You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org by Georg Datterl <ge...@geneon.de> on 2009/12/01 17:34:29 UTC
again strange keeps
Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
Regards,
Georg Datterl
------ Kontakt ------
Georg Datterl
Geneon media solutions gmbh
Gutenstetter Stra�e 8a
90449 N�rnberg
HRB N�rnberg: 17193
Gesch�ftsf�hrer: Yong-Harry Steiert
Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
www.geneon.de
Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
AW: again strange keeps
Posted by Georg Datterl <ge...@geneon.de>.
Hi Vincent,
It works now, but only with constraint "always", not with "5". Thanks for your help.
Regards,
Georg Datterl
------ Kontakt ------
Georg Datterl
Geneon media solutions gmbh
Gutenstetter Straße 8a
90449 Nürnberg
HRB Nürnberg: 17193
Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
www.geneon.de
Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Freitag, 4. Dezember 2009 17:03
An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
Hi Georg,
Georg Datterl wrote:
> Hi Vincent,
>
> You explanations sounds quite good, but if I replace the keeps "5" with "always", the whole block, images and everything, move to the next page. Is that, because that's more "desireable"?
That's because you use keep-with-next.within-page instead of .within-column, and that has a side-effect on the table algorithm. In
short: .within-column forbids any block-level break whatsoever, whereas .within-page only forbids page breaks. This is enough for the table algorithm to build a different sequence of elements, and skip the preferable break after the 'TEST' block. Replace your keep.within-page with keep.within-column and you get the expected output.
> The present solution with the headre and the final, empty line on the next page is in any case least desireable, because it looks ugly. Do you see a way to force the images and two tables on the first page, the third table and image on the second page?
>
> Regards,
>
> Georg Datterl
HTH,
Vincent
PS: please, next time, could you try and simplify your FO document to use more 'regular' dimensions? For example, a padding of 1.5pt instead of 1.417pt, a space-after of 6pt instead of 5.669pt, etc. That would ease the debugging a lot (provided you can still reproduce your problem, of course). Thanks :-)
> ------ Kontakt ------
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> Geneon media solutions gmbh
> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
> 90449 Nürnberg
>
> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>
> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>
> www.geneon.de
>
> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>
> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2009 13:24
> An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
> Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
>
> Hi Georg,
>
> Georg Datterl wrote:
>> Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
>>
>> Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
>
> Support for integer keeps is very limited at the moment. A break
> occurring within an integer keep will simply be given maximum penalty
> in the hope that breaks at better places (i.e., where keep has been
> left to
> auto) will be privileged. All integer values result into the same
> break penalty. In fact, the current implementation supports only 3
> keep
> values: auto, 'highly desirable', always.
>
> A break where keep is highly desirable may still be privileged over a
> break where keep is auto if that leads to a better overall layout; for
> example, if breaking at auto places would lead to half-empty pages
> whereas breaking at undesirable places would give full pages. (This is
> not compliant with the Recommendation, for that matter.)
>
> In the present case, however, there is something else that comes into
> play: since the two images in the first column must be kept together, they make a big unbreakable block. Therefore, the table algorithm will put as much content from the second column as possible to match the height of the first one (the heuristic being that full tables are more desirable). By doing that, it will skip the acceptable breaks after the TEST blocks, and will end up with the less acceptable ones inside the inner tables.
>
>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> ------ Kontakt ------
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> Geneon media solutions gmbh
>> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
>> 90449 Nürnberg
>>
>> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
>> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>>
>> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
>> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>>
>> www.geneon.de
>>
>> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>>
>> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
>> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
>> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
>
>
> Vincent
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
AW: again strange keeps
Posted by Georg Datterl <ge...@geneon.de>.
Hi Vincent,
I'll try your suggestion on Monday. Thanks a lot.
I do try to simplify my fos, but usually I end up with a simple fo which doesn't show the problem any longer. But I did not know this values make debugging harder. I'll keep it in mind for the next problem.
Regards and have a nice weekend,
Georg Datterl
------ Kontakt ------
Georg Datterl
Geneon media solutions gmbh
Gutenstetter Straße 8a
90449 Nürnberg
HRB Nürnberg: 17193
Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
www.geneon.de
Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Freitag, 4. Dezember 2009 17:03
An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
Hi Georg,
Georg Datterl wrote:
> Hi Vincent,
>
> You explanations sounds quite good, but if I replace the keeps "5" with "always", the whole block, images and everything, move to the next page. Is that, because that's more "desireable"?
That's because you use keep-with-next.within-page instead of .within-column, and that has a side-effect on the table algorithm. In
short: .within-column forbids any block-level break whatsoever, whereas .within-page only forbids page breaks. This is enough for the table algorithm to build a different sequence of elements, and skip the preferable break after the 'TEST' block. Replace your keep.within-page with keep.within-column and you get the expected output.
