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Posted to dev@httpd.apache.org by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com> on 2002/05/09 06:01:44 UTC
Apache History Project - Call for comments
Call for comments
Apache History Project
We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
Last year Rich Bowen tried to start the effort by writing a draft for
the Apache history, but response was sparse and discussions died out.
The draft is available from
<URL:http://www.drbacchus.com/apache_history.html>
The effort we are hoping to start would be a large extension of this
effort.
Things we'd like to see go down into writing for future Apache users
to know are, among others:
Netcraft statistics: when did Apache become the most used webserver
on the Internet? How is the curve going? What were some of the other
players (CERN, NCSA) and what became of them?
Members of the ASF: When did they join? What did they do? Profiles
of all members of the ASF with a small biography. Pictures from
ASF gatherings.
Have you got any information that could be helpful to the project?
Are you in contact with any of the folks that were involved in the early
days, including, but not limited to, the original 8 members, who are
not involved any more? Other folks like Tim Berners-Lee, Rob McCool, and
various people who were important to the existence and success of Apache.
Have you got any source distributions currently not available?
We have:
0.6.5 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
0.8.8
0.8.14 [ broken ] from web.archive.org
1.0.0 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.0.2 [ broken ] from web.archive.org
1.0.3 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.0.4 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.0.5 [ broken ] from web.archive.org
1.1.0 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.1b1 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.1b2 [ broken ] from web.archive.org
1.1b3 from web.archive.org
1.1b4 [ .gz broken ] from web.archive.org
1.1.1
1.1.3 ftp.visi.com
1.2.0 mirrors.xmission.com
1.2b10 ftp.visi.com
1.2.1 ftp.wg.saar.de
1.2.4 ftp.fysik.dtu.dk
1.2.5 ftp.visi.com
1.2.6 mirrors.xmission.com
1.3b3 ftp.visi.com
1.3b5 ftp.visi.com
We also have serveral releases of NCSA. Including 0.5.
Most importantly missing from the list is 0.6.2, which was the initial
release of Apache.
We'd like releases in between these, and especially releases before
0.6.5. Duplicates are fine too, since some of the gziped archives are
dead. We'd also like to have the NSCA sources, as far back as they are
available, against which the early patch distributions were applied.
We realize that there are many Apache projects, which have equally
interesting historical records that need to be preserved, but we need to
start somewhere, and perhaps this will give inspiration to some other
folks to work on the other Apache projects.
Initiative restarted by Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner May 8th 2002.
Re[2]: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by RapidFX <gr...@beldamar.com>.
Hello...
I vote yes.
Saturday, May 11, 2002, 5:43:35 AM, you wrote:
RB> On Thu, 9 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
RB> Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
RB> initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
RB> thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
RB> Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner
- --
Greg S. Wirth
Anchorage, Alaska
http://rapidfx.org
http://dejapc.com
IpFilter // FreeBSD // Apache
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Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Thomas Eibner <th...@stderr.net>.
On Sun, May 12, 2002 at 10:47:52PM -0400, Rich Bowen wrote:
> On Sun, 12 May 2002, Aaron Bannert wrote:
>
> > > Well, this is very promising. The first thing we'd really like is a
> > > mailing list. What's the SOP for getting one created? Or is there
> > > something else that needs to happen before that can be done?
> > >
> > > I figure we should get moving while we're motivated, before real life
> > > intrudes.
> >
> > Should we make this part of the Docs project, and then if it starts
> > generating enough traffic it can be moved to its own list?
>
> There are two reasons I did not want this to happen.
>
> First, we want this to be larger than just the httpd project, and want
> other projects to be included even from the start. Of course, the fact
> that this entire discussion has happened on @httpd.apache.org lists does
> not help that argument any.
And it's not closely related to the current development of Apache (Oh
yes it is! But we're putting this into the history-"book").
