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Posted to general@xml.apache.org by ma...@corrosive.co.uk on 2001/11/05 16:16:43 UTC
website++: some fixes
Hi
Thanks for the feedback!
I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
At 9:11 AM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
>However, The text in the body could stand to be a little larger.
At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
>My only other comment is: *please* don't set font-size (or
>line-height) using "px" units in CSS, because it looks unreadably
>small on large displays. You probably shouldn't need to set the
>default font size at all, and even "pt" is risky, because Mac and PC
>measure that differently. You could use "small" and "x-small"
>without too much problem, though, I expect.
At 3:18 PM +0100 11/5/01, Henning von Bargen wrote:
>The body text is a bit too small, quite hard to read.
At 9:32 AM -0500 11/5/01, timtwwatts@netscape.net wrote:
>although I agree with the comments that the font size needs to be a
>bit larger.
I've also redesigned the logo/title area of the page: it should now
maintain the shape even at larger fonts.
At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
>... if you set the font size really large (as I do on my big monitor
>sometimes), the "The Apache XML Project" logo at the top left gets
>spread out into 3 pieces. If you care, you could fix this with more
>table nesting, I suppose (or a rowspan):
>
>+----+----
>| |+---
>| ||
>| |+---
>|LOGO||
>| |+---
>| ||
>| |+---
>+----+----
The address is the same
(http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site/), so please reload
or force-reload the page.
Looking forward to hear more comments.
Max
--
------------------------------
Max Guglielmino
Corrosive
http://www.corrosive.co.uk
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
Berin Loritsch wrote:
>
> max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > Thanks for the feedback!
> >
> > I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> > small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
>
> Much better. If everything is using relative sizing, then I
> can fine-tune the results on my browser to reflect what I
> personally like.
>
> I think this is good for a start. I am working on simplifying
> the markup, and will post the results when I am done. The simplified
> markup should work on both types of browsers.
I added a <base/> element just so that the graphics would
be found correctly. You will find that the tables are much
less complex, and are broken into sections. Please let me
know what you think.
I believe that it does render a little quicker as well.
--
"Those who would trade liberty for
temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
>
> Hi
>
> Thanks for the feedback!
>
> I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
Much better. If everything is using relative sizing, then I
can fine-tune the results on my browser to reflect what I
personally like.
I think this is good for a start. I am working on simplifying
the markup, and will post the results when I am done. The simplified
markup should work on both types of browsers.
> At 9:11 AM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> >However, The text in the body could stand to be a little larger.
>
> At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >My only other comment is: *please* don't set font-size (or
> >line-height) using "px" units in CSS, because it looks unreadably
> >small on large displays. You probably shouldn't need to set the
> >default font size at all, and even "pt" is risky, because Mac and PC
> >measure that differently. You could use "small" and "x-small"
> >without too much problem, though, I expect.
>
> At 3:18 PM +0100 11/5/01, Henning von Bargen wrote:
> >The body text is a bit too small, quite hard to read.
>
> At 9:32 AM -0500 11/5/01, timtwwatts@netscape.net wrote:
> >although I agree with the comments that the font size needs to be a
> >bit larger.
>
> I've also redesigned the logo/title area of the page: it should now
> maintain the shape even at larger fonts.
>
> At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >... if you set the font size really large (as I do on my big monitor
> >sometimes), the "The Apache XML Project" logo at the top left gets
> >spread out into 3 pieces. If you care, you could fix this with more
> >table nesting, I suppose (or a rowspan):
> >
> >+----+----
> >| |+---
> >| ||
> >| |+---
> >|LOGO||
> >| |+---
> >| ||
> >| |+---
> >+----+----
>
> The address is the same
> (http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site/), so please reload
> or force-reload the page.
>
> Looking forward to hear more comments.
>
> Max
> --
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Max Guglielmino
> Corrosive
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
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temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Andy Clark <an...@apache.org>.
Let's avoid using font sizes entirely. The small, medium, large
gives different results in both major browser sets and so does
"em" units (which I prefer). When I removed the font sizes
altogether, it finally displayed reasonably well in both. The
only thing was the entries in the navbar seems a little too
big. Hmmm...