> The present solution with the headre and the final, empty line on the next page is in any case least desireable, because it looks ugly. Do you see a way to force the images and two tables on the first page, the third table and image on the second page?
>
> Regards,
>
> Georg Datterl
HTH,
Vincent
PS: please, next time, could you try and simplify your FO document to use more 'regular' dimensions? For example, a padding of 1.5pt instead of 1.417pt, a space-after of 6pt instead of 5.669pt, etc. That would ease the debugging a lot (provided you can still reproduce your problem, of course). Thanks :-)
> ------ Kontakt ------
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> Geneon media solutions gmbh
> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
> 90449 Nürnberg
>
> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>
> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>
> www.geneon.de
>
> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>
> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2009 13:24
> An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
> Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
>
> Hi Georg,
>
> Georg Datterl wrote:
>> Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
>>
>> Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
>
> Support for integer keeps is very limited at the moment. A break
> occurring within an integer keep will simply be given maximum penalty
> in the hope that breaks at better places (i.e., where keep has been
> left to
> auto) will be privileged. All integer values result into the same
> break penalty. In fact, the current implementation supports only 3
> keep
> values: auto, 'highly desirable', always.
>
> A break where keep is highly desirable may still be privileged over a
> break where keep is auto if that leads to a better overall layout; for
> example, if breaking at auto places would lead to half-empty pages
> whereas breaking at undesirable places would give full pages. (This is
> not compliant with the Recommendation, for that matter.)
>
> In the present case, however, there is something else that comes into
> play: since the two images in the first column must be kept together, they make a big unbreakable block. Therefore, the table algorithm will put as much content from the second column as possible to match the height of the first one (the heuristic being that full tables are more desirable). By doing that, it will skip the acceptable breaks after the TEST blocks, and will end up with the less acceptable ones inside the inner tables.
>
>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> ------ Kontakt ------
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> Geneon media solutions gmbh
>> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
>> 90449 Nürnberg
>>
>> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
>> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>>
>> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
>> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>>
>> www.geneon.de
>>
>> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>>
>> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
>> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
>> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
>
>
> Vincent
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
Re: again strange keeps
Posted by Vincent Hennebert <vh...@gmail.com>.
Hi Georg,
Georg Datterl wrote:
> Hi Vincent,
>
> You explanations sounds quite good, but if I replace the keeps "5" with "always", the whole block, images and everything, move to the next page. Is that, because that's more "desireable"?
That’s because you use keep-with-next.within-page instead of
.within-column, and that has a side-effect on the table algorithm. In
short: .within-column forbids any block-level break whatsoever, whereas
.within-page only forbids page breaks. This is enough for the table
algorithm to build a different sequence of elements, and skip the
preferable break after the ‘TEST’ block. Replace your keep.within-page
with keep.within-column and you get the expected output.
> The present solution with the headre and the final, empty line on the next page is in any case least desireable, because it looks ugly. Do you see a way to force the images and two tables on the first page, the third table and image on the second page?
>
> Regards,
>
> Georg Datterl
HTH,
Vincent
PS: please, next time, could you try and simplify your FO document to
use more ‘regular’ dimensions? For example, a padding of 1.5pt instead
of 1.417pt, a space-after of 6pt instead of 5.669pt, etc. That would
ease the debugging a lot (provided you can still reproduce your problem,
of course). Thanks :-)
> ------ Kontakt ------
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> Geneon media solutions gmbh
> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
> 90449 Nürnberg
>
> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>
> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>
> www.geneon.de
>
> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>
> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2009 13:24
> An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
> Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
>
> Hi Georg,
>
> Georg Datterl wrote:
>> Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
>>
>> Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
>
> Support for integer keeps is very limited at the moment. A break occurring within an integer keep will simply be given maximum penalty in the hope that breaks at better places (i.e., where keep has been left to
> auto) will be privileged. All integer values result into the same break penalty. In fact, the current implementation supports only 3 keep
> values: auto, 'highly desirable', always.
>
> A break where keep is highly desirable may still be privileged over a break where keep is auto if that leads to a better overall layout; for example, if breaking at auto places would lead to half-empty pages whereas breaking at undesirable places would give full pages. (This is not compliant with the Recommendation, for that matter.)
>
> In the present case, however, there is something else that comes into
> play: since the two images in the first column must be kept together, they make a big unbreakable block. Therefore, the table algorithm will put as much content from the second column as possible to match the height of the first one (the heuristic being that full tables are more desirable). By doing that, it will skip the acceptable breaks after the TEST blocks, and will end up with the less acceptable ones inside the inner tables.
