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Posted to dev@flex.apache.org by Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com> on 2012/03/23 23:16:19 UTC
Halo x Spark
Greatings everyone,
I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
result.
I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the ScrollBar.
Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export for
actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and its
done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man, thats a
really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work for
such a little result!
Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3 insted of
4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex, is a
mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
simple and intelligent to do.
Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
prediction about this?
Thanks!
Williams Farias
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Nicholas Kwiatkowski <ni...@spoon.as>.
Yeah, I'm still debating on wither to include any images at all. Other
than the default icon, everything else should scale (I've tested on 72 dpi,
240 and 320 dpi, and they look good).
I'll look into the MobileButtonSkin. From what I remember, all it does is
cut out the down/hover states.
-Nick
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 2:22 AM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Nick,
>
> I was looking at the code from the link below and was noticing a couple of
> things that might need to be considered when building for mobile devices.
> Primarily the need for skins to be Multi-DPI capable. It doesn't seem like
> you have taken this into account. Also I would suggest using the
> MobileButtonSkin based off of the Mobile skin class instead of using the
> SparkButtonSkin for buttons. Just some suggestions.
>
> Rich
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Mar 24, 2012, at 6:41 AM, Nicholas Kwiatkowski <ni...@spoon.as>
> wrote:
>
> > I'd love to.
> >
> > Take a look at some of the components that are being submitted via our
> own
> > SVN (in the whiteboard area). For example, the MobileAlert component
> I've
> > been writing uses Spark skinning, and in all honesty, it is pretty nice.
> >
> >
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/incubator/flex/whiteboard/quetwo/MobileAlert/src/org/apache/spark/components/
> >
> >
> > (Take a look at MobileAlert.as and the AppleOSAlert.mxml skin paired with
> > it).
> >
> > Once you get your head around what is going on, it is not too bad. What
> > makes it really powerful is the ability to use the same layer effects,
> > vectors, etc. as you do in Photoshop or Illustrator as you do through
> code.
> > This is unlike the Halo model where you tie together all sorts of raster
> > images, or worse yet, rely on the low-level drawing apis to make your
> > skins. Mind you, making raster images in Halo works, but the quality of
> > the skins you can come up with if you draw them in FXG can be much
> higher.
> >
> > -Nick
> >
> > On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 12:21 AM, Williams Farias <will.farias@gmail.com
> >wrote:
> >
> >> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
> >> custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
> >> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
> >>
> >> If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous,
> just
> >> CSS and images.
> >>
> >> Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it
> and
> >> whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design...
> they
> >> only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
> >> have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because
> of
> >> that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
> >> hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> >> nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code
> with
> >> a great custom skin...
> >>
> >> If you have, please show me.
> >>
> >>
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com>.
Hi Nick,
I was looking at the code from the link below and was noticing a couple of things that might need to be considered when building for mobile devices. Primarily the need for skins to be Multi-DPI capable. It doesn't seem like you have taken this into account. Also I would suggest using the MobileButtonSkin based off of the Mobile skin class instead of using the SparkButtonSkin for buttons. Just some suggestions.
Rich
Sent from my iPad
On Mar 24, 2012, at 6:41 AM, Nicholas Kwiatkowski <ni...@spoon.as> wrote:
> I'd love to.
>
> Take a look at some of the components that are being submitted via our own
> SVN (in the whiteboard area). For example, the MobileAlert component I've
> been writing uses Spark skinning, and in all honesty, it is pretty nice.
>
> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/incubator/flex/whiteboard/quetwo/MobileAlert/src/org/apache/spark/components/
>
>
> (Take a look at MobileAlert.as and the AppleOSAlert.mxml skin paired with
> it).
>
> Once you get your head around what is going on, it is not too bad. What
> makes it really powerful is the ability to use the same layer effects,
> vectors, etc. as you do in Photoshop or Illustrator as you do through code.
> This is unlike the Halo model where you tie together all sorts of raster
> images, or worse yet, rely on the low-level drawing apis to make your
> skins. Mind you, making raster images in Halo works, but the quality of
> the skins you can come up with if you draw them in FXG can be much higher.
>
> -Nick
>
> On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 12:21 AM, Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
>> custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
>> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
>>
>> If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous, just
>> CSS and images.
>>
>> Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
>> whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design... they
>> only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
>> have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because of
>> that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
>> hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
>> nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code with
>> a great custom skin...
>>
>> If you have, please show me.
>>
>>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Nicholas Kwiatkowski <ni...@spoon.as>.
I'd love to.
Take a look at some of the components that are being submitted via our own
SVN (in the whiteboard area). For example, the MobileAlert component I've
been writing uses Spark skinning, and in all honesty, it is pretty nice.
http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/incubator/flex/whiteboard/quetwo/MobileAlert/src/org/apache/spark/components/
(Take a look at MobileAlert.as and the AppleOSAlert.mxml skin paired with
it).
Once you get your head around what is going on, it is not too bad. What
makes it really powerful is the ability to use the same layer effects,
vectors, etc. as you do in Photoshop or Illustrator as you do through code.
