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Posted to users@httpd.apache.org by linux guru <li...@gmail.com> on 2007/03/13 22:31:40 UTC
[users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Does anybody host about 2000-2500 virtual sites in single server?
Which version of Apache do you prefer 2.0 or 2.2 for hosting thousands of
websites?
Do you have examples or some experiment about the httpd.conf for this kind
of servers?
Have you ever noticed an error like this below;
apachectl stop, OK
apachectl start, No responce. FAIL
open the file which has virtual host records, inc.vhost.httpd.conf put #
sign
start of 30-40 lines save and close the file.
apachectl start, OK
open the file again and remove the #'s
apachectl graceful, OK
Please help :) We are getting mad more and more everyday.
You could check the php config and other details at
http://82.222.170.52/i.php
We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are installing apache , php , and
modules from source.
The servers are extremly powerful and does not have other services like
mysql or mail server. only apache serving.
Please contact me directly if you think you could help.
Thanks.
Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Sean Conner <sp...@conman.org>.
It was thus said that the Great linux guru once stated:
> Does anybody host about 2000-2500 virtual sites in single server?
I've hosted about 1000+ sites on a single server, and have faced some of
the problems mentioned herein.
> Which version of Apache do you prefer 2.0 or 2.2 for hosting thousands of
> websites?
No opinion on this. I had no problems with Apache 1.3 and only upgraded
to 2.2 when one of the sites needed a reverse proxy.
> Do you have examples or some experiment about the httpd.conf for this kind
> of servers?
>
> Have you ever noticed an error like this below;
>
> apachectl stop, OK
> apachectl start, No responce. FAIL
>
> open the file which has virtual host records, inc.vhost.httpd.conf put #
> sign
> start of 30-40 lines save and close the file.
>
> apachectl start, OK
>
> open the file again and remove the #'s
>
> apachectl graceful, OK
>
> Please help :) We are getting mad more and more everyday.
Sounds like you are hitting the limit of the number of open files per
process. One thing I did was to have a single error log for everything.
When that was exhausted, I increased the number of allowable open files by
adding "ulimit -n 8192" to the Apache startup script. If that got
exhausted, I would have upped the actual operating system limit (under
Linux, use "sysctl -a" to list all OS tunable parameters; you use sysctl to
set these parameters as well).
-spc
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Jo...@hcssystems.com.
On Tue, 13 Mar 2007, linux guru wrote:
> Does anybody host about 2000-2500 virtual sites in single server?
>
> Which version of Apache do you prefer 2.0 or 2.2 for hosting thousands of
> websites?
>
> Do you have examples or some experiment about the httpd.conf for this kind
> of servers?
>
> Have you ever noticed an error like this below;
>
> apachectl stop, OK
> apachectl start, No responce. FAIL
You're probably hitting some resource limit.
Look within apachectl for the line which invokes httpd.
Figure out the variables and try to start it with the "broken" config it
from the command line with
'strace -f', like this:
cd $APACHE_ROOT/bin # or wherever your httpd is
strace -f ./httpd -k start # this is my server's config
...and at the end, check the return code:
echo $?
and post the last 20 lines or so to the list. Might help to capture all
that to a file with either output redirection or 'script.'
Thanks,
Josh
>
> open the file which has virtual host records, inc.vhost.httpd.conf put #
> sign
> start of 30-40 lines save and close the file.
>
> apachectl start, OK
>
> open the file again and remove the #'s
>
> apachectl graceful, OK
>
> Please help :) We are getting mad more and more everyday.
>
> You could check the php config and other details at
> http://82.222.170.52/i.php
>
> We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are installing apache , php , and
> modules from source.
>
> The servers are extremly powerful and does not have other services like
> mysql or mail server. only apache serving.
>
> Please contact me directly if you think you could help.
>
> Thanks.
>
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RE: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Mark Lavi <ml...@sgi.com>.
This is off-topic from the question, but I wanted to add some
commentary.
I loved the simplicity of http://www.apachetoolbox.com/ while automated
the build of Apache, PHP, and many other modules. But alas, it's Apache
1.3.x not 2.x.