> Secondly, since I'm a history nut, as I have already illustrated, it
> seeme beneficial to have this discussion happen in an environment
> un-commingled with other stuff, so that it is easy to see which is
> which.
And so we generate too much off topic-ness.
> This seemed to also be Thomas' opinion when we discussed it on IRC a
> little while ago. Perhaps he can chime in - I think he's on this list.
Yes, you pretty much laid my opinion out on the table in your mail :)
> I'm not sure how much traffic this will ever generate, as it is largely
> an effort of archaelogy, not a creative process, per se. (Sounds here
> like I'm waffling a little. Dunno.) We need some forum in which to
> discuss what needs to get done, and have it archived. Apart from that, I
> suppose I'm not terribly concerned.
Traffic is likely to happen in bursts and might get lost in all the other
discussion that goes on here on dev@.
Right now we're still brainstorming on which kind of information we'd like
to see in the history project and it would benefit having a seperate
mailinglist for that.
--
Thomas Eibner <http://thomas.eibner.dk/> DnsZone <http://dnszone.org/>
mod_pointer <http://stderr.net/mod_pointer> <http://photos.eibner.dk/>
!(C)<http://copywrong.dk/> <http://apachegallery.dk/>
Putting the HEST in .COM <http://www.hestdesign.com/>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Justin Erenkrantz <je...@apache.org>.
On Sun, May 12, 2002 at 04:46:58PM -0700, Aaron Bannert wrote:
> Should we make this part of the Docs project, and then if it starts
> generating enough traffic it can be moved to its own list?
+1. -- justin
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com>.
On Sun, 12 May 2002, Aaron Bannert wrote:
> > Well, this is very promising. The first thing we'd really like is a
> > mailing list. What's the SOP for getting one created? Or is there
> > something else that needs to happen before that can be done?
> >
> > I figure we should get moving while we're motivated, before real life
> > intrudes.
>
> Should we make this part of the Docs project, and then if it starts
> generating enough traffic it can be moved to its own list?
There are two reasons I did not want this to happen.
First, we want this to be larger than just the httpd project, and want
other projects to be included even from the start. Of course, the fact
that this entire discussion has happened on @httpd.apache.org lists does
not help that argument any.
Secondly, since I'm a history nut, as I have already illustrated, it
seeme beneficial to have this discussion happen in an environment
un-commingled with other stuff, so that it is easy to see which is
which.
This seemed to also be Thomas' opinion when we discussed it on IRC a
little while ago. Perhaps he can chime in - I think he's on this list.
I'm not sure how much traffic this will ever generate, as it is largely
an effort of archaelogy, not a creative process, per se. (Sounds here
like I'm waffling a little. Dunno.) We need some forum in which to
discuss what needs to get done, and have it archived. Apart from that, I
suppose I'm not terribly concerned.
There, did I change my mind enough times in that note?
--
Rich Bowen - rbowen@rcbowen.com
... and another brother out of his mind, and another brother out at New
York (not the same, though it might appear so)
Somebody's Luggage (Charles Dickens)
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Aaron Bannert <aa...@clove.org>.
> Well, this is very promising. The first thing we'd really like is a
> mailing list. What's the SOP for getting one created? Or is there
> something else that needs to happen before that can be done?
>
> I figure we should get moving while we're motivated, before real life
> intrudes.
Should we make this part of the Docs project, and then if it starts
generating enough traffic it can be moved to its own list?
-aaron
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com>.
Re: Apache History project, several folks wrote:
> +1
Well, this is very promising. The first thing we'd really like is a
mailing list. What's the SOP for getting one created? Or is there
something else that needs to happen before that can be done?
I figure we should get moving while we're motivated, before real life
intrudes.
--
Rich Bowen - rbowen@rcbowen.com
As we trace our own few circles around the sun
We get it backwards and our seven years go by like one
Dog Years (Rush - Test for Echo - 1999)
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Bill Stoddard <bi...@wstoddard.com>.
