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Posted to general@commons.apache.org by Rodent of Unusual Size <Ke...@Golux.Com> on 2002/11/03 22:31:09 UTC
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
[+1] One mother general@ list, with specific breakouts when needed
[-1] Per-concept mailing lists (define "concept" however)
[-1] Per-language mailing lists
i'm bothered by the 'i don't want to see what the <other-foo> people
are working on' syndrome i've seen some people express here. well,
maybe you aren't -- so filter it out. *they* may want to see *yours*.
and before someone says 'then let them subscribe to the <my-foo> list',
i'll say that's bogus. they need to know a) that the list exists, and
b) that there might be stuff that's useful/instructive to them on it.
i want to see us practise inclusion by default, not exclusion.
maybe the language constructs in java may not be useful to c people --
but the algorithms and concepts may be.
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Scott Sanders wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 04, 2002 at 09:03:22AM -0500, Henri Yandell wrote:
> > On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
> > > -1 on mandatory enforcement, but +1 on encouragement.
> > >
> > > You'll find that with the slosh of messages for unrelated projects on the
> > > commons list, having a hint of what to read or dump is very helpful.
> >
> > Still, it will lead to an increase of the number of times [d] has to be
> > hit. Would be nice to have a mail-agent in which I can hit 'D' or
> > something and it will kill anything in that thread.
> >
>
> Already done. http://www.mutt.org. Exactly the reason I use mutt is the threading capability.
>
I will repeat my efforts to move to mutt. Have tried before and it so
blows up my existing system [copies inbox to a new location, sorts the
actual file and not just the view] that I run away each time.
Having a feature to go there for might help, so I'll try again.
Thanks,
Hen
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Scott Sanders <sa...@apache.org>.
On Mon, Nov 04, 2002 at 09:03:22AM -0500, Henri Yandell wrote:
> On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
> > -1 on mandatory enforcement, but +1 on encouragement.
> >
> > You'll find that with the slosh of messages for unrelated projects on the
> > commons list, having a hint of what to read or dump is very helpful.
>
> Still, it will lead to an increase of the number of times [d] has to be
> hit. Would be nice to have a mail-agent in which I can hit 'D' or
> something and it will kill anything in that thread.
>
Already done. http://www.mutt.org. Exactly the reason I use mutt is the threading capability.
--
Scott Sanders - sanders@apache.org
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Rodent of Unusual Size <Ke...@Golux.Com>.
Aaron Bannert wrote:
>
> You can always filter on the List-Post: headers. Please don't
> clutter up my subject line. :)
the problem being that a single large list will have a single
list-post header field.. that's why hen suggested frobbing the
subject line.
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Rodent of Unusual Size <Ke...@Golux.Com>.
Aaron Bannert wrote:
>
> My mistake. I thought we were talking about putting automated
> [fooproject] entries in our subject lines. If we are
> considering voluntarily putting [fooproject] in the subject
> when talking about a subproject on a shared list, then that
> seems obvious to me and I'm confused why we are talking about
> this.
hen suggested configuring the mlm so that it would reject any
messages that *didn't* have a '[.*]' in the subject line. thus
making semi-focussed target audiences required. or something
like that.
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Aaron Bannert <aa...@clove.org>.
My mistake. I thought we were talking about putting automated [fooproject]
entries in our subject lines. If we are considering voluntarily putting
[fooproject] in the subject when talking about a subproject on a shared
list, then that seems obvious to me and I'm confused why we are talking
about this. You're not going to get your filter to be perfect when humans
are involved, however.
-aaron
On Mon, Nov 04, 2002 at 12:21:10PM -0800, John McNally wrote:
> How can specifying the code you are talking about be considered clutter,
> are you objecting to using delimiters such as []?
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by John McNally <jm...@collab.net>.
How can specifying the code you are talking about be considered clutter,
are you objecting to using delimiters such as []?
On Mon, 2002-11-04 at 11:51, Aaron Bannert wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 04, 2002 at 09:03:22AM -0500, Henri Yandell wrote:
> > > > Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
> > > > good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
> > > > subject lines in the first place. -- justin
> >
> > I'm fine with the sentiment, but mail filters don't deal with meaningful
> > subject lines.
>
> You can always filter on the List-Post: headers. Please don't clutter
> up my subject line. :)
>
> -aaron
>
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Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Aaron Bannert <aa...@clove.org>.
On Mon, Nov 04, 2002 at 09:03:22AM -0500, Henri Yandell wrote:
> > > Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
> > > good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
> > > subject lines in the first place. -- justin
>
> I'm fine with the sentiment, but mail filters don't deal with meaningful
> subject lines.
You can always filter on the List-Post: headers. Please don't clutter
up my subject line. :)
-aaron
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Rodent of Unusual Size <Ke...@Golux.Com>.
* On 2002-11-04 at 09:46,
Sander Striker <st...@apache.org> excited the electrons to say:
>
> I don't see what it helps us to put all msgs in one list if people
> are (going to be) filtering them out by subject anyway.
it's the issue of choice. in the above case, people == 'some people'.
if the issues are split out, people == 'all people' because we're
forcing the filtering on them. do not make the mistake of equating
the two scenaria.
RE: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Sander Striker <st...@apache.org>.
> From: Henri Yandell [mailto:bayard@generationjava.com]
> Sent: 04 November 2002 15:03
> On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
>
> > On 11/3/02 10:41 PM, "Justin Erenkrantz" <je...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> > > --On Sunday, November 3, 2002 7:33 PM -0500 Henri Yandell
> > > <ba...@generationjava.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Exactly [regex bit]. Commons and Jakarta-Taglibs both work well when
> > >> people obey this convention [with [general] as an 'everyone' one],
> > >> but enforcing it would stop the frequent times when a new user to
> > >> the Dev list has to be given the speech.