Before Apache Toolbox and since then, I've happily made my own build
scripts to check for libraries and activate modules, etc. It's the best
way to document what you did and reproduce it for your next build.
Cheers,
--Mark
Mark Lavi, Enterprise Web Management Team @ SGI
mailto:mlavi@sgi.com || phone:+1-650-933-7707
-----Original Message-----
From: Jaqui Greenlees [mailto:jaqui_greenlees@yahoo.ca]
Sent: Tuesday, March 13, 2007 4:54 PM
To: users@httpd.apache.org
Subject: Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
[previous quotes]
> It was thus said that the Great Jaqui Greenlees once
> stated:
> > > We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are
> > > installing apache , php , and modules from
> source.
> >
> > Why not use the RHEL supplied packages? it would
> > simplify the administration and patching for bugs
> and
> > security issues.
>
> I found the exact opposite. Using the tarballs to
> install has been by far
> easier on me than expecting the various package
> managmenet tools to work
> correctly (I've been burned by apt-get, yum and
> emerge too many times to
> even bother with them any more).
>
I personally wouldn't use RHEL or Suse either, both
use YUM, both throw really stupid requirements into
package dependencies. [ what binary distro doesn't
though? ]
I was thinking more the maintenance with patching,
than the basic installation being easier with a
package manager.
DIY or LFS are the two distros I think are worth
using, a 100% from source, no automated tools build, [
DIY being build scripts, not a installer script ] no
bogus dependencies foisted on you by someone else, no
bloatware GUI forced on you, no really stupid disable
root account type decisions to have to fix. [ can ya
tell I'm not happy with most distros? ;) ]
I only once, in the last 9 years, have had a single
issue caused through an update from a distro supplied
package manager, Mandrake 8.2 broke Apache with a
mod_perl update.
Jaqui
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by linux guru <li...@gmail.com>.
To sum up;
* we are using ulimit -n 32000 and more while trying to restart apache but
it does not work.
* do you have ideas or numbers that you could offer for "sysctl -a"
parameters?
* also for tarballs we prefer them and use them.
* for offer hosting less websites on a single server, it could be an idea
but, we use fully redundant servers, raid, dual cpu, huge ram, dual power
suppy, and it costs much, so we need to get out of it.
* for fail over server, we are hosting more than 15.000 websites in more
than 20 webservers, so the fail over is not efficient in usd :)
On 3/14/07, Sean Conner <sp...@conman.org> wrote:
>
> It was thus said that the Great Jaqui Greenlees once stated:
> >
> > > You could check the php config and other details at
> > > http://82.222.170.52/i.php
> >
> > This was not a good idea, this list has publicly
> > accesable archives of all messages.
>
> And how is this any different than when it's requested to post
> configurations here, unaltered, for help in debugging? (sorry, "security
> through obscurity" is a hot button topic for me, one that I don't believe
> in).
>
> > > We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are
> > > installing apache , php , and modules from source.
> >
> > Why not use the RHEL supplied packages? it would
> > simplify the administration and patching for bugs and
> > security issues.
>
> I found the exact opposite. Using the tarballs to install has been by far
> easier on me than expecting the various package managmenet tools to work
> correctly (I've been burned by apt-get, yum and emerge too many times to
> even bother with them any more).
>
> -spc
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> The official User-To-User support forum of the Apache HTTP Server Project.
> See <URL:http://httpd.apache.org/userslist.html> for more info.
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@httpd.apache.org
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>
>
Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Jaqui Greenlees <ja...@yahoo.ca>.
--- Sean Conner <sp...@conman.org> wrote:
> It was thus said that the Great Jaqui Greenlees once
> stated:
> >
> > > You could check the php config and other details
> at
> > > http://82.222.170.52/i.php
> >
> > This was not a good idea, this list has publicly
> > accesable archives of all messages.
>
> And how is this any different than when it's
> requested to post
> configurations here, unaltered, for help in
> debugging? (sorry, "security
> through obscurity" is a hot button topic for me, one
> that I don't believe
> in).
>
It's different in that the SERVER IP isn't part of a
message with the data in it.
