You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@cocoon.apache.org by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org> on 2003/10/09 13:03:02 UTC
Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
am I mistaken about the agreement?
Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
Forms ;-)
-Bertrand
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Per-Olof Noren <pe...@alma.nu>.
Here is 2 cents worth of opinions from sweden :-)
On Thu, 2003-10-09 at 13:03, Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
+1
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though
-1 For the sake of naming consistency. Its' better to change it now
while the user count is fairly low, than doing it when thousands and
thousands of people are using it.
Regards,
Per-Olof Norén
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Marc Portier <mp...@outerthought.org>.
Joerg Heinicke wrote:
> Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
>
>> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote,
>> or am I mistaken about the agreement?
>
>
> Someone mentioned that "Forms" in the name is "to official" and Stefano
> answered "if we won't have forms in the name we don't need to rename it
> at all". Such a nice toy name :) But I have no problem with renaming it.
>
>> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and
>> shows that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
>
>
> +1
>
+1
>> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
>> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
>> Forms ;-)
>
>
> -1 either "Woody" or "Cocoon Forms", not a mixture
>
yes, same feeling here
however I do like the idea of holding on to some
historic-faits-dhiver-reference by adding a cocoon forms sample that
shows how to use it for building a sandwich-lunch-ordering application :-)
actually we should change namespaces too, and the used prefixes
as well as some classnames,
and some stuff in the samples, possible references from other blocks,
the (wiki) docos,...
any feelings around this?
regards,
-marc=
--
Marc Portier http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center
Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0116284/
mpo@outerthought.org mpo@apache.org
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Joerg Heinicke <jh...@virbus.de>.
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> am I mistaken about the agreement?
Someone mentioned that "Forms" in the name is "to official" and Stefano
answered "if we won't have forms in the name we don't need to rename it at
all". Such a nice toy name :) But I have no problem with renaming it.
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
+1
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon Forms
> ;-)
-1 either "Woody" or "Cocoon Forms", not a mixture
Joerg
--
System Development
VIRBUS AG
Fon +49(0)341-979-7419
Fax +49(0)341-979-7409
joerg.heinicke@virbus.de
www.virbus.de
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> am I mistaken about the agreement?
I guess there were a couple of +1 ;)
Here is mine again: +1
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
>
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon Forms
> ;-)
Hm... better let's keep it consistent! People would not search
for the "woody" block but the "forms" block or something.
I'd prefer to rename the block as well
--
Torsten
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Tony Collen <co...@umn.edu>.
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> am I mistaken about the agreement?
>
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
My late +1 for "Cocoon Forms"
>
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon Forms
> ;-)
>
> -Bertrand
>
Regards,
tony
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Stefano Mazzocchi <st...@apache.org>.
On Thursday, Oct 9, 2003, at 14:07 Europe/Rome, Geoff Howard wrote:
> Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
>> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote,
>> or am I mistaken about the agreement?
>> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and
>> shows that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
>
> +1
+1
>> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
>> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
>> Forms ;-)
>
> No, I think that block name reduces visibility.
Agreed, +1 to change the block name as well.
> In fact, I'm starting to feel that non-descriptive names for projects
> are a marketing liability unless the "brand" can really be equated
> with its meaning.
True. But when a brand indicates use (think "kleenex", "googling")
that's where you have marketing connected to the use of the term. We
might be achiving that status with cocoon "let's cocoon our web site",
anyone? ;-)
--
Stefano.
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Geoff Howard <co...@leverageweb.com>.
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> am I mistaken about the agreement?
>
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
+1
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon Forms
> ;-)
No, I think that block name reduces visibility. In fact, I'm starting
to feel that non-descriptive names for projects are a marketing
liability unless the "brand" can really be equated with its meaning.
Geoff
Re: [HUM] block names (Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?)
Posted by Michael Melhem <mi...@managesoft.com>.
On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 10:55:58PM +0200, Marc Portier wrote:
>
>
> Michael Melhem wrote:
>
> >On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 01:13:38PM +0200, Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
> >
> >>Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> >>
>
> <snip/>
>
> >>>We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> >>>great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
> >>>Forms ;-)
> >>
> >>I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
> >
> >
> > Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
> >
> > cheers,
> > Michael
> >
>
> eheh, next time we need a name for a new block I'll propose 'rooster' ;-)
hmmm...I think we might need a "rooster" plugin :)
Michael
>
> -marc=
> --
> Marc Portier http://outerthought.org/
> Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center
> Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0116284/
> mpo@outerthought.org mpo@apache.org
>
>
>
[HUM] block names (Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?)