+1
> On Thu, 9 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
>
> > Call for comments
> >
> > Apache History Project
> >
> > We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
> > history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
> > comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
> > Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
> > and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
> > etc ...
>
> Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
> initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
> thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
> and were hoping that we could get some technical support. Specifically,
> we want:
>
> A hostname (history.apache.org)
> Mailing list @apache.org (history@ ?)
> A cvs repository for the stuff (or should this go in the documentation
> repository?)
> Space on a web server somewhere - I'm mighty close to my bandwidth
> allocation most months.
>
> I can do any of these on one of my own domain names, if needed (except
> for the last, noted above, I'd really want to host elsewhere) but was
> really hoping to get apache.org names on them.
>
> I suspect that I could convince a local ISP to coloc a donated machine
> (hint, hint) if such a thing were available.
>
> Anyways, and thoughts at all?
>
> Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner
>
> --
> And everyone said, "If we only live,
> We too will go to sea in a Sieve -
> To the hills of the Chankly Bore!"
> (The Jumblies, by Edward Lear)
>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Thomas Eibner <th...@stderr.net>.
On Wed, May 15, 2002 at 09:33:00AM -0400, Jim Jagielski wrote:
> Also useful, I think, would be a description of how the actual
> coding environment changed, from people submitting patches and one
> person being responsible for folding them into the code, the
> "3 +1s" required for a patch to be included, review-then-commit
> vs. commit-then-review, etc...
Very useful, adding that to our notes. Thanks.
--
Thomas Eibner <http://thomas.eibner.dk/> DnsZone <http://dnszone.org/>
mod_pointer <http://stderr.net/mod_pointer> <http://photos.eibner.dk/>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Jim Jagielski <ji...@jaguNET.com>.
At 5:15 AM +0200 5/15/02, Thomas Eibner wrote:
>
>Apache httpd Release timeline
> * Release Date
> * Changelog / Release notes
> * Tarball
> * Usage statistics
> * Other Important Release informaton
> Version
> Release Manager
> Security Fixes
> New Directives
> Changed Directives
> State (Alpha/Beta/GA)
> Etc.
>
Also useful, I think, would be a description of how the actual
coding environment changed, from people submitting patches and one
person being responsible for folding them into the code, the
"3 +1s" required for a patch to be included, review-then-commit
vs. commit-then-review, etc...
--
===========================================================================
Jim Jagielski [|] jim@jaguNET.com [|] http://www.jaguNET.com/
"A society that will trade a little liberty for a little order
will lose both and deserve neither" - T.Jefferson
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Ben Hyde <bh...@pobox.com>.
Thomas Eibner wrote:
> I agree, what I was more interested in was actually the sheer volume of
> the mailinglist archive.
I've graphed volume (particularly in CVS's logging) over time, that's an
interesting way to keep an ear to the railroad tracks.
> These statistics weren't created for someone to
> be offened and they aren't going generated on a regular basis anyway.
> This was not an attempt to degrade anyone's effort on the Apache httpd
> list.
I apologize if I left the impression that anybody's motives weren't of
the highest caliber. You wouldn't believe the damage I've mindlessly
done to projects with awk.
Rich Bowen wrote:
> .. interesting statistic, ... get peoples' attention ...
That it's fun and grabs attention is just part of the lession I learned
the hard way.
> ... roadmap ...
My current favorite reductionist model of open source is that you have a
pool of common knowledge manifested in the repository/web-site/mailing
list archives. The cell wall of this pool is managed by those who have
commit rights. That 'innovations' are pushed into the pool, and
releases are pulled out.
For example CTR is a rule about the details of the cell's digestive
tract as is the you can't veto a release rule.
Another, I think unspoken rule, is that if somebody does the work - we
strive to empower them. That's the way I feel about the history project
- cool go for it. That was the way I felt about the budding off of
APR; very risky but I bit my tougue. That seems to have worked out
quite nicely.