Not only is the configuration data there, you have the
publicly accessable ip number for the server.
the configuration data psted as part of the message,
no ip number for someone to use to try to break the
system.
[ not that apache or linux are that vulnerable to
such, compared to Windows and IIS or Microsoft Server.
]
> > > We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are
> > > installing apache , php , and modules from
> source.
> >
> > Why not use the RHEL supplied packages? it would
> > simplify the administration and patching for bugs
> and
> > security issues.
>
> I found the exact opposite. Using the tarballs to
> install has been by far
> easier on me than expecting the various package
> managmenet tools to work
> correctly (I've been burned by apt-get, yum and
> emerge too many times to
> even bother with them any more).
>
I personally wouldn't use RHEL or Suse either, both
use YUM, both throw really stupid requirements into
package dependencies. [ what binary distro doesn't
though? ]
I was thinking more the maintenance with patching,
than the basic installation being easier with a
package manager.
DIY or LFS are the two distros I think are worth
using, a 100% from source, no automated tools build, [
DIY being build scripts, not a installer script ] no
bogus dependencies foisted on you by someone else, no
bloatware GUI forced on you, no really stupid disable
root account type decisions to have to fix. [ can ya
tell I'm not happy with most distros? ;) ]
I only once, in the last 9 years, have had a single
issue caused through an update from a distro supplied
package manager, Mandrake 8.2 broke Apache with a
mod_perl update.
Jaqui
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Sean Conner <sp...@conman.org>.
It was thus said that the Great Jaqui Greenlees once stated:
>
> > You could check the php config and other details at
> > http://82.222.170.52/i.php
>
> This was not a good idea, this list has publicly
> accesable archives of all messages.
And how is this any different than when it's requested to post
configurations here, unaltered, for help in debugging? (sorry, "security
through obscurity" is a hot button topic for me, one that I don't believe
in).
> > We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are
> > installing apache , php , and modules from source.
>
> Why not use the RHEL supplied packages? it would
> simplify the administration and patching for bugs and
> security issues.
I found the exact opposite. Using the tarballs to install has been by far
easier on me than expecting the various package managmenet tools to work
correctly (I've been burned by apt-get, yum and emerge too many times to
even bother with them any more).
-spc
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [users@httpd] Apache Examples Extreme Web Servers
Posted by Jaqui Greenlees <ja...@yahoo.ca>.
--- linux guru <li...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Does anybody host about 2000-2500 virtual sites in
> single server?
>
> Which version of Apache do you prefer 2.0 or 2.2 for
> hosting thousands of websites?
>
I personally would use 2.2, since it's the active
version for development and support.
> Do you have examples or some experiment about the
> httpd.conf for this kind of servers?
>
> Have you ever noticed an error like this below;
>
> apachectl stop, OK
> apachectl start, No responce. FAIL
With that many virtual hosts on one machine, the
server may not be completely cleaned up after the stop
before you try starting it again. It takes the os a
few seconds to clean the ram / swap after shutting
down apache without that many virtual hosts.
> open the file which has virtual host records,
> inc.vhost.httpd.conf put #
> sign
> start of 30-40 lines save and close the file.
>
> apachectl start, OK
>
> open the file again and remove the #'s
>
> apachectl graceful, OK
Graceful ans stop / start are two entirely different
functions. Graceful / restart rereads the conf and
applies changes on the fly in functionality.
The stop / start completely cleans the server from the
system stack then starts it up again.
> Please help :) We are getting mad more and more
> everyday.
>
> You could check the php config and other details at
> http://82.222.170.52/i.php
>
This was not a good idea, this list has publicly
accesable archives of all messages.
> We are using Redhat Enterprise Linux 4, we are
> installing apache , php , and modules from source.
Why not use the RHEL supplied packages? it would
simplify the administration and patching for bugs and
security issues.
> The servers are extremly powerful and does not have
> other services like mysql or mail server. only
apache > serving.
You should still have a backup server running with
fail-over configured so that clients service isn't
interrupted if the server fails. It would be a good
idea to have fewer virtual hosts on any one machine,
just to reduce the number of clients affected by any
problems.
Jaqui
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