Posted by Marc Portier <mp...@outerthought.org>.
Michael Melhem wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 01:13:38PM +0200, Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
>
>>Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
>>
<snip/>
>>>We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
>>>great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
>>>Forms ;-)
>>
>>I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
>
>
> Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
>
> cheers,
> Michael
>
eheh, next time we need a name for a new block I'll propose 'rooster' ;-)
-marc=
--
Marc Portier http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center
Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0116284/
mpo@outerthought.org mpo@apache.org
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Michael Hartle <mh...@hartle-klug.com>.
Sylvain Wallez wrote:
> Torsten Curdt wrote:
>
>> ...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means in Australia ;)
>
> ROFTL ;-D
>
> For those who hadn't special aussie lessons with Michael, check out
> the "vulgar slang" meaning at
> http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=woody
>
> Sylvain
>
It reminds me of one the "Austin Powers" movies with Mike Meyers (the
one prior to "Goldmember", I think), where Woody Harrolson played a part
in the very funny "Spotting Dr. Evils Spaceship"-style scenes :-)
Best regards,
Michael Hartle
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Sylvain Wallez <sy...@anyware-tech.com>.
Torsten Curdt wrote:
>>> I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
>>
>>
>> Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
>>
>> cheers,
>> Michael
>
>
> ...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means in Australia ;)
ROFTL ;-D
For those who hadn't special aussie lessons with Michael, check out the
"vulgar slang" meaning at http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=woody
Sylvain
--
Sylvain Wallez Anyware Technologies
http://www.apache.org/~sylvain http://www.anyware-tech.com
{ XML, Java, Cocoon, OpenSource }*{ Training, Consulting, Projects }
Orixo, the opensource XML business alliance - http://www.orixo.com
RE: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Carsten Ziegeler <cz...@s-und-n.de>.
Matthew Langham wrote:
>
> >>> I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
> >>
> >> Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
> >> cheers,
> >> Michael
> >
> > ...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means
> > in Australia ;)
> >
>
> Hahaha - that's really funny :-).
>
Ok, before someone finds a "really funny" description/picture
of a "Woody" in google (I just found someone which I wont
post here!), the "Woody" I ate yesterday is a SANDWICH
as everyone in the cocoon community should know anyway :)
Carsten
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
>> ...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means
>> in Australia ;)
hum. I'm starting to agree with you guys on the renaming ;-)
-Bertrand
P.S. http://psy.otago.ac.nz/r_oshea/slang.html
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Matthew Langham <ml...@s-und-n.de>.
>>> I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
>>
>> Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
>> cheers,
>> Michael
>
> ...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means
> in Australia ;)
>
Hahaha - that's really funny :-).
Matthew
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
>>I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
>
>
> Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
>
> cheers,
> Michael
...I doubt everyone knows what "woody" means
in Australia ;)
cheers
--
Torsten
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Steven Noels <st...@outerthought.org>.
Christopher Oliver wrote:
> But as far as the continuation and flowscript support for this goes, I
> think "refactoring" is the proper term. IMO the hack to support
> ${continuation.id} and the whole JS (woody.js, woody2.js) interface
> needs to be redesigned.
+1, and a big thank you for this cool-headed remark.
</Steven>
--
Steven Noels http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source Java & XML An Orixo Member
Read my weblog at http://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/
stevenn at outerthought.org stevenn at apache.org
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Sylvain Wallez <sy...@anyware-tech.com>.
Christopher Oliver wrote:
> Sylvain Wallez wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> I volunteer for this. This move should also be the occasion of doing
>> the refactoring (rather a polishing, actually) I proposed in august
>> so that we quickly have some stable APIs.
>
>
> But as far as the continuation and flowscript support for this goes, I
> think "refactoring" is the proper term. IMO the hack to support
> ${continuation.id} and the whole JS (woody.js, woody2.js) interface
> needs to be redesigned.
+1
Sylvain
--
Sylvain Wallez Anyware Technologies
http://www.apache.org/~sylvain http://www.anyware-tech.com
{ XML, Java, Cocoon, OpenSource }*{ Training, Consulting, Projects }
Orixo, the opensource XML business alliance - http://www.orixo.com
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Christopher Oliver <re...@verizon.net>.
Sylvain Wallez wrote:
<snip>
>
> I volunteer for this. This move should also be the occasion of doing
> the refactoring (rather a polishing, actually) I proposed in august so
> that we quickly have some stable APIs.
But as far as the continuation and flowscript support for this goes, I
think "refactoring" is the proper term. IMO the hack to support
${continuation.id} and the whole JS (woody.js, woody2.js) interface
needs to be redesigned.
