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Posted to dev@lucy.apache.org by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov> on 2011/10/28 00:44:13 UTC
[lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All dependency licensing
issues resolved)
Marvin,
That's amazing!
As soon as I VOTE on the latest RC, I'm going to recommend that the Lucy
community over the next month seriously consider graduating from the Incubator.
You've fulfilled pretty much the mantra that you set out in the Incubator:
- elected new committers
- had > 1 release manager (nice job Peter!)
- made releases
- cleaned up licensing issues
You guys are ready for prime time. What do others think? I raised this
issue a few months ago and the major thing I remember that was raised
was this licensing issue.
Cheers,
Chris
On Oct 27, 2011, at 3:31 PM, Marvin Humphrey wrote:
> Greets,
>
> A few hours ago, the existing implementation of the Clownfish parser was
> swapped out for one based on Flex and the Lemon parser generator, eliminating
> Lucy's dependency on the CPAN module Parse::RecDescent.
>
> As of today, the Lucy mainline no longer has any non-core Perl dependencies,
> and all of the licensing and legal issues that needed to be resolved during
> Lucy's incubation have been resolved.
>
> The Flex/Lemon-based parser has an additional benefit: it is much faster than
> the Parse::RecDescent based version. The Clownfish compiler now parses all of
> those .cfh files in core/ in under a second -- a task that used to take
> approximately 15-20 seconds. Between that and several other other changes
> from the last few months, the build time for Lucy has improved dramatically
> since release 0.1.0, dropping from just over three minutes to just over a
> minute and a half.
>
> Marvin Humphrey
>
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Marvin Humphrey <ma...@rectangular.com>.
On Thu, Oct 27, 2011 at 09:51:26PM -0700, Nathan Kurz wrote:
> I have no particular opinion on this matter, but please take the rest
> of this conversation to private email. The tone is poor, and I don't
> think it reflects well on Lucy.
Thanks, Nate, for stepping in and noting something I had thought as well, and
thanks to the participants for bringing us back on track so swiftly, because
the content of this exchange has been welcome and productive.
Mattmann's JFDI bulldozer spirit prods an awful lot of progress in the
Incubator and around the ASF. In this case, it has elicited a useful critique
from Torsten.
Regardless of whether Lucy's graduation needs to be gated on increasing the
diversity of commits, it's true that it would be in the project's best
interest if we improved in that area as much as we have in others. I think it
is wise for us to stay on top of this issue, and that we shouldn't relax the
pressure until it is truly behind us.
I'm going to continue to work on tearing down barriers to participation. A
few months ago, someone contemplating a C host binding would have had to
address JSON parsing and UTF-8 validation by figuring out how to integrate
external libraries; those are both solved problems now. And since
Parse::RecDescent, the last of our CPAN dependencies, is history as of
yesterday, all you needs is a machine with Perl 5.10 and a C compiler on it to
build Lucy -- no CPAN expertise or configuration required.
This work will pay off sooner or later. I know Peter is pretty
time-constrained, but we have the advantage that since he is already expert on
many areas of Lucy, less bootstrapping is required than for a fresh face like
Brad or Torsten. Fun times ahead!
Marvin Humphrey
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Nathan Kurz <na...@verse.com>.
I have no particular opinion on this matter, but please take the rest
of this conversation to private email. The tone is poor, and I don't
think it reflects well on Lucy.
Nathan Kurz
nate@verse.com
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
Hi Torsten,
On Oct 28, 2011, at 12:34 AM, Torsten Curdt wrote:
>>> Right. So then there would be just no one committing?
>>> Please explain how that should work from your POV.
>>
>> Committing isn't the only contribution.
>
> That doesn't answer the question and you know it.
Let me try and better explain then. What question are you asking?
Are you saying that if a community only has 1 major person writing
code then it won't be a success? If so, then I'd disagree with you
and my statement above holds, and I believe answers the question.
The Apache mantra is "community over code", and 3 +1s is what it
is all about. On a project where one of those +1s is a coder/hacker,
another is a release manager, and another is someone that writes
documentation, then no I don't see a problem with that. If the project
can muster 3 +1s for new committers, for releases, for etc., then
it's absolutely fine.
>
>>> Exactly. So let's give it the time it needs. What's so bad if it takes 3 years?
>>
>> That's not a sustainable model for the incubator.
>
> So far we have been OK. We had other podlings that also took their time needed.
There have been several discussions over the past 9 months about Incubator
projects that have been alive for years and in all of those cases the projects
are either being encouraged to graduate (e.g., RAT [1]), or to be retired (Alios [2], etc.).
