You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to dev@commons.apache.org by Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com> on 2003/02/05 18:32:42 UTC
[Graph2] nsUML license problem
Hey all,
If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
The choices seem to be:
1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
license
2) Remove nsUML from graph
Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
If not, we're stuck with option number two.
- Morgan
=====
Morgan Delagrange
http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
http://axion.tigris.org
http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net>.
Here is my option :
See my proposal "reverse dependency strategy" just sent to general.
This way we can leave the dependency and just need to refactor to have
an interface, where we can implement it some other cvs repo than the
apache one (maybe a werken repo?)
Mvgr,
Martin
On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 18:32, Morgan Delagrange wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
> board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
> link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
> of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
>
> http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
>
> The choices seem to be:
>
> 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> license
> 2) Remove nsUML from graph
>
> Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
> If not, we're stuck with option number two.
>
> - Morgan
>
> =====
> Morgan Delagrange
> http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> http://axion.tigris.org
> http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On 5 Feb 2003, Jason van Zyl wrote:
> On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 14:11, David Dixon-Peugh wrote:
> > The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph package.
> >
> > Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
> > in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
> > packages and distributing them separately.
> >
> > (Its doubtful that many people need to convert
> > statecharts from UML into Graphs for manipulation.)
>
> These are the kinds of things that shouldn't be necessary though. It's
> in there because it was serving a purpose and needs to be removed
> because of bureaucratic nonsense. It just doesn't sit well.
Is it bureaucratic or idealogical? If the ASF website is breaking the
rules of a GPL licence, can the ASF complain when another entity breaks
their licence?
Is it a case of 'practice what you preach'?
Hen
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com>.
On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 14:11, David Dixon-Peugh wrote:
> The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph package.
>
> Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
> in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
> packages and distributing them separately.
>
> (Its doubtful that many people need to convert
> statecharts from UML into Graphs for manipulation.)
These are the kinds of things that shouldn't be necessary though. It's
in there because it was serving a purpose and needs to be removed
because of bureaucratic nonsense. It just doesn't sit well.
> DDP
>
> --- Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com> wrote:
> > On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange
> > wrote:
> > > Hey all,
> > >
> > > If you follow the community list, it sounds like
> > the
> > > board is coming down on libraries that distribute
> > or
> > > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is
> > one
> > > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
> > >
> > > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> > >
> > > The choices seem to be:
> > >
> > > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> > > license
> > > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> > >
> > > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first
> > option?
> > > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> >
> > Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just
> > ridiculous. We can't
> > make everyone on the face of planet switch licenses
> > over night. I _hate_
> > _hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time to
> > try to convert
> > everyone, and some won't, so what do we do? Negate a
> > whole universe of
> > software already written. It's just so stupid.
> >
> > > - Morgan
> > >
> > > =====
> > > Morgan Delagrange
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > > http://axion.tigris.org
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> > now.
> > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > --
> > jvz.
> >
> > Jason van Zyl
> > jason@zenplex.com
> > http://tambora.zenplex.org
> >
> > In short, man creates for himself a new religion of
> > a rational
> > and technical order to justify his work and to be
> > justified in it.
> >
> > -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
> >
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
--
jvz.
Jason van Zyl
jason@zenplex.com
http://tambora.zenplex.org
In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
-- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net>.
Maybe it can be part of the documentation ?
That way people can use the code / learn from the code.
I'll yank it out anyway and if you decide to add it as docs, just revive
them in a different place and in a different format ;) (I don't assume
code examples in docs can break any licenses though..)
Mvgr,
Martin
On Sat, 2003-02-08 at 16:51, David Dixon-Peugh wrote:
> The code that was in Graph, was designed
> to build a State Machine off of a State Chart
> as defined in UML.
>
> I was experimenting with it as a way of testing.
> (Tests would be run straight from UML. Very little
> Java/Python/Ruby code would be required.)
>
> I don't think the experiment went very far, but
> I left the UML in as an example of how to use the
> Graph package. It doesn't matter to me if it
> gets wiped off the face of the Earth. . .
>
> DDP
>
> --- Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net> wrote:
> > David,
> >
> > Can you have a look at http://www.eclipse.org/emf/.
> > It has an XMIReader
> > and is CPL, but I don't have a clue what the code
> > does in graph, Even
> > though it is an eclipse plugin, the design could be
> > that good that it is
> > usable..