This is unlike the Halo model where you tie together all sorts of raster
images, or worse yet, rely on the low-level drawing apis to make your
skins. Mind you, making raster images in Halo works, but the quality of
the skins you can come up with if you draw them in FXG can be much higher.
-Nick
On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 12:21 AM, Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
> custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
>
> If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous, just
> CSS and images.
>
> Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
> whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design... they
> only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
> have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because of
> that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
> hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code with
> a great custom skin...
>
> If you have, please show me.
>
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Left Right <ol...@gmail.com>.
I think that the most important motivation behind new skinning system was
that assets imported from Flash CS aren't editable / aren't fully editable
in other editors commonly used for Flex framework. Since new skins are all
in plain text, they eliminate this restriction. However, several important
advantages of previous system were lost. The preview at the time of
developing the skin is very important, but no tool exists to fairly preview
Spark skins until they are actually used. For reasons beyond my
comprehension, the skins had to inherit from UIComponent. Combined together
these two disadvantages are a show-stopper for many projects / workflows.
Now, the problem with promising that this is going to be fixed any time is
that:
- If we want to consider some graphic tool for designing the GUI, what tool
should it be?
- New skinning system is the most significant change in Halo to Spark
transition, if it is dropped, then there's basically no reason to use Spark
at all. So, patching Spark components in attempt to alter the way they use
skins would be a major rewrite anyway.
- There isn't any solid plan, neither less solid goals or even intentions
expressed as about what would be the priorities of Apache version of the
framework, so I don't think there may be a reasonable answer. Maybe this
will be addressed, maybe it won't be, maybe the problem will perish because
of the development taking a completely different turn...
Best.
Oleg
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Frank Pepermans <fr...@hotmail.com>.
Spark has a lot of potential and for me personally, I never went back to
Flex 3.x mx skinning.
But your complaints are valid of course, simple skinning tasks can be very
cumbersome and 'visualizing' MXML code as you type it can be quite hard,
I briefly tried Catalyst but didn't end up using it, plus Catalyst really
needed to be part of Flash Builder in Eclipse from day one.
However my main concern with Spark is performance,
in my current project, I ended up rewriting many MXML skins to AS skins,
which Adobe also did for mobile, and the performance gain is brutal.
Having a skin as an AS class is obviously not a preferred choice, plus you
lose all the nice perks of an MXML skin such as color.over = value for
example.
-----Original Message-----
From: Williams Farias
Sent: Saturday, March 24, 2012 5:37 AM
To: flex-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Halo x Spark
And my final question is: why just not mix them?
I belive in 'superable' comment. I know that Spark has great advantages.
But Halo is so much simple! So, why just mix them? take the best of their
too... and make a HaloSpark all in one architeture. Man, imagine if your
client dont need a insanely custom skin... just need a simple custom
scrollbar! In Halo, 5 minutes: open Flash, draw it literally with your
hands... and thats it. Spark... code... code and more code on blind view.
I havent seen any insanely Spark skinning exemple so far...
2012/3/24 Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>
> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
> custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
>
> If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous, just
> CSS and images.
>
> Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
> whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design... they
> only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
> have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because of
> that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
> hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code with
> a great custom skin...
>
> If you have, please show me.
>
>
>
> 2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
>
>> I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best thing to happen to Flex.
>> It makes it possible to do some insanely custom skins that I would have
>> shuddered to think about attempting to do with Halo
>>
>> Yes it makes it harder to simply style based skinning initially, but if
>> you
>> use that a lot, its possible to build that style support in in your core
>> component class, once and then reuse.
>> It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to make.
>>
>> One important piece to skinning in Spark is to understand the Catalyst
>> workflow.
>> I realize the product itself is discontinued, but even at the state its
>> in,
>> it great for taking assets from designers and generating FXG graphics or
>> even mxml skin code, that you can then use in your Flex app.
>>
>> superabe
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
>> > research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your
>> > project.
>> > There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
>> > pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I
>> > have
>> > had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff
>> for
>> > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you
>> should
>> > be able to go with MXML.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
>> >
>> > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
>> >
>> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <
>> cort@cortwinters.net
>> > >wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hi Will,
>> > >
>> > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
>> > >
>> > > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
>> > > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one
>> > > area
>> > that
>> > > it's most likely to get it.
>> > >
>> > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will
>> do
>> > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take
>> some
>> > > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the
>> framework
>> > and
>> > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a
>> whole
>> > > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
>> > plenty
>> > > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile
>> ones
>> > > performant.
>> > >
>> > > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that
>> > most
>> > > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
>> > developers,
>> > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning
>> there
>> > > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good
>> > > system.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <
>> will.farias@gmail.com
>> > > >wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Greatings everyone,
>> > > >
>> > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a
>> simple
>> > > > result.
>> > > >
>> > > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
>> > ScrollBar.
>> > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and
>> "Export
>> > > for
>> > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code,
>> > > > and
>> > its
>> > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
>> > > >
>> > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to
>> take...
>> > > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
>> > thats a
>> > > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a
>> design
>> > > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much
>> work
>> > for
>> > > > such a little result!
>> > > >
>> > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
>> > insted
>> > > of
>> > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
>> > > >
>> > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could
>> be
>> > > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar
>> skin?
>> > > >
>> > > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of
>> > > > Flex,
>> > is a
>> > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much
>> more
>> > > > simple and intelligent to do.
>> > > >
>> > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not
>> update
>> > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
>> > > > prediction about this?
>> > > >
>> > > > Thanks!
>> > > >
>> > > > Williams Farias
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
>
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>.
@William. A good example is an app I am working on now. It's not released
to the public yet, but when it does I will be sure to post a link here.
About samples online, not sure, but did you check
http://www.scalenine.com/gallery/ . It usually has good skin collections.
About mixing it, like I said before, with Spark, you can clone the default
skin, expose whatever properties you want as CSS style properties.
Do this once, and reuse that everywhere.
On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 12:37 AM, Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>wrote:
> And my final question is: why just not mix them?
>
> I belive in 'superable' comment. I know that Spark has great advantages.
> But Halo is so much simple! So, why just mix them? take the best of their
> too... and make a HaloSpark all in one architeture. Man, imagine if your
> client dont need a insanely custom skin... just need a simple custom
> scrollbar! In Halo, 5 minutes: open Flash, draw it literally with your
> hands... and thats it. Spark... code... code and more code on blind view.
>
> I havent seen any insanely Spark skinning exemple so far...
>
> 2012/3/24 Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>
>
> > Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
> > custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
> > http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
> >
> > If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous,
> just
> > CSS and images.
> >
> > Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
> > whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design...
> they
> > only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
> > have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because
> of
> > that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
> > hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> > nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code
> with
> > a great custom skin...
> >
> > If you have, please show me.
> >
> >
> >
> > 2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
> >
> >> I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best thing to happen to Flex.
> >> It makes it possible to do some insanely custom skins that I would have
> >> shuddered to think about attempting to do with Halo
> >>
> >> Yes it makes it harder to simply style based skinning initially, but if
> >> you
> >> use that a lot, its possible to build that style support in in your core
> >> component class, once and then reuse.
> >> It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to make.
> >>
> >> One important piece to skinning in Spark is to understand the Catalyst
> >> workflow.
> >> I realize the product itself is discontinued, but even at the state its
> >> in,
> >> it great for taking assets from designers and generating FXG graphics or
> >> even mxml skin code, that you can then use in your Flex app.
> >>
> >> superabe
> >>
> >> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> > I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
> >> > research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your
> project.
> >> > There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt
> your
> >> > pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I
> have
> >> > had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical
> stuff
> >> for
> >> > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you
> >> should
> >> > be able to go with MXML.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
> >> >
> >> > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
> >> >
> >> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <
> >> cort@cortwinters.net
> >> > >wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Hi Will,
> >> > >
> >> > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
> >> > >
> >> > > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
> >> > > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one
> area
> >> > that
> >> > > it's most likely to get it.
> >> > >
> >> > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it
> will
> >> do
> >> > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take
> >> some
> >> > > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the
> >> framework
> >> > and
> >> > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a
> >> whole
> >> > > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
> >> > plenty
> >> > > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile
> >> ones
> >> > > performant.
> >> > >
> >> > > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is
> that
> >> > most
> >> > > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
> >> > developers,
> >> > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning
> >> there
> >> > > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good
> system.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <
> >> will.farias@gmail.com
> >> > > >wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > Greatings everyone,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a
> >> simple
> >> > > > result.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
> >> > ScrollBar.
> >> > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and
> >> "Export
> >> > > for
> >> > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code,
> and
> >> > its
> >> > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to
> >> take...
> >> > > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
> >> > thats a
> >> > > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a
> >> design
> >> > > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much
> >> work
> >> > for
> >> > > > such a little result!
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
> >> > insted
> >> > > of
> >> > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
> >> > > >
> >> > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could
> >> be
> >> > > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar
> >> skin?
> >> > > >
> >> > > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of
> Flex,
> >> > is a
> >> > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much
> >> more
> >> > > > simple and intelligent to do.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not
> >> update
> >> > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> >> > > > prediction about this?
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Thanks!
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Williams Farias
> >> > > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
> >
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>.
And my final question is: why just not mix them?
I belive in 'superable' comment. I know that Spark has great advantages.
But Halo is so much simple! So, why just mix them? take the best of their
too... and make a HaloSpark all in one architeture. Man, imagine if your
client dont need a insanely custom skin... just need a simple custom
scrollbar! In Halo, 5 minutes: open Flash, draw it literally with your
hands... and thats it. Spark... code... code and more code on blind view.
I havent seen any insanely Spark skinning exemple so far...
2012/3/24 Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>
> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
> custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
>
> If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous, just
> CSS and images.
>
> Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
> whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design... they
> only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
> have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because of
> that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
> hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code with
> a great custom skin...