Growing projects that live in the Incubator for years is not a sustainable model.
Projects should have goals of graduating as soon as they are ready. That's why we
have monthly Incubator reporting for the first 3 months, and quarterly after that. Think
about what quarterly means. And think about what reporting means. It means that
at worst, every 3 months, the IPMC chair reports to the board on the _current status
of the podling towards *graduation*_. That's what reporting is about. And, that's
what mentoring is about. Mentors should actively check with their podlings during
those 3 month reporting cycles to make sure they are on path to meet their goals
for graduating.
>
>>> Quoting from the incubator guide at
>>> Snip...
>>> That's just not the case yet.
>>
>> Says you with absolutely 0 merit in this community besides lurking.
>
> As a member of the ASF and a member of the incubator PMC I am voicing
> my concerns.
> You just call me troll and don't adress my concerns at all.
You are welcome to your concerns. I am also welcome to my statement that
I think Lucy is graduating. Both of us are Incubator PMC members, and
have a single VOTE towards Lucy's graduation when the time that the VOTE
is cast, at which point it's at least 3 +1s from the PMC, and then simply more +1s
than -1s at that point after that.
I have a few real concerns right now too, which led me to start this thread:
1. Those doing the work in Lucy (and yes, it's more than Marvin, and to reduce it
to just Marvin is a joke) don't have binding VOTEs on the work they are doing right
now. Joe Schaefer stepped up and rewrote the build system
with Marvin's help. Peter just RM'ed the frickin' project (NICE Peter!). We've had
new committers (e.g., David, Brad). We've had releases, multiple of them. Heck,
even I RM'ed one of them. I want to get the people doing the work to have
binding VOTEs, and the best way to do that is to make them a committee, that is
self-directing and managing, make them a PMC. Have they met the criteria for
that?
2. In my mind, anyone that goes back, reads the Lucy proposal [3], and
reads out monthly reports for the last 1 year and 3 months will see that
the checklist has been checked off from what we originally set out to do.
3. Not gating or tying graduation to a set of development goals, and thinking
that we are still X development goals away from graduation. Guess what,
development can still occur while you are graduating! In fact, I'd encourage it.
In Tika and OODT, we didn't shut down SVN when we started graduating.
We didn't shut down the mailing lists. We just kept working. Same in Nutch.
Same in all the projects I've watched graduate, and mentor over the years,
including some pretty huge ones at Apache.
4. A TLP allows the Lucy community to continue doing what they are doing.
It's not TLP and then everything is stopped, we pat ourselves on the make,
and we're 1.0. TLP != 1.0. TLP simply says that the commumity has shown
that it can: (a) self-govern; (b) elect new committers; (c) make releases of
ALv2 licensed software, with proper license vetting, etc.; (d) show diversity
in terms of organizations, etc. Lucy has shown all that. There is no requirement
that you need to be at 1.0, or have met N development goals before you
can graduate.
I hope that clarifies my position.
Cheers,
Chris
[1] http://s.apache.org/lx
[2] http://s.apache.org/7gf
[3] http://wiki.apache.org/lucy/LucyIncubatorProposal
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
>> Right. So then there would be just no one committing?
>> Please explain how that should work from your POV.
>
> Committing isn't the only contribution.
That doesn't answer the question and you know it.
>> Unfortunately in terms of diversity not that much seems to have changed since.
>>
>>> http://s.apache.org/a08
>>
>> ...even with the new committer on board.
>
> Says you. You were trolling then and you are again.
Just calling me a troll does not make this go away.
>> You are pushing for it - and I don't get why.
>
> You probably don't.
No, and you don't help by not giving a reason.
>> Exactly. So let's give it the time it needs. What's so bad if it takes 3 years?
>
> That's not a sustainable model for the incubator.
So far we have been OK. We had other podlings that also took their time needed.
>> Quoting from the incubator guide at
>> Snip...
>> That's just not the case yet.
>
> Says you with absolutely 0 merit in this community besides lurking.
As a member of the ASF and a member of the incubator PMC I am voicing
my concerns.
You just call me troll and don't adress my concerns at all.
> Sorry but we can agree to disagree and leave it at that.
Maybe we should take this offline.
cheers,
Torsten
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
Sent from my iPhone
On Oct 27, 2011, at 6:28 PM, "Torsten Curdt" <tc...@vafer.org> wrote:
>>> That's all and great but this falls down as soon as Marvin (for
>>> whatever reason) would be gone.
>>
>> I wholly disagree with you.
>
> Right. So then there would be just no one committing?
> Please explain how that should work from your POV.
Committing isn't the only contribution.