Some other adjustments that are nice: P { text-align: justify;
margin-right: 10 }. The justified text looks better when the
first line is indented and you remove the inter-paragraph
spacing, though.
--
Andy Clark * IBM, TRL - Japan * andyc@apache.org
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by "Theodore W. Leung" <tw...@sauria.com>.
Max, sorry for the late reply, I've been out of the office.
Here's my feeling: What you've done is much much better than what we
have. Rather than guild the lily, is there some small amount of
tweaking that can be done to make this work?
I've viewed the latest pages this morning with IE6 - looks great to me,
and Mozilla .9.5 cuts off the www.w3c.org link on the right, but
otherwise looks fine
Ted
On Mon, 2001-11-05 at 16:58, max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> At 10:41 PM +0100 11/5/01, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> >Netscape 4.78 is also not resizing the image in the cell background and
> >is loosing a the image on top of the sitebar.
> >
> >Mozilla is messing up with the closing image on the left of the top
> >image.
> >
> >Hmmm, I wonder: why don't we just write a simple "rectangle" layout and
> >forget about fancy stuff? just an idea (please max, don't take it wrong,
> >I love your contribution! it's really much better than what we have!)
>
> yeah, I'm beginning to wonder myself...
> feedbacks have been very different so far and, although I like the
> design, I'm feeling we are "exposing" it to far too many variants...
>
> (...mind you, Berin's code has solved the top background image
> problem on my NC4.7 and still works fine on IE5.1...)
>
> I wonder what everybody else thinks about this issue? is it worth me
> trying out a sharp-edged version of the same design?
> --
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Max Guglielmino
> Corrosive
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by ma...@corrosive.co.uk.
At 10:41 PM +0100 11/5/01, Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
>Netscape 4.78 is also not resizing the image in the cell background and
>is loosing a the image on top of the sitebar.
>
>Mozilla is messing up with the closing image on the left of the top
>image.
>
>Hmmm, I wonder: why don't we just write a simple "rectangle" layout and
>forget about fancy stuff? just an idea (please max, don't take it wrong,
>I love your contribution! it's really much better than what we have!)
yeah, I'm beginning to wonder myself...
feedbacks have been very different so far and, although I like the
design, I'm feeling we are "exposing" it to far too many variants...
(...mind you, Berin's code has solved the top background image
problem on my NC4.7 and still works fine on IE5.1...)
I wonder what everybody else thinks about this issue? is it worth me
trying out a sharp-edged version of the same design?
--
------------------------------
Max Guglielmino
Corrosive
http://www.corrosive.co.uk
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
>
> hi All
>
> At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> >You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
> >into sections. Please let me know what you think.
>
> At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
> >Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
>
> At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
> >default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
> >heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
> >lesson for us both :-)
>
> HTML and CSS modified:
>
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
Looking good! I like the overall sizing of everything. Just one very
minor note:
the name of the current page in the navigation hierarchy is unreadable:
xml.apache.org > home
The "home" part is unreadable.
>
> max
> --
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Max Guglielmino
> Corrosive
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
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--
"Those who would trade liberty for
temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
"Theodore W. Leung" wrote:
>
> This looks fine to my unpracitised eye. If people like this, I'll start
> on a stylebook style. After that we can go on to DocBook.
Check with Netscape 4.75
The Navigation section final destination is so small it's unreadable:
xml.apache.org > news
("news" is the part that is not readable)
On IE, all is well.
>
> Ted
>
> On Wed, 2001-11-07 at 10:49, max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> > hi All
> >
> > At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> > >You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
> > >into sections. Please let me know what you think.
> >
> > At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
> > >Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
> >
> > At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> > >You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
> > >default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
> > >heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
> > >lesson for us both :-)
> >
> >
> > HTML and CSS modified:
> >
> > http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
> >
> >
> > max
> > --
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Max Guglielmino
> > Corrosive
> > http://www.corrosive.co.uk
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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"Those who would trade liberty for
temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
"Theodore W. Leung" wrote:
>
> Could you just commit it to xml-site, as newstyle?
>
> Or mail me the zip and I'll commit it.