>
> If you have, please show me.
>
>
>
> 2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
>
>> I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best thing to happen to Flex.
>> It makes it possible to do some insanely custom skins that I would have
>> shuddered to think about attempting to do with Halo
>>
>> Yes it makes it harder to simply style based skinning initially, but if
>> you
>> use that a lot, its possible to build that style support in in your core
>> component class, once and then reuse.
>> It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to make.
>>
>> One important piece to skinning in Spark is to understand the Catalyst
>> workflow.
>> I realize the product itself is discontinued, but even at the state its
>> in,
>> it great for taking assets from designers and generating FXG graphics or
>> even mxml skin code, that you can then use in your Flex app.
>>
>> superabe
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> > I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
>> > research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your project.
>> > There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
>> > pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I have
>> > had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff
>> for
>> > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you
>> should
>> > be able to go with MXML.
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
>> >
>> > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
>> >
>> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <
>> cort@cortwinters.net
>> > >wrote:
>> >
>> > > Hi Will,
>> > >
>> > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
>> > >
>> > > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
>> > > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area
>> > that
>> > > it's most likely to get it.
>> > >
>> > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will
>> do
>> > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take
>> some
>> > > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the
>> framework
>> > and
>> > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a
>> whole
>> > > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
>> > plenty
>> > > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile
>> ones
>> > > performant.
>> > >
>> > > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that
>> > most
>> > > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
>> > developers,
>> > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning
>> there
>> > > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <
>> will.farias@gmail.com
>> > > >wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Greatings everyone,
>> > > >
>> > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a
>> simple
>> > > > result.
>> > > >
>> > > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
>> > ScrollBar.
>> > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and
>> "Export
>> > > for
>> > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and
>> > its
>> > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
>> > > >
>> > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to
>> take...
>> > > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
>> > thats a
>> > > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a
>> design
>> > > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much
>> work
>> > for
>> > > > such a little result!
>> > > >
>> > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
>> > insted
>> > > of
>> > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
>> > > >
>> > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could
>> be
>> > > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar
>> skin?
>> > > >
>> > > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex,
>> > is a
>> > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much
>> more
>> > > > simple and intelligent to do.
>> > > >
>> > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not
>> update
>> > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
>> > > > prediction about this?
>> > > >
>> > > > Thanks!
>> > > >
>> > > > Williams Farias
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
>
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Nicholas Kwiatkowski <ni...@spoon.as>.
True. But the point I was trying to make was not about the power (which,
it is extremely powerful), but that it is powerful, even at
the introductory level. Making an Alert Box look like the iOS Alert Box in
Halo is damn near impossible without resorting to raster images -- which
don't scale, and add a LOT of weight to the framework.
-Nick
On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 11:26 AM, tinylion development
<in...@tinylion.co.uk>wrote:
> That’s just the thing
>
> The example you’ve shown isn't really a very
> different look than the standard one. Just
> different images in basically the same component.
>
> With spark skin you can make a component radically
> different in ways that would be impossible in
> halo.
>
> Try for example in halo, taking the stand list
> component and just with skinning turn it into a
> faux 3D rotating circle of selectable shapes or
> images, each different and with different roll
> over and selection images and then take that same
> code and with some small changes make the circle a
> horizontal fading line.
>
> Ok, I know there may not be a good UX reason for
> this. But the way you make a component look in
> spark is limitless. Where as in halo it's just a
> different cover over basically the exact same
> thing
>
> Sorry if this was not put very well, but the
> payoff in using spark is huge.
>
> Glenn
> tinylion
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Williams Farias
> [mailto:will.farias@gmail.com]
> Sent: 24 March 2012 04:22
> To: flex-dev@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Re: Halo x Spark
>
> Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark
> skinning, with really custom components... and of
> course, with source code... like that:
> http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
>
> If you see the source code, you´ll se the
> simplicity, its ridiculous, just CSS and images.
>
> Its not about what the technology can do... its
> about who will use it and whith what ammount of
> work? Man, developers usually dont do design...
> they only code the things... acess databases and
> so on. Spark components dont have so much
> impressive skinning examples, in my point of view,
> because of
> that: designers where excluded from skinning
> components! So, if only hardcode developders can
> do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
> nobody will use it... I what just to see an
> exemple, with source code with a great custom
> skin...
>
> If you have, please show me.
>
>
> 2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
>
> > I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best
> thing to happen to Flex.
> > It makes it possible to do some insanely custom
> skins that I would
> > have shuddered to think about attempting to do
> with Halo
> >
> > Yes it makes it harder to simply style based
> skinning initially, but
> > if you use that a lot, its possible to build
> that style support in in
> > your core component class, once and then reuse.
> > It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to
> make.
> >
> > One important piece to skinning in Spark is to
> understand the Catalyst
> > workflow.
> > I realize the product itself is discontinued,
> but even at the state
> > its in, it great for taking assets from
> designers and generating FXG
> > graphics or even mxml skin code, that you can
> then use in your Flex app.
