work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
> > core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
> >
> > Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> > teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of this
> > magic stuff isn't costly.
> >
> >
> > These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> > Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is 98%
> > there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> > problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would contain
> > in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
> >
> > Geoff
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very backwards
> > > compatible.
> > >
> > > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were
> > marked
> > > for removal in 4.1 though.
> > >
> > > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or not
> > but
> > > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse for
> > so
> > > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my setup
> > > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been
> > using
> > > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so far.
> > >
> > > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or others
> > but
> > > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have to be
> > a
> > > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the additional
> > > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be on
> > dtds)
> > >
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so now
> > > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1 is
> > > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > > >
> > > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't
> > matter to
> > > > me)
> > > >
> > > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a Contrib
> > > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> > > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add extra
> > > > 4.1 goodness.
> > > >
> > > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that Spindle
> > > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is moot
> > > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be for
> > > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > > >
> > > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1 in
> > > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in the
> > > > ass.
> > > >
> > > > Geoff
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of
> > the
> > > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > > >
> > > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions
> > if
> > > > we
> > > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure
> > the
> > > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > > >
> > > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts
> > of
> > > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new
> > Spindle
> > > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Geoff
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > > >
> > > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > >
> > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jesse Kuhnert
> Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
>
> Open source based consulting work centered around
> dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
>
>
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com>.
Annotations have definitely not been added to anything other than the
annotation optional jar + demo application.
As for context/template/etc lookup paths and such, I haven't changed
anything in there so you should be a-ok in theory.
I'm not against a 4.0.3 release, just wondering what the ramifications are
in terms of website content/etc. I had planned on releasing 4.1 using
maven2, as well as doing a lot of ducmentation updates to reflect all of the
changes . (and cleanup some old items)
Should we be releasing the site like tomcat does as well? (Ie a link to each
release # with its own set of docs)
On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
> Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
> shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
>
> Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core Libraries
> (this is thankfully a short list):
>
> 1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not recognized.
>
> 2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one case
> - Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
>
> 3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
> ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
> classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
> or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
> declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of the
> 4.0 rules.
>
> In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
> warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
> problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not possible
> to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
> ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
> work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
> core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
>
> Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
> teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of this
> magic stuff isn't costly.
>
>
> These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
> Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is 98%
> there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
> problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would contain
> in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
>
> Geoff
>
> On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very backwards
> > compatible.
> >
> > I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were
> marked
> > for removal in 4.1 though.
> >
> > It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or not
> but
> > you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse for
> so
> > long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my setup
> > supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been
> using
> > eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so far.
> >
> > I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or others
> but
> > most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have to be
> a
> > new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the additional
> > changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be on
> dtds)
> >
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so now
> > > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1 is
> > > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> > >
> > > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't
> matter to
> > > me)
> > >
> > > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a Contrib
> > > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> > > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add extra
> > > 4.1 goodness.
> > >
> > > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that Spindle
> > > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is moot
> > > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be for
> > > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> > >
> > > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1 in
> > > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in the
> > > ass.
> > >
> > > Geoff
> > >
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of
> the
> > > > 4.1changes in it.
> > > >
> > > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions
> if
> > > we
> > > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure
> the
> > > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > > >
> > > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts
> of
> > > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new
> Spindle
> > > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > > >
> > > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > > >
> > > > > Geoff
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > > >
> > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > > >
> > > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jesse Kuhnert
> > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> >
> > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Jesse Kuhnert
Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
Open source based consulting work centered around
dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com>.
DTD changes are fine and expected as are removed deprecations.
Annotations are not an issue really as using them in a core Library
shipped with 4.1 would make 4.1 compatible with JDK1.5 only.
Things that are annoying in general and a killer in the core Libraries
(this is thankfully a short list):
1) The metas for looking up page and component classes are not recognized.
2) Specless pages and components are not supported, except in one case
- Specless pages in the T3 sense are supported.
3) Pages/Components declared or referenced with path like names are
ignored as far as the role they play in T4 w/respect to locating
classes and specs. It's not an error but Spindle won't find the page
or component spec/class if it's not also locatable by explicit
declaration or by the old T3 "lookup rules" which are a subset of the
4.0 rules.
In the wild it means that users that use these features will see odd
warnings and weird behviour in some cases. In most cases a handy
problem marker will be the clue to the fix. User beware. Not possible
to add a marker to a binary file in a jar so the core Libraries that
ship with Spindle 4T4 need to be 'clean'. This means a little more
work for us committers but I think it has a definite advantage - the
core stuff is easier to read and figure out (no magic).
Who knows, maybe having stricter core Libraries would result in a
teeeny weeny perfomance boost as I'm not convinced that a lot of this
magic stuff isn't costly.
These magic things are convenience items for end users IMO and
Framework has, so far, gotten along fine without them. Contrib is 98%
there too. In fact there is only one component in contrib that is
problematic, DumpObject. The fix for this is what 4.0.3 would contain
in addition to the any other bug fixes that have been backported.
