development question of future feature

[Christopher Jackson <ti...@verizon.net>]

I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the developers
of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?

 

your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface. as a
simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve the
product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.

 

thanks for you time.

 

Chris Jackson

Maryland USA

Re: development question of future feature

[Kevin Grignon <ke...@gmail.com>]

KG02- See comments inline. 

On Tuesday, July 17, 2012, Clarence GUO wrote:
 
I think new UI means three aspects.
One is about usability which make UI easier to use. Sidebar of Symphony is
a good illustration. 
Symphony has another good improvement which drew less
attentions, that is it reorganised the menus and toolbars(only on Java
build version). The layout of menus and toolbars in Symphony is more
reasonable I think. For example, the entry of define range name is from
"Create" main menu in Symphony, but that of AOO locates in "Data" main
menu. Symhony is better, because define range name will create a new name
but actions under "Data" main menu are all related to concrete data
operations.
Here I want to discuss the other two aspects(visual design and resources).
Maybe I missed some discussions, but I saw many discussions only focus on
the first aspect.
We also need a new visual design. Nowadays the the popular UI style is
transparent + gradient effect, large and simplified icons, light colors,
some animation effects, and so on. Our UI style is quite old. The visual
design will give users the first feeling. So it is as important as the
first aspect.
And our resources are quite old too. Here the resources I mean gallery,
templates of Presentaion master pages and so on. We really need to update
them.
 I really hope new AOO3.5 or 4.0 can attract my eyes when I first see it.

KG02 - Clarence, thanks for sharing. I agree with your assessments of the Symphony task bar UI design and menu information design. Each contributes to improved usability of the toolset. 
 
KG02 - I see a new UI design according to the following design perspectives: 
1) information design - design of the information architecture that reinforces tool objects and their available actions.
2) user interface/interaction design - the design of the layout and behaviour of tool workspaces and forms.
3) visual design -  the visual elements or skin we apply to our info and UI design
I intend to create a number of pages on the AOO wiki to discuss such a UI refresh.  I invite your to continue to share your thoughts and contribute to the future design direction of AOO.

KG02 - Regarding clip art and template resources, I agree. I think Symphony may have some fresh connect to contribute. We may want to consider a social integration with providers like OpenClipart.
 

2012/7/16 Christopher Jackson <ti...@verizon.net>

> I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the developers
> of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?
>
>
>
> your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface. as a
> simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve the
> product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.
>
>
>
> thanks for you time.
>
>
>
> Chris Jackson
>
> Maryland USA
>
>

Re: development question of future feature

[Shan Zhu <sh...@gmail.com>]

It sounds good to enhance the clip art and presentation template.

BTW, to name a cell range in Spreadsheet, the menu entrance is Insert->
Name-> Define.
The "define range" you mentioned is about Database Range, which is a little
different from Name.
Symphony has disabled the entrance, use Name only.

Regards,
Shan Zhu




2012/7/17 Clarence GUO <cl...@gmail.com>

> I think new UI means three aspects.
> One is about usability which make UI easier to use. Sidebar of Symphony is
> a good illustration. Symphony has another good improvement which drew less
> attentions, that is it reorganised the menus and toolbars(only on Java
> build version). The layout of menus and toolbars in Symphony is more
> reasonable I think. For example, the entry of define range name is from
> "Create" main menu in Symphony, but that of AOO locates in "Data" main
> menu. Symhony is better, because define range name will create a new name
> but actions under "Data" main menu are all related to concrete data
> operations.
> Here I want to discuss the other two aspects(visual design and resources).
> Maybe I missed some discussions, but I saw many discussions only focus on
> the first aspect.
> We also need a new visual design. Nowadays the the popular UI style is
> transparent + gradient effect, large and simplified icons, light colors,
> some animation effects, and so on. Our UI style is quite old. The visual
> design will give users the first feeling. So it is as important as the
> first aspect.
> And our resources are quite old too. Here the resources I mean gallery,
> templates of Presentaion master pages and so on. We really need to update
> them.
>  I really hope new AOO3.5 or 4.0 can attract my eyes when I first see it.
>
>
> 2012/7/16 Christopher Jackson <ti...@verizon.net>
>
> > I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the
> developers
> > of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?
> >
> >
> >
> > your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface.
> as a
> > simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve
> the
> > product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.
> >
> >
> >
> > thanks for you time.
> >
> >
> >
> > Chris Jackson
> >
> > Maryland USA
> >
> >
>

Re: development question of future feature

[Clarence GUO <cl...@gmail.com>]

I think new UI means three aspects.
One is about usability which make UI easier to use. Sidebar of Symphony is
a good illustration. Symphony has another good improvement which drew less
attentions, that is it reorganised the menus and toolbars(only on Java
build version). The layout of menus and toolbars in Symphony is more
reasonable I think. For example, the entry of define range name is from
"Create" main menu in Symphony, but that of AOO locates in "Data" main
menu. Symhony is better, because define range name will create a new name
but actions under "Data" main menu are all related to concrete data
operations.
Here I want to discuss the other two aspects(visual design and resources).
Maybe I missed some discussions, but I saw many discussions only focus on
the first aspect.
We also need a new visual design. Nowadays the the popular UI style is
transparent + gradient effect, large and simplified icons, light colors,
some animation effects, and so on. Our UI style is quite old. The visual
design will give users the first feeling. So it is as important as the
first aspect.
And our resources are quite old too. Here the resources I mean gallery,
templates of Presentaion master pages and so on. We really need to update
them.
 I really hope new AOO3.5 or 4.0 can attract my eyes when I first see it.