> >
> > superabe
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren
> <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > I am not sure what you were trying to do...
> but with a little bit of
> > > research you should have been able to still
> use Flex 4 for your project.
> > > There is a learning curve to get behind the
> concept so I have felt
> > > your pain before but if you stick with it it
> does get somewhat
> > > easier. I have had to resort back to OLD
> school ways and Draw a lot
> > > of graphical stuff
> > for
> > > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but
> for desktop stuff you
> > > should be able to go with MXML.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-
> custom-horizontal-sc
> > roll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
> > >
> > > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt
> Winters
> > > <cort@cortwinters.net
> > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi Will,
> > > >
> > > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire
> one.
> > > >
> > > > It's true what you say, but though this is
> an area that the flex
> > > > components most need some TLC in, I'm
> confident that it's the one
> > > > area
> > > that
> > > > it's most likely to get it.
> > > >
> > > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe
> will do what it said it
> > > > will
> > do
> > > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty
> stable state. It will take
> > > > some time for folk to get familiar with the
> apache process and the
> > > > framework
> > > and
> > > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on
> mobile apps that have a
> > whole
> > > > new level of performance requirement, but
> that there are going to
> > > > be
> > > plenty
> > > > of opportunities to make both web based apps
> easy to skin and
> > > > mobile
> > ones
> > > > performant.
> > > >
> > > > The toughest part about taking flex and
> making it open source is
> > > > that
> > > most
> > > > flex users are not component developers,
> they are end user app
> > > developers,
> > > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with
> styling and skinning
> > > > there should be a lot of easily available
> expertise to create a good system.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams
> Farias <
> > will.farias@gmail.com
> > > > >wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Greatings everyone,
> > > > >
> > > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is
> so dificult to get a
> > simple
> > > > > result.
> > > > >
> > > > > I´m building now a web application and I
> need just to skin the
> > > ScrollBar.
> > > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5,
> create a new Symbol and
> > "Export
> > > > for
> > > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines
> in my CSS style code,
> > > > > and
> > > its
> > > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts
> made scrollbar.
> > > > >
> > > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a
> brutal work i´d had to take...
> > > > > create a new Style... and put everything
> on the code... ohhh
> > > > > man,
> > > thats a
> > > > > really waste of time with hundreds of
> codes lines and without a
> > design
> > > > > interface to see how it looks like... in
> my opinion its too much
> > > > > work
> > > for
> > > > > such a little result!
> > > > >
> > > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had
> to decide to use Flex
> > > > > 3
> > > insted
> > > > of
> > > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar
> skin!
> > > > >
> > > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple
> thing to do in Flex
> > > > > could be transformed in a bunch of lines
> and hard work as that
> > > > > scrolllBar
> > skin?
> > > > >
> > > > > If i could propose something to chance in
> the next releases of
> > > > > Flex,
> > > is a
> > > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that
> Flex3 skinning is much
> > > > > more simple and intelligent to do.
> > > > >
> > > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to
> read that Adobe will not
> > update
> > > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder!
> Does Apacge group have
> > > > > any prediction about this?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks!
> > > > >
> > > > > Williams Farias
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
>
RE: Halo x Spark
Posted by tinylion development <in...@tinylion.co.uk>.
Thats just the thing
The example youve shown isn't really a very
different look than the standard one. Just
different images in basically the same component.
With spark skin you can make a component radically
different in ways that would be impossible in
halo.
Try for example in halo, taking the stand list
component and just with skinning turn it into a
faux 3D rotating circle of selectable shapes or
images, each different and with different roll
over and selection images and then take that same
code and with some small changes make the circle a
horizontal fading line.
Ok, I know there may not be a good UX reason for
this. But the way you make a component look in
spark is limitless. Where as in halo it's just a
different cover over basically the exact same
thing
Sorry if this was not put very well, but the
payoff in using spark is huge.
Glenn
tinylion
-----Original Message-----
From: Williams Farias
[mailto:will.farias@gmail.com]
Sent: 24 March 2012 04:22
To: flex-dev@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Re: Halo x Spark
Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark
skinning, with really custom components... and of
course, with source code... like that:
http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
If you see the source code, you´ll se the
simplicity, its ridiculous, just CSS and images.
Its not about what the technology can do... its
about who will use it and whith what ammount of
work? Man, developers usually dont do design...
they only code the things... acess databases and
so on. Spark components dont have so much
impressive skinning examples, in my point of view,
because of
that: designers where excluded from skinning
components! So, if only hardcode developders can
do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
nobody will use it... I what just to see an
exemple, with source code with a great custom
skin...
If you have, please show me.
2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
> I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best
thing to happen to Flex.
> It makes it possible to do some insanely custom
skins that I would
> have shuddered to think about attempting to do
with Halo
>
> Yes it makes it harder to simply style based
skinning initially, but
> if you use that a lot, its possible to build
that style support in in
> your core component class, once and then reuse.
> It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to
make.
>
> One important piece to skinning in Spark is to
understand the Catalyst
> workflow.