The second part of my tiny model is that there is a cycle: releases are
refined and distributed to users who use them. Some of those users
innovate, some of those innovations get sent 'home again' some of those
get noticed, some get pushed into the pool. One of the oh so many
reasons to keep it open is it increases the chance of somebody out
there getting a cool innovation back into the pool.
Getting the cycle to function better, understanding how the various
stages work, where the barriers are, etc. etc. is all facinating. For
example, cvs diff was a huge breakthru in making the flow of incomming
stuff work better - it really focuses the discussion and helps the
contributor to know what to do. We haven't made much progress on that
front since!
In the early days this cycle was a lot tigher, simpler. These days, as
it's scaled, we have lots of larger institutions all around the cycle.
That has benefits and agency problems. Looking at the history of this
evolution should be fun and facinating.
Sorry... this entire discussion is off topic. This mailing list
is were the cell wall _is_ this discussion is 10K feet over that.
Have fun.
- ben
There is honor in the mail not written.
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Thomas Eibner <th...@stderr.net>.
On Wed, May 15, 2002 at 08:56:38AM -0400, Ben Hyde wrote:
> This comes up from time to time. Somebody measures something; bugs
> submitted, bugs fixes, lines written, commits made, documents written,
> mails send, bylaws written, meetings attended, email threads started,
> email threads ended, uses of the word 'bucket'...
>
> When it has come up before I have written variations of the following.
> Try not to take this as an attack on the volunteer or the messenger
> but ...
>
> I have very strong objections to nieve attempts to reduce the
> contributions made by various individuals into 'objective' scores and
> 'leader boards'.
>
> Projects thrive when diverse and complementary skills are brought
> together in a way to avoids rivalry.
>
> Skills are complementary when their measures are orthogonal. Often they
> are so orthogonal that one contributor couldn't for the love nor money fill
> the role another person is playing. I certainly could never fill
> Doug's shoes; he's a doer.
>
> In such an environment measures that are easily collected are certain to
> be seriously misleading and can trivially leave feelings hurt and create
> contests that lead to deadly disputes.
I agree, what I was more interested in was actually the sheer volume of
the mailinglist archive. These statistics weren't created for someone to
be offened and they aren't going generated on a regular basis anyway.
This was not an attempt to degrade anyone's effort on the Apache httpd
list.
> It is extremely hard to get people to remain detached about these things.
Very true.
--
Thomas Eibner <http://thomas.eibner.dk/> DnsZone <http://dnszone.org/>
mod_pointer <http://stderr.net/mod_pointer> <http://photos.eibner.dk/>
!(C)<http://copywrong.dk/> <http://apachegallery.dk/>
Putting the HEST in .COM <http://www.hestdesign.com/>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com>.
On Wed, 15 May 2002, Ben Hyde wrote:
> Thomas Eibner wrote:
> > One volunteer has already come forward to help us gather data and we've
> > compiled some statistics from this mailinglist showing how many posts
> > each person has made since '95:
> >
> > Total Posts on dev@httpd.apache.org: 87510
> >
> > 1: ...
>
> I have very strong objections to nieve attempts to reduce the
> contributions made by various individuals into 'objective' scores and
> 'leader boards'.
That was certainly not the point at all. No such reduction is possible,
or even remotely desired. It was an interesting statistic, and nothing
more. If people object to it, we can drop it, as it is *not* one of the
important parts of the project at all. More than anything, it was posted
here in order to get peoples' attention, as it did, and very little
else.
Please read the first part of the message - the proposed project roadmap
- as that is the part that actually matters. Mailing list statistics are
not mentioned in there at all, you will notice. We're most interested in
a release history, what things went into each release, and important
philosophical discussions that happened along the way.
--
Who can say where the road goes
Where the day flows
Only time
--Pilgrim (Enya - A Day Without Rain)
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Ben Hyde <bh...@pobox.com>.
