Re: Google App Engine and Wicket

[Jim Pinkham <pi...@gmail.com>]

I've followed with interest all the wicket on GAE threads I can, and these
all seem to address necessary minor tweaks to get it set up, but the one big
thing I haven't seen much discussion on is the BigTable storage system,
since we wouldn't be able to use MySQL.

Maybe that's the whole point for some folks looking for high scalability,
but from my perspective, I'm more interested in the idea of a free
turnkey(ish) Java hosting environment.

I'd like to be able to resell my wicket app (it's a fundraising auction
system designed for nonprofits) to lots of tiny churches or other nonprofit
organizations - they typically have no IT experience, so bypassing the
hosting concerns could be a big win.  Plus, the system would be ultra low
traffic by google standards especially (maybe 8 concurrent users tops per
org during peak demand!).

Right now it's 'incubated' as an old underpowered Windows 2000 server
running Jetty sitting in a closet at my church, where the business class ISP
licence agreement legally permits it.  Seems like quite a leap to be
considering GAE, but if it's free and folks trust the availability and I can
easily configure it for each additional client, that could work out pretty
well for me.

But of course my system is all heavily SQL oriented - seems like this would
be a pretty fundamental rewrite for me to go to BigTable, and I was
wondering if any other wicket developers were also attracted to this type of
system, for these or other reasons, or whether I should just shell out for
some shared hosting blades and go for it?

Thanks,
-- Jim
On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 2:15 PM, Maarten Bosteels
<mb...@gmail.com>wrote:

> Good news:
> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java/msg/f50bbb131dc524c1
>
> <quote>
> "HttpSessions will work out of the box if you enable them in your
> appengine-web.xml.
>
> We do not guarantee that all requests for the same session go to the same
> JVM, but persistence of sessions is managed behind the scenes with the
> datastore and memcache.
>
> You are, of course, free to use the memcache and/or datastore API's
> directly
> if you want more control. "
> </quote>
>
> Maarten
>
> On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Adriano dos Santos Fernandes
> <ad...@uol.com.br> wrote:
> > Maarten Bosteels wrote:
> >>
> >> But AFAIK GAE doesn't use/guarantee sticky sessions, so I am afraid
> >> you can't rely on local memory.
> >>
> >> "App Engine uses multiple web servers to run your application, and
> >> automatically adjusts the number of servers it is using to handle
> >> requests reliably. A given request may be routed to any server, and it
> >> may not be the same server that handled a previous request from the
> >> same user."
> >>
> >>
> http://code.google.com/appengine/docs/java/runtime.html#Requests_and_Servlets
> >>
> >> It would be interesting to test the performance of an ISessionStore
> >> backed by the App Engine datastore.
> >
> > FYI, I've put a app. with a static variable counter (just a static, not
> in
> > session). And since two days there, the counter is maintained.
> >
> > So I guess they solution uses something like Terracotta. BTW, they web
> > server is Jetty.
> >
> >
> > Adriano
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@wicket.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@wicket.apache.org
> >
> >
>
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> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@wicket.apache.org
>
>

Re: Google App Engine and Wicket

[Jeremy Thomerson <je...@wickettraining.com>]

You can get a dedicated server at GoDaddy for under $100 per month.
I've had one running Java / Wicket apps with an uptime of around two
years now.  With your very small load, you could also use
redwoodvirtual and use a Linux Virtual Server for $20 or $40.  I also
had a server with them running for a couple of consecutive years.

I think you're overengineering something that definitely doesn't need it.

--
Jeremy Thomerson
http://www.wickettraining.com




On Mon, May 11, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Jim Pinkham <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I've followed with interest all the wicket on GAE threads I can, and these
> all seem to address necessary minor tweaks to get it set up, but the one big
> thing I haven't seen much discussion on is the BigTable storage system,
> since we wouldn't be able to use MySQL.
>
> Maybe that's the whole point for some folks looking for high scalability,
> but from my perspective, I'm more interested in the idea of a free
> turnkey(ish) Java hosting environment.
>
> I'd like to be able to resell my wicket app (it's a fundraising auction
> system designed for nonprofits) to lots of tiny churches or other nonprofit
> organizations - they typically have no IT experience, so bypassing the
> hosting concerns could be a big win.  Plus, the system would be ultra low
> traffic by google standards especially (maybe 8 concurrent users tops per
> org during peak demand!).
>
> Right now it's 'incubated' as an old underpowered Windows 2000 server
> running Jetty sitting in a closet at my church, where the business class ISP
> licence agreement legally permits it.  Seems like quite a leap to be
> considering GAE, but if it's free and folks trust the availability and I can
> easily configure it for each additional client, that could work out pretty
> well for me.
>
> But of course my system is all heavily SQL oriented - seems like this would
> be a pretty fundamental rewrite for me to go to BigTable, and I was
> wondering if any other wicket developers were also attracted to this type of
> system, for these or other reasons, or whether I should just shell out for
> some shared hosting blades and go for it?
>
> Thanks,
> -- Jim
> On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 2:15 PM, Maarten Bosteels
> <mb...@gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Good news:
>> http://groups.google.com/group/google-appengine-java/msg/f50bbb131dc524c1
>>
>> <quote>
>> "HttpSessions will work out of the box if you enable them in your
>> appengine-web.xml.
>>
>> We do not guarantee that all requests for the same session go to the same
>> JVM, but persistence of sessions is managed behind the scenes with the
>> datastore and memcache.
>>
>> You are, of course, free to use the memcache and/or datastore API's
>> directly
>> if you want more control. "
>> </quote>
>>
>> Maarten
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 12, 2009 at 4:18 PM, Adriano dos Santos Fernandes
>> <ad...@uol.com.br> wrote:
>> > Maarten Bosteels wrote:
>> >>
>> >> But AFAIK GAE doesn't use/guarantee sticky sessions, so I am afraid
>> >> you can't rely on local memory.
>> >>
>> >> "App Engine uses multiple web servers to run your application, and
>> >> automatically adjusts the number of servers it is using to handle
>> >> requests reliably. A given request may be routed to any server, and it
>> >> may not be the same server that handled a previous request from the
>> >> same user."
>> >>
>> >>
>> http://code.google.com/appengine/docs/java/runtime.html#Requests_and_Servlets
>> >>
>> >> It would be interesting to test the performance of an ISessionStore
>> >> backed by the App Engine datastore.
>> >
>> > FYI, I've put a app. with a static variable counter (just a static, not
>> in
>> > session). And since two days there, the counter is maintained.
>> >
>> > So I guess they solution uses something like Terracotta. BTW, they web
>> > server is Jetty.
>> >
>> >
>> > Adriano
>> >
>> >
>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@wicket.apache.org
>> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@wicket.apache.org
>> >
>> >
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@wicket.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@wicket.apache.org
>>
>>
>

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