> I realize the product itself is discontinued,
but even at the state
> its in, it great for taking assets from
designers and generating FXG
> graphics or even mxml skin code, that you can
then use in your Flex app.
>
> superabe
>
> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren
<ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I am not sure what you were trying to do...
but with a little bit of
> > research you should have been able to still
use Flex 4 for your project.
> > There is a learning curve to get behind the
concept so I have felt
> > your pain before but if you stick with it it
does get somewhat
> > easier. I have had to resort back to OLD
school ways and Draw a lot
> > of graphical stuff
> for
> > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but
for desktop stuff you
> > should be able to go with MXML.
> >
> >
> >
>
http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-
custom-horizontal-sc
> roll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
> >
> > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt
Winters
> > <cort@cortwinters.net
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Will,
> > >
> > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire
one.
> > >
> > > It's true what you say, but though this is
an area that the flex
> > > components most need some TLC in, I'm
confident that it's the one
> > > area
> > that
> > > it's most likely to get it.
> > >
> > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe
will do what it said it
> > > will
> do
> > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty
stable state. It will take
> > > some time for folk to get familiar with the
apache process and the
> > > framework
> > and
> > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on
mobile apps that have a
> whole
> > > new level of performance requirement, but
that there are going to
> > > be
> > plenty
> > > of opportunities to make both web based apps
easy to skin and
> > > mobile
> ones
> > > performant.
> > >
> > > The toughest part about taking flex and
making it open source is
> > > that
> > most
> > > flex users are not component developers,
they are end user app
> > developers,
> > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with
styling and skinning
> > > there should be a lot of easily available
expertise to create a good system.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams
Farias <
> will.farias@gmail.com
> > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Greatings everyone,
> > > >
> > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is
so dificult to get a
> simple
> > > > result.
> > > >
> > > > I´m building now a web application and I
need just to skin the
> > ScrollBar.
> > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5,
create a new Symbol and
> "Export
> > > for
> > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines
in my CSS style code,
> > > > and
> > its
> > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts
made scrollbar.
> > > >
> > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a
brutal work i´d had to take...
> > > > create a new Style... and put everything
on the code... ohhh
> > > > man,
> > thats a
> > > > really waste of time with hundreds of
codes lines and without a
> design
> > > > interface to see how it looks like... in
my opinion its too much
> > > > work
> > for
> > > > such a little result!
> > > >
> > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had
to decide to use Flex
> > > > 3
> > insted
> > > of
> > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar
skin!
> > > >
> > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple
thing to do in Flex
> > > > could be transformed in a bunch of lines
and hard work as that
> > > > scrolllBar
> skin?
> > > >
> > > > If i could propose something to chance in
the next releases of
> > > > Flex,
> > is a
> > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that
Flex3 skinning is much
> > > > more simple and intelligent to do.
> > > >
> > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to
read that Adobe will not
> update
> > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder!
Does Apacge group have
> > > > any prediction about this?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks!
> > > >
> > > > Williams Farias
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>.
Ok, so please show me a great example with Spark skinning, with really
custom components... and of course, with source code... like that:
http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
If you see the source code, you´ll se the simplicity, its ridiculous, just
CSS and images.
Its not about what the technology can do... its about who will use it and
whith what ammount of work? Man, developers usually dont do design... they
only code the things... acess databases and so on. Spark components dont
have so much impressive skinning examples, in my point of view, because of
that: designers where excluded from skinning components! So, if only
hardcode developders can do it... what meters if it´s the best whay? if
nobody will use it... I what just to see an exemple, with source code with
a great custom skin...
If you have, please show me.
2012/3/23 superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>
> I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best thing to happen to Flex.
> It makes it possible to do some insanely custom skins that I would have
> shuddered to think about attempting to do with Halo
>
> Yes it makes it harder to simply style based skinning initially, but if you
> use that a lot, its possible to build that style support in in your core
> component class, once and then reuse.
> It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to make.
>
> One important piece to skinning in Spark is to understand the Catalyst
> workflow.
> I realize the product itself is discontinued, but even at the state its in,
> it great for taking assets from designers and generating FXG graphics or
> even mxml skin code, that you can then use in your Flex app.
>
> superabe
>
> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
> > research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your project.
> > There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
> > pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I have
> > had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff
> for
> > Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you should
> > be able to go with MXML.
> >
> >
> >
> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
> >
> > Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <cort@cortwinters.net
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Will,
> > >
> > > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
> > >
> > > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
> > > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area
> > that
> > > it's most likely to get it.
> > >
> > > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will
> do
> > > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take some
> > > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the framework
> > and
> > > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a
> whole
> > > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
> > plenty
> > > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile
> ones
> > > performant.
> > >
> > > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that
> > most
> > > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
> > developers,
> > > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning there
> > > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <
> will.farias@gmail.com
> > > >wrote:
> > >
> > > > Greatings everyone,
> > > >
> > > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a
> simple
> > > > result.
> > > >
> > > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
> > ScrollBar.
> > > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and
> "Export
> > > for
> > > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and
> > its
> > > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
> > > >
> > > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> > > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
> > thats a
> > > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a
> design
> > > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work
> > for
> > > > such a little result!
> > > >
> > > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
> > insted
> > > of
> > > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
> > > >
> > > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> > > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar
> skin?
> > > >
> > > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex,
> > is a
> > > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> > > > simple and intelligent to do.
> > > >
> > > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not
> update
> > > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> > > > prediction about this?
> > > >
> > > > Thanks!
> > > >
> > > > Williams Farias
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by superabe superabe <su...@gmail.com>.
I disagree. I think Spark skinning was the best thing to happen to Flex.
It makes it possible to do some insanely custom skins that I would have
shuddered to think about attempting to do with Halo
Yes it makes it harder to simply style based skinning initially, but if you
use that a lot, its possible to build that style support in in your core
component class, once and then reuse.
It's a tradeoff that I am completely happy to make.
One important piece to skinning in Spark is to understand the Catalyst
workflow.
I realize the product itself is discontinued, but even at the state its in,
it great for taking assets from designers and generating FXG graphics or
even mxml skin code, that you can then use in your Flex app.
superabe
On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 8:25 PM, Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
> research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your project.
> There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
> pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I have
> had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff for
> Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you should
> be able to go with MXML.
>
>
> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
>
> Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
>
> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <cort@cortwinters.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi Will,
> >
> > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
> >
> > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
> > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area
> that
> > it's most likely to get it.
> >
> > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will do
> > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take some
> > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the framework
> and
> > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a whole
> > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
> plenty
> > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile ones
> > performant.
> >
> > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that
> most
> > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
> developers,
> > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning there
> > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <will.farias@gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Greatings everyone,
> > >
> > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
> > > result.
> > >
> > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
> ScrollBar.
> > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export
> > for
> > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and
> its
> > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
> > >
> > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
> thats a
> > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
> > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work
> for
> > > such a little result!
> > >
> > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
> insted
> > of
> > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
> > >
> > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
> > >
> > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex,
> is a
> > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> > > simple and intelligent to do.
> > >
> > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
> > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> > > prediction about this?
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Williams Farias
> > >
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>.
Hi Richard,
Thanks for the reply, but i dont think you got the point i try to explain.
Ok, there are some ways on Spark to skin the scrollbar, or to put a
background image, but thats not the point here.
The thing is not if you can or if you cant skin an component. I´ve already
seem the link you pass, and I´ve problably seem all the exemples on the web
about Flex4 Spark components. Thats why i choose Flex3. I havent seem
nothing so far with Spark Skinning that impressed me, with less work and
more intelligent way to do then Halo components. Thats for me a step back
in the technology: they complicated a lot the way to do a simple job.
Take a look at this: http://fleksray.org/Flex_skin.html#Flekscribble
and more specifically this: http://fleksray.org/skins/scribble/Scribble.html
*
*Man, that thing i can make that in 20 minutes using Flex3 and Flash with a
tablet, even with Photoshop or any other image tool. But show me a way to
skin like this on Spark. With that easiest, its impossible for a "non super
advanced developer". With Halo components, designers skin each component
the way they want (in photoshop or flash) in minutes, and developres just
use them in a 4 lines CSS Flex code! Now on Spark, it seems designers was
eliminated of the process! Adobe dont whant more creative interfaces, only
form based ones with a little make up, and only developers now can skin the
componets with code!
The scrollbar example was just to illustrate how dificult is to do a simple
skin with Spark. Ok, your link skins the component.... but that example
just change the colors. Try do a more specific scrollbar... a more creative
design one... you will spend days and days trying to achieve something that
on Halo you got in minutes; and thats why Flex is (was? had been?) so
impressive! Its about business!
Halo is much, much more simple to skin components - less time (money) and
more clients happy with their really exclusive components (not only changed
colors one). Designers do them on Flash... clients aprove, or do changes on
the fly, and its done. Spark: open flex, work hours and hours to create a
custom skin with just a code view (need to compile hundreds of time to get
it), pray to the client aprove - if disaprove ... more hours of coding
work.. Its too much work, time and money lost to do a such simple thing.
Got this point of view? Does anyone have any news about that: future about
skinning components? Will Spark continues on Apache plans?
I vote: Halo architecture for skinning future!
Thanks.
On that point of view: Flex3 Halo = 10!! Flex4 Spark: 2 ...
**
2012/3/23 Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com>
> I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
> research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your project.
> There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
> pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I have
> had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff for
> Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you should
> be able to go with MXML.
>
>
> http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
>
> Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
>
> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <cort@cortwinters.net
> >wrote:
>
> > Hi Will,
> >
> > I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
> >
> > It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
> > components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area
> that
> > it's most likely to get it.
> >
> > As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will do
> > and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take some
> > time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the framework
> and
> > to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a whole
> > new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be
> plenty
> > of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile ones
> > performant.