Thomas Eibner wrote:
> One volunteer has already come forward to help us gather data and we've
> compiled some statistics from this mailinglist showing how many posts
> each person has made since '95:
>
> Total Posts on dev@httpd.apache.org: 87510
>
> 1: ...
This comes up from time to time. Somebody measures something; bugs
submitted, bugs fixes, lines written, commits made, documents written,
mails send, bylaws written, meetings attended, email threads started,
email threads ended, uses of the word 'bucket'...
When it has come up before I have written variations of the following.
Try not to take this as an attack on the volunteer or the messenger
but ...
I have very strong objections to nieve attempts to reduce the
contributions made by various individuals into 'objective' scores and
'leader boards'.
Projects thrive when diverse and complementary skills are brought
together in a way to avoids rivalry.
Skills are complementary when their measures are orthogonal. Often they
are so orthogonal that one contributor couldn't for the love nor money fill
the role another person is playing. I certainly could never fill
Doug's shoes; he's a doer.
In such an environment measures that are easily collected are certain to
be seriously misleading and can trivially leave feelings hurt and create
contests that lead to deadly disputes.
It is extremely hard to get people to remain detached about these things.
- ben
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Thomas Eibner <th...@stderr.net>.
On Tue, May 14, 2002 at 08:30:49PM -0700, Doug MacEachern wrote:
> On Tue, 14 May 2002, Doug MacEachern wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 15 May 2002, Thomas Eibner wrote:
> >
> > > Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
> > > http://stderr.net/history/topposters
> >
> > cool, now i am tied with ben hyde.
>
> haha, now i am 1 ahead of ben hyde, i'm #32 woohoo!
You're already way ahead, the archive we generated it from only goes
up to May 1st ;)
--
Thomas Eibner <http://thomas.eibner.dk/> DnsZone <http://dnszone.org/>
mod_pointer <http://stderr.net/mod_pointer> <http://photos.eibner.dk/>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Ben Hyde <bh...@pobox.com>.
Doug MacEachern wrote:
> On Tue, 14 May 2002, Doug MacEachern wrote:
>
> > On Wed, 15 May 2002, Thomas Eibner wrote:
> >
> > > Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
> > > http://stderr.net/history/topposters
> >
> > cool, now i am tied with ben hyde.
>
> haha, now i am 1 ahead of ben hyde, i'm #32 woohoo!
:-)
RE: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Ryan Bloom <rb...@covalent.net>.
I still have to post 600 more times to catch up to Dean. I'll make it
some day. Of course, his posts are usually more informative than mine.
:-)
Ryan
----------------------------------------------
Ryan Bloom rbb@covalent.net
645 Howard St. rbb@apache.org
San Francisco, CA
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doug MacEachern [mailto:dougm@covalent.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2002 8:29 PM
> To: dev@httpd.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
>
> On Wed, 15 May 2002, Thomas Eibner wrote:
>
> > Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
> > http://stderr.net/history/topposters
>
> cool, now i am tied with ben hyde.
>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Doug MacEachern <do...@covalent.net>.
On Tue, 14 May 2002, Doug MacEachern wrote:
> On Wed, 15 May 2002, Thomas Eibner wrote:
>
> > Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
> > http://stderr.net/history/topposters
>
> cool, now i am tied with ben hyde.
haha, now i am 1 ahead of ben hyde, i'm #32 woohoo!
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Doug MacEachern <do...@covalent.net>.
On Wed, 15 May 2002, Thomas Eibner wrote:
> Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
> http://stderr.net/history/topposters
cool, now i am tied with ben hyde.
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Thomas Eibner <th...@stderr.net>.
On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 07:24:22PM +0100, Tony Finch wrote:
> On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 09:23:58AM -0700, Aaron Bannert wrote:
> > On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 12:16:48PM -0400, Jim Jagielski wrote:
> > >
> > > +1. I think it's a great idea... I'd like to propose it as an
> > > ASF (sub)project.
> >
> > +1 from me too.