I committed the first draft of the build process for you.
It needs some fine-tuning to work with xml-site's build
process.
--
"Those who would trade liberty for
temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by "Theodore W. Leung" <tw...@sauria.com>.
Could you just commit it to xml-site, as newstyle?
Or mail me the zip and I'll commit it.
Ted
On Thu, 2001-11-08 at 09:39, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> "Theodore W. Leung" wrote:
> >
> > This looks fine to my unpracitised eye. If people like this, I'll start
> > on a stylebook style. After that we can go on to DocBook.
>
> BTW, I have a Stylebook style already that works :) Do you want me to
> post it in a zip file?
>
> >
> > Ted
> >
> > On Wed, 2001-11-07 at 10:49, max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> > > hi All
> > >
> > > At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> > > >You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
> > > >into sections. Please let me know what you think.
> > >
> > > At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
> > > >Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
> > >
> > > At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> > > >You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
> > > >default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
> > > >heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
> > > >lesson for us both :-)
> > >
> > >
> > > HTML and CSS modified:
> > >
> > > http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
> > >
> > >
> > > max
> > > --
> > >
> > > ------------------------------
> > >
> > > Max Guglielmino
> > > Corrosive
> > > http://www.corrosive.co.uk
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
>
>
> --
>
> "Those who would trade liberty for
> temporary security deserve neither"
> - Benjamin Franklin
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Berin Loritsch <bl...@apache.org>.
"Theodore W. Leung" wrote:
>
> This looks fine to my unpracitised eye. If people like this, I'll start
> on a stylebook style. After that we can go on to DocBook.
BTW, I have a Stylebook style already that works :) Do you want me to
post it in a zip file?
>
> Ted
>
> On Wed, 2001-11-07 at 10:49, max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> > hi All
> >
> > At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> > >You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
> > >into sections. Please let me know what you think.
> >
> > At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
> > >Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
> >
> > At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> > >You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
> > >default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
> > >heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
> > >lesson for us both :-)
> >
> >
> > HTML and CSS modified:
> >
> > http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
> >
> >
> > max
> > --
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Max Guglielmino
> > Corrosive
> > http://www.corrosive.co.uk
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
--
"Those who would trade liberty for
temporary security deserve neither"
- Benjamin Franklin
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by "Theodore W. Leung" <tw...@sauria.com>.
This looks fine to my unpracitised eye. If people like this, I'll start
on a stylebook style. After that we can go on to DocBook.
Ted
On Wed, 2001-11-07 at 10:49, max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> hi All
>
> At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> >You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
> >into sections. Please let me know what you think.
>
> At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
> >Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
>
> At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
> >default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
> >heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
> >lesson for us both :-)
>
>
> HTML and CSS modified:
>
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
>
>
> max
> --
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Max Guglielmino
> Corrosive
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@xml.apache.org
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by ma...@corrosive.co.uk.
hi All
At 12:50 PM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
>You will find that the tables are much less complex, and are broken
>into sections. Please let me know what you think.
At 5:43 PM +0900 11/6/01, Andy Clark wrote:
>Let's avoid using font sizes entirely...
At 10:03 AM +0000 11/6/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
>You could try not using a font size specification at all for the
>default font size you want, then using "font-size: larger" for the
>heading and "font-size: smaller" for the navbar... Hmm, a useful CSS
>lesson for us both :-)
HTML and CSS modified:
http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site1/
max
--
------------------------------
Max Guglielmino
Corrosive
http://www.corrosive.co.uk
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Stefano Mazzocchi <st...@apache.org>.
Robert Koberg wrote:
>
> yea, at least it is not like that amatuer logo so promoinently displayed on
> cocoon's web-site...
what do you mean?
--
Stefano Mazzocchi One must still have chaos in oneself to be
able to give birth to a dancing star.
<st...@apache.org> Friedrich Nietzsche
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RE: website++: some fixes
Posted by Robert Koberg <ro...@koberg.com>.
yea, at least it is not like that amatuer logo so promoinently displayed on
cocoon's web-site...