My $0.02,
Chris
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Sylvain Wallez <sy...@anyware-tech.com>.
Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
>Sylvain Wallez wrote:
>
>
>>I volunteer for this. This move should also be the occasion of doing the
>>refactoring (rather a polishing, actually) I proposed in august so that
>>we quickly have some stable APIs.
>>
>>
>Just curious, when are you planning to do so?
>
>
I should be starting this by the end of next week. The start of the week
will be occupied giving a... Flowscript & Woody training!!!
Sylvain
--
Sylvain Wallez Anyware Technologies
http://www.apache.org/~sylvain http://www.anyware-tech.com
{ XML, Java, Cocoon, OpenSource }*{ Training, Consulting, Projects }
Orixo, the opensource XML business alliance - http://www.orixo.com
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Steven Noels <st...@outerthought.org>.
Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
> Sylvain Wallez wrote:
>
>>
>>I propose that we put in the docs some notes about the history of
>>Woody/Cocoon Forms: who started it (you deserve credit), the initial
>>name and where it came from, etc, etc, including the australian meaning
>>of woody ;-)
>>
>
> +1 (apart from the australian meaning)
Hehe. It was funny seeing people finding that out - though it was the
first thing which came to my mind when seeing "Debian Woody" quite some
time ago. I must have been lectured English using tasty reading
material, I guess. Or I've been subject to too much crafterm'isms over
the past years. ;-)
> We have the CREDITS text for exactly that purpose.
CREDITS should be used for proper donations, developed parallel to the
collaborative community process, IMHO, and donated in an official way to
the ASF (using the proper paperwork). Looking at the current list, we
should actively try to keep it as short as possible. Web3 should be in
it, as well, to give an example. I'm -0 to add any little company-funded
piece of code into the CREDITS file, since it would become a marketing
tool then.
</Steven>
--
Steven Noels http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source Java & XML An Orixo Member
Read my weblog at http://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/
stevenn at outerthought.org stevenn at apache.org
RE: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Carsten Ziegeler <cz...@s-und-n.de>.
Sylvain Wallez wrote:
>
>
> I propose that we put in the docs some notes about the history of
> Woody/Cocoon Forms: who started it (you deserve credit), the initial
> name and where it came from, etc, etc, including the australian meaning
> of woody ;-)
>
+1 (apart from the australian meaning)
We have the CREDITS text for exactly that purpose.
>
> I volunteer for this. This move should also be the occasion of doing the
> refactoring (rather a polishing, actually) I proposed in august so that
> we quickly have some stable APIs.
>
Just curious, when are you planning to do so?
Carsten
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Sylvain Wallez <sy...@anyware-tech.com>.
Steven Noels wrote:
> Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
<snip/>
>> This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
>> good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon
>> flow" "cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more
>> protected and a more solid foundation.
>
>
> +1 - let's go for "Cocoon Forms" - even if I feel kind of sad seeing
> the name I suggested going away. Oh well - it's about seeing you kids
> grow up, I guess.
I propose that we put in the docs some notes about the history of
Woody/Cocoon Forms: who started it (you deserve credit), the initial
name and where it came from, etc, etc, including the australian meaning
of woody ;-)
> Bearing in mind the amount of work that requires a _real_ renaming,
> like changing package names, namespaces and all that - who's going to
> do that?
I volunteer for this. This move should also be the occasion of doing the
refactoring (rather a polishing, actually) I proposed in august so that
we quickly have some stable APIs.
Sylvain
--
Sylvain Wallez Anyware Technologies
http://www.apache.org/~sylvain http://www.anyware-tech.com
{ XML, Java, Cocoon, OpenSource }*{ Training, Consulting, Projects }
Orixo, the opensource XML business alliance - http://www.orixo.com
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Steven Noels <st...@outerthought.org>.
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
>
> On Friday, Oct 10, 2003, at 09:15 Europe/Rome, Steven Noels wrote:
>
>> Bearing in mind the amount of work that requires a _real_ renaming,
>> like changing package names, namespaces and all that - who's going to
>> do that?
>
>
> I would suggest we do that in Cocoon 2.2
>
> For the users, a "planned incompatibility" is not so bad, expecially if
> it's just a matter of doing namespace changes between (very few users
> care about package names).
>
> thoughts?
Fine with me - it's a community thing now (which we will actively try to
support, of course).
</Steven>
--
Steven Noels http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source Java & XML An Orixo Member
Read my weblog at http://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/
stevenn at outerthought.org stevenn at apache.org
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Stefano Mazzocchi <st...@apache.org>.