Geoff
On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very backwards
> compatible.
>
> I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were marked
> for removal in 4.1 though.
>
> It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or not but
> you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse for so
> long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my setup
> supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been using
> eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so far.
>
> I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or others but
> most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have to be a
> new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the additional
> changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be on dtds)
>
>
> On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so now
> > would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1 is
> > 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
> >
> > (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't matter to
> > me)
> >
> > I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> > functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a Contrib
> > that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> > After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add extra
> > 4.1 goodness.
> >
> > Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that Spindle
> > 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is moot
> > because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be for
> > 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
> >
> > BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1 in
> > Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in the
> > ass.
> >
> > Geoff
> >
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of the
> > > 4.1changes in it.
> > >
> > > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions if
> > we
> > > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure the
> > > changes get into trunk as well?
> > >
> > > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts of
> > > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new Spindle
> > > > 4T4 core without error.
> > > >
> > > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > > >
> > > > Geoff
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Jesse Kuhnert
> > > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> > >
> > > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jesse Kuhnert
> Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
>
> Open source based consulting work centered around
> dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
>
>
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com>.
Yeah 4.1 should just be 4.0 ++, hopefully with ++ meaning very backwards
compatible.
I have removed (not all) a good portion of interfaces/etc that were marked
for removal in 4.1 though.
It's impossible for me to guess whether things will still work or not but
you can always give it a try and see? I've been using 4.1 in eclipse for so
long now my views on how easy it is are probably invalid since my setup
supports everything it wants already ;) I should note that I've been using
eclipse 3.2 almost exclusively, but everything is mostly easy so far.
I'm not sure I follow you in regard to compatibility with 4.0 or others but
most of the new functionality is optionally used . There will have to be a
new .page/.jwc dtd and .script dtd published to handle the additional
changes. (Or modified? Not sure what the versioning path should be on dtds)
On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so now
> would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1 is
> 4.0 plus extra goodness right?
>
> (I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't matter to
> me)
>
> I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
> functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a Contrib
> that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
> After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add extra
> 4.1 goodness.
>
> Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that Spindle
> 4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is moot
> because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be for
> 4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
>
> BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1 in
> Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in the
> ass.
>
> Geoff
>
>
> On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of the
> > 4.1changes in it.
> >
> > I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions if
> we
> > can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure the
> > changes get into trunk as well?
> >
> > On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts of
> > > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new Spindle
> > > 4T4 core without error.
> > >
> > > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> > >
> > > Geoff
> > >
> > > --
> > > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Jesse Kuhnert
> > Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
> >
> > Open source based consulting work centered around
> > dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Jesse Kuhnert
Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
Open source based consulting work centered around
dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com>.
Thing is I have not even started looking at 4.1 yet and to do so now
would be a step backward for me. Correct me if I'm wrong but 4.1 is
4.0 plus extra goodness right?
(I suspect the render story is different in 4.1 but that doesn't matter to me)
I need to get the 4.0 stuff out the door so that the basic
functionality can be proven. Can't do that until there is a Contrib
that Spindle 4T4 can process. Thus, 4.0.3 is not optional for me.
After that, and added annotation support, I can modify to add extra
4.1 goodness.
Although, if 4.1 mandates the use of some T4 "features" that Spindle
4T4 can't handle , in a Library *shipped* wth 4.1, then point is moot
because I won't be porting anyways. In this case support will be for
4.0 only until 5.0 comes out.
BTW how much jumping around and tweaking is needed to compile 4.1 in
Eclipse out of the (svn) box? The build story for 4.0 is a pain in the
ass.
Geoff
On 6/4/06, Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com> wrote:
> There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of the
> 4.1changes in it.
>
> I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions if we
> can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure the
> changes get into trunk as well?
>
> On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts of
> > Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new Spindle
> > 4T4 core without error.
> >
> > BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
> >
> > Geoff
> >
> > --
> > The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> > Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> > Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jesse Kuhnert
> Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
>
> Open source based consulting work centered around
> dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.
>
>
--
The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
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Re: Tapesrty 4.0.3 and SVN
Posted by Jesse Kuhnert <jk...@gmail.com>.
There is a 4.0 branch, but the current tapestry4 trunk has all of the
4.1changes in it.
I think it is preferrable to not release anymore 4.0 series versions if we
can get away with it, but if it ~has~ to be done can you make sure the
changes get into trunk as well?
On 6/4/06, Geoff Longman <gl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Where is 4.0.3 in the repo? I've finally narrowsed down the parts of
> Contrib that need to be tweaked to be passed through the new Spindle
> 4T4 core without error.
>
> BTW is looks like only 3 changes.
>
> Geoff
>
> --
> The Spindle guy. http://spindle.sf.net
> Blog: http://jroller.com/page/glongman
> Other interests: http://www.squidoo.com/spaceelevator/
>
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>
>
--
Jesse Kuhnert
Tacos/Tapestry, team member/developer
Open source based consulting work centered around
dojo/tapestry/tacos/hivemind.