>
> +1
So how do we get anything rolling? Rich and I have cooked up what we see
as an initial roadmap for the project:
General History of Apache
* Before Apache
* Why Apache
* Initial Development Team
* How Apache became one of the most successful OSS projects to date
Apache httpd Release timeline
* Release Date
* Changelog / Release notes
* Tarball
* Usage statistics
* Other Important Release informaton
Version
Release Manager
Security Fixes
New Directives
Changed Directives
State (Alpha/Beta/GA)
Etc.
Apache Software Foundation History
* Project Profiles
* Member Profiles
Join Date
First List Post
Description of work done for project
Subprojects History
* Convince at least one person from each project to participate and
maintain history of that project.
* Short historical description
* Usage statistics
* Same project parts as the httpd history projects
Quote collection from development lists
* Historical comments
* Funny comments
We've already started on the httpd release timeline and we have
information exchanges over IRC that would fit better in a cvs repository,
so we'd really like to get something moving very soon now.
We've put our uptodate writings on http://stderr.net/history/ for now
and anyone is free to look and give suggestions.
One volunteer has already come forward to help us gather data and we've
compiled some statistics from this mailinglist showing how many posts
each person has made since '95:
Total Posts on dev@httpd.apache.org: 87510
1: Dean Gaudet 5184 5.924%
2: Ryan B. Bloom 4521 5.166%
3: Jim Jagielski 4404 5.033%
4: Rob Hartill 4200 4.799%
5: Marc Slemko 3807 4.350%
6: Ben Laurie 3769 4.307%
7: Ken Coar 3457 3.950%
8: Brian Behlendorf 3263 3.729%
9: Randy Terbush 2996 3.424%
10: William Rowe 2859 3.267%
11: Greg Stein 2315 2.645%
12: Roy T Fielding 2099 2.399%
13: Jeff Trawick 1894 2.164%
14: Ralf S Engelschall 1748 1.997%
15: Bill Stoddard 1703 1.946%
16: Robert S Thau 1699 1.941%
17: Alexei Kosut 1684 1.924%
18: Chuck Murcko 1503 1.718%
19: Rasmus Lerdorf 1260 1.440%
20: Martin Kraemer 1202 1.374%
21: Sameer Parekh 1196 1.367%
22: Dirk-Willem van Gulik 1064 1.216%
23: Cliff Woolley 1011 1.155%
24: Manoj Kasichainula 964 1.102%
25: Justin Erenkrantz 953 1.089%
Full list of posters with more than 10 posts can be found at:
http://stderr.net/history/topposters
--
Thomas Eibner <http://thomas.eibner.dk/> DnsZone <http://dnszone.org/>
mod_pointer <http://stderr.net/mod_pointer> <http://photos.eibner.dk/>
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Tony Finch <do...@dotat.at>.
On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 09:23:58AM -0700, Aaron Bannert wrote:
> On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 12:16:48PM -0400, Jim Jagielski wrote:
> >
> > +1. I think it's a great idea... I'd like to propose it as an
> > ASF (sub)project.
>
> +1 from me too.
+1
Tony.
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Aaron Bannert <aa...@clove.org>.
On Sat, May 11, 2002 at 12:16:48PM -0400, Jim Jagielski wrote:
> Rich Bowen wrote:
> >
> >
> > Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
> > initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
> > thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
> >
>
> +1. I think it's a great idea... I'd like to propose it as an
> ASF (sub)project.
+1 from me too. I can also volunteer any site or machine administration
if necessary.
-aaron
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rasmus Lerdorf <ra...@lerdorf.ca>.
Just to let you know, both messages came through. Personally I couldn't
be less interested in this, but each to his own.
-Rasmus
On Sat, 11 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
> On Thu, 9 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
>
> > Call for comments
> >
> > Apache History Project
> >
> > We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
> > history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
> > comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
> > Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
> > and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
> > etc ...