>
>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> ------ Kontakt ------
>>
>> Georg Datterl
>>
>> Geneon media solutions gmbh
>> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
>> 90449 Nürnberg
>>
>> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
>> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>>
>> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
>> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>>
>> www.geneon.de
>>
>> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>>
>> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
>> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
>> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
>
>
> Vincent
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
AW: again strange keeps
Posted by Georg Datterl <ge...@geneon.de>.
Hi Vincent,
You explanations sounds quite good, but if I replace the keeps "5" with "always", the whole block, images and everything, move to the next page. Is that, because that's more "desireable"?
The present solution with the headre and the final, empty line on the next page is in any case least desireable, because it looks ugly. Do you see a way to force the images and two tables on the first page, the third table and image on the second page?
Regards,
Georg Datterl
------ Kontakt ------
Georg Datterl
Geneon media solutions gmbh
Gutenstetter Straße 8a
90449 Nürnberg
HRB Nürnberg: 17193
Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
www.geneon.de
Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Vincent Hennebert [mailto:vhennebert@gmail.com]
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 3. Dezember 2009 13:24
An: fop-users@xmlgraphics.apache.org
Betreff: Re: again strange keeps
Hi Georg,
Georg Datterl wrote:
> Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
>
> Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
Support for integer keeps is very limited at the moment. A break occurring within an integer keep will simply be given maximum penalty in the hope that breaks at better places (i.e., where keep has been left to
auto) will be privileged. All integer values result into the same break penalty. In fact, the current implementation supports only 3 keep
values: auto, 'highly desirable', always.
A break where keep is highly desirable may still be privileged over a break where keep is auto if that leads to a better overall layout; for example, if breaking at auto places would lead to half-empty pages whereas breaking at undesirable places would give full pages. (This is not compliant with the Recommendation, for that matter.)
In the present case, however, there is something else that comes into
play: since the two images in the first column must be kept together, they make a big unbreakable block. Therefore, the table algorithm will put as much content from the second column as possible to match the height of the first one (the heuristic being that full tables are more desirable). By doing that, it will skip the acceptable breaks after the TEST blocks, and will end up with the less acceptable ones inside the inner tables.
> Regards,
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> ------ Kontakt ------
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> Geneon media solutions gmbh
> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
> 90449 Nürnberg
>
> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>
> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>
> www.geneon.de
>
> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>
> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
Vincent
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org
Re: again strange keeps
Posted by Vincent Hennebert <vh...@gmail.com>.
Hi Georg,
Georg Datterl wrote:
> Hi everybody, hi Vincent,
>
> Attached fo file contains the already well known tables, now for A6 format. In this case, the right column contains three short tables and one image. Since that's too much for one page, fop inserts a break before the last line of the third table, overriding a keep-with-next.within-page="5". Now I would have expected the keep at the red block with the "TEST"-Text, since this block does not have any keeps, but obviously I'm missing something here. Can somebody help?
Support for integer keeps is very limited at the moment. A break
occurring within an integer keep will simply be given maximum penalty in
the hope that breaks at better places (i.e., where keep has been left to
auto) will be privileged. All integer values result into the same break
penalty. In fact, the current implementation supports only 3 keep
values: auto, ‘highly desirable’, always.
A break where keep is highly desirable may still be privileged over
a break where keep is auto if that leads to a better overall layout; for
example, if breaking at auto places would lead to half-empty pages
whereas breaking at undesirable places would give full pages. (This is
not compliant with the Recommendation, for that matter.)
In the present case, however, there is something else that comes into
play: since the two images in the first column must be kept together,
they make a big unbreakable block. Therefore, the table algorithm will
put as much content from the second column as possible to match the
height of the first one (the heuristic being that full tables are more
desirable). By doing that, it will skip the acceptable breaks after the
TEST blocks, and will end up with the less acceptable ones inside the
inner tables.
> Regards,
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> ------ Kontakt ------
>
> Georg Datterl
>
> Geneon media solutions gmbh
> Gutenstetter Straße 8a
> 90449 Nürnberg
>
> HRB Nürnberg: 17193
> Geschäftsführer: Yong-Harry Steiert
>
> Tel.: 0911/36 78 88 - 26
> Fax: 0911/36 78 88 - 20
>
> www.geneon.de
>
> Weitere Mitglieder der Willmy MediaGroup:
>
> IRS Integrated Realization Services GmbH: www.irs-nbg.de
> Willmy PrintMedia GmbH: www.willmy.de
> Willmy Consult & Content GmbH: www.willmycc.de
Vincent
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: fop-users-unsubscribe@xmlgraphics.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: fop-users-help@xmlgraphics.apache.org