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Posted to dev@cloudstack.apache.org by Rohit Yadav <ro...@shapeblue.com> on 2015/03/27 07:37:38 UTC
Re: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
Hi everyone,
I want to re-start the discussion on improving VR services and making a framework to build/improve old/new features such as reset password, dhcp, dns, vpn etc. that are both running on VR or on user VMs (reset password for example). For this, I’ve updated the wiki for high level goals and architecture diagram. Please share your comments and review on this proposal:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
Kishan - Yes, I’m also want to have a mechanism to update/upgrade systemvms without say registering a new one, or say during the patching process it can upgrades packages; since recently we had seen several openssl related issues where a common fix was to simply upgrade the packages. See the above wiki for details.
> On 20-Feb-2015, at 2:48 pm, Kishan Kavala <ki...@citrix.com> wrote:
>
> Rohit,
> Completely agree with the scalability and maintenance issues with systems Vms. Using an agent inside VR will probably work well for KVM, since the KVM agent (Resource layer) is remote. Communication using link-local network also won't be a problem is such case.
> For other hypervisors, it will increase load on the mgmt server due to direct agents. Also, mgmt server cannot access VRs directly.
>
> The options you mentioned are definitely worth exploring.
>
> Are you also looking at improving system Vm upgrade procedure?
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rohit Yadav [mailto:rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com]
> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 1:24 PM
> To: dev; users@cloudstack.apache.org
> Subject: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
>
> Hi,
>
> I'm trying to explore how to make systemvms more robust and fault-tolerant, and the manual/automated QA of systemvms. One of the common user facing issues related to scalability was the reset password/key servers where the VR serves data using socat etc using forking mechanisms and global locks. This slows down the processes such as reset password.
>
> More here: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-8272
>
> One of the blindly thrown solutions includes increasing the VR RAM which works for at scale but then seems to fail again when the load is increased beyond a point. I don't know of any performance and stress testing reports that tell us about these bottlenecks. Please share if you have done anything in this regard.
>
> I want to do couple of things:
>
> - Explore systemvm build changes using newer tools such as packer
> - Cleanup script execution and code in resource layer
> - Start replacing bash scripts with more robust implementations, perhaps a single or few agents on VRs that provide non-hardcoded well-documented interfaces
> - Right now everything in VR/systemvms is sort of hardcoded and the services/interfaces are not well-documented. The idea is to refactor and wrap everything we want to do with the systemvms in a general agents framework that provides monitoring and managing the VRs (do stuff like upgrades etc to combat things like ghost, poodle issues):
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
>
> What are the other issues you've had in past that you would like to be improved?
>
> --
> Regards,
> Rohit Yadav
> Software Architect, ShapeBlue
> M. +91 8826230892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
> Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab PS. If you see any footer below, I did not add it :) Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
>
> IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
> CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
> CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
> CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
>
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
Regards,
Rohit Yadav
Software Architect, ShapeBlue
M. +91 88 262 30892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab
Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
Re: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
Posted by Funs Kessen <fu...@barred.org>.
Hi Rohit,
At the moment I’m looking into doing something with a much lighter and quite flexible alternative for the VR. I was actually thinking of using Tiny Core OS as a base, it has a great packaging system with loop mounts and is very simple and tiny compared to the VR we have now (tens of MBs instead of 1.x to 2GB). And upgrading it could easily be bundled from the systemvm.iso as it’s really small. Another thing I’m experimenting with is getting openvswitch in there which should enable us to get rid of some of the limitations with regard to the amounts of networks you can make (4 in a VPC due to the 7 nic limit ?) and some nice L2-ish features too, platform independent and perhaps move to full routing/switching functionality in the VR. It would also enable us to lift that functionality very simple into a container perhaps.
So the state right now is experimental, and I'm not at the point it could do all the singing and dancing, but I think it might be viable for further network virtualisation in CS and perhaps more.
Cheers,
Funs
> On 27 Mar 2015, at 07:37, Rohit Yadav <ro...@shapeblue.com> wrote:
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I want to re-start the discussion on improving VR services and making a framework to build/improve old/new features such as reset password, dhcp, dns, vpn etc. that are both running on VR or on user VMs (reset password for example). For this, I’ve updated the wiki for high level goals and architecture diagram. Please share your comments and review on this proposal:
>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
>
> Kishan - Yes, I’m also want to have a mechanism to update/upgrade systemvms without say registering a new one, or say during the patching process it can upgrades packages; since recently we had seen several openssl related issues where a common fix was to simply upgrade the packages. See the above wiki for details.
>
>> On 20-Feb-2015, at 2:48 pm, Kishan Kavala <ki...@citrix.com> wrote:
>>
>> Rohit,
>> Completely agree with the scalability and maintenance issues with systems Vms. Using an agent inside VR will probably work well for KVM, since the KVM agent (Resource layer) is remote. Communication using link-local network also won't be a problem is such case.
>> For other hypervisors, it will increase load on the mgmt server due to direct agents. Also, mgmt server cannot access VRs directly.
>>
>> The options you mentioned are definitely worth exploring.
>>
>> Are you also looking at improving system Vm upgrade procedure?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Rohit Yadav [mailto:rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com]
>> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 1:24 PM
>> To: dev; users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Subject: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm trying to explore how to make systemvms more robust and fault-tolerant, and the manual/automated QA of systemvms. One of the common user facing issues related to scalability was the reset password/key servers where the VR serves data using socat etc using forking mechanisms and global locks. This slows down the processes such as reset password.
>>
>> More here: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-8272
>>
>> One of the blindly thrown solutions includes increasing the VR RAM which works for at scale but then seems to fail again when the load is increased beyond a point. I don't know of any performance and stress testing reports that tell us about these bottlenecks. Please share if you have done anything in this regard.
