End-user (not administrator) question

["Ricardo P. Jasinski" <ja...@cefetpr.br>]

Hi all,
 
the system administrator in our university recently started using
spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has been a
good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain why.

First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an email
with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way my spam
count could never decrease.

Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I
evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we are
forced to living by the same rules.

As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having really
good results on spam elimination and customization. My immediate feeling is
that the adoption of spamassassin has tremendously worsened my spam-dealing
routine. Since for every mail that spamassassin considers a spam it
generates new a message describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way
of sorting it by the contents anymore. 

This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm back at
having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden inside
attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my spam detecting
engine.

I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with
spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, I
would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling spamassassin
for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing to do.

Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive comments
if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.

Ricardo.

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[NM Public <ag...@nm.deflexion.com>]

Sur 2006-05-25, Evan Platt skribis:
>
> Umm... Switch to a different mail provider?

I just blogged about this yesterday. If your university uses 
IMAP, which is the case for almost all universities these days, 
they can set things up so that each user has the option to have 
his/her spammy messages delivered to an IMAP-accessible 
'MaybeSpam' mailbox. Details are here:

  IMAP and Spam Filtering
  <http://deflexion.com/2006/05/imap-and-spam-filtering>

If they won't let you specify your own spam configuration 
options, I agree with Evan Platt: Switch to a different email 
provider!

Good luck with your email sys admin,
  Nancy
   (sent via gmane.mail.spam.spamassassin.general)

-- 
   Nancy McGough
   Infinite Ink: <http://www.ii.com/>
   Bookmarks & Blog:  <http://deflexion.com/>

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[Evan Platt <ev...@espphotography.com>]

On Thu, May 25, 2006 12:13 pm, Ricardo P. Jasinski wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> the system administrator in our university recently started using
> spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has been
> a
> good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain why.
>
> First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an
> email
> with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way my spam
> count could never decrease.

That's a configuration change your administrator can make.

> Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I
> evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we are
> forced to living by the same rules.

That's something else your administrator can change.

> As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having really
> good results on spam elimination and customization. My immediate feeling
> is
> that the adoption of spamassassin has tremendously worsened my
> spam-dealing
> routine. Since for every mail that spamassassin considers a spam it
> generates new a message describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way
> of sorting it by the contents anymore.
>
> This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm back
> at
> having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden inside
> attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my spam
> detecting
> engine.
>
> I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with
> spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, I
> would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling
> spamassassin
> for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing to do.

Yes. Ask your mail admin. That all depends on how spamassassin is being
run on the server.

> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive
> comments
> if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
> that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.

Umm... Switch to a different mail provider?

Unless you have a web based interface to make changes to your spamassassin
settings, you'll need to contact your administrator.

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[jdow <jd...@earthlink.net>]

From: "Ricardo P. Jasinski" <ja...@cefetpr.br>

> Hi all,
> 
> the system administrator in our university recently started using
> spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has been a
> good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain why.
> 
> First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an email
> with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way my spam
> count could never decrease.
> 
> Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I
> evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we are
> forced to living by the same rules.
> 
> As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having really
> good results on spam elimination and customization. My immediate feeling is
> that the adoption of spamassassin has tremendously worsened my spam-dealing
> routine. Since for every mail that spamassassin considers a spam it
> generates new a message describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way
> of sorting it by the contents anymore. 
> 
> This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm back at
> having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden inside
> attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my spam detecting
> engine.
> 
> I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with
> spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, I
> would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling spamassassin
> for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing to do.
> 
> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive comments
> if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
> that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.

1) Does the spam mail have a score in some part of the message on which
   a sane person can sort and redirect the spam to a spam folder FOR A
   PERIODIC QUICK REVIEW? (Mismarked ham is a bad thing. SpamAssassin
   lets you see the messages to make SURE the are spam. Any tool which
   does NOT do this is broken.) And note that Outlook is its own
   punishment for using it. At LEAST use Outlook Express, which is not
   quite so nanny driven. Either one can sort to folders on the subject
   line, though.
2) If you line SpamBayes then continue to run it.
3) Welcome to the real world of "system administrators" who may well be
   orders of magnitude more clueless than you feel you are.
4) Any tool which uses a Bayes filter requires training. If the training
   goes bad the results are terrible.
5) Any tool which uses GLOBAL Bayes filter is going to be much worse than
   the same tool using personal Bayes filters that can be personally
   trained.

{^_^}

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[jdow <jd...@earthlink.net>]

From: "Andrzej Adam Filip" <an...@xl.wp.pl>

>> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive comments
>> if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
>> that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.
> 
> I assume you use procmail to deploy your personal spamassassin.
> 
> To get back to previous situation you can use "spamassassin -d" as
> procmail filter for "tagged as spam" messages.
> 
> It is not the best option but it is the most simple and fastest to
> implement [option zero].

