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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org> on 2017/07/10 16:51:34 UTC
[NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
All,
Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
out when you see something.
John
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
Looks like the following diff would sort this:
diff --git a/build_site.sh b/build_site.sh
index af56ce2..adc4d68 100755
--- a/build_site.sh
+++ b/build_site.sh
@@ -20,6 +20,7 @@ svn co $SVN_REPO $SVN_CO_DIR
mv $SVN_BUILD_DIR/ip-clearance $WORKDIR
mv $SVN_BUILD_DIR/projects $WORKDIR
mv $SVN_BUILD_DIR/clutch $WORKDIR
+ cp content/podlings.* $WORKDIR
)
But I don't have karma to push the change.
On 16 July 2017 at 09:49, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>
> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>
> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
>
>
> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> All,
>>
>> The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
>> while we were committing things.
>>
>> Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new website
>> - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>>
>> I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>>
>> John
>>
>> On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> All,
>>>
>>> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
>>> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
>>> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
>>> out when you see something.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 17 July 2017 at 00:34, sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 16 July 2017 at 23:25, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> > Sebb,
>>> >
>>> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure why
>>> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
>>> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to do
>>> a
>>> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
>>> latest
>>> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out there
>>> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
>>> location, I
>>> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
>>> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files as
>>> > well.
>>>
>>> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
>>> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
>>>
>>
>> Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN.
>
> It's either not working or has not yet been deployed:
>
> $ curl -I http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
> Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2017 23:27:40 GMT
> Server: Apache/2.4.18 (Ubuntu)
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>>
>> If you know of other tools, please speak up.
I see Infra had to update one of their tools:
http://svn.apache.org/viewvc?view=revision&revision=1802088
It's possible that people.a.o or reporter.a.o use the URL
(though they should be using the appropriate file(s) from
https://whimsy.apache.org/public/)
>>>
>>> > John
>>> >
>>> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>>> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations,
>>> >> e.g.
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
>>> >>
>>> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
>>> >>
>>> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>>> >>
>>> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
>>> >>
>>> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
>>> >>
>>> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
>>> >> > (though
>>> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
>>> >> >
>>> >> > John
>>> >> >
>>> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use
>>> them.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>>> wrote:
>>> >> >> > All,
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs
>>> list
>>> >> >> > while we were committing things.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
>>> >> >> website
>>> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > John
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
>>> johndament@apache.org
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> > wrote:
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >> All,
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
>>> website
>>> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some
>>> links
>>> >> may
>>> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and
>>> >> shout
>>> >> >> >> out when you see something.
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >> >> John
>>> >> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>>> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>>
>>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
On Mon, Jul 17, 2017 at 10:29 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 17 July 2017 at 02:54, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 7:34 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 16 July 2017 at 23:25, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >> >> > Sebb,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not
> sure
> >> why
> >> >> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path
> for
> >> >> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is
> to
> >> do
> >> >> a
> >> >> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
> >> >> latest
> >> >> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out
> >> there
> >> >> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
> >> >> location, I
> >> >> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the
> website
> >> >> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl
> files
> >> as
> >> >> > well.
> >> >>
> >> >> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
> >> >> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> > Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN.
> >>
> >> It's either not working or has not yet been deployed:
> >>
> >> $ curl -I http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
> >> Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2017 23:27:40 GMT
> >> Server: Apache/2.4.18 (Ubuntu)
> >> Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
> >>
> >>
> > That is correct. As I mentioned before, please feel free to commit a
> > change.
>
> I updated .htaccess.; that built OK.
> I then triggered a build of the Jenkins job; that also built OK.
>
> It looks like the .htaccess file is not being picked up from SVN.
> Instead it seems to be copied from the assets/ directory in Git.
>
> As already mentioned, I don't have karma to update that.
>
>
Please review - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html
I'd like to understand why you think you don't have karma to update that.
All incubator committers have write access to this repo.
John
> ==
>
> If the .htaccess file in SVN is no longer relevant, this should be
> noted in comments in the file.
> However I think it would be better to edit the build_site.sh file to
> pick up the correct file from SVN, and drop the one under assets/
>
> Note: I don't have time to fix this now.
>
> >
> >> >
> >> > If you know of other tools, please speak up.
> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> > John
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN
> >> locations,
> >> >> >> e.g.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised
> somewhere.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
> >> >> >> > (though
> >> >> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > John
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy)
> use
> >> >> them.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org
> >
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> >> > All,
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the
> >> cvs
> >> >> list
> >> >> >> >> > while we were committing things.
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use
> the
> >> new
> >> >> >> >> website
> >> >> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > John
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
> >> >> johndament@apache.org
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> >> All,
> >> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
> >> >> website
> >> >> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time
> some
> >> >> links
> >> >> >> may
> >> >> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be
> patient
> >> and
> >> >> >> shout
> >> >> >> >> >> out when you see something.
> >> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> >> John
> >> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 17 July 2017 at 02:54, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 7:34 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 16 July 2017 at 23:25, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> >> > Sebb,
>> >> >
>> >> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure
>> why
>> >> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
>> >> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to
>> do
>> >> a
>> >> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
>> >> latest
>> >> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out
>> there
>> >> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
>> >> location, I
>> >> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
>> >> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files
>> as
>> >> > well.