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Stefano Mazzocchi [mailto:stefano@apache.org]
> Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 1:41 PM
> To: general@xml.apache.org
> Subject: Re: website++: some fixes
>
>
> max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
> >
> > Hi
> >
> > Thanks for the feedback!
> >
> > I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> > small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
>
> Well, kinda big on IE 5.00.3315.1000 and Netscape 4.78
>
> Mozilla 0.9.5 look ok.
>
> Netscape 4.78 is also not resizing the image in the cell background and
> is loosing a the image on top of the sitebar.
>
> Mozilla is messing up with the closing image on the left of the top
> image.
>
> Hmmm, I wonder: why don't we just write a simple "rectangle" layout and
> forget about fancy stuff? just an idea (please max, don't take it wrong,
> I love your contribution! it's really much better than what we have!)
>
> --
> Stefano Mazzocchi One must still have chaos in oneself to be
> able to give birth to a dancing star.
> <st...@apache.org> Friedrich Nietzsche
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> In case of troubles, e-mail: webmaster@xml.apache.org
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@xml.apache.org
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Stefano Mazzocchi <st...@apache.org>.
max@corrosive.co.uk wrote:
>
> Hi
>
> Thanks for the feedback!
>
> I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
Well, kinda big on IE 5.00.3315.1000 and Netscape 4.78
Mozilla 0.9.5 look ok.
Netscape 4.78 is also not resizing the image in the cell background and
is loosing a the image on top of the sitebar.
Mozilla is messing up with the closing image on the left of the top
image.
Hmmm, I wonder: why don't we just write a simple "rectangle" layout and
forget about fancy stuff? just an idea (please max, don't take it wrong,
I love your contribution! it's really much better than what we have!)
--
Stefano Mazzocchi One must still have chaos in oneself to be
able to give birth to a dancing star.
<st...@apache.org> Friedrich Nietzsche
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Re: website++: some fixes
Posted by Louis Tribble <lo...@webgain.com>.
>
> I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
Hmmm. I didn't see the first version, but in the revised version on IE (Win2K),
the fonts are huge. Ya can't win...
I also happen to prefer serif fonts for body text, but I guess that's a
prejudice that many don't share.
Louis Tribble
----- Original Message -----
From: <ma...@corrosive.co.uk>
To: <ge...@xml.apache.org>
Sent: Monday, November 05, 2001 7:16 AM
Subject: website++: some fixes
> Hi
>
> Thanks for the feedback!
>
> I've followed Hugh suggestion and switched the CSS to use
> small-medium-large. Please verify the font size is ok now.
>
> At 9:11 AM -0500 11/5/01, Berin Loritsch wrote:
> >However, The text in the body could stand to be a little larger.
>
> At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >My only other comment is: *please* don't set font-size (or
> >line-height) using "px" units in CSS, because it looks unreadably
> >small on large displays. You probably shouldn't need to set the
> >default font size at all, and even "pt" is risky, because Mac and PC
> >measure that differently. You could use "small" and "x-small"
> >without too much problem, though, I expect.
>
> At 3:18 PM +0100 11/5/01, Henning von Bargen wrote:
> >The body text is a bit too small, quite hard to read.
>
> At 9:32 AM -0500 11/5/01, timtwwatts@netscape.net wrote:
> >although I agree with the comments that the font size needs to be a
> >bit larger.
>
>
>
> I've also redesigned the logo/title area of the page: it should now
> maintain the shape even at larger fonts.
>
> At 2:03 PM +0000 11/5/01, Hugh Greene wrote:
> >... if you set the font size really large (as I do on my big monitor
> >sometimes), the "The Apache XML Project" logo at the top left gets
> >spread out into 3 pieces. If you care, you could fix this with more
> >table nesting, I suppose (or a rowspan):
> >
> >+----+----
> >| |+---
> >| ||
> >| |+---
> >|LOGO||
> >| |+---
> >| ||
> >| |+---
> >+----+----
>
>
> The address is the same
> (http://www.corrosive.co.uk/xml_apache_org/site/), so please reload
> or force-reload the page.
>
> Looking forward to hear more comments.
>
> Max
> --
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Max Guglielmino
> Corrosive
> http://www.corrosive.co.uk
>
>
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