You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <de...@acm.org> on 2015/09/04 00:14:33 UTC
FW: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
More information about the Plugfest for some who might not have noticed earlier.
I have edited this lightly to reflect the current status in my case.
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
Sent: Friday, July 31, 2015 15:31
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015 (was RE: [NOMINATION] Dennis Hamilton ... )
Roberto mentions the forthcoming ODF Plugfest to be held September 15-16 at the Hague.
WHAT THE ODF PLUGFEST IS
Information about the Plugfest is on this Wiki page:
<http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info>.
To see how these have operated, it is useful to look at the programs of prior plugfests starting with the two in 2009 (although some of the historical material seems to consist of placeholders).
I have not been to any of these except vicariously as a member of the OASIS ODF Interoperability and Conformance (OIC) Technical Committee and as a participant in some of the planning.
I see three matters that are useful to be present for. Anyone could attend to participate as a contributor to Apache OpenOffice in those events:
1. The presentations on ODF adoption and also on developments of the ODF specifications
2. The subsequent presentations on implementation efforts, where 8 are listed so far, including Apache OpenOffice.
3. The Interop testing that occupies the remainder of the first day and all of the second day. For this, it is desirable to show up with demonstration and test documents to interchanges and then inspect implementations. This activity tends to be conducted in confidence, regrettably. There is a sample scenario template to use in presenting tests.
AOO PARTICIPATION
For AOO, it would be good to have some simple presentation of status for (2) and to have some contributions (3) of tests or exemplary documents for which interoperability is a concern.
Roberto has been on the calls for organization of the Plugtest and it is valuable that he is doing so. His keeping us apprised of what AOO might do to contribute and to participate will be very helpful.
I think if we create a portfolio of tests and a few slides on the status of AOO by mid-September, anyone could be present as an AOO participant.
The Plugfests are obviously more amenable to participation by ODF experts and implementers that are based in Europe and we have able members of the AOO community there.
MY PERSONAL PARTICIPATION
I have always wanted to go to a Plugfest and never managed to arrange it. I think we have many able spokespersons.
I do not have the means to travel to The Netherlands for this event. I am willing to go, although it would be valuable to at least have someone more technically involved around interoperability testing. I don't think it is necessary to have someone be an official of some form, whether PMC member or a Chair
[Note: I learned that, in addition to not having the means, I have a conflict. ]
Here at dev@ we can work up a status report that anyone could deliver and also development of any contributions to the interoperability testing that would be useful for cross-implementation demonstration/confirmation in those sessions.
I am happy to cooperate in any way I can in the development of such materials. I trust Roberto will continue to participate on the calls (since they tend to be at 6am in my local time).
[Note: That was in July. This is September already and my ability to assist here is severely limited, although I will do what I can.]
- Dennis
[ ... ]
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Louis Suárez-Potts <lu...@gmail.com>.
> On 04 Sep 15, at 16:05, Roberto Galoppini <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> 2015-09-04 19:39 GMT+02:00 Louis Suárez-Potts <lu...@gmail.com>:
>
>> Comments inline; Roberto, feel free…
>>
>>
>
> Actually I didn't go since the Orvieto Plugfest, that is almost 10 years
> ago. Anyway, I believe we missed the opportunity to come up with something
> valuable and interesting for the agenda, unless someone has a different
> idea. If I would have gone I would have joined the technical sessions, but
> again our understanding of how AOO is or is not compliant with the finally
> approved ODF 1.2 is little at best.
>
Interesting; I had the impression you’d gone to the most recent. Then, it would seem the case Rob and I have gone to more, as I’ve attended most of them, though not since 2012 Brussels.
> To all this we should add the concerns and questions rightfully raised by
> Dennis, here and on the other thread.
Y.
>
> I would favor us to get a hold of where are we in respect of such a
> standard, and plan to join the next Plugfest.
I would go further and suggest we shape the content of our future. Not spectate.
>
> My two cents.
I raise you a loony. (Loony: the Canadian dollar but probably less than that, given the plunging value of "money"; also a bird and useful adjective indicating craziness.)
>
> Roberto
>
>
>>
>> best
>> louis
>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> - Dennis
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:luispo@gmail.com]
>>> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 07:27
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
>>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> [ ... ]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Status, then, is:
>>>
>>> * We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created.
>> Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it
>> may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
>>>
>>> * We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at
>> the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly
>> imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
>>>
>>> * Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot
>> of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to
>> have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s
>> bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
>>>
>>> - Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the
>> Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also
>> encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there
>> may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I
>> was with large corporations.)
