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Posted to legal-discuss@apache.org by "Dan Haywood (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org> on 2010/10/11 16:55:32 UTC
[jira] Created: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE)
a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Key: LEGAL-82
URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
Project: Legal Discuss
Issue Type: Question
Reporter: Dan Haywood
The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
Many thanks,
Dan
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[jira] Commented: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than
DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Posted by "Dan Haywood (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org>.
[ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=12919985#action_12919985 ]
Dan Haywood commented on LEGAL-82:
----------------------------------
Hi Sam,
Thanks for that, that's pretty clear.
In our proposal to enter the incubator we had identified the dependency on Hibernate as being LGPL and would need to replace it, almost certainly with Apache's own OpenJPA. So no problem on that front.
The BerkeleyDB dependency got overlooked, so I think we'll need to drop that particular module from the project.
Thanks again, I'll close this issue.
Dan
> Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Key: LEGAL-82
> URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
> Project: Legal Discuss
> Issue Type: Question
> Reporter: Dan Haywood
>
> The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
> In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
> In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
> My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
> Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
> Many thanks,
> Dan
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[jira] Commented: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than
DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Posted by "Dan Haywood (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org>.
[ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=12919860#action_12919860 ]
Dan Haywood commented on LEGAL-82:
----------------------------------
Hi Mark,
yes, I raised a separate ticket (LEGAL-81) with respect to that other dependency.
This ticket is about some other Category-X dependencies that we also have.
Apols if I've made things confusing here; I guess one ticket might have sufficed.
Dan
> Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Key: LEGAL-82
> URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
> Project: Legal Discuss
> Issue Type: Question
> Reporter: Dan Haywood
>
> The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
> In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
> In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
> My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
> Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
> Many thanks,
> Dan
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[jira] Closed: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE)
a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Posted by "Dan Haywood (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org>.
[ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:all-tabpanel ]
Dan Haywood closed LEGAL-82.
----------------------------
Resolution: Fixed
Answered satisfactorily.
> Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Key: LEGAL-82
> URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
> Project: Legal Discuss
> Issue Type: Question
> Reporter: Dan Haywood
>
> The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
> In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
> In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
> My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
> Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
> Many thanks,
> Dan
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[jira] Commented: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than
DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Posted by "Mark Struberg (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org>.
[ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=12919857#action_12919857 ]
Mark Struberg commented on LEGAL-82:
------------------------------------
just to make this more clear:
"Not 100% sure though whether/where we need to put this on file. I'd say we contact legal@a.o, just to be sure."
did relate to Sergey Ilinskys offer to double license it under ASL for us. Not sure about the steps/process which needs to be done for this re-licensing.
> Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Key: LEGAL-82
> URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
> Project: Legal Discuss
> Issue Type: Question
> Reporter: Dan Haywood
>
> The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
> In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
> In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
> My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
> Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
> Many thanks,
> Dan
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[jira] Commented: (LEGAL-82) Is it ok to USE (rather than
DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
Posted by "Sam Ruby (JIRA)" <ji...@apache.org>.
[ https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82?page=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.issuetabpanels:comment-tabpanel&focusedCommentId=12919979#action_12919979 ]
Sam Ruby commented on LEGAL-82:
-------------------------------
Short answer is no.
There are many different kinds of usages. Using GNU Emacs to edit source files is OK, as is doing so on GNU Linux. Neither create a runtime dependency that would prevent our licensees from sub-licensing our code and distributing the results under the terms of the Apache License, Version 2.0.
Exceptions are often granted for optional dependencies where there are viable alternatives. Or cases where the user separately and intentionally installs the dependency.
The issue of inclusion of Hibernate has been dealt with before, and the resolution was to find an alternative:
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/ROL-1447
Further background: http://www.apache.org/legal/ramblings.html
> Is it ok to USE (rather than DISTRIBUTE) a Category-X dependency? If so, what, precisely, is allowed?
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Key: LEGAL-82
> URL: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LEGAL-82
> Project: Legal Discuss
> Issue Type: Question
> Reporter: Dan Haywood
>
> The Apache Isis project has recently entered the incubator, and we're sorting out dependencies. This is a Java project, built using Maven.
> In one of our modules we have an dependency (via Maven) to an LGPL dependency (Hibernate); in another we have a dependency to a Sleepycat dependency (Berkeley JE). I see that these are both "Category X" dependencies (http://www.apache.org/legal/resolved.html#category-x).
> In response to a question relating to something else, our mentor noted that "... if we are _not_ distributing [an LGPL dependency] but only _using_ it, then it would be no problem at all. LGPL projects might be used this way." (see http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-isis-dev/201010.mbox/%3C95888.7913.qm@web27803.mail.ukl.yahoo.com%3E).
> My question is: what exactly is allowed here? Specifically, does "USE" allow a <dependency> reference in a Maven POM, with a corresponding <repository> entry so that the end-user can download the dependency themselves.
> Not to tell a tale here, but I did note in googling that the Lucene project does seem to have a dependency on Berkeley JE, see http://lucene.apache.org/java/3_0_2/api/contrib-bdb-je/org/apache/lucene/store/je/JEDirectory.html. I don't know if they're "USEing" the dependency in the appropriate way? It would seem like we want to do what Lucene is doing.
> Many thanks,
> Dan
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