>
>>> Frankly - I don't understand the rush.
>>
>> What rush? I raised this issue months ago, and we actually had some discussions
>> about it. Most folks in the community agreed that the remaining item to check off
>> was the licensing issues.
>
> Unfortunately in terms of diversity not that much seems to have changed since.
>
>> http://s.apache.org/a08
>
> ...even with the new committer on board.
Says you. You were trolling then and you are again.
>
>> Months is not a rush.
>
> You are pushing for it - and I don't get why.
>
You probably don't.
Every mentor should be asking the question periodically if their podlings are ready to graduate.
>> Go read the Lucy reports: the project has been in Incubation
>> since July 2010: so it's been about 1 year, 3 months. Every project has a different
>> amount of time in Incubation
>
> Exactly. So let's give it the time it needs. What's so bad if it takes 3 years?
That's not a sustainable model for the incubator.
> Just bringing this up every other month does not bring it any closer
> to a successful graduation.
Try 3 months.
>
>> and every project has a checklist of things to get done
>> before graduating. I think we've met that checklist.
>
> Quoting from the incubator guide at
> Snip...
> That's just not the case yet.
Says you with absolutely 0 merit in this community besides lurking.
Sorry but we can agree to disagree and leave it at that.
>
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "David E. Wheeler" <da...@kineticode.com>.
On Nov 1, 2011, at 6:39 PM, Nathan Kurz wrote:
> I love your analogy, but it conveniently forgets the five years that
> Lucy dropped out of school, ran away from home, lived under an
> assumed name, and pretended to be a consenting adult. Lucy is glad to
> be back in a warm, loving home instead of busking on the streets and
> shacking up with long-haired men of dubious musical talent
> (http://www.rectangular.com/about.html), but she views her time back
> as just as much for her parents' benefit as for hers. If they want to
> persist in their squabbling, and if they really want to rent her
> bedroom to some stranger for some pittance of a rent, she reminds them
> that she's perfectly able to take care of herself and that Creamy G
> promised he'd always be "froopy" for her.
>
> Is he the kind of "nice guy" you were picturing? Do you really want
> to drive her back to that? :)
Now I'm worried.
:-)
D
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "Henry C." <he...@cityweb.co.za>.
On Wed, November 2, 2011 03:39, Nathan Kurz wrote:
> long-haired men of dubious musical talent
> (http://www.rectangular.com/about.html), but she views her time back
I'm afraid it's far, far worse than that. Dig down deep enough into the
unkempt hair and the frightening truth may just reach out and drag you in,
screaming, gurgling.
Some say he's the premature reincarnation of Jeff Minter (of Llamasoft fame) -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Minter. This is only a rumour, though, so
don't take the hushed, furtive whispers at the water-cooler too seriously.
When I confronted him (years ago) with this very question, he just smiled
enigmatically.
Minter is still alive, so perhaps CreamyG is an e-fork :)
Either way, he's not coming close to my pure blue-eyed blonde beautiful
daughters...
Not until he shaves, at least.
...or procures a less pretentious guitar.
h
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Nathan Kurz <na...@verse.com>.
On Fri, Oct 28, 2011 at 2:57 PM, Chris Hostetter <ho...@fucit.org> wrote:
> Mattman is like Lucy's mom: "Now that you've finished high school, you
> should think about getting a part time job, so you can move into your own
> apartment while you go to college at night, so you can save up money to
> start a family when you meet a nice guy to settle down with."
I love your analogy, but it conveniently forgets the five years that
Lucy dropped out of school, ran away from home, lived under an
assumed name, and pretended to be a consenting adult. Lucy is glad to
be back in a warm, loving home instead of busking on the streets and
shacking up with long-haired men of dubious musical talent
(http://www.rectangular.com/about.html), but she views her time back
as just as much for her parents' benefit as for hers. If they want to
persist in their squabbling, and if they really want to rent her
bedroom to some stranger for some pittance of a rent, she reminds them
that she's perfectly able to take care of herself and that Creamy G
promised he'd always be "froopy" for her.
Is he the kind of "nice guy" you were picturing? Do you really want
to drive her back to that? :)
--nate
> This type of encouragement is good -- it's healthy to remind the project
> that it shouldn't hide out in the basement as a podling forever.
>
> we're all entitled to our opinions about the status of the project --
> you're certainly free to play the part of the Uncle who thinks Lucy hasn't
> made enough of herself yet and needs to date more before she's ready to
> move out into the big city on her own -- but ultimately it's up to the
> community (the whole community) to decide when it is "ready" to vote
> for it's own graduation, and it's up to the IPMC to vote to approve that
> graduation and propose it to the board as a resolution, and it's up to the
> board to accept that proposal and create a new PMC.