> >
> > Mvgr,
> > Martin
> >
> > On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 20:11, David Dixon-Peugh
> > wrote:
> > > The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph
> > package.
> > >
> > > Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
> > > in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
> > > packages and distributing them separately.
> > >
> > > (Its doubtful that many people need to convert
> > > statecharts from UML into Graphs for
> > manipulation.)
> > >
> > > DDP
> > >
> > > --- Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com> wrote:
> > > > On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange
> > > > wrote:
> > > > > Hey all,
> > > > >
> > > > > If you follow the community list, it sounds
> > like
> > > > the
> > > > > board is coming down on libraries that
> > distribute
> > > > or
> > > > > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2
> > is
> > > > one
> > > > > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML
> > license:
> > > > >
> > > > > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> > > > >
> > > > > The choices seem to be:
> > > > >
> > > > > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a
> > new
> > > > > license
> > > > > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> > > > >
> > > > > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first
> > > > option?
> > > > > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> > > >
> > > > Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just
> > > > ridiculous. We can't
> > > > make everyone on the face of planet switch
> > licenses
> > > > over night. I _hate_
> > > > _hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time
> > to
> > > > try to convert
> > > > everyone, and some won't, so what do we do?
> > Negate a
> > > > whole universe of
> > > > software already written. It's just so stupid.
> > > >
> > > > > - Morgan
> > > > >
> > > > > =====
> > > > > Morgan Delagrange
> > > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > > > > http://axion.tigris.org
> > > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > __________________________________________________
> > > > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign
> > up
> > > > now.
> > > > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > > > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > > > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > > > --
> > > > jvz.
> > > >
> > > > Jason van Zyl
> > > > jason@zenplex.com
> > > > http://tambora.zenplex.org
> > > >
> > > > In short, man creates for himself a new religion
> > of
> > > > a rational
> > > > and technical order to justify his work and to
> > be
> > > > justified in it.
> > > >
> > > > -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > > > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > > > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> > now.
> > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by David Dixon-Peugh <di...@yahoo.com>.
The code that was in Graph, was designed
to build a State Machine off of a State Chart
as defined in UML.
I was experimenting with it as a way of testing.
(Tests would be run straight from UML. Very little
Java/Python/Ruby code would be required.)
I don't think the experiment went very far, but
I left the UML in as an example of how to use the
Graph package. It doesn't matter to me if it
gets wiped off the face of the Earth. . .
DDP
--- Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net> wrote:
> David,
>
> Can you have a look at http://www.eclipse.org/emf/.
> It has an XMIReader
> and is CPL, but I don't have a clue what the code
> does in graph, Even
> though it is an eclipse plugin, the design could be
> that good that it is
> usable..
>
> Mvgr,
> Martin
>
> On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 20:11, David Dixon-Peugh
> wrote:
> > The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph
> package.
> >
> > Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
> > in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
> > packages and distributing them separately.
> >
> > (Its doubtful that many people need to convert
> > statecharts from UML into Graphs for
> manipulation.)
> >
> > DDP
> >
> > --- Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com> wrote:
> > > On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange
> > > wrote:
> > > > Hey all,
> > > >
> > > > If you follow the community list, it sounds
> like
> > > the
> > > > board is coming down on libraries that
> distribute
> > > or
> > > > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2
> is
> > > one
> > > > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML
> license:
> > > >
> > > > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> > > >
> > > > The choices seem to be:
> > > >
> > > > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a
> new
> > > > license
> > > > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> > > >
> > > > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first
> > > option?
> > > > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> > >
> > > Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just
> > > ridiculous. We can't
> > > make everyone on the face of planet switch
> licenses
> > > over night. I _hate_
> > > _hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time
> to
> > > try to convert
> > > everyone, and some won't, so what do we do?
> Negate a
> > > whole universe of
> > > software already written. It's just so stupid.
> > >
> > > > - Morgan
> > > >
> > > > =====
> > > > Morgan Delagrange
> > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > > > http://axion.tigris.org
> > > > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> > > >
> > > >
> __________________________________________________
> > > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign
> up
> > > now.
> > > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > > --
> > > jvz.
> > >
> > > Jason van Zyl
> > > jason@zenplex.com
> > > http://tambora.zenplex.org
> > >
> > > In short, man creates for himself a new religion
> of
> > > a rational
> > > and technical order to justify his work and to
> be
> > > justified in it.