On Friday, Oct 10, 2003, at 09:15 Europe/Rome, Steven Noels wrote:
> Bearing in mind the amount of work that requires a _real_ renaming,
> like changing package names, namespaces and all that - who's going to
> do that?
I would suggest we do that in Cocoon 2.2
For the users, a "planned incompatibility" is not so bad, expecially if
it's just a matter of doing namespace changes between (very few users
care about package names).
thoughts?
--
Stefano.
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Steven Noels <st...@outerthought.org>.
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> Which is a nice example, here, btw: the OT team proposed an alternative
> flow control concept and an alternative form framework, the community
> considered the first inferior to what we already had, but considered
> superior the second and promoted it as "official".
Adapting to better reflect historical accuracy: no single line of Woody
was written until _after_ Bruno's form proposal was discussed on the
list. So in the end, the proposal was about design, and not about a
finished code package being donated to the project. I tend to believe
that this is exactly the reason why Woody has been able to grow into
Cocoon Forms.
> [at the hackaton, there was a discussion on why the REST-based approach
> that Marc proposed cannot be matched one-2-one with the flow approach.
> Marc agreed that his idea of continuation and the current continuation
> are different concepts and forcing them into the same terminology might
> stretch the paradigm too much]
>
> No matter what the result was, I think forcing people with one solution
> forced discussions to happen, which helped all the parties involved,
> even to understand thing that were not previously understood by both sides.
>
> This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
> good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon flow"
> "cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more protected
> and a more solid foundation.
+1 - let's go for "Cocoon Forms" - even if I feel kind of sad seeing the
name I suggested going away. Oh well - it's about seeing you kids grow
up, I guess.
Bearing in mind the amount of work that requires a _real_ renaming, like
changing package names, namespaces and all that - who's going to do that?
Cheers,
</Steven>
--
Steven Noels http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source Java & XML An Orixo Member
Read my weblog at http://blogs.cocoondev.org/stevenn/
stevenn at outerthought.org stevenn at apache.org
ReSTy continuations (was Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?)
Posted by Marc Portier <mp...@outerthought.org>.
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
<snip />
>
> [at the hackaton, there was a discussion on why the REST-based approach
> that Marc proposed cannot be matched one-2-one with the flow approach.
> Marc agreed that his idea of continuation and the current continuation
> are different concepts and forcing them into the same terminology might
> stretch the paradigm too much]
>
yep, hackathon discussion made me see some fundamental diffs
yet still I see loads of opportunities in the ReSTy approach and I do
think Cocoon's sitemap fits big time to the general ideas behind it
I'm currently somewhat in doubth around next steps, and am just betting
on some background-mind-processing thread working out how the ReST
benefits could be more naturally added or at least made available to the
cocoon user base.
basically I'm still all ears to others wanting to join in the fun.
regards,
-marc=
--
Marc Portier http://outerthought.org/
Outerthought - Open Source, Java & XML Competence Support Center
Read my weblog at http://radio.weblogs.com/0116284/
mpo@outerthought.org mpo@apache.org
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Sylvain Wallez <sy...@anyware-tech.com>.
Torsten Curdt wrote:
> <snip/>
>
>> This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
>> good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon
>> flow" "cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more
>> protected and a more solid foundation.
>
>
> +1
+1 also.
> that's exactly what I was preaching in my presentation at the GT last
> year ;) glad we finally have something that seems to be community driven!
I must say that I was totally amazed by the feedback after my
presentation on Woody. Lots of people came to me asking questions,
saying they agreed Woody was the way to go, saying they already used it
and liked it, and proposing enhancements (more on my blog).
Maybe the community was expecting some kind of "go" sign to rush on
Woody and it appears I clearly gave this sign at Gent. Amazing
community, and sudden amazing responsibility for those that thought they
were a bit alone on this stuff in their "woody corner of the blocks
directory" ;-)
I love it :-)
Sylvain
--
Sylvain Wallez Anyware Technologies
http://www.apache.org/~sylvain http://www.anyware-tech.com
{ XML, Java, Cocoon, OpenSource }*{ Training, Consulting, Projects }
Orixo, the opensource XML business alliance - http://www.orixo.com
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
<snip/>
> This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
> good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon flow"
> "cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more protected
> and a more solid foundation.
+1
that's exactly what I was preaching in my presentation at the GT last
year ;) glad we finally have something that seems to be community driven!
--
Torsten
RE: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Carsten Ziegeler <cz...@s-und-n.de>.