>
> Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
> initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
> thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
> and were hoping that we could get some technical support. Specifically,
> we want:
>
> A hostname (history.apache.org)
> Mailing list @apache.org (history@ ?)
> A cvs repository for the stuff (or should this go in the documentation
> repository?)
> Space on a web server somewhere - I'm mighty close to my bandwidth
> allocation most months.
>
> I can do any of these on one of my own domain names, if needed (except
> for the last, noted above, I'd really want to host elsewhere) but was
> really hoping to get apache.org names on them.
>
> I suspect that I could convince a local ISP to coloc a donated machine
> (hint, hint) if such a thing were available.
>
> Anyways, and thoughts at all?
>
> Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner
>
> --
> And everyone said, "If we only live,
> We too will go to sea in a Sieve -
> To the hills of the Chankly Bore!"
> (The Jumblies, by Edward Lear)
>
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Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Lars Eilebrecht <la...@hyperreal.org>.
>> > Call for comments
>> >
>> > Apache History Project
>> >
>> > We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
>> > history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
>> > comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
>> > Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
>> > and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
>> > etc ...
+1
ciao...
--
Lars Eilebrecht - I want to reach your mind...
lars@hyperreal.org - where is it currently located?
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Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Cliff Woolley <jw...@virginia.edu>.
On Sat, 11 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
> > Call for comments
> >
> > Apache History Project
> >
> > We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
> > history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
> > comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
> > Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
> > and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
> > etc ...
+1 (did I already vote? ugh, I have an awful memory)
--Cliff
--------------------------------------------------------------
Cliff Woolley
cliffwoolley@yahoo.com
Charlottesville, VA
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Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com>.
On Thu, 9 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
> Call for comments
>
> Apache History Project
>
> We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
> history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
> comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
> Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
> and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
> etc ...
Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
and were hoping that we could get some technical support. Specifically,
we want:
A hostname (history.apache.org)
Mailing list @apache.org (history@ ?)
A cvs repository for the stuff (or should this go in the documentation
repository?)
Space on a web server somewhere - I'm mighty close to my bandwidth
allocation most months.
I can do any of these on one of my own domain names, if needed (except
for the last, noted above, I'd really want to host elsewhere) but was
really hoping to get apache.org names on them.
I suspect that I could convince a local ISP to coloc a donated machine
(hint, hint) if such a thing were available.
Anyways, and thoughts at all?
Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner
--
And everyone said, "If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve -
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!"
(The Jumblies, by Edward Lear)
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For additional commands, e-mail: docs-help@httpd.apache.org
Re: Apache History Project - Call for comments
Posted by Rich Bowen <rb...@rcbowen.com>.
On Thu, 9 May 2002, Rich Bowen wrote:
> Call for comments
>
> Apache History Project
>
> We are a few people that are of the opinion that saving a piece of
> history is very important. That is why we have drafted this call for
> comments. We want to save as much of Apache's history as possible.
> Including, but not limited to, old sources, change descriptions,
> and feature additions (when was a feature added to Apache).
> etc ...
Well, the almost-complete lack of any response has made us wonder if our
initial note got lost somewhere. Anyways, a brief follow-up. If nobody
thinks that this is a terrible idea, we'd like to go forward with it,
and were hoping that we could get some technical support. Specifically,
we want:
A hostname (history.apache.org)
Mailing list @apache.org (history@ ?)
A cvs repository for the stuff (or should this go in the documentation
repository?)
Space on a web server somewhere - I'm mighty close to my bandwidth
allocation most months.
I can do any of these on one of my own domain names, if needed (except
for the last, noted above, I'd really want to host elsewhere) but was
really hoping to get apache.org names on them.
I suspect that I could convince a local ISP to coloc a donated machine
(hint, hint) if such a thing were available.
Anyways, and thoughts at all?
Rich Bowen and Thomas Eibner
--
And everyone said, "If we only live,
We too will go to sea in a Sieve -
To the hills of the Chankly Bore!"
(The Jumblies, by Edward Lear)