>>>
>>> Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced
>> its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental
>> entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards
>> ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations
>> and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF
>> plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or
>> attending.
>>>
>>> Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the
>> would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead,
>> dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
>>>
>>>
>>> I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would
>> hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
>>>
>>> But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first
>> that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not
>> come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
>>>
>>> Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer,
>> then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants
>> to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is
>> willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
>>>
>>> Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and
>> cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has
>> voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
>>>
>>> -louis
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Roberto Galoppini <ro...@gmail.com>.
2015-09-04 19:39 GMT+02:00 Louis Suárez-Potts <lu...@gmail.com>:
> Comments inline; Roberto, feel free…
>
>
> > On 04 Sep 15, at 13:10, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > It is not clear to me what is being discussed here. Can we separate out
> the parts, please?
> >
> > 1. There is discussion of sending someone to participate in the ODF
> Plugfest to be held on 2015-09/15-16, 11 days from now. That includes a
> request for travel funding.
>
> Yes. Honestly, tho this could be an important event, the rush and cost are
> such that unless someone is closer to the event—i.e., not on the wrong side
> of the Atlantic—the cost would seem prohibitive, especially if my presence
> would only be to relay status.
>
> >
> > 2. It is not clear to me exactly what that participation would be.
>
> Quite.
>
> > Is it only to participate in status and not testing?
>
> If I were to go, that would in fact be the case: status not testing.
> However, there is also the point that I’ve been trying to make (and I think
> Roberto, too) about the optics—the appearance—of our presence or
> nonpresence.
>
> > If it is status, it appears that any status presentation is likely part
> of an agenda item to be led by Gijs Hillenius of OSOR.
>
> Yes.
>
> > See <
> http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info>.
> The topic is "ODF in the market place." That is an interesting topic if it
> remains the focus. I'm not certain what we know about in that respect. I
> definitely think it would be useful to have concrete information about that
> specific topic with respect to Apache OpenOffice. If we figured it out, we
> could offer a slide or two without having to be there. Would that suffice?
>
> Yes, but given the malleability of things, I’d guess that we could shape
> the topic to a degree. By concrete information, I am guessing you have in
> mind data we can cite indicating uptake or usage of AOO and thus of our
> implementation of ODF. To this point, Rob did point out that we could re-do
> our survey, which looked at preferred open source office suites. One could
> also conceivably add more questions illuminating AOO’s market currency.
> (Eg, percentage in any sector or other useful data points that suggest a
> picture of how and where AOO is being used. We did this a long while ago,
> at the Oasis ODF Adoption TC.)
> >
> > 3. I don't understand what English flyer from the OpenDocs Society is
> being spoken of. I don't recall the ASF and certainly not the AOO Project
> being participants/sponsors of the OpenDocs Society. Am I mistaken? Is a
> draft available?
>
> You are not mistaken as far as I know regarding sponsorship. I think a
> draft is available and was sent by Basil, but….
> I think the money here, which we have some discretionary control over,
> independent of ASF—perhaps Andrea can explain it better—would go for
> printing. But: this, too is coming thick and fast. I mean the call for
> action on this matter.
>
> >
> > 4. Also on this thread, there is some question about payment. If this
> is with regard to sponsoring this event, or being a sponsor in the
> production of a flyer, the timing is very short here and it seems to me
> that the window may have closed.
> >
> > Also, please note that today is the early-start beginning of a major
> 3-day Holiday weekend in the United States. We must move deliberately but
> inclusively.
> >
> > Please clarify,
>
> Doubtless Roberto or Andrea can shed more light. I had been aware of the
> event but had not planned on going before, as it interacted (and still
> does) with a prior personal engagement. But the event does strike me as
> potential important. But not so important as to cause the sky to fall,
> should we not make it.
>
> The status report Gijs would read out is good. But my point that being
> there and meeting the government developers and representatives, as well as
> the others involved, would send a strong signal to an admittedly small but
> probably significant group.
>
> But Roberto, who went last time, and Rob, who’s gone many times, can
> probably evaluate the scenario better than I. And we can also meet the
> principals elsewhere. Like at ACEU. Indeed, inviting them to the event and
> then holding much more informed and less rushed meetings there, would be
> good; but it would depend on them being there.
>
Actually I didn't go since the Orvieto Plugfest, that is almost 10 years
ago. Anyway, I believe we missed the opportunity to come up with something
valuable and interesting for the agenda, unless someone has a different
idea. If I would have gone I would have joined the technical sessions, but
again our understanding of how AOO is or is not compliant with the finally
approved ODF 1.2 is little at best.
