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Posted to general@xml.apache.org by Jan-Henrik Haukeland <ha...@tildeslash.com> on 2001/02/15 01:32:56 UTC
XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Paul Russell <pa...@luminas.co.uk> writes:
[*]
> Extreme Programming [*] is a methodology which I feel translates
> well to the open source ethos.
Bullshit. XP depends on a tight controlled and closely managed
iterative development process with a small team. There is very little
of this in an open source project.
XP boils down to 4 main iterative principles:
1) Listen to the user organization
2) Design as simple as possible (occams razor)
3) Test
4) Code and refactor
What OSS projects are:
1) Listen to the users (via mailinglists), insult the users and other
developers, discus stuff totaly out of foucs (like this thread), argue
and if you don't like my "brilliant" idea or code -> fork.
2) Design using patterns, that is, anti-patterns like the Blob. Take a
look at the initial tomecat code drop from SUN to see good usage of
this kind of patterns. Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
Steven's work.
3) Release often and let the users test the code, we'll probably get
some nice patches.
4) Code and refactor.. or rather copy and paste.
Yet it works, it's a miracle! But the corporate guys that has been
taking over Jakarta don't belive in miracles so we have these regular
stupid systems development process discussions, whenever e.g. a Sun or
Ibm square head programmer thinks that involment in Jakarta will look
good on his resume.
The bottom line, and I have been wanting to say this for some time -
Sun killed Java Apache, the long wait for the code drop stopped
development of JServ 1.1 and when the code finally was released it was
a *fucking* mess along with a fucking mess off corporate developers
from Sun and Ibm swamping the mailing lists with totally bureaucracy
and making action decisions hopeless.
--
Jan-Henrik Haukeland
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by "Pier P. Fumagalli" <pi...@betaversion.org>.
Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com> wrote:
> on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
>
>> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
>> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
>> Steven's work.
>
> Ok, that is insulting.
Yeah, it's written "SPAGHETTI" first of all, and if there's someone to blame
for the Jserv code, a huge bunch of us is to be blamed...
And if Jserv sucks so badly, well, how could it still win award after award
? :) :)
Pier
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Pier Fumagalli <http://www.betaversion.org/> <ma...@betaversion.org>
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com>.
on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
> Steven's work.
Ok, that is insulting.
-jon
--
If you come from a Perl or PHP background, JSP is a way to take
your pain to new levels. --Anonymous
<http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/> && <http://java.apache.org/turbine/>
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com>.
on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
> Steven's work.
Ok, that is insulting.
-jon
--
If you come from a Perl or PHP background, JSP is a way to take
your pain to new levels. --Anonymous
<http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/> && <http://java.apache.org/turbine/>
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com>.
on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
> Steven's work.
Ok, that is insulting.
-jon
--
If you come from a Perl or PHP background, JSP is a way to take
your pain to new levels. --Anonymous
<http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/> && <http://java.apache.org/turbine/>
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com>.
on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
> Steven's work.
Ok, that is insulting.
-jon
--
If you come from a Perl or PHP background, JSP is a way to take
your pain to new levels. --Anonymous
<http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/> && <http://java.apache.org/turbine/>
Re: XP and Jakarta [was: Re: Test Infrastructure Project Proposal]
Posted by Jon Stevens <jo...@latchkey.com>.
on 2/14/01 4:32 PM, "Jan-Henrik Haukeland" <ha...@tildeslash.com> wrote:
> Also if you are really into anti-patterns or
> spageti-code have a look at earlier 1.0 versions of JServ or Jon
> Steven's work.
Ok, that is insulting.
-jon
--
If you come from a Perl or PHP background, JSP is a way to take
your pain to new levels. --Anonymous
<http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/> && <http://java.apache.org/turbine/>