>
> Everyone is free to voice their opinions during these discussions, and
> cast their votes however they see fit -- but ultimatley if you care enough
> about Lucy to subscribe to these mailing lists, and participate in this
> discussions, then it seems like there probably a lot more productive ways
> to contribute then getting into a pissing match over wether Lucy is ready
> for graduation.
>
> if you think there aren't enough contributors, then contribute. if you
> think there aren't enough committers, then nominate someone. if you think
> the overall activity level is too low to be self sustaining, then
> encourage more people to get involved. etc....
>
>
> (For the record: I consider myself Lucy's slightly senile grandfather. a
> dirty old man with a weak hip who doesn't spend much time with Lucy on a
> regular basis, and frequently spouts non-sense, but occaionally spouts
> inspiring wisdon in between attempts to get Lucy to "pull my finger".)
>
>
>
> -Hoss
>
>
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All dependency
licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Chris Hostetter <ho...@fucit.org>.
: You are pushing for it - and I don't get why.
Mattman is being the voice of progress, encouranging the project to think
about it's future, and about moving forward and leaving the nest.
Mattman is like Lucy's mom: "Now that you've finished high school, you
should think about getting a part time job, so you can move into your own
apartment while you go to college at night, so you can save up money to
start a family when you meet a nice guy to settle down with."
This type of encouragement is good -- it's healthy to remind the project
that it shouldn't hide out in the basement as a podling forever.
we're all entitled to our opinions about the status of the project --
you're certainly free to play the part of the Uncle who thinks Lucy hasn't
made enough of herself yet and needs to date more before she's ready to
move out into the big city on her own -- but ultimately it's up to the
community (the whole community) to decide when it is "ready" to vote
for it's own graduation, and it's up to the IPMC to vote to approve that
graduation and propose it to the board as a resolution, and it's up to the
board to accept that proposal and create a new PMC.
Everyone is free to voice their opinions during these discussions, and
cast their votes however they see fit -- but ultimatley if you care enough
about Lucy to subscribe to these mailing lists, and participate in this
discussions, then it seems like there probably a lot more productive ways
to contribute then getting into a pissing match over wether Lucy is ready
for graduation.
if you think there aren't enough contributors, then contribute. if you
think there aren't enough committers, then nominate someone. if you think
the overall activity level is too low to be self sustaining, then
encourage more people to get involved. etc....
(For the record: I consider myself Lucy's slightly senile grandfather. a
dirty old man with a weak hip who doesn't spend much time with Lucy on a
regular basis, and frequently spouts non-sense, but occaionally spouts
inspiring wisdon in between attempts to get Lucy to "pull my finger".)
-Hoss
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
>> That's all and great but this falls down as soon as Marvin (for
>> whatever reason) would be gone.
>
> I wholly disagree with you.
Right. So then there would be just no one committing?
Please explain how that should work from your POV.
>> Frankly - I don't understand the rush.
>
> What rush? I raised this issue months ago, and we actually had some discussions
> about it. Most folks in the community agreed that the remaining item to check off
> was the licensing issues.
Unfortunately in terms of diversity not that much seems to have changed since.
> http://s.apache.org/a08
...even with the new committer on board.
> Months is not a rush.
You are pushing for it - and I don't get why.
> Go read the Lucy reports: the project has been in Incubation
> since July 2010: so it's been about 1 year, 3 months. Every project has a different
> amount of time in Incubation
Exactly. So let's give it the time it needs. What's so bad if it takes 3 years?
Just bringing this up every other month does not bring it any closer
to a successful graduation.
> and every project has a checklist of things to get done
> before graduating. I think we've met that checklist.
Quoting from the incubator guide at
http://incubator.apache.org/guides/graduation.html
"The project is considered to have a diverse community when it is not
highly dependent on any single contributor (there are at least 3
legally independent committers and there is no single company or
entity that is vital to the success of the project)"
That's just not the case yet.
cheers,
Torsten
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
On Oct 27, 2011, at 5:18 PM, Torsten Curdt wrote:
>>> Commit mails on markmail.org still show mostly "just" Marvin.
>>> Or what am I missing?
>>
>> Commits aren't the only sign of community. They also aren't the only
>> sustaining thing you need. You need:
>>
>> * VOTEs
>> * discussion emails
>> * JIRA threads
>> * release managers
>> * documentation writers, etc.
>
> That's all and great but this falls down as soon as Marvin (for
> whatever reason) would be gone.
I wholly disagree with you.
[...]