>>
>> I want to do couple of things:
>>
>> - Explore systemvm build changes using newer tools such as packer
>> - Cleanup script execution and code in resource layer
>> - Start replacing bash scripts with more robust implementations, perhaps a single or few agents on VRs that provide non-hardcoded well-documented interfaces
>> - Right now everything in VR/systemvms is sort of hardcoded and the services/interfaces are not well-documented. The idea is to refactor and wrap everything we want to do with the systemvms in a general agents framework that provides monitoring and managing the VRs (do stuff like upgrades etc to combat things like ghost, poodle issues):
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
>>
>> What are the other issues you've had in past that you would like to be improved?
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Rohit Yadav
>> Software Architect, ShapeBlue
>> M. +91 8826230892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
>> Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab PS. If you see any footer below, I did not add it :) Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
>>
>> IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
>> CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
>> CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
>> CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
>> CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
>> CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
>>
>> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
>
> Regards,
> Rohit Yadav
> Software Architect, ShapeBlue
> M. +91 88 262 30892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
> Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab
>
>
>
> Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
>
> IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
> CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
> CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
> CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
>
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
—
=Funs
Re: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
Posted by ilya <il...@gmail.com>.
How about extending all features into io-socket in KVM/XEN and VM
Annotation details with VmWare?
Similar to what we do with system VMs when they come up - except there
are no router vms to manage and depend on.
On 3/26/15 11:37 PM, Rohit Yadav wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I want to re-start the discussion on improving VR services and making a framework to build/improve old/new features such as reset password, dhcp, dns, vpn etc. that are both running on VR or on user VMs (reset password for example). For this, I’ve updated the wiki for high level goals and architecture diagram. Please share your comments and review on this proposal:
>
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
>
> Kishan - Yes, I’m also want to have a mechanism to update/upgrade systemvms without say registering a new one, or say during the patching process it can upgrades packages; since recently we had seen several openssl related issues where a common fix was to simply upgrade the packages. See the above wiki for details.
>
>> On 20-Feb-2015, at 2:48 pm, Kishan Kavala <ki...@citrix.com> wrote:
>>
>> Rohit,
>> Completely agree with the scalability and maintenance issues with systems Vms. Using an agent inside VR will probably work well for KVM, since the KVM agent (Resource layer) is remote. Communication using link-local network also won't be a problem is such case.
>> For other hypervisors, it will increase load on the mgmt server due to direct agents. Also, mgmt server cannot access VRs directly.
>>
>> The options you mentioned are definitely worth exploring.
>>
>> Are you also looking at improving system Vm upgrade procedure?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Rohit Yadav [mailto:rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com]
>> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2015 1:24 PM
>> To: dev; users@cloudstack.apache.org
>> Subject: [DISCUSS] Improving VR services such as password server
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm trying to explore how to make systemvms more robust and fault-tolerant, and the manual/automated QA of systemvms. One of the common user facing issues related to scalability was the reset password/key servers where the VR serves data using socat etc using forking mechanisms and global locks. This slows down the processes such as reset password.
>>
>> More here: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CLOUDSTACK-8272
>>
>> One of the blindly thrown solutions includes increasing the VR RAM which works for at scale but then seems to fail again when the load is increased beyond a point. I don't know of any performance and stress testing reports that tell us about these bottlenecks. Please share if you have done anything in this regard.
>>
>> I want to do couple of things:
>>
>> - Explore systemvm build changes using newer tools such as packer
>> - Cleanup script execution and code in resource layer
>> - Start replacing bash scripts with more robust implementations, perhaps a single or few agents on VRs that provide non-hardcoded well-documented interfaces
>> - Right now everything in VR/systemvms is sort of hardcoded and the services/interfaces are not well-documented. The idea is to refactor and wrap everything we want to do with the systemvms in a general agents framework that provides monitoring and managing the VRs (do stuff like upgrades etc to combat things like ghost, poodle issues):
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/CLOUDSTACK/Agents+Framework
>>
>> What are the other issues you've had in past that you would like to be improved?
>>
>> --
>> Regards,
>> Rohit Yadav
>> Software Architect, ShapeBlue
>> M. +91 8826230892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
>> Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab PS. If you see any footer below, I did not add it :) Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
>>
>> IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
>> CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
>> CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
>> CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
>> CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
>> CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
>>
>> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.
> Regards,
> Rohit Yadav
> Software Architect, ShapeBlue
> M. +91 88 262 30892 | rohit.yadav@shapeblue.com
> Blog: bhaisaab.org | Twitter: @_bhaisaab
>
>
>
> Find out more about ShapeBlue and our range of CloudStack related services
>
> IaaS Cloud Design & Build<http://shapeblue.com/iaas-cloud-design-and-build//>
> CSForge – rapid IaaS deployment framework<http://shapeblue.com/csforge/>
> CloudStack Consulting<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-consultancy/>
> CloudStack Software Engineering<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-software-engineering/>
> CloudStack Infrastructure Support<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-infrastructure-support/>
> CloudStack Bootcamp Training Courses<http://shapeblue.com/cloudstack-training/>
>
> This email and any attachments to it may be confidential and are intended solely for the use of the individual to whom it is addressed. Any views or opinions expressed are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Shape Blue Ltd or related companies. If you are not the intended recipient of this email, you must neither take any action based upon its contents, nor copy or show it to anyone. Please contact the sender if you believe you have received this email in error. Shape Blue Ltd is a company incorporated in England & Wales. ShapeBlue Services India LLP is a company incorporated in India and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. Shape Blue Brasil Consultoria Ltda is a company incorporated in Brasil and is operated under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue SA Pty Ltd is a company registered by The Republic of South Africa and is traded under license from Shape Blue Ltd. ShapeBlue is a registered trademark.