2012/7/16 Christopher Jackson <ti...@verizon.net>

> I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the developers
> of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?
>
>
>
> your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface. as a
> simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve the
> product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.
>
>
>
> thanks for you time.
>
>
>
> Chris Jackson
>
> Maryland USA
>
>

Re: development question of future feature

[Jürgen Schmidt <jo...@googlemail.com>]

On 7/16/12 6:35 AM, Christopher Jackson wrote:
> I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the developers
> of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?
> 
>  
> 
> your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface. as a
> simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve the
> product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.
> 

sure, if somebody comes up with good ideas how to improve the UI to make
the work more intuitive or easier for users we are open for changes.

Symphony has some nice UI changes that we will probably integrate or at
least adapt in AOO over time.

Feel free to provide your own ideas to the project, explain and discuss
new ideas for UI changes here on the list.

Juergen

Re: development question of future feature

[Kevin Grignon <ke...@gmail.com>]

KG02 - See comments inline

On Jul 20, 2012, at 6:37 PM, TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com> wrote:

> On 7/16/2012 18:07, Kevin Grignon wrote:
>> KG01 - Hey all, I'm back from the unconnected world.
>> 
>> Great topic. See comments inline.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 16, 2012, at 11:22 PM, Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
>> 
>>> Just for the property sidebar. Kevin have done some analysis about how
>>> it can be integrated into AOO.
>> 
>> KG01 - Indeed, Symphony sidebar has some great behavior that we should adopt. My assessment identifies specific aspects of the Symphony UX to adopt, and identifies opportunities for AOO improvement as well. Ideally, we can provide a hybrib that reprenents the best of both tools. Next step is to move the line items into Bugzilla.
>> 
>> I would also note that there ate many aspects of Symphony UX that would be great to adopt. See. AOO UX wiki for more details.
>>> 
>>> The problem is the migration of it from Symphony won't be
>>> straightforward and no one is actually working on it as far as I know.
>> 
>> KG01 - hmmmm....
>>> 
>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:34 PM, Guy Waterval <wa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Hi Yong Lin Ma,
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 2012/7/16 Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>
>>>> 
>>>>> You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Or propose ideas by yourself here
>> 
>> KG01 - visit the AOO UX wiki for more information on how we can move forward on our next generation UI.
>>>> 
>>>> What I find a great feature in LS is the "Context sensitive toolbar" which
>>>> allows to reduce the number of available toolbars in the Vue menu.
>> 
>> KG01 - Context sensitive toolbars are a great way to manage complexity and to progressively disclose tool actions. The Symphony task pane is a great start. We could explore other approaches to reduce the number of commands presented in the toolbars and make the available sections more contextual.
>> 
>>>> But OK,
>>>> I'm a Symphony user. Perhaps this feature would be found unpleasant for
>>>> most OpenOffice users.
>>>> Meanwhile, the impossibility to deplace this toolbar in the work area is
>>>> perhaps discutable.
>>>> 
>>>> A+
>>>> --
>>>> gw
>> 
>> KG01 - Re: next generation AOO UI. I will start a discussion thread on the AOO wiki to advance this exploration. See wiki for details.
>> 
> Hi, Kevin,
> 
> Two quick comments:
> (1) Links to the wiki are helpful to your readers here.

KG02 - Indeed, I'll create the pages and share the links when available. I'm on vacation right now, and will update the UX wiki in a few days. Much to discuss here moving forward. 

> (2) Pictures of the Symphony details are worth 10K words, especially in the .ODT documents (it's easier there than on the wiki).
> 

KG02 - I understand. Great suggestion. 


> /tj/
> 

Re: development question of future feature

[TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com>]

On 7/16/2012 18:07, Kevin Grignon wrote:
> KG01 - Hey all, I'm back from the unconnected world.
>
> Great topic. See comments inline.
>
>
>
> On Jul 16, 2012, at 11:22 PM, Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>> Just for the property sidebar. Kevin have done some analysis about how
>> it can be integrated into AOO.
>
> KG01 - Indeed, Symphony sidebar has some great behavior that we should adopt. My assessment identifies specific aspects of the Symphony UX to adopt, and identifies opportunities for AOO improvement as well. Ideally, we can provide a hybrib that reprenents the best of both tools. Next step is to move the line items into Bugzilla.
>
> I would also note that there ate many aspects of Symphony UX that would be great to adopt. See. AOO UX wiki for more details.
>>
>> The problem is the migration of it from Symphony won't be
>> straightforward and no one is actually working on it as far as I know.
>
> KG01 - hmmmm....
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:34 PM, Guy Waterval <wa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi Yong Lin Ma,
>>>
>>>
>>> 2012/7/16 Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>
>>>
>>>> You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.
>>>>
>>>> Or propose ideas by yourself here
>
> KG01 - visit the AOO UX wiki for more information on how we can move forward on our next generation UI.
>>>
>>> What I find a great feature in LS is the "Context sensitive toolbar" which
>>> allows to reduce the number of available toolbars in the Vue menu.
>
> KG01 - Context sensitive toolbars are a great way to manage complexity and to progressively disclose tool actions. The Symphony task pane is a great start. We could explore other approaches to reduce the number of commands presented in the toolbars and make the available sections more contextual.
>
>>> But OK,
>>> I'm a Symphony user. Perhaps this feature would be found unpleasant for
>>> most OpenOffice users.
>>> Meanwhile, the impossibility to deplace this toolbar in the work area is
>>> perhaps discutable.
>>>
>>> A+
>>> --
>>> gw
>
> KG01 - Re: next generation AOO UI. I will start a discussion thread on the AOO wiki to advance this exploration. See wiki for details.
>
Hi, Kevin,

