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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org> on 2015/02/09 21:57:16 UTC
[DISCUSS] Is the Incubator a product? If so, why are there so few bugs?
Guess how many bugs have been logged against the Incubator in the last
2 years? Only four[1].
The recent discussions about effective mentoring got me thinking. I
know that my mentors are busy people, so I don't bother them with a
question unless I've first tried to find the answer. In fact, most of
the time I don't want to be "mentored" as such: I just want the
Incubator to provide a clear process that I can find using five
minutes and a couple of google searches.
It seems clear (at least to me) that the Incubator provides a product.
That product is an explanation of the Apache process, as clear as
possible, and as accessible as possible. When the process is not
clear, that is a bug in the product. So, when a discussion on this
list did not yield a clear answer, I logged a bug[2]. That's when I
discovered that virtually no one else is logging bugs against the
Incubator, and I found that really surprising.
Let me expand on the product metaphor. The Incubator provides guidance
on the Apache process, and the projects follow it, learn, and due
course graduate. The "product" here is the explanation of the Apache
process. The "customers" here are the incubation projects. The product
is imperfect and always changing, but everyone wants to improve it,
and the way to do that is by logging issues.
The contract is that the customers (the projects) commit to logging
the issues they encounter (and if possible make contributions to fix
those issues), and the the producer (the Incubator) commits to resolve
those issues in a timely fashion.
So then, why is the Incubator not imploring the projects to log more issues?
Julian
[1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/issues/?jql=project%20%3D%20INCUBATOR
[2] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-129
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Re: [DISCUSS] Is the Incubator a product? If so, why are there so few bugs?
Posted by jan i <ja...@apache.org>.
On 9 February 2015 at 21:59, John D. Ament <jo...@apache.org> wrote:
> I noticed that as well. I'm assuming it's in part because no one has
> access to the incubator JIRA.
>
How come ? of course you need a jira account, but incubator jira does not
seem to have specially closed permissions.
https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR/?selectedTab=com.atlassian.jira.jira-projects-plugin:summary-panel
>
> John
>
> On Mon Feb 09 2015 at 3:57:23 PM Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > Guess how many bugs have been logged against the Incubator in the last
> > 2 years? Only four[1].
> >
> > The recent discussions about effective mentoring got me thinking. I
> > know that my mentors are busy people, so I don't bother them with a
> > question unless I've first tried to find the answer. In fact, most of
> > the time I don't want to be "mentored" as such: I just want the
> > Incubator to provide a clear process that I can find using five
> > minutes and a couple of google searches.
> >
> > It seems clear (at least to me) that the Incubator provides a product.
> > That product is an explanation of the Apache process, as clear as
> > possible, and as accessible as possible. When the process is not
> > clear, that is a bug in the product. So, when a discussion on this
> > list did not yield a clear answer, I logged a bug[2]. That's when I
> > discovered that virtually no one else is logging bugs against the
> > Incubator, and I found that really surprising.
> >
> > Let me expand on the product metaphor. The Incubator provides guidance
> > on the Apache process, and the projects follow it, learn, and due
> > course graduate. The "product" here is the explanation of the Apache
> > process. The "customers" here are the incubation projects. The product
> > is imperfect and always changing, but everyone wants to improve it,
> > and the way to do that is by logging issues.
> >
> > The contract is that the customers (the projects) commit to logging
> > the issues they encounter (and if possible make contributions to fix
> > those issues), and the the producer (the Incubator) commits to resolve
> > those issues in a timely fashion.
> >
> > So then, why is the Incubator not imploring the projects to log more
> > issues?
>
A very straight and very fine argumentation, I like it a lot (and agree
with it).
rgds
jan i.
>
> > Julian
> >
> > [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/issues/?jql=project%20%3D%20INCUBATOR
> >
> > [2] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-129
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
> >
> >
>
Re: [DISCUSS] Is the Incubator a product? If so, why are there so few bugs?
Posted by "John D. Ament" <jo...@apache.org>.
I noticed that as well. I'm assuming it's in part because no one has
access to the incubator JIRA.
John
On Mon Feb 09 2015 at 3:57:23 PM Julian Hyde <jh...@apache.org> wrote:
> Guess how many bugs have been logged against the Incubator in the last
> 2 years? Only four[1].
>
> The recent discussions about effective mentoring got me thinking. I
> know that my mentors are busy people, so I don't bother them with a
> question unless I've first tried to find the answer. In fact, most of
> the time I don't want to be "mentored" as such: I just want the
> Incubator to provide a clear process that I can find using five
> minutes and a couple of google searches.
>
> It seems clear (at least to me) that the Incubator provides a product.
> That product is an explanation of the Apache process, as clear as
> possible, and as accessible as possible. When the process is not
> clear, that is a bug in the product. So, when a discussion on this
> list did not yield a clear answer, I logged a bug[2]. That's when I
> discovered that virtually no one else is logging bugs against the
> Incubator, and I found that really surprising.
>
> Let me expand on the product metaphor. The Incubator provides guidance
> on the Apache process, and the projects follow it, learn, and due
> course graduate. The "product" here is the explanation of the Apache
> process. The "customers" here are the incubation projects. The product
> is imperfect and always changing, but everyone wants to improve it,
> and the way to do that is by logging issues.
>
> The contract is that the customers (the projects) commit to logging
> the issues they encounter (and if possible make contributions to fix
> those issues), and the the producer (the Incubator) commits to resolve
> those issues in a timely fashion.
>
> So then, why is the Incubator not imploring the projects to log more
> issues?
>
> Julian
>
> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/issues/?jql=project%20%3D%20INCUBATOR
>
> [2] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/INCUBATOR-129
>
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