>> >>
>> >> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
>> >> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
>> >>
>> >
>> > Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN.
>>
>> It's either not working or has not yet been deployed:
>>
>> $ curl -I http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
>> Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2017 23:27:40 GMT
>> Server: Apache/2.4.18 (Ubuntu)
>> Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
>>
>>
> That is correct. As I mentioned before, please feel free to commit a
> change.
I updated .htaccess.; that built OK.
I then triggered a build of the Jenkins job; that also built OK.
It looks like the .htaccess file is not being picked up from SVN.
Instead it seems to be copied from the assets/ directory in Git.
As already mentioned, I don't have karma to update that.
==
If the .htaccess file in SVN is no longer relevant, this should be
noted in comments in the file.
However I think it would be better to edit the build_site.sh file to
pick up the correct file from SVN, and drop the one under assets/
Note: I don't have time to fix this now.
>
>> >
>> > If you know of other tools, please speak up.
>>
>> >>
>> >> > John
>> >> >
>> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> wrote:
>> >> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN
>> locations,
>> >> >> e.g.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
>> >> >>
>> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> >> >>
>> >> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
>> >> >> > (though
>> >> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > John
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use
>> >> them.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> >> wrote:
>> >> >> >> > All,
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the
>> cvs
>> >> list
>> >> >> >> > while we were committing things.
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the
>> new
>> >> >> >> website
>> >> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > John
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
>> >> johndament@apache.org
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> >> All,
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
>> >> website
>> >> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some
>> >> links
>> >> >> may
>> >> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient
>> and
>> >> >> shout
>> >> >> >> >> out when you see something.
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> >> John
>> >> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
>> general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 7:34 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 16 July 2017 at 23:25, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> >> > Sebb,
> >> >
> >> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure
> why
> >> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
> >> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to
> do
> >> a
> >> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
> >> latest
> >> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out
> there
> >> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
> >> location, I
> >> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
> >> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files
> as
> >> > well.
> >>
> >> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
> >> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
> >>
> >
> > Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN.
>
> It's either not working or has not yet been deployed:
>
> $ curl -I http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
> Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2017 23:27:40 GMT
> Server: Apache/2.4.18 (Ubuntu)
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
>
>
That is correct. As I mentioned before, please feel free to commit a
change.
> >
> > If you know of other tools, please speak up.
>
> >>
> >> > John
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN
> locations,
> >> >> e.g.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >>
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
> >> >>
> >> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
> >> >>
> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> >>
> >> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
> >> >>
> >> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
> >> >>
> >> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >>
> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
> >> >> > (though
> >> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
> >> >> >
> >> >> > John
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use
> >> them.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> >> wrote:
> >> >> >> > All,
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the
> cvs
> >> list
> >> >> >> > while we were committing things.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the
> new
> >> >> >> website
> >> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > John
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
> >> johndament@apache.org
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >> >
> >> >> >> >> All,
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
> >> website
> >> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some
> >> links
> >> >> may
> >> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient
> and
> >> >> shout
> >> >> >> >> out when you see something.
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> >> John
> >> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 16 July 2017 at 23:25, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> > Sebb,
>> >
>> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure why
>> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
>> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to do
>> a
>> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
>> latest
>> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out there
>> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
>> location, I
>> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
>> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files as
>> > well.
>>
>> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
>> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
>>
>
> Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN.
It's either not working or has not yet been deployed:
$ curl -I http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
Date: Sun, 16 Jul 2017 23:27:40 GMT
Server: Apache/2.4.18 (Ubuntu)
Content-Type: text/html; charset=iso-8859-1
>
> If you know of other tools, please speak up.
>>
>> > John
>> >
>> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations,
>> >> e.g.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
>> >>
>> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
>> >>
>> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> >>
>> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
>> >>
>> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
>> >>
>> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
>> >> >
>> >>
>> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
>> >> > (though
>> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
>> >> >
>> >> > John
>> >> >
>> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>> >> >>
>> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use
>> them.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> wrote:
>> >> >> > All,
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs
>> list
>> >> >> > while we were committing things.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
>> >> >> website
>> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > John
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
>> johndament@apache.org
>> >> >
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> All,
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
>> website
>> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some
>> links
>> >> may
>> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and
>> >> shout
>> >> >> >> out when you see something.
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >> >> John
>> >> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 5:32 PM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> > Sebb,
> >
> > I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure why
> > you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
> > podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to do
> a
> > 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the
> latest
> > but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out there
> > that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this
> location, I
> > have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
> > repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files as
> > well.
>
> A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
> What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
>
Infra have updated the scripts on eos to point to SVN. If you know of
other tools, please speak up.
>
> > John
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> >> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations,
> >> e.g.