Two quick comments:
(1) Links to the wiki are helpful to your readers here.
(2) Pictures of the Symphony details are worth 10K words, especially in 
the .ODT documents (it's easier there than on the wiki).

/tj/

Re: development question of future feature

[Kevin Grignon <ke...@gmail.com>]

KG01 - Hey all, I'm back from the unconnected world. 

Great topic. See comments inline. 



On Jul 16, 2012, at 11:22 PM, Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org> wrote:

> Just for the property sidebar. Kevin have done some analysis about how
> it can be integrated into AOO.

KG01 - Indeed, Symphony sidebar has some great behavior that we should adopt. My assessment identifies specific aspects of the Symphony UX to adopt, and identifies opportunities for AOO improvement as well. Ideally, we can provide a hybrib that reprenents the best of both tools. Next step is to move the line items into Bugzilla. 

I would also note that there ate many aspects of Symphony UX that would be great to adopt. See. AOO UX wiki for more details. 
> 
> The problem is the migration of it from Symphony won't be
> straightforward and no one is actually working on it as far as I know.

KG01 - hmmmm....
> 
> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:34 PM, Guy Waterval <wa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Yong Lin Ma,
>> 
>> 
>> 2012/7/16 Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>
>> 
>>> You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.
>>> 
>>> Or propose ideas by yourself here 

KG01 - visit the AOO UX wiki for more information on how we can move forward on our next generation UI. 
>> 
>> What I find a great feature in LS is the "Context sensitive toolbar" which
>> allows to reduce the number of available toolbars in the Vue menu.

KG01 - Context sensitive toolbars are a great way to manage complexity and to progressively disclose tool actions. The Symphony task pane is a great start. We could explore other approaches to reduce the number of commands presented in the toolbars and make the available sections more contextual. 

>> But OK,
>> I'm a Symphony user. Perhaps this feature would be found unpleasant for
>> most OpenOffice users.
>> Meanwhile, the impossibility to deplace this toolbar in the work area is
>> perhaps discutable.
>> 
>> A+
>> --
>> gw

KG01 - Re: next generation AOO UI. I will start a discussion thread on the AOO wiki to advance this exploration. See wiki for details. 

Re: development question of future feature

[Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>]

Just for the property sidebar. Kevin have done some analysis about how
it can be integrated into AOO.

The problem is the migration of it from Symphony won't be
straightforward and no one is actually working on it as far as I know.

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:34 PM, Guy Waterval <wa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Yong Lin Ma,
>
>
> 2012/7/16 Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>
>
>> You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.
>>
>> Or propose ideas by yourself here ...
>>
>
> What I find a great feature in LS is the "Context sensitive toolbar" which
> allows to reduce the number of available toolbars in the Vue menu. But OK,
> I'm a Symphony user. Perhaps this feature would be found unpleasant for
> most OpenOffice users.
> Meanwhile, the impossibility to deplace this toolbar in the work area is
> perhaps discutable.
>
> A+
> --
> gw

Re: development question of future feature

[Guy Waterval <wa...@gmail.com>]

Hi Yong Lin Ma,


2012/7/16 Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>

> You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.
>
> Or propose ideas by yourself here ...
>

What I find a great feature in LS is the "Context sensitive toolbar" which
allows to reduce the number of available toolbars in the Vue menu. But OK,
I'm a Symphony user. Perhaps this feature would be found unpleasant for
most OpenOffice users.
Meanwhile, the impossibility to deplace this toolbar in the work area is
perhaps discutable.

A+
-- 
gw

Re: development question of future feature

[Yong Lin Ma <ma...@apache.org>]

You may share ideas with Kevin who is working on UI changes backlogs.

Or propose ideas by yourself here ...

On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 12:35 PM, Christopher Jackson
<ti...@verizon.net> wrote:
> I am writing to ask you if there is any desire among you and the developers
> of OpenOffice to update the user interface for the suite?
>
>
>
> your competitor, microsoft of course has updated their user interface. as a
> simple user, I think updating the user interface would greatly improve the
> product. we can't always sit in one spot and never change.
>
>
>
> thanks for you time.
>
>
>
> Chris Jackson
>
> Maryland USA
>