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Posted to taglibs-dev@jakarta.apache.org by Vincent Keunen <vi...@manex.be> on 2004/02/08 18:04:14 UTC
Re: LDAP Tag lib
Indeed, the situation seems confusing at Jakarta about that library!...
Can you tell me a bit more about your own library: we looked at it and
it seems rather complete (read and write most ldap stuff), but it seems
that getting a "list of entities" (to be able to loop through them) is
not supported. Is that right? Is there a reason (not enough time, too
difficult, waiting for EL?...). Jacques and David, can you maybe add
more comments to mine?
And about the license: I understand that Apache was not very
open/reactive to your suggestions. But for us to contribute to your
lib, we would need some assurance that we can use the results in any way
we want. For example, we would improve the taglib and then use it for
some projects of ours (for our clients). The current GPL license does
NOT allow us to use the library unless ALL the code is GPL... and our
clients would not like that... So would you agree to change the license
to be "commercial friendly"? An apache-like license or a Mozilla-like
license would be ok for us (see http://www.opensource.org)... Let me know.
orhan alkan wrote:
>
>
> Vincent Keunen wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your quick reply!
>
> Sorry but we are busy at the moment.
>
>> We also contacted the jakarta group because they also have a ldap
>> (jndi) taglib, although it's less advanced than yours. Our
>> proposition would be to merge the two and then develop the merged
>> taglib. But for that, you would need to agree to change the license
>> of your existing taglib to Apache. Is it in your plans? Do you plan
>> to make money with it? Let me know.
>
> If apache accepts your proposal, we are part of, and we agree on
> architecture , yes we can change it to apache. One year ago we
> contacted to apache and they were more interested developing general
> jndi package. but, to provide more feature than apache jndi tag lib
> there should be another package. I want to see how they are going to
> approach this time.
>
>>
>>
>>
>> orhan alkan wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Vincent,
>>> First we opened the project. You can find at SF. It's name easyldap.
>>> We have lots ideas, we want to implement. We have very busy with the
>>> project from which we generate Some revenue.
>>> We are willing to collaborate with you to improve the project. Why
>>> don't you and us share our opinion and prioritize them
>>> Keep in touch
>>> Orhan
>>>
>>> Vincent Keunen wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> Could you tell me why your library has not been modified for one
>>>> year? Is it a dead development? Has it been replaced by something
>>>> else? JSTL? Your library seems more complete than the Jakarta
>>>> one. Why did not the two of you collaborate?
>>>>
>>>> We could be interested in adding more functionality to the library,
>>>> but would you then agree to distribute it under the Apache
>>>> license? We prefer to release our open source code under Apache
>>>> rather than GPL, because Apache is more successfull and more permisive.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for letting us know!
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Vincent Keunen
>>>> Manex, rue Wagner 127, BE-4100 Boncelles, Belgium (map
>>>> <http://www.mappy.com/PlanPerso/vincentkeunen/0>)
>>>> web: manex.be phone: +32 4 3303730
>>>>
Struts and Taglibs (was Re: LDAP Tag lib)
Posted by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org>.
On Sun, 8 Feb 2004, Mark R. Diggory wrote:
<big-snip/>
> Taglib's is not a extremely active area at Apache at this time. More
> focus tends to go into the standard taglibrary than the other taglib
> projects. As well, there is a separation between the taglibrary
> development actually going on in Struts and Taglibs groups that should
> probably be addressed at some point, as it is producing separate yet
> comparable taglibraries in the long run. My opinion is that Struts
> efforts should be used to "revitalize" taglibraries and that any
> taglibraries produced by struts should actually reside in the
> taglibraries project (gulp, incoming!).
Just FYI, the majority of the effort being put into the Struts taglibs
these days is focussed on those taglibs that are tied to Struts, such as
the HTML and Tiles tags. Most of the committers are not interested in
spending their time on the more general taglibs, such as Bean and Logic,
because the functionality of those taglibs has been subsumed by JSTL.
We're encouraging people to move to JSTL where they can, rather than
relying on Struts "properietary" taglibs.
--
Martin Cooper
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Re: LDAP Tag lib
Posted by "Mark R. Diggory" <md...@latte.harvard.edu>.
First off, I am only speaking from opinion and this is not necessarily
the position of Apache as a whole on this subject (that is if there
really is a position at Apache on this, given its loose organizational
structure).
If I remember correctly, we were concerned that an "LDAP" taglibrary
based on JNDI should actually be JNDI oriented and not just LDAP
oriented. I think we were concerned that introducing just an LDAP
library to the taglibs project would be "disadvantageous" in that JNDI
actually can support this generically. And that sticking a closely as
possible to the JNDI design model would establish a library that was
reusable and extendable.