> >> >
> >>
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
> >>
> >> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
> >>
> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >>
> >> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
> >>
> >> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
> >>
> >> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
> >> >
> >>
> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
> >> > (though
> >> > the link in the README is wrong)
> >> >
> >> > John
> >> >
> >> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
> >> >>
> >> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >> >>
> >> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
> >> >>
> >> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use
> them.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >> >> > All,
> >> >> >
> >> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs
> list
> >> >> > while we were committing things.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
> >> >> website
> >> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > John
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <
> johndament@apache.org
> >> >
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> All,
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator
> website
> >> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some
> links
> >> may
> >> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and
> >> shout
> >> >> >> out when you see something.
> >> >> >>
> >> >> >> John
> >> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 16 July 2017 at 21:22, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> Sebb,
>
> I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure why
> you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
> podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to do a
> 302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the latest
> but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out there
> that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this location, I
> have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
> repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files as
> well.
A redirect (or 3) may be sufficient.
What definitely needs to be avoided is a 404.
> John
>
> On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations,
>> e.g.
>> >
>> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
>>
>> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
>>
>> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>>
>> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
>>
>> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
>>
>> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
>> >
>> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
>> > (though
>> > the link in the README is wrong)
>> >
>> > John
>> >
>> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>> >>
>> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>> >>
>> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>> >>
>> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> >> > All,
>> >> >
>> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
>> >> > while we were committing things.
>> >> >
>> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
>> >> website
>> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>> >> >
>> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>> >> >
>> >> > John
>> >> >
>> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org
>> >
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> All,
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
>> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links
>> may
>> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and
>> shout
>> >> >> out when you see something.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> John
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>> >>
>> >>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
Sebb,
I have no particular issue with including the file, and I'm not sure why
you think I or anyone else would. This is not the canonical path for
podlings.xml though, and may be out of date. My recommendation is to do a
302 to the right location, so that consumers are always getting the latest
but I know not all tools can follow 302's. If there are tools out there
that need it, and you want to make those tools get it from this location, I
have no issue with you committing your proposed change to the website
repo. I would recommend that we also include the .dtd and .xsl files as
well.
John
On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 8:02 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> > Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations,
> e.g.
> >
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
>
> Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>
> used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
>
> It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
>
> > You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
> >
> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
> > (though
> > the link in the README is wrong)
> >
> > John
> >
> > On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
> >>
> >> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
> >>
> >> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
> >>
> >> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
> >>
> >>
> >> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> >> > All,
> >> >
> >> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
> >> > while we were committing things.
> >> >
> >> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
> >> website
> >> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
> >> >
> >> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
> >> >
> >> > John
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <johndament@apache.org
> >
> >> > wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> All,
> >> >>
> >> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
> >> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links
> may
> >> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and
> shout
> >> >> out when you see something.
> >> >>
> >> >> John
> >> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
On 16 July 2017 at 11:47, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations, e.g.
> http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
Perhaps they should, but the fact is that the URL
http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
used to work. And I'm fairly sure it used to be advertised somewhere.
It's trivial to fix, so why not fix it?
> You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
> https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
> (though
> the link in the README is wrong)
>
> John
>
> On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>>
>> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>>
>> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>>
>> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
>>
>>
>> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
>> > All,
>> >
>> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
>> > while we were committing things.
>> >
>> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
>> website
>> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>> >
>> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>> >
>> > John
>> >
>> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> All,
>> >>
>> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
>> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
>> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
>> >> out when you see something.
>> >>
>> >> John
>> >>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
Each of those services should be reading the file from SVN locations, e.g.
http://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/incubator/public/trunk/content/podlings.xml
You can see it being done correctly in whimsy here:
https://github.com/apache/whimsy/blob/ed8acc34dff71ef811b2e11312866c2d1f971b67/www/incubator/moderators.cgi
(though
the link in the README is wrong)
John
On Sun, Jul 16, 2017 at 4:49 AM sebb <se...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The podlings.xml file used to be available from
>
> http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
>
> Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
>
> These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
>
>
> On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> > All,
> >
> > The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
> > while we were committing things.
> >
> > Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new
> website
> > - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
> >
> > I'll begin content editing within a few days.
> >
> > John
> >
> > On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> All,
> >>
> >> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
> >> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
> >> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
> >> out when you see something.
> >>
> >> John
> >>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by sebb <se...@gmail.com>.
The podlings.xml file used to be available from
http://incubator.apache.org/podlings.xml
Also the related .dtd and .xsl were there.
These URLs need to be restored as 3rd parties (such as Whimsy) use them.
On 13 July 2017 at 02:50, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> All,
>
> The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
> while we were committing things.
>
> Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new website
> - https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
>
> I'll begin content editing within a few days.
>
> John
>
> On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
> wrote:
>
>> All,
>>
>> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
>> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
>> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
>> out when you see something.
>>
>> John
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
Re: [NOTICE] Migrating to the new Incubator Website Wednesday night
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
All,
The website has been migrated. Apologies for any spam on the cvs list
while we were committing things.
Please feel free to review the website guide for how to use the new website
- https://incubator.apache.org/guides/website.html .
I'll begin content editing within a few days.
John
On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 12:51 PM John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org>
wrote:
> All,
>
> Just as a heads up we will be migrating to the new Incubator website
> Wednesday night, 9pm Eastern. I expect during this time some links may
> break and other stuff not work quite right. Please be patient and shout
> out when you see something.
>
> John
>