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Posted to docs@httpd.apache.org by Joshua Slive <jo...@slive.ca> on 2002/08/15 16:44:53 UTC
Re: HTML+CSS proposal
Michael.Schroepl@telekurs.de wrote:
> Netscape 4 doesn't show a border around the
> <table class="related">
> which would be very helpful IMHO (and is already there
> in browsers like Mozilla or MSIE 5.0).
> Is there any possibility to enable this border for NS4?
Just to register a couple opinions here:
- I would be perfectly happy with using one of the tricks to make NS4
ignore the CSS entirely. I don't think we should spend any effort
making the pages look pretty in NS4. It is an obsolete browser. The
pages must be usable, but need not look nice.
- I would sort of like to restore the breadcrumb links that I had at the
top of my last version (apache > http server > documentation > version
2.0 > etc). I think this will really help people situate the pages in
teh overall apache hierarchy.
- I definitely will want to restore some amount of differentiation for
links to modules and directives. I think it is important that these
elements are styled differently from normal links, in order to help
users understand these basic apache concepts.
- I've noticed that actual work on the docs seems to have slowed down a
little while we have been talking about style. There is absolutely no
reason to stop any other documentation work because of this stuff. When
we make a final decision, all that needs to be changed is stuff in the
style/ directory. Everything else will remain the same. And none of
this will work unless the docs are converted to XML.
Joshua.
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Re: docs layout revision
Posted by André Malo <nd...@perlig.de>.
* Joshua Slive wrote:
>> ok. we revised the whole stuff. It might be a little bit colorful
>> now, but IMHO it becomes also more friendly so.
>
> OK. I'll try to find a little time to do an xsl mockup of this
> stuff.
If there are any questions in conclusion with the layout or the
semantics, please ask. Maybe some parts (of my thoughts :) need an
explanation.
And probably are there some things I not thought about in the CSS
(because some parts of the documentation are a little bit loose, we
will see the problems, if there ary any, after the whole
transformation)
>> There are several semantics issues, which we should think over. For
>> instance, the <em>s used in syntax definitions should be <var>s.
> Yes, true.
ok, if no other does, I'm going to look through the documents and
patch them.
(Do we need to modify the dtds?)
>> | The processing is controlled by specially formated SGML comments,
>> | referred to as <em>elements</em>.
>>
>> is probably better written as "... <dfn>elements</dfn>."
>
> I'm not exactly sure what you are implying here. What specifically
> does <dfn> mean semantically?
from html spec:
| [dfn] indicates that this is the defining instance of the enclosed
| term.
in the words of the example above: The author explains, what elements
are. So the [by dfn] enclosed term "elements" is the defining
instance.
> The other one I was thinking of adding which is somewhat related is
> some kind of tag to indicate that something is defined in the
> glossary (which the xsl could automatically transform into a link to
> the relevant place in the glossary).
<glossary>? ;-)
it could result in
<a href="glossary.html#blah" title="glossary">blah</a> or so.
perhaps with an image before (an arrow that points right up).
> And another one is that <code> might be overused in some places
> where a more specific tag would be better. I haven't thought too
> much about what could replace it.
in XML or HTML?
hmm. in HTML there are <samp> and <kbd> additionally possible.
| SAMP: Designates sample output from programs, scripts, etc.
| KBD: Indicates text to be entered by the user.
IMHO <samp> may be used for sample input, too.
<kbd> is a problem in our case, because nearly all of the code there
has to be entered by the user... ;-)
nd
--
print "Just Another Perl Hacker";
# André Malo, <http://www.perlig.de/> #
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Re: docs layout revision (was: HTML+CSS proposal)
Posted by Joshua Slive <jo...@slive.ca>.
André Malo wrote:
> Hi,
>
> ok. we revised the whole stuff. It might be a little bit colorful now,
> but IMHO it becomes also more friendly so.
OK. I'll try to find a little time to do an xsl mockup of this stuff.
>
> There are several semantics issues, which we should think over. For
> instance, the <em>s used in syntax definitions should be <var>s.
Yes, true.