His message headers suggested he is using a Windows machine with
Outlook.
{^_^}

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[Andrzej Adam Filip <an...@xl.wp.pl>]

"Ricardo P. Jasinski" <ja...@cefetpr.br> writes:
> the system administrator in our university recently started using
> spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has been a
> good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain why.
>
> First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an email
> with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way my spam
> count could never decrease.
>
> Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I
> evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we are
> forced to living by the same rules.
>
> As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having really
> good results on spam elimination and customization. My immediate feeling is
> that the adoption of spamassassin has tremendously worsened my spam-dealing
> routine. Since for every mail that spamassassin considers a spam it
> generates new a message describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way
> of sorting it by the contents anymore. 
>
> This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm back at
> having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden inside
> attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my spam detecting
> engine.
>
> I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with
> spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, I
> would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling spamassassin
> for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing to do.
>
> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive comments
> if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
> that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.

I assume you use procmail to deploy your personal spamassassin.

To get back to previous situation you can use "spamassassin -d" as
procmail filter for "tagged as spam" messages.

It is not the best option but it is the most simple and fastest to
implement [option zero].

-- 
[pl2en: Andrew] Andrzej Adam Filip : anfi@priv.onet.pl : anfi@xl.wp.pl
http://anfi.homeunix.net/           http://www.linkedin.com/in/andfil

[FOLLOW-UP] End-user (not administrator) question

["Ricardo P. Jasinski" <ja...@cefetpr.br>]

Hi fellows,

thanks to everyone who bothered sharing their opinion on this matter. Loaded
with your suggestions, I called our administrator and kindly requested to be
added to the spam-lovers list. He just asked my motivations, wich I kindly
explained, and he quickly made the change.

Note: before having your directions, I had already called him and asked what
we could do to solve that problem, to which he replied that there was no
easy way of doing it.

So, thanks again!

Ricardo.

-----Mensagem original-----
De: Timothy Burt [mailto:salist@timburt.com] 
Enviada em: quinta-feira, 25 de maio de 2006 16:32
Para: Ricardo P. Jasinski
Cc: users@spamassassin.apache.org
Assunto: Re: End-user (not administrator) question


Most certainly.  Ask to be put on the "Spam Lovers" list.

Spamassassin is (IMHO) the best tool for dealing with SPAM.  And the ability
to give any user the freedom to deal with SPAM in his own manner is good
evidence.

Enjoy!

--------------------
Timothy Burt
Los Angeles, Calif. USA

On Thu, 25 May 2006, Ricardo P. Jasinski wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> the system administrator in our university recently started using 
> spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has 
> been a good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain
why.
>
> First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an 
> email with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way 
> my spam count could never decrease.
>
> Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I 
> evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we 
> are forced to living by the same rules.
>
> As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having 
> really good results on spam elimination and customization. My 
> immediate feeling is that the adoption of spamassassin has 
> tremendously worsened my spam-dealing routine. Since for every mail 
> that spamassassin considers a spam it generates new a message 
> describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way of sorting it by the
contents anymore.
>
> This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm 
> back at having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden 
> inside attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my 
> spam detecting engine.
>
> I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with 
> spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, 
> I would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling 
> spamassassin for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing
to do.
>
> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive 
> comments if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. 
> Any solution that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for
me, though.
>
> Ricardo.
>

Re: End-user (not administrator) question

[Timothy Burt <sa...@timburt.com>]

Most certainly.  Ask to be put on the "Spam Lovers" list.

Spamassassin is (IMHO) the best tool for dealing with SPAM.  And the 
ability to give any user the freedom to deal with SPAM in his own manner 
is good evidence.

Enjoy!

--------------------
Timothy Burt
Los Angeles, Calif. USA

On Thu, 25 May 2006, Ricardo P. Jasinski wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> the system administrator in our university recently started using
> spamassassin in our mail server. Unfortunately, I can't say this has been a
> good thing for me and for many other users, and I'll try to explain why.
>
> First, for each mail that the tool assumes to be a spam, I receive an email
> with the original message as an attachment. Obviously, this way my spam
> count could never decrease.
>
> Second, now I have no control over what I consider as a spam. What I
> evaluate as spam is not the same as what my colleagues do. But now, we are
> forced to living by the same rules.
>
> As a previous spambayes outlook plugin user, I was used to having really
> good results on spam elimination and customization. My immediate feeling is
> that the adoption of spamassassin has tremendously worsened my spam-dealing
> routine. Since for every mail that spamassassin considers a spam it
> generates new a message describing the rules it used, spambayes has no way
> of sorting it by the contents anymore.
>
> This is what upsets me: I (almost) was free from spam hell, now I'm back at
> having to open manually all my messages, which are now hidden inside
> attachments, and there is no way of improving or training my spam detecting
> engine.
>
> I hope you understand that I am having a terrible experience with
> spamassassin. Since my system administrator will not tell this to me, I
> would like to know from you guys if there is a way of disabling spamassassin
> for my individual mail address, and if this is an easy thing to do.
>
> Thank you immensely for your replies. Also, I would like to receive comments
> if you guys can think of any other way out of my situation. Any solution
> that does not depend on the admin is more likely to work for me, though.
>
> Ricardo.
>