> > >
> > > -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> now.
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail:
> commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net>.
David,
Can you have a look at http://www.eclipse.org/emf/. It has an XMIReader
and is CPL, but I don't have a clue what the code does in graph, Even
though it is an eclipse plugin, the design could be that good that it is
usable..
Mvgr,
Martin
On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 20:11, David Dixon-Peugh wrote:
> The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph package.
>
> Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
> in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
> packages and distributing them separately.
>
> (Its doubtful that many people need to convert
> statecharts from UML into Graphs for manipulation.)
>
> DDP
>
> --- Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com> wrote:
> > On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange
> > wrote:
> > > Hey all,
> > >
> > > If you follow the community list, it sounds like
> > the
> > > board is coming down on libraries that distribute
> > or
> > > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is
> > one
> > > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
> > >
> > > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> > >
> > > The choices seem to be:
> > >
> > > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> > > license
> > > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> > >
> > > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first
> > option?
> > > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> >
> > Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just
> > ridiculous. We can't
> > make everyone on the face of planet switch licenses
> > over night. I _hate_
> > _hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time to
> > try to convert
> > everyone, and some won't, so what do we do? Negate a
> > whole universe of
> > software already written. It's just so stupid.
> >
> > > - Morgan
> > >
> > > =====
> > > Morgan Delagrange
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > > http://axion.tigris.org
> > > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Do you Yahoo!?
> > > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> > now.
> > > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> > >
> > >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> > --
> > jvz.
> >
> > Jason van Zyl
> > jason@zenplex.com
> > http://tambora.zenplex.org
> >
> > In short, man creates for himself a new religion of
> > a rational
> > and technical order to justify his work and to be
> > justified in it.
> >
> > -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
> >
> >
> >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by David Dixon-Peugh <di...@yahoo.com>.
The nsUML stuff isn't central to the Graph package.
Indeed it might be better off if it isn't included
in the Jars. I can see taking some of the domain
packages and distributing them separately.
(Its doubtful that many people need to convert
statecharts from UML into Graphs for manipulation.)
DDP
--- Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange
> wrote:
> > Hey all,
> >
> > If you follow the community list, it sounds like
> the
> > board is coming down on libraries that distribute
> or
> > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is
> one
> > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
> >
> > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> >
> > The choices seem to be:
> >
> > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> > license
> > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> >
> > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first
> option?
> > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
>
> Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just
> ridiculous. We can't
> make everyone on the face of planet switch licenses
> over night. I _hate_
> _hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time to
> try to convert
> everyone, and some won't, so what do we do? Negate a
> whole universe of
> software already written. It's just so stupid.
>
> > - Morgan
> >
> > =====
> > Morgan Delagrange
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > http://axion.tigris.org
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up
> now.
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> --
> jvz.
>
> Jason van Zyl
> jason@zenplex.com
> http://tambora.zenplex.org
>
> In short, man creates for himself a new religion of
> a rational
> and technical order to justify his work and to be
> justified in it.
>
> -- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail:
> commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Jason van Zyl <ja...@zenplex.com>.
On Wed, 2003-02-05 at 12:32, Morgan Delagrange wrote:
> Hey all,
>
> If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
> board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
> link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
> of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
>
> http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
>
> The choices seem to be:
>
> 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> license
> 2) Remove nsUML from graph
>
> Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
> If not, we're stuck with option number two.
Or I'll just move it to werken.com. This is just ridiculous. We can't
make everyone on the face of planet switch licenses over night. I _hate_
_hate_ _hate_ GPL licenses but no one has time to try to convert
everyone, and some won't, so what do we do? Negate a whole universe of
software already written. It's just so stupid.
> - Morgan
>
> =====
> Morgan Delagrange
> http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> http://axion.tigris.org
> http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
--
jvz.
Jason van Zyl
jason@zenplex.com
http://tambora.zenplex.org
In short, man creates for himself a new religion of a rational
and technical order to justify his work and to be justified in it.
-- Jacques Ellul, The Technological Society
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Steve Downey <st...@globeinvestment.com>.
OK. Thanks for the reference. A little further down that thread, I finally
got the explanation of why LGPL is no good for ASF code!
http://archives.apache.org/eyebrowse/ReadMsg?listId=135&msgNo=1429
Reading Ken's message in light of this, it's a lot clearer. I'd focused on
this
>if a licence permits *linking* against
>a library, there's no prohibition on our packages requiring
>the library in order to run properly.
