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Posted to dev@tapestry.apache.org by "Howard M. Lewis Ship" <hl...@attbi.com> on 2003/04/23 17:28:37 UTC
Javassist vs. BCEL
So I was recently turned on to a library calles Javassist:
http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
It allows you to do bytecode engineering without having to know bytecode.
It understands a subset of Java expressions (kind of like OGNL) and converts
the expressions into bytecode for you.
I'm going to look at replacing BCEL usage into Javassist.
I heard about this library from Bill Burke (JBoss) who gave a talk locally.
They're using this for all their Aspect stuff, which is essentially what
Tapestry is doing as well.
I believe MPL (Mozilla Public License) is compatible with ASL.
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
http://jakarta.apache.org/tapestry
Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by Tetsuya Kitahata <te...@nifty.com>.
Hi, Colin,
On Sat, 31 May 2003 16:40:13 -0400
(Subject: Re: Javassist vs. BCEL)
Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com> wrote:
> >Precisely saying,
> >"Chiba" is his family name and "Shigeru" is first name.
> >
> Interesting. He always signs his messages as 'Chiba', and people call
> him 'Chiba'. Given that in some Asian countries the name is commonly
> written last name followed by first name, I just assumed that all meant
> Chiba was his first name.
As for me, I put a signature "Tetsuya Kitahata" at the bottom of
e-mails, and my first name is "Tetsuya". This seems strange, I know,
because Korean and Chinese use family name first and write first name
followed by family name.
e.g. "Kim Yong Sumg" -- Kim = Family Nameb / Korean
This is because Japanese guys are mostly brainwashed by American
Cultures ;-)
Anyway, I am sure that "Chiba-san" is the best when calling him.
> Anyways, it's good software, and now that it's dual licensed there are
> hopefully no issues with anybody using it...
If I were an alumnus of titech (Tokyo Institute of Technology),
maybe I could directly negociate with him... But, I am not.
However, I think that Chiba-san (Mr. Chiba) might be thoughtful
person enough to take a consideration of these issues.
Hope things go well.
Sincerely,
P.S. I love these two, Javassist and BCEL, so I can't compare..
-----------------------------------------------------
Tetsuya Kitahata -- Terra-International, Inc.
E-mail: kitahata@bb.mbn.or.jp
http://www.terra-intl.com/
(Apache Jakarta Translation, Japanese)
http://jakarta.terra-intl.com/
Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com>.
Tetsuya Kitahata wrote:
>On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:09:22 -0400
>(Subject: Re: Javassist vs. BCEL)
>Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com> wrote:
>
>>'m just a user of Javassist...
>>
>>Javassist was created and maintained by Shigeru Chiba (Chiba is his
>>first name), from Japan. This is his old page:
>> http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
>>and this is the new page on the JBoss site:
>>
>>http://www.jboss.org/index.html?module=html&op=userdisplay&id=developers/projects/javassist
>>
>>
>Precisely saying,
>"Chiba" is his family name and "Shigeru" is first name.
>
Interesting. He always signs his messages as 'Chiba', and people call
him 'Chiba'. Given that in some Asian countries the name is commonly
written last name followed by first name, I just assumed that all meant
Chiba was his first name.
Anyways, it's good software, and now that it's dual licensed there are
hopefully no issues with anybody using it...
Colin
Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by Tetsuya Kitahata <te...@nifty.com>.
On Fri, 25 Apr 2003 12:09:22 -0400
(Subject: Re: Javassist vs. BCEL)
Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com> wrote:
> I'm just a user of Javassist...
>
> Javassist was created and maintained by Shigeru Chiba (Chiba is his
> first name), from Japan. This is his old page:
> http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
> and this is the new page on the JBoss site:
>
> http://www.jboss.org/index.html?module=html&op=userdisplay&id=developers/projects/javassist
Precisely saying,
"Chiba" is his family name and "Shigeru" is first name.
And here's a news that BCEL 5.1 has been released on 25th April.
http://jakarta.apache.org/bcel/news.html
-----------------------------------------------------
Tetsuya Kitahata -- Terra-International, Inc.
E-mail: kitahata@bb.mbn.or.jp
http://www.terra-intl.com/
Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com>.
I'm just a user of Javassist...
Javassist was created and maintained by Shigeru Chiba (Chiba is his
first name), from Japan. This is his old page:
http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
and this is the new page on the JBoss site:
http://www.jboss.org/index.html?module=html&op=userdisplay&id=developers/projects/javassist
I believe JBoss offered to host Javassist since they are big fans of it,
will probably be contributing some changes to it, and Chiba probably has
better things to do than run the site for it. The expectation is that he
still will be the main contributer to Javassist and will remain active.
I think his decision to switch to LGPL was basically on the premise of,
"JBoss is using LGPL, so Javassist may as well". When I saw the
announcement a few days ago I just sent some emails to the mailing list
questioning if the decision really made sense (aside from issues with
Apache code, there are some other issues with LGPL). The old mailing
list is going to be shut down some time soon (since they expect to use
the forums on the JBoss site), and doesn't seem to have archives. I will
forward you the emails on the subject that passed by in the last few
days. If you are interested in trying to push dual licensing or have
Javassist remain Mozilla licensed, then it is probably worth it to joing
the mailing list (while it exists) and express your views...
Regards, Colin
Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
>If you switch to LGPL then I can't use it, and I'd like to. It's not just a
>matter of having it CVS or distributing it with Tapestry, I can't have any
>Tapestry code import from any LGPL library.