So, I believe we suggested that expanding/extending the features of the
Apache JNDI taglibrary would be more beneficial and actually be a more
generic and reusable solution. This was a discussion, I wouldn't say any
sort of resolution actually was established at Apache.
I apologize if it appeared that the donation of your codebase was
somehow "rejected", it probably was not the case that it was, more so
was the case that there simply were not enough motivated individuals
with rights enough to assist you in approaching the donation process. I
actually was not a commiter at Apache at that time, yet I do recognize
that no decision making process did actually occur on the taglibs list.
Taglib's is not a extremely active area at Apache at this time. More
focus tends to go into the standard taglibrary than the other taglib
projects. As well, there is a separation between the taglibrary
development actually going on in Struts and Taglibs groups that should
probably be addressed at some point, as it is producing separate yet
comparable taglibraries in the long run. My opinion is that Struts
efforts should be used to "revitalize" taglibraries and that any
taglibraries produced by struts should actually reside in the
taglibraries project (gulp, incoming!).
Note, now that I am an active committer on the JNDI taglib project, I
can say that any discussion and further exploration is welcome and
appreciated at the taglib's project. But would remind those parties
interested that it is your involvement and effort that would really make
any movement forward occur in this case, Apache can't donate your code
for you. Apache can't create your patches for you.
-Mark Diggory
Vincent Keunen wrote:
> Indeed, the situation seems confusing at Jakarta about that library!...
>
> Can you tell me a bit more about your own library: we looked at it and
> it seems rather complete (read and write most ldap stuff), but it seems
> that getting a "list of entities" (to be able to loop through them) is
> not supported. Is that right? Is there a reason (not enough time, too
> difficult, waiting for EL?...). Jacques and David, can you maybe add
> more comments to mine?
>
> And about the license: I understand that Apache was not very
> open/reactive to your suggestions. But for us to contribute to your
> lib, we would need some assurance that we can use the results in any way
> we want. For example, we would improve the taglib and then use it for
> some projects of ours (for our clients). The current GPL license does
> NOT allow us to use the library unless ALL the code is GPL... and our
> clients would not like that... So would you agree to change the license
> to be "commercial friendly"? An apache-like license or a Mozilla-like
> license would be ok for us (see http://www.opensource.org)... Let me know.
>
> orhan alkan wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Vincent Keunen wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for your quick reply!
>>
>>
>> Sorry but we are busy at the moment.
>>
>>> We also contacted the jakarta group because they also have a ldap
>>> (jndi) taglib, although it's less advanced than yours. Our
>>> proposition would be to merge the two and then develop the merged
>>> taglib. But for that, you would need to agree to change the license
>>> of your existing taglib to Apache. Is it in your plans? Do you plan
>>> to make money with it? Let me know.
>>
>>
>> If apache accepts your proposal, we are part of, and we agree on
>> architecture , yes we can change it to apache. One year ago we
>> contacted to apache and they were more interested developing general
>> jndi package. but, to provide more feature than apache jndi tag lib
>> there should be another package. I want to see how they are going to
>> approach this time.
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> orhan alkan wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi Vincent,
>>>> First we opened the project. You can find at SF. It's name easyldap.
>>>> We have lots ideas, we want to implement. We have very busy with the
>>>> project from which we generate Some revenue.
>>>> We are willing to collaborate with you to improve the project. Why
>>>> don't you and us share our opinion and prioritize them
>>>> Keep in touch
>>>> Orhan
>>>>
>>>> Vincent Keunen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> Could you tell me why your library has not been modified for one
>>>>> year? Is it a dead development? Has it been replaced by something
>>>>> else? JSTL? Your library seems more complete than the Jakarta
>>>>> one. Why did not the two of you collaborate?
>>>>>
>>>>> We could be interested in adding more functionality to the library,
>>>>> but would you then agree to distribute it under the Apache
>>>>> license? We prefer to release our open source code under Apache
>>>>> rather than GPL, because Apache is more successfull and more
>>>>> permisive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for letting us know!
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Vincent Keunen
>>>>> Manex, rue Wagner 127, BE-4100 Boncelles, Belgium (map
>>>>> <http://www.mappy.com/PlanPerso/vincentkeunen/0>)
>>>>> web: manex.be phone: +32 4 3303730
>>>>>
>
--
Mark Diggory
Software Developer
Harvard MIT Data Center
http://www.hmdc.harvard.edu
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