But it's clear that the 'viral' nature of LGPL section 6 (i.e.)
... provided that the terms permit modification of the work for the
customer's own use and reverse engineering for debugging such modifications
would attach restrictions on people who use ASF code that the ASF license
does not. e.g. They do not have to allow reverse engineering. So NO LGPL
imports.
OTOH, if someone had an LGPL implementation of a 'standard' interface, e.g.
the java crypto api, or an xml parser, that should be OK, since there
wouldn't be any LGPL code in the ASF code.
Is MPL or MPL-derived code OK? This is actually on point, as there may be a
replacement for the nsuml library available from the NetBeans project, which
uses the Sun Public License, which is a search-and-replace version of the
Mozilla Public License.
NSUML is being abandoned, and I've seen traffic on the argouml list
regarding replacing it with the metadata repository (MDR) library from
NetBeans.
Moreover, I'm actually interested in this because I use statecharts to model
servlet activity, and have done a few handwritten code generators for them.
I hadn't noticed before this that graph had anything to do with it.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Stefan Bodewig" <bo...@apache.org>
To: <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2003 11:32 AM
Subject: Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2003, Steve Downey <st...@globeinvestment.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Would it be possible to take an approach analagous to Ant's optional
> > tasks?
>
> I'm pretty sure there is no optional task that depends on an LGPLed
> library.
>
> > That is, distribute the code that _uses_ the API, but not distribute
> > the library itself?
>
> See this mail
>
>
<http://archives.apache.org/eyebrowse/ReadMsg?listName=community@apache.org&
msgNo=1419>
>
> where Roy clearly states that one import statement is too much.
>
> > Based on what Ken posted, it looks like linking against a LGPL
> > library is OK, while distributing it is not.
>
> Please read Ken's mail again.
>
> Stefan
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 6 Feb 2003, Steve Downey <st...@globeinvestment.com>
wrote:
> Would it be possible to take an approach analagous to Ant's optional
> tasks?
I'm pretty sure there is no optional task that depends on an LGPLed
library.
> That is, distribute the code that _uses_ the API, but not distribute
> the library itself?
See this mail
<http://archives.apache.org/eyebrowse/ReadMsg?listName=community@apache.org&msgNo=1419>
where Roy clearly states that one import statement is too much.
> Based on what Ken posted, it looks like linking against a LGPL
> library is OK, while distributing it is not.
Please read Ken's mail again.
Stefan
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Steve Downey <st...@globeinvestment.com>.
Would it be possible to take an approach analagous to Ant's optional tasks?
That is, distribute the code that _uses_ the API, but not distribute the
library itself? Then, if anyone wants to use the nsUML library, they can go
and get it.
Based on what Ken posted, it looks like linking against a LGPL library is
OK, while distributing it is not.
-SMD
----- Original Message -----
From: <di...@multitask.com.au>
To: "Jakarta Commons Developers List" <co...@jakarta.apache.org>
Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2003 7:17 PM
Subject: Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
> There is a third option:
>
> 3) Remove graph2 from commons.
> --
> dIon Gillard, Multitask Consulting
> Blog: http://www.freeroller.net/page/dion/Weblog
> Work: http://www.multitask.com.au
>
>
> Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com> wrote on 06/02/2003 04:32:42 AM:
>
> > Hey all,
> >
> > If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
> > board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
> > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
> > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
> >
> > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> >
> > The choices seem to be:
> >
> > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> > license
> > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> >
> > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
> > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> >
> > - Morgan
> >
> > =====
> > Morgan Delagrange
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > http://axion.tigris.org
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
> > ForwardSourceID:NT000AD5EE
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Martin van den Bemt <ml...@mvdb.net>.
I don't see any other dependecies on commons-graph, so I'll have a look
in the morning, if maven is working ok without them (and deleting if
from cvs for now).
Since there are also no testcases for the nsuml stuff, I suspect it is
not used by maven. Just making sure though in the morning..
Mvgr,
Martin
On Thu, 2003-02-06 at 01:17, dion@multitask.com.au wrote:
> There is a third option:
>
> 3) Remove graph2 from commons.
