[users@httpd] WebSockets and Asynchronous IO

[Jess Holle <je...@ptc.com>]

Does Apache+mod_jk support WebSockets now?  If not, when will it?

Same questions for mod_proxy_ajp, though mod_jk was more robust last I 
compared the two and the focus of much more development energy.

Or does this work but only with mod_proxy_http?  If so, that raises 
issues in that we want to be able to do authentication in Apache but not 
treat this as proxy authentication, etc -- logically speaking we want 
Apache treated as "the" web server endpoint as with mod_jk, not as a 
proxy.  Also, last I checked mod_balancer's balancing was not 
up-to-snuff when compared to mod_jk -- its balancing was prone to 
getting really unbalanced.

Furthermore, there'd seem to be a difference between supporting 
WebSockets and doing so efficiently.  Doing so efficiently would really 
seem to be for asynchronous mod_event like handling -- including on 
Windows and with SSL, places where no version of Apache has asynchronous 
request handling as I understand it.

Overall, I'm struggling to see how Apache continues to fit in a world 
with WebSockets and asynchronous IO playing a larger role. Java servlet 
engines and app servers are jumping on supporting this.  We use Apache 
for load balancing over multiple Tomcat instances and for 
authentication, including its support for SiteMinder and other 
authentication plug-ins, so I really want to see it just handle 
WebSockets and asynchronous IO on all platforms and with SSL.  If that's 
not in Apache's near-term future, however, that may force a re-think of 
Apache's role here.

--
Jess Holle


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Re: [users@httpd] WebSockets and Asynchronous IO

[Eric Covener <co...@gmail.com>]

On Fri, Oct 12, 2012 at 9:00 AM, Eric Covener <co...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Overall, I'm struggling to see how Apache continues to fit in a world with
>> WebSockets and asynchronous IO playing a larger role. Java servlet engines
>> and app servers are jumping on supporting this.  We use Apache for load
>> balancing over multiple Tomcat instances and for authentication, including
>> its support for SiteMinder and other authentication plug-ins, so I really
>> want to see it just handle WebSockets and asynchronous IO on all platforms
>> and with SSL.  If that's not in Apache's near-term future, however, that may
>> force a re-think of Apache's role here.
>
> There's only support for one asynchronous handler, mod_serf, and it's
> tied into the event MPM kind of directly IIRC.  In other words,
> everything else ties up a thread while waiting on e.g. proxy I/O or
> CGI output.
>
> I don't think anyone is working on making Apache a websockets proxy,
> much less an efficient one (much less including Windows in that
> efficiency side of the equation). I believe it boils down to being an
> efficient TCP proxy which is not the best fit for jamming into Apache
> beyond port sharing (but if you had a great TCP proxy, you could just
> put it in front).

caveat: little or no practical interest/experience in websockets so
could be way off base.

-- 
Eric Covener
covener@gmail.com

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Re: [users@httpd] WebSockets and Asynchronous IO

[Eric Covener <co...@gmail.com>]

> Overall, I'm struggling to see how Apache continues to fit in a world with
> WebSockets and asynchronous IO playing a larger role. Java servlet engines
> and app servers are jumping on supporting this.  We use Apache for load
> balancing over multiple Tomcat instances and for authentication, including
> its support for SiteMinder and other authentication plug-ins, so I really
> want to see it just handle WebSockets and asynchronous IO on all platforms
> and with SSL.  If that's not in Apache's near-term future, however, that may
> force a re-think of Apache's role here.

There's only support for one asynchronous handler, mod_serf, and it's
tied into the event MPM kind of directly IIRC.  In other words,
everything else ties up a thread while waiting on e.g. proxy I/O or
CGI output.

I don't think anyone is working on making Apache a websockets proxy,
much less an efficient one (much less including Windows in that
efficiency side of the equation). I believe it boils down to being an
efficient TCP proxy which is not the best fit for jamming into Apache
beyond port sharing (but if you had a great TCP proxy, you could just
put it in front).

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