> > >>
> > >> Also stops us forgetting too :)
> > >
> > > -1 on mandatory enforcement of this.
> > >
> > > If people want to have this as a convention fine, but this should not
> > > be required.
> > >
> > > Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
> > > good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
> > > subject lines in the first place. -- justin
>
> I'm fine with the sentiment, but mail filters don't deal with meaningful
> subject lines.
I don't see what it helps us to put all msgs in one list if people
are (going to be) filtering them out by subject anyway. We might aswell
split lists (to hold related projects?) and have a bigmother@ list subscribed
to all lists, so that the people who wish to see all traffic can do so by
only subscribing to bigmother@.
Sander
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On Mon, 4 Nov 2002, Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:
> On 11/3/02 10:41 PM, "Justin Erenkrantz" <je...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > --On Sunday, November 3, 2002 7:33 PM -0500 Henri Yandell
> > <ba...@generationjava.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Exactly [regex bit]. Commons and Jakarta-Taglibs both work well when
> >> people obey this convention [with [general] as an 'everyone' one],
> >> but enforcing it would stop the frequent times when a new user to
> >> the Dev list has to be given the speech.
> >>
> >> Also stops us forgetting too :)
> >
> > -1 on mandatory enforcement of this.
> >
> > If people want to have this as a convention fine, but this should not
> > be required.
> >
> > Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
> > good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
> > subject lines in the first place. -- justin
I'm fine with the sentiment, but mail filters don't deal with meaningful
subject lines.
> -1 on mandatory enforcement, but +1 on encouragement.
>
> You'll find that with the slosh of messages for unrelated projects on the
> commons list, having a hint of what to read or dump is very helpful.
Still, it will lead to an increase of the number of times [d] has to be
hit. Would be nice to have a mail-agent in which I can hit 'D' or
something and it will kill anything in that thread.
Hen
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by "Geir Magnusson Jr." <ge...@adeptra.com>.
On 11/3/02 10:41 PM, "Justin Erenkrantz" <je...@apache.org> wrote:
> --On Sunday, November 3, 2002 7:33 PM -0500 Henri Yandell
> <ba...@generationjava.com> wrote:
>
>> Exactly [regex bit]. Commons and Jakarta-Taglibs both work well when
>> people obey this convention [with [general] as an 'everyone' one],
>> but enforcing it would stop the frequent times when a new user to
>> the Dev list has to be given the speech.
>>
>> Also stops us forgetting too :)
>
> -1 on mandatory enforcement of this.
>
> If people want to have this as a convention fine, but this should not
> be required.
>
> Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
> good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
> subject lines in the first place. -- justin
-1 on mandatory enforcement, but +1 on encouragement.
You'll find that with the slosh of messages for unrelated projects on the
commons list, having a hint of what to read or dump is very helpful.
geir
--
Geir Magnusson Jr.
geirm@adeptra.com +1-203-355-2219 (w)
Adeptra Inc. +1-203-247-1713 (m)
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Justin Erenkrantz <je...@apache.org>.
--On Sunday, November 3, 2002 7:33 PM -0500 Henri Yandell
<ba...@generationjava.com> wrote:
> Exactly [regex bit]. Commons and Jakarta-Taglibs both work well when
> people obey this convention [with [general] as an 'everyone' one],
> but enforcing it would stop the frequent times when a new user to
> the Dev list has to be given the speech.
>
> Also stops us forgetting too :)
-1 on mandatory enforcement of this.
If people want to have this as a convention fine, but this should not
be required.
Personally, I don't think adding such fields to the subject line is a
good idea. IMHO, a far better thing is to just have meaningful
subject lines in the first place. -- justin
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On Sun, 3 Nov 2002, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
> Henri Yandell wrote:
> >
> > Is it possible for the list itself to refuse any mail which does not have
> > a [..] in the title?
>
> probably; i'd have to check. you like as in requiring every post to
> have something like '[java-regex]' or '[c-regex]' in the subject?
> yes, my suggestion to filter things didn't provide much to work
> from, did it. :-/
Exactly [regex bit]. Commons and Jakarta-Taglibs both work well when
people obey this convention [with [general] as an 'everyone' one], but
enforcing it would stop the frequent times when a new user to the Dev list
has to be given the speech.
Also stops us forgetting too :)
Hen
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Rodent of Unusual Size <Ke...@Golux.Com>.
Henri Yandell wrote:
>
> Is it possible for the list itself to refuse any mail which does not have
> a [..] in the title?
probably; i'd have to check. you like as in requiring every post to
have something like '[java-regex]' or '[c-regex]' in the subject?
yes, my suggestion to filter things didn't provide much to work
from, did it. :-/
Re: [VOTE: commons lists]
Posted by Henri Yandell <ba...@generationjava.com>.
On Sun, 3 Nov 2002, Rodent of Unusual Size wrote:
> [+1] One mother general@ list, with specific breakouts when needed
> [-1] Per-concept mailing lists (define "concept" however)
> [-1] Per-language mailing lists
>
> i'm bothered by the 'i don't want to see what the <other-foo> people
> are working on' syndrome i've seen some people express here. well,
> maybe you aren't -- so filter it out.
Is it possible for the list itself to refuse any mail which does not have
a [..] in the title?
Hen