Stefano Mazzocchi wrote:
> <SNIP>
>
> No matter what the result was, I think forcing people with one solution
> forced discussions to happen, which helped all the parties involved,
> even to understand thing that were not previously understood by both
> sides.
>
> This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
> good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon flow"
> "cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more protected
> and a more solid foundation.
>
+1
In some areas we have two or three (or more) different solutions
all not satisfying the real users needs which is really crap.
So, I consider this one of the most important discussions at
the GT and the result might be the most important one.
Carsten
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Stefano Mazzocchi <st...@apache.org>.
On Thursday, Oct 9, 2003, at 14:50 Europe/Rome, Michael Melhem wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 01:13:38PM +0200, Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
>> Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
>>>
>>> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote,
>>> or
>>> am I mistaken about the agreement?
>> I think we had consensus, however not all committers attended the
>> hackathon,
>> so it might be that someone is -1 on it and has a good reason.
>>
>>>
>>> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and
>>> shows
>>> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
>> +1
>
> Im not against naming it "Cocoon Forms" but we need to be
> sure we want to lock Cocoon to a single Forms implementation.
I do. Just like I wouldn't want multiple flow, FOM or sitemap
implementation as core.
We allow other people to write their own, but we support only one of a
kind: this forces discussions instead of forking... remember the
balkanization thread.
Which is a nice example, here, btw: the OT team proposed an alternative
flow control concept and an alternative form framework, the community
considered the first inferior to what we already had, but considered
superior the second and promoted it as "official".
[at the hackaton, there was a discussion on why the REST-based approach
that Marc proposed cannot be matched one-2-one with the flow approach.
Marc agreed that his idea of continuation and the current continuation
are different concepts and forcing them into the same terminology might
stretch the paradigm too much]
No matter what the result was, I think forcing people with one solution
forced discussions to happen, which helped all the parties involved,
even to understand thing that were not previously understood by both
sides.
This is why having one official direction on the various areas is
good(tm) and having a simple name for it "cocoon sitemap" "cocoon flow"
"cocoon forms" would help our users to choose and feel more protected
and a more solid foundation.
--
Stefano.
Re: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Michael Melhem <mi...@managesoft.com>.
On Thu, Oct 09, 2003 at 01:13:38PM +0200, Carsten Ziegeler wrote:
> Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> >
> > I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> > am I mistaken about the agreement?
> I think we had consensus, however not all committers attended the hackathon,
> so it might be that someone is -1 on it and has a good reason.
>
> >
> > Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> > that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
> +1
Im not against naming it "Cocoon Forms" but we need to be
sure we want to lock Cocoon to a single Forms implementation.
Just to play "devils advocate", an alternative name could be
"Woody Forms" or "WForms"
>
> >
> > We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> > great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
> > Forms ;-)
> I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
Carsten, tooo much information mate, ;)
cheers,
Michael
>
> But I think that it makes sense to rename the block as well. If someone
> is looking for form handling he will soon notice that the "form" block
> is about forms. But that's not visible if we keep the name "woody".
>
> Carsten
>
>
>
RE: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Reinhard Poetz <re...@apache.org>.
From: Carsten Ziegeler
> Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
> >
> > I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we
> need a vote,
> > or am I mistaken about the agreement?
> I think we had consensus, however not all committers attended
> the hackathon, so it might be that someone is -1 on it and
> has a good reason.
>
> >
> > Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and
> > shows that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
> +1
+1 too
>
> >
> > We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in
> homage to the
> > great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
> > Forms ;-)
> I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
>
> But I think that it makes sense to rename the block as well.
> If someone is looking for form handling he will soon notice
> that the "form" block is about forms. But that's not visible
> if we keep the name "woody".
+1 for the renaming (we should have only one official brand)
Reinhard
RE: Renaming Woody to "Cocoon Forms" ?
Posted by Carsten Ziegeler <cz...@s-und-n.de>.
Bertrand Delacretaz wrote:
>
> I think there was agreement on Monday about this, do we need a vote, or
> am I mistaken about the agreement?
I think we had consensus, however not all committers attended the hackathon,
so it might be that someone is -1 on it and has a good reason.
>
> Naming it "Cocoon Forms" is a nice parallel to "Cocoon Flow", and shows
> that we're betting the farm on it, which I like.
+1
>
> We can probably keep Woody as the block name though, in homage to the
> great sandwiches delivered to the great original authors of Cocoon
> Forms ;-)
I had a "Woody" yesterday; well...it's not that bad.
But I think that it makes sense to rename the block as well. If someone
is looking for form handling he will soon notice that the "form" block
is about forms. But that's not visible if we keep the name "woody".
Carsten