> As much as I would love to see lucy graduate I still think it's not ready.
>
> Well, and I am saying this is not a diverse community - which also one
> of the goals of incubation. A single person committing on a TLP is not
> quite the Apache way I know.
>
> Frankly - I don't understand the rush.
What rush? I raised this issue months ago, and we actually had some discussions
about it. Most folks in the community agreed that the remaining item to check off
was the licensing issues.
http://s.apache.org/a08
Months is not a rush.
Go read the Lucy reports: the project has been in Incubation
since July 2010: so it's been about 1 year, 3 months. Every project has a different
amount of time in Incubation and every project has a checklist of things to get done
before graduating. I think we've met that checklist.
Cheers,
Chris
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
>> Commit mails on markmail.org still show mostly "just" Marvin.
>> Or what am I missing?
>
> Commits aren't the only sign of community. They also aren't the only
> sustaining thing you need. You need:
>
> * VOTEs
> * discussion emails
> * JIRA threads
> * release managers
> * documentation writers, etc.
These things you need on top, indeed :)
> I've seen Peter, David, Nathan, Joe (S.) and a host of other folks
> contribute.
That's all and great but this falls down as soon as Marvin (for
whatever reason) would be gone.
Graduation is also about build a sustainable community - not a single
person doing the coding.
And frankly speaking I am lurking on the dev list and didn't see that
many discussion emails.
As much as I would love to see lucy graduate I still think it's not ready.
> And committers != PMC != community.
nitpicking: whether committers != PMC depends on the project, it's the
same for some projects
> The VOTE is to decide on whether or not Lucy has:
>
> * elected new (P)PMC members
> * shown that it can govern itself
> * made releases
> * vetted its licenses
> * operated in the Apache way
>
> I'd say it has.
Well, and I am saying this is not a diverse community - which also one
of the goals of incubation. A single person committing on a TLP is not
quite the Apache way I know.
Frankly - I don't understand the rush.
cheers,
Torsten
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by "Mattmann, Chris A (388J)" <ch...@jpl.nasa.gov>.
On Oct 27, 2011, at 4:18 PM, Torsten Curdt wrote:
>> As soon as I VOTE on the latest RC, I'm going to recommend that the Lucy
>> community over the next month seriously consider graduating from the Incubator.
>>
>> You've fulfilled pretty much the mantra that you set out in the Incubator:
>>
>> - elected new committers
>> - had > 1 release manager (nice job Peter!)
>> - made releases
>> - cleaned up licensing issues
>
> Commit mails on markmail.org still show mostly "just" Marvin.
> Or what am I missing?
Commits aren't the only sign of community. They also aren't the only
sustaining thing you need. You need:
* VOTEs
* discussion emails
* JIRA threads
* release managers
* documentation writers, etc.
For the above:
I've seen Peter, David, Nathan, Joe (S.) and a host of other folks
contribute.
>
>> You guys are ready for prime time. What do others think? I raised this
>> issue a few months ago and the major thing I remember that was raised
>> was this licensing issue.
>
> That and not enough active committers.
> Doesn't look like the latter has changed yet.
And committers != PMC != community.
The VOTE is to decide on whether or not Lucy has:
* elected new (P)PMC members
* shown that it can govern itself
* made releases
* vetted its licenses
* operated in the Apache way
I'd say it has.
Cheers,
Chris
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Chris Mattmann, Ph.D.
Senior Computer Scientist
NASA Jet Propulsion Laboratory Pasadena, CA 91109 USA
Office: 171-266B, Mailstop: 171-246
Email: chris.a.mattmann@nasa.gov
WWW: http://sunset.usc.edu/~mattmann/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Adjunct Assistant Professor, Computer Science Department
University of Southern California, Los Angeles, CA 90089 USA
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Re: [lucy-dev] [DISCUSS] Graduation (was Re: [lucy-dev] All
dependency licensing issues resolved)
Posted by Torsten Curdt <tc...@vafer.org>.
> As soon as I VOTE on the latest RC, I'm going to recommend that the Lucy
> community over the next month seriously consider graduating from the Incubator.
>
> You've fulfilled pretty much the mantra that you set out in the Incubator:
>
> - elected new committers
> - had > 1 release manager (nice job Peter!)
> - made releases
> - cleaned up licensing issues
Commit mails on markmail.org still show mostly "just" Marvin.
Or what am I missing?
> You guys are ready for prime time. What do others think? I raised this
> issue a few months ago and the major thing I remember that was raised
> was this licensing issue.
That and not enough active committers.
Doesn't look like the latter has changed yet.
cheers,
Torsten