> Or,
> from mod_include.html:
>
> | The processing is controlled by specially formated SGML comments,
> | referred to as <em>elements</em>.
>
> is probably better written as "... <dfn>elements</dfn>."
I'm not exactly sure what you are implying here. What specifically does
<dfn> mean semantically?
The other one I was thinking of adding which is somewhat related is some
kind of tag to indicate that something is defined in the glossary (which
the xsl could automatically transform into a link to the relevant place
in the glossary).
And another one is that <code> might be overused in some places where a
more specific tag would be better. I haven't thought too much about
what could replace it.
Joshua.
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docs layout revision (was: HTML+CSS proposal)
Posted by André Malo <nd...@perlig.de>.
Hi,
ok. we revised the whole stuff. It might be a little bit colorful now,
but IMHO it becomes also more friendly so.
Thanks a lot to Erik for his useful screenshots ;-). The question marks
in NN4/Mac are subject to ignore. They appear only on NN4/Mac.
Any additional comments and tests on all browsers are welcome!
I tried to apply the styles to some module files, so you may have a look
at the following URLs:
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/env.html
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/mod/mod_log_config.html
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/mod/mod_include.html
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/mod/mod_auth.html
The whole set of files can be found in:
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/apdoc.zip or
http://test.perlig.de/apdoc/apdoc.tar.gz
---
There are several semantics issues, which we should think over. For
instance, the <em>s used in syntax definitions should be <var>s. Or,
from mod_include.html:
| The processing is controlled by specially formated SGML comments,
| referred to as <em>elements</em>.
is probably better written as "... <dfn>elements</dfn>."
What do other people think? (Of course, I'd volunteer to step through
the xml files and convert the bogus <em>s etc.)
There are some other things, that may be applied to the docs. If I have
more time ;-), I'll write down my thoughts completely. Just an idea:
Perhaps we can write a "how to write a documentation" doc based on the
whole (layout & semantics) work.
nd
--
s s^saaaaaoaaaoaaaaooooaaoaaaomaaaa a alataa aaoat a a
a maoaa a laoata a oia a o a m a o alaoooat aaool aaoaa
matooololaaatoto aaa o a o ms;s;\s;s;g;y;s;:;s;y#mailto: #
\51/\134\137| http://www.perlig.de #;print;# > nd@perlig.de
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Re: HTML+CSS proposal
Posted by André Malo <nd...@perlig.de>.
* Joshua Slive wrote:
> Just to register a couple opinions here:
>
> - I would be perfectly happy with using one of the tricks to make NS4
> ignore the CSS entirely. I don't think we should spend any effort
> making the pages look pretty in NS4. It is an obsolete browser. The
> pages must be usable, but need not look nice.
-0 from me. NN speaks a better HTTP than IE or Opera ever did (and do).
Mozilla eats up my memory. And the main point: The bugs in NN are bad,
of course. But one surely /can/ work around them. The Bugs in IE and
Opera are much more bad, because sometimes there's no way round.
And yes, I personally do work with that browser ;-)
> - I would sort of like to restore the breadcrumb links that I had at
> the top of my last version (apache > http server > documentation >
> version 2.0 > etc). I think this will really help people situate the
> pages in teh overall apache hierarchy.
oh, right. Added the code.
> - I definitely will want to restore some amount of differentiation for
> links to modules and directives. I think it is important that these
> elements are styled differently from normal links, in order to help
> users understand these basic apache concepts.
+1.
because I reordered this stuff for better semantics (IMHO), this will
become some CSS code like this:
code a {...} /* and */
code.directive a {...}
We'll think it over. Any suggestions?
> - I've noticed that actual work on the docs seems to have slowed down
> a little while we have been talking about style. There is absolutely
> no reason to stop any other documentation work because of this stuff.
> When we make a final decision, all that needs to be changed is stuff
> in the style/ directory. Everything else will remain the same. And
> none of this will work unless the docs are converted to XML.
ACK. You're absolutely right.
nd
--
Gefunden auf einer "Webdesigner"-Seite:
> Programmierung in HTML, XML, WML, CGI, FLASH <
# André Malo # http://www.perlig.de/ #
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