> --
> dIon Gillard, Multitask Consulting
> Blog: http://www.freeroller.net/page/dion/Weblog
> Work: http://www.multitask.com.au
>
>
> Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com> wrote on 06/02/2003 04:32:42 AM:
>
> > Hey all,
> >
> > If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
> > board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
> > link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
> > of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
> >
> > http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
> >
> > The choices seem to be:
> >
> > 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> > license
> > 2) Remove nsUML from graph
> >
> > Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
> > If not, we're stuck with option number two.
> >
> > - Morgan
> >
> > =====
> > Morgan Delagrange
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> > http://axion.tigris.org
> > http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> > http://mailplus.yahoo.com
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
>
> > ForwardSourceID:NT000AD5EE
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by di...@multitask.com.au.
Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com> wrote on 06/02/2003 11:28:55 AM:
>
> --- dion@multitask.com.au wrote:
> > There is a third option:
> >
> > 3) Remove graph2 from commons.
>
> I wouldn't presume to do that on my own recognizance,
> but if all the graph2 developers decided to go that
> way, that would be fine. Seems like overkill for the
> sake of two classes, but I have no idea how important
> they are to Maven or other dependant projects not
> tracked by GUMP. Removing graph2 from Commons still
> may mean that it can't be used in other Jakarta
> software, depending on how the board decides to
> interpret the LGPL and viral licensing.
>
> Don't shoot the messenger, I don't care one whit about
> the holy wars. In fact, the only reason I know what
> license nsUML uses is because last week I researched
> the project so I could have an informed opinion on how
> to fix the GUMP build for graph, so we could make some
> progress on Maven nightlies.
Hey, I'm not shooting anybody, I'm just making sure we cover all options.
[snip]
> This is me being proactive.
And it works for me. I like proactive. We just need to keep our minds
clear about what our options are.
--
dIon Gillard, Multitask Consulting
Blog: http://www.freeroller.net/page/dion/Weblog
Work: http://www.multitask.com.au
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com>.
--- dion@multitask.com.au wrote:
> There is a third option:
>
> 3) Remove graph2 from commons.
I wouldn't presume to do that on my own recognizance,
but if all the graph2 developers decided to go that
way, that would be fine. Seems like overkill for the
sake of two classes, but I have no idea how important
they are to Maven or other dependant projects not
tracked by GUMP. Removing graph2 from Commons still
may mean that it can't be used in other Jakarta
software, depending on how the board decides to
interpret the LGPL and viral licensing.
Don't shoot the messenger, I don't care one whit about
the holy wars. In fact, the only reason I know what
license nsUML uses is because last week I researched
the project so I could have an informed opinion on how
to fix the GUMP build for graph, so we could make some
progress on Maven nightlies.
If after all the discussions are over, LGPL imports
turn out to be OK, then yay for us. But a few months
ago somebody on the board mistakenly implicated the
Commons repository as a source of copyright
infringment. At that time, we all discussed the issue
and agreed to be AS PROACTIVE AS POSSIBLE:
http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=jakarta-commons-dev&m=103533740906927&w=2
This is me being proactive.
- Morgan
=====
Morgan Delagrange
http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
http://axion.tigris.org
http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
__________________________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
http://mailplus.yahoo.com
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
Re: [Graph2] nsUML license problem
Posted by di...@multitask.com.au.
There is a third option:
3) Remove graph2 from commons.
--
dIon Gillard, Multitask Consulting
Blog: http://www.freeroller.net/page/dion/Weblog
Work: http://www.multitask.com.au
Morgan Delagrange <md...@yahoo.com> wrote on 06/02/2003 04:32:42 AM:
> Hey all,
>
> If you follow the community list, it sounds like the
> board is coming down on libraries that distribute or
> link to LGPL software. Unfortunately, graph2 is one
> of those libraries, by way of the nsUML license:
>
> http://nsuml.sourceforge.net
>
> The choices seem to be:
>
> 1) Convince nsUML to redistribute under a new
> license
> 2) Remove nsUML from graph
>
> Does anyone want to volunteer for the first option?
> If not, we're stuck with option number two.
>
> - Morgan
>
> =====
> Morgan Delagrange
> http://jakarta.apache.org/taglibs
> http://jakarta.apache.org/commons
> http://axion.tigris.org
> http://jakarta.apache.org/watchdog
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now.
> http://mailplus.yahoo.com
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
> ForwardSourceID:NT000AD5EE
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: commons-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: commons-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org