To all this we should add the concerns and questions rightfully raised by
Dennis, here and on the other thread.
I would favor us to get a hold of where are we in respect of such a
standard, and plan to join the next Plugfest.
My two cents.
Roberto
>
> best
> louis
>
>
>
> >
> > - Dennis
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:luispo@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 07:27
> > To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > [ ... ]
> >
> >
> >
> > Status, then, is:
> >
> > * We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created.
> Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it
> may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
> >
> > * We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at
> the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly
> imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
> >
> > * Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot
> of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to
> have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s
> bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
> >
> > - Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the
> Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also
> encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there
> may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I
> was with large corporations.)
> >
> > Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced
> its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental
> entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards
> ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations
> and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF
> plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or
> attending.
> >
> > Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the
> would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead,
> dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
> >
> >
> > I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would
> hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
> >
> > But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first
> that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not
> come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
> >
> > Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer,
> then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants
> to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is
> willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
> >
> > Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and
> cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has
> voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
> >
> > -louis
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>
Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Louis Suárez-Potts <lu...@gmail.com>.
Comments inline; Roberto, feel free…
> On 04 Sep 15, at 13:10, Dennis E. Hamilton <or...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> It is not clear to me what is being discussed here. Can we separate out the parts, please?
>
> 1. There is discussion of sending someone to participate in the ODF Plugfest to be held on 2015-09/15-16, 11 days from now. That includes a request for travel funding.
Yes. Honestly, tho this could be an important event, the rush and cost are such that unless someone is closer to the event—i.e., not on the wrong side of the Atlantic—the cost would seem prohibitive, especially if my presence would only be to relay status.
>
> 2. It is not clear to me exactly what that participation would be.
Quite.
> Is it only to participate in status and not testing?
If I were to go, that would in fact be the case: status not testing. However, there is also the point that I’ve been trying to make (and I think Roberto, too) about the optics—the appearance—of our presence or nonpresence.
> If it is status, it appears that any status presentation is likely part of an agenda item to be led by Gijs Hillenius of OSOR.
Yes.
> See <http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info>. The topic is "ODF in the market place." That is an interesting topic if it remains the focus. I'm not certain what we know about in that respect. I definitely think it would be useful to have concrete information about that specific topic with respect to Apache OpenOffice. If we figured it out, we could offer a slide or two without having to be there. Would that suffice?
Yes, but given the malleability of things, I’d guess that we could shape the topic to a degree. By concrete information, I am guessing you have in mind data we can cite indicating uptake or usage of AOO and thus of our implementation of ODF. To this point, Rob did point out that we could re-do our survey, which looked at preferred open source office suites. One could also conceivably add more questions illuminating AOO’s market currency. (Eg, percentage in any sector or other useful data points that suggest a picture of how and where AOO is being used. We did this a long while ago, at the Oasis ODF Adoption TC.)
>
> 3. I don't understand what English flyer from the OpenDocs Society is being spoken of. I don't recall the ASF and certainly not the AOO Project being participants/sponsors of the OpenDocs Society. Am I mistaken? Is a draft available?
You are not mistaken as far as I know regarding sponsorship. I think a draft is available and was sent by Basil, but….
I think the money here, which we have some discretionary control over, independent of ASF—perhaps Andrea can explain it better—would go for printing. But: this, too is coming thick and fast. I mean the call for action on this matter.
>
> 4. Also on this thread, there is some question about payment. If this is with regard to sponsoring this event, or being a sponsor in the production of a flyer, the timing is very short here and it seems to me that the window may have closed.
>
> Also, please note that today is the early-start beginning of a major 3-day Holiday weekend in the United States. We must move deliberately but inclusively.
>
> Please clarify,
Doubtless Roberto or Andrea can shed more light. I had been aware of the event but had not planned on going before, as it interacted (and still does) with a prior personal engagement. But the event does strike me as potential important. But not so important as to cause the sky to fall, should we not make it.
The status report Gijs would read out is good. But my point that being there and meeting the government developers and representatives, as well as the others involved, would send a strong signal to an admittedly small but probably significant group.
But Roberto, who went last time, and Rob, who’s gone many times, can probably evaluate the scenario better than I. And we can also meet the principals elsewhere. Like at ACEU. Indeed, inviting them to the event and then holding much more informed and less rushed meetings there, would be good; but it would depend on them being there.
best
louis
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:luispo@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 07:27
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
>
> Hi
>
> [ ... ]
>
>
>
> Status, then, is:
>
> * We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created. Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
>
> * We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
>
> * Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
>
> - Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I was with large corporations.)