> >
> > The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that
> most
> > flex users are not component developers, they are end user app
> developers,
> > but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning there
> > should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <will.farias@gmail.com
> > >wrote:
> >
> > > Greatings everyone,
> > >
> > > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
> > > result.
> > >
> > > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the
> ScrollBar.
> > > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export
> > for
> > > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and
> its
> > > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
> > >
> > > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> > > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man,
> thats a
> > > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
> > > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work
> for
> > > such a little result!
> > >
> > > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3
> insted
> > of
> > > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
> > >
> > > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> > > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
> > >
> > > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex,
> is a
> > > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> > > simple and intelligent to do.
> > >
> > > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
> > > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> > > prediction about this?
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Williams Farias
> > >
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Richard Oren <ro...@gmail.com>.
I am not sure what you were trying to do... but with a little bit of
research you should have been able to still use Flex 4 for your project.
There is a learning curve to get behind the concept so I have felt your
pain before but if you stick with it it does get somewhat easier. I have
had to resort back to OLD school ways and Draw a lot of graphical stuff for
Mobile Development with the Drawing API, but for desktop stuff you should
be able to go with MXML.
http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/11/04/setting-a-custom-horizontal-scroll-bar-skin-on-a-spark-list-control-in-flex-4/
Hang in there! You can Do it! :)
On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 3:44 PM, Cortlandt Winters <co...@cortwinters.net>wrote:
> Hi Will,
>
> I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
>
> It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
> components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area that
> it's most likely to get it.
>
> As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will do
> and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take some
> time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the framework and
> to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a whole
> new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be plenty
> of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile ones
> performant.
>
> The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that most
> flex users are not component developers, they are end user app developers,
> but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning there
> should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <will.farias@gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> > Greatings everyone,
> >
> > I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
> > result.
> >
> > I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the ScrollBar.
> > Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export
> for
> > actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and its
> > done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
> >
> > But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> > create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man, thats a
> > really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
> > interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work for
> > such a little result!
> >
> > Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3 insted
> of
> > 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
> >
> > I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> > transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
> >
> > If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex, is a
> > mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> > simple and intelligent to do.
> >
> > Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
> > more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> > prediction about this?
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Williams Farias
> >
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Cortlandt Winters <co...@cortwinters.net>.
Hi Will,
I do have a prediction. And it's not a dire one.
It's true what you say, but though this is an area that the flex
components most need some TLC in, I'm confident that it's the one area that
it's most likely to get it.
As for predictions, I predict that Adobe will do what it said it will do
and it will leave Flex "5?" in a pretty stable state. It will take some
time for folk to get familiar with the apache process and the framework and
to determine how to deal with scrolling on mobile apps that have a whole
new level of performance requirement, but that there are going to be plenty
of opportunities to make both web based apps easy to skin and mobile ones
performant.
The toughest part about taking flex and making it open source is that most
flex users are not component developers, they are end user app developers,
but as far as folk that are comfortable with styling and skinning there
should be a lot of easily available expertise to create a good system.
On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:16 PM, Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Greatings everyone,
>
> I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
> result.
>
> I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the ScrollBar.
> Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export for
> actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and its
> done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
>
> But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man, thats a
> really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
> interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work for
> such a little result!
>
> Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3 insted of
> 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
>
> I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
>
> If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex, is a
> mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> simple and intelligent to do.
>
> Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
> more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> prediction about this?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Williams Farias
>
Re: Halo x Spark
Posted by Alain Ekambi <ja...@googlemail.com>.
I feel your pain.
Reminds me of this post
http://blog.flexexamples.com/2009/03/22/setting-a-background-image-on-an-fxapplication-in-flex-gumbo/
Basically requiring a degree in computer science to set a backgroundimage.
To me all this Spark stuff was the right move in the wrong direction.
2012/3/23 Williams Farias <wi...@gmail.com>
> Greatings everyone,
>
> I´d like to know why does Spark skining is so dificult to get a simple
> result.
>
> I´m building now a web application and I need just to skin the ScrollBar.
> Ok, in Flex3 i just open my Flash CS5, create a new Symbol and "Export for
> actionscript". Then i just add 4 new lines in my CSS style code, and its
> done. I have now a simple and 2 minuts made scrollbar.
>
> But in Spark component... ohhh, what a brutal work i´d had to take...
> create a new Style... and put everything on the code... ohhh man, thats a
> really waste of time with hundreds of codes lines and without a design
> interface to see how it looks like... in my opinion its too much work for
> such a little result!
>
> Just because of that scrollbar man, i had to decide to use Flex 3 insted of
> 4!!! A simple and mediocre scrollbar skin!
>
> I was wondering: how can the most simple thing to do in Flex could be
> transformed in a bunch of lines and hard work as that scrolllBar skin?
>
> If i could propose something to chance in the next releases of Flex, is a
> mix of Halo and Spark Skins. I think that Flex3 skinning is much more
> simple and intelligent to do.
>
> Antoher thing that frightened me was to read that Adobe will not update
> more the Design View of Flash Builder! Does Apacge group have any
> prediction about this?
>
> Thanks!
>
> Williams Farias
>