>
>Who, exactly, is making this decision? Is there any way for me to get
>involved? Leave the license as is, or dual license, would be best.
>
>--
>Howard M. Lewis Ship
>Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
>http://jakarta.apache.org/tapestry
>
>
>
>
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Colin Sampaleanu [mailto:colinml1@exis.com]
>>Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 11:45 AM
>>To: Tapestry development
>>Subject: Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
>>
>>
>>Javassist is great, and simpler to use than BCEL, since it works at a
>>higher level.
>>
>>Note that as part of the move to being hosted as part of JBoss, Chiba
>>was planning to change the license from Mozilla to LGPL. We were
>>actually having some discussion on the Javassist mailing list
>>(soon to
>>be discontinued) about this, and I was pushing the point that
>>the switch
>>in license should be considered a bit more carefully, since there are
>>some issues. Don't know if anything is going to change on
>>that decision
>>though. Obviously for Tapestry or other Apache projects to use it and
>>ship with it it would have some big effects...
>>
>>Colin
>>
>>
>>Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>So I was recently turned on to a library calles Javassist:
>>>
>>>http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
>>>
>>>It allows you to do bytecode engineering without having to know
>>>bytecode. It understands a subset of Java expressions (kind of like
>>>OGNL) and converts the expressions into bytecode for you.
>>>
>>>I'm going to look at replacing BCEL usage into Javassist.
>>>
>>>I heard about this library from Bill Burke (JBoss) who gave a talk
>>>locally. They're using this for all their Aspect stuff, which is
>>>essentially what Tapestry is doing as well.
>>>
>>>I believe MPL (Mozilla Public License) is compatible with ASL.
>>>
>>>
RE: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by "Howard M. Lewis Ship" <hl...@attbi.com>.
If you switch to LGPL then I can't use it, and I'd like to. It's not just a
matter of having it CVS or distributing it with Tapestry, I can't have any
Tapestry code import from any LGPL library.
Who, exactly, is making this decision? Is there any way for me to get
involved? Leave the license as is, or dual license, would be best.
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
http://jakarta.apache.org/tapestry
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Colin Sampaleanu [mailto:colinml1@exis.com]
> Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 11:45 AM
> To: Tapestry development
> Subject: Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
>
>
> Javassist is great, and simpler to use than BCEL, since it works at a
> higher level.
>
> Note that as part of the move to being hosted as part of JBoss, Chiba
> was planning to change the license from Mozilla to LGPL. We were
> actually having some discussion on the Javassist mailing list
> (soon to
> be discontinued) about this, and I was pushing the point that
> the switch
> in license should be considered a bit more carefully, since there are
> some issues. Don't know if anything is going to change on
> that decision
> though. Obviously for Tapestry or other Apache projects to use it and
> ship with it it would have some big effects...
>
> Colin
>
>
> Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
>
> >So I was recently turned on to a library calles Javassist:
> >
> >http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
> >
> >It allows you to do bytecode engineering without having to know
> >bytecode. It understands a subset of Java expressions (kind of like
> >OGNL) and converts the expressions into bytecode for you.
> >
> >I'm going to look at replacing BCEL usage into Javassist.
> >
> >I heard about this library from Bill Burke (JBoss) who gave a talk
> >locally. They're using this for all their Aspect stuff, which is
> >essentially what Tapestry is doing as well.
> >
> >I believe MPL (Mozilla Public License) is compatible with ASL.
> >
> >
> >--
> >Howard M. Lewis Ship
> >Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
> >http://jakarta.apache.org/tapestry
> >
> >
> >
> >---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To unsubscribe, e-mail: tapestry-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> >For additional commands, e-mail: tapestry-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: tapestry-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: tapestry-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
Re: Javassist vs. BCEL
Posted by Colin Sampaleanu <co...@exis.com>.
Javassist is great, and simpler to use than BCEL, since it works at a
higher level.
Note that as part of the move to being hosted as part of JBoss, Chiba
was planning to change the license from Mozilla to LGPL. We were
actually having some discussion on the Javassist mailing list (soon to
be discontinued) about this, and I was pushing the point that the switch
in license should be considered a bit more carefully, since there are
some issues. Don't know if anything is going to change on that decision
though. Obviously for Tapestry or other Apache projects to use it and
ship with it it would have some big effects...
Colin
Howard M. Lewis Ship wrote:
>So I was recently turned on to a library calles Javassist:
>
>http://www.csg.is.titech.ac.jp/~chiba/javassist/
>
>It allows you to do bytecode engineering without having to know bytecode.
>It understands a subset of Java expressions (kind of like OGNL) and converts
>the expressions into bytecode for you.
>
>I'm going to look at replacing BCEL usage into Javassist.
>
>I heard about this library from Bill Burke (JBoss) who gave a talk locally.
>They're using this for all their Aspect stuff, which is essentially what
>Tapestry is doing as well.
>
>I believe MPL (Mozilla Public License) is compatible with ASL.
>
>
>--
>Howard M. Lewis Ship
>Creator, Tapestry: Java Web Components
>http://jakarta.apache.org/tapestry
>
>
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------------
>To unsubscribe, e-mail: tapestry-dev-unsubscribe@jakarta.apache.org
>For additional commands, e-mail: tapestry-dev-help@jakarta.apache.org
>
>
>