>
> Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or attending.
>
> Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead, dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
>
>
> I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
>
> But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
>
> Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer, then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
>
> Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
>
> -louis
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Andrea Pescetti <pe...@apache.org>.
On 04/09/2015 Dennis E. Hamilton wrote:
> 3. I don't understand what English flyer from the OpenDocs Society is being spoken of.
There were three bullet items in my mail.
If this wasn't clear, items 2. and 3. referred to the flyer. I called it
a "leaflet" but that was it. See
http://www.mail-archive.com/dev@openoffice.apache.org/msg24775.html
I see the other thread has now done more progress, so I recommend that
we simply keep discussing on that one.
Regards,
Andrea.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
RE: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by "Dennis E. Hamilton" <or...@apache.org>.
It is not clear to me what is being discussed here. Can we separate out the parts, please?
1. There is discussion of sending someone to participate in the ODF Plugfest to be held on 2015-09/15-16, 11 days from now. That includes a request for travel funding.
2. It is not clear to me exactly what that participation would be. Is it only to participate in status and not testing? If it is status, it appears that any status presentation is likely part of an agenda item to be led by Gijs Hillenius of OSOR. See <http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info>. The topic is "ODF in the market place." That is an interesting topic if it remains the focus. I'm not certain what we know about in that respect. I definitely think it would be useful to have concrete information about that specific topic with respect to Apache OpenOffice. If we figured it out, we could offer a slide or two without having to be there. Would that suffice?
3. I don't understand what English flyer from the OpenDocs Society is being spoken of. I don't recall the ASF and certainly not the AOO Project being participants/sponsors of the OpenDocs Society. Am I mistaken? Is a draft available?
4. Also on this thread, there is some question about payment. If this is with regard to sponsoring this event, or being a sponsor in the production of a flyer, the timing is very short here and it seems to me that the window may have closed.
Also, please note that today is the early-start beginning of a major 3-day Holiday weekend in the United States. We must move deliberately but inclusively.
Please clarify,
- Dennis
-----Original Message-----
From: Louis Suárez-Potts [mailto:luispo@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, September 4, 2015 07:27
To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
Subject: Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Hi
[ ... ]
Status, then, is:
* We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created. Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
* We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
* Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
- Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I was with large corporations.)
Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or attending.
Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead, dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer, then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
-louis
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
Re: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Louis Suárez-Potts <lu...@gmail.com>.
Hi
> On 04 Sep 15, at 07:42, Roberto Galoppini <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Here at dev@ we can work up a status report that anyone could deliver and
>> also development of any contributions to the interoperability testing that
>> would be useful for cross-implementation demonstration/confirmation in
>> those sessions.
>>
>> I am happy to cooperate in any way I can in the development of such
>> materials. I trust Roberto will continue to participate on the calls
>> (since they tend to be at 6am in my local time).
>>
>
> I will surely do if any will be set, but I guess for this ODF-Plugfest
> we're done. If someone - not me, as per my message on another thread I
> can't commit to this now - is willing to go, we better give heads up to the
> organizers so that a talk of us can be added to the agenda.
>
> Roberto
>
Status, then, is:
* We need to update the English flyer that OpenDocs Society has created. Roberto (or DH) seem to think this is a PMC-level decision. Be that as it may, I think it’s in our interest as ODF implementers to do it.
* We are agreed that it would be good to have an AOO representative at the upcoming ODF Plugfest. "Upcoming" is an understatement; it’s nearly imminent, 15& 16 September of this year.
* Roberto cannot go. Andrea cannot go. Dennis (whose has invested a lot of time into ODF matters) cannot go. I may be able to go but would need to have my travel taken care of by our bursary. As I live in Toronto, it’s bound to be more expensive than someone coming from Europe.
- Rob would also be a choice, as he used to lead, and may still, the Oasis TC, where ODF matters are decided (or not…). Rob? Rob would also encounter the same Atlantic as I, and as he is with a large company, there may be issues with him accepting AOO funds. (There were such issues when I was with large corporations.)
Why is this event important? The UK government back in 2014 announced its ODF desires for a large swath of public documents. Other governmental entities in other parts of continental Europe, have been hedging towards ODF or at least away from 20th-century style desktop/intranet installations and toward what could be a future (or just a lousy investment). This ODF plugfest has several of the governmental practitioners presenting or attending.
Our concern is that they look to AOO and see…. nada. An absence the would confirm what the tech journos love writing about us, that we’re dead, dying, and worse, stifle the living communities.
I don’t think those representations are justified at all, and I would hate for them to be given the semblance of truth by our absence
But this is not the only Plugfest that will happen nor is it the first that has taken place since the UK gov’t’s announcement. The world will not come to an end because we do not show. But it would be better if we did.
Finally, if we do need to take a PMC vote on updating the English flyer, then let’s get that going. Personally, I’d just think that if someone wants to tackle it, please, go ahead and drag in whomever else you want and is willing to help out. Why do we need to add yet more bureaucracy to this?
Because to print out a lot of the flyers and make them look glossy and cool, that takes money, which we can spend, but only after the PMC has voted on doing so. Hence the PMC vote.
-louis
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
Re: FW: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015
Posted by Roberto Galoppini <ro...@gmail.com>.
2015-09-04 0:14 GMT+02:00 Dennis E. Hamilton <de...@acm.org>:
> More information about the Plugfest for some who might not have noticed
> earlier.
>
> I have edited this lightly to reflect the current status in my case.
>
> - Dennis
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis E. Hamilton [mailto:orcmid@apache.org]
> Sent: Friday, July 31, 2015 15:31
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: [DISCUSSION] ODF Plugfest, September 2015 (was RE: [NOMINATION]
> Dennis Hamilton ... )
>
> Roberto mentions the forthcoming ODF Plugfest to be held September 15-16
> at the Hague.
>
> WHAT THE ODF PLUGFEST IS
>
> Information about the Plugfest is on this Wiki page:
> <
> http://plugtest.opendocsociety.org/doku.php?id=plugfests:201509_thehague:info
> >.
>
> To see how these have operated, it is useful to look at the programs of
> prior plugfests starting with the two in 2009 (although some of the
> historical material seems to consist of placeholders).
>
> I have not been to any of these except vicariously as a member of the
> OASIS ODF Interoperability and Conformance (OIC) Technical Committee and as
> a participant in some of the planning.
>
> I see three matters that are useful to be present for. Anyone could
> attend to participate as a contributor to Apache OpenOffice in those events:
>
> 1. The presentations on ODF adoption and also on developments of the ODF
> specifications
> 2. The subsequent presentations on implementation efforts, where 8 are
> listed so far, including Apache OpenOffice.
> 3. The Interop testing that occupies the remainder of the first day and
> all of the second day. For this, it is desirable to show up with
> demonstration and test documents to interchanges and then inspect
> implementations. This activity tends to be conducted in confidence,
> regrettably. There is a sample scenario template to use in presenting
> tests.
>
> AOO PARTICIPATION
>
> For AOO, it would be good to have some simple presentation of status for
> (2) and to have some contributions (3) of tests or exemplary documents for
> which interoperability is a concern.
>
> Roberto has been on the calls for organization of the Plugtest and it is
> valuable that he is doing so. His keeping us apprised of what AOO might do
> to contribute and to participate will be very helpful.
>
> I think if we create a portfolio of tests and a few slides on the status
> of AOO by mid-September, anyone could be present as an AOO participant.
>
> The Plugfests are obviously more amenable to participation by ODF experts
> and implementers that are based in Europe and we have able members of the
> AOO community there.
>
> MY PERSONAL PARTICIPATION
>
> I have always wanted to go to a Plugfest and never managed to arrange it.
> I think we have many able spokespersons.
>
> I do not have the means to travel to The Netherlands for this event. I am
> willing to go, although it would be valuable to at least have someone more
> technically involved around interoperability testing. I don't think it is
> necessary to have someone be an official of some form, whether PMC member
> or a Chair
>
> [Note: I learned that, in addition to not having the means, I have a
> conflict. ]
>
>
> Here at dev@ we can work up a status report that anyone could deliver and
> also development of any contributions to the interoperability testing that
> would be useful for cross-implementation demonstration/confirmation in
> those sessions.
>
> I am happy to cooperate in any way I can in the development of such
> materials. I trust Roberto will continue to participate on the calls
> (since they tend to be at 6am in my local time).
>
I will surely do if any will be set, but I guess for this ODF-Plugfest
we're done. If someone - not me, as per my message on another thread I
can't commit to this now - is willing to go, we better give heads up to the
organizers so that a talk of us can be added to the agenda.
Roberto
>
> [Note: That was in July. This is September already and my ability to
> assist here is severely limited, although I will do what I can.]
>
> - Dennis
>
> [ ... ]
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@openoffice.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@openoffice.apache.org
>
>