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Posted to dev@ant.apache.org by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org> on 2009/12/18 16:12:25 UTC
Naming of target-group
Hi all
I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to come up
with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall being
proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
anyway.
I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
(1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
(a) target-group
(b) phase
(c) goal
(d - z) anything else
(2) What do we want to call the attribute of <target> that is used to
add a target to a depends-list of (1)?
(a) group
(b - z) anything else
Stefan
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Nicolas Lalevée <ni...@hibnet.org>.
On Fri, 18 Dec 2009 16:12:25 +0100, Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>
wrote:
> Hi all
>
> I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to come up
> with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall being
> proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
> anyway.
>
> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>
> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
>
> (a) target-group
no objection for me
>
> (b) phase
>
> (c) goal
Both I would prefer not to, as this could recall maven concepts which are
not quite similar to the target-group current implementation.
> (d - z) anything else
abstract-target, so it says it is about making some "API" in the build
script.
>
> (2) What do we want to call the attribute of <target> that is used to
> add a target to a depends-list of (1)?
>
> (a) group
fine for me with the target-group element
>
> (b - z) anything else
an attribute corresponding to abstract-target: hookedto. A first idea
would be "implements", but it doesn't feel like inheritance. I prefer the
"hook" notion that the target will be added to the dependency of another
abstract one.
Nicolas
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Raja Nagendra Kumar <Na...@tejasoft.com>.
How about some thing like
<target name="" category=""/>
or
<category name=""/>
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>.
On 2009-12-18, Kevin Jackson <fo...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
>> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
> - moving-target (very familiar for people working in IT)
combined with change-request for the attribute this made my day, thanks.
Stefan
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Kevin Jackson <fo...@gmail.com>.
> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>
> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
- moving-target (very familiar for people working in IT)
or
- mutable-target ?
>
> (a) target-group
>
> (b) phase
>
> (c) goal
>
> (d - z) anything else
>
> (2) What do we want to call the attribute of <target> that is used to
> add a target to a depends-list of (1)?
>
> (a) group
>
> (b - z) anything else
- change-request...
- mutable
Kev
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Bruce Atherton <br...@callenish.com>.
Coming into this thread I didn't really have an opinion, but I like this
reasoning. +1 for both.
Nicolas Lalevée wrote:
>
> Well, the main use case I see of target groups is about using them between
> different build scripts, as also noted in the documentation Stefan just
> wrote. So the "extension point" is more an extension point of the build
> script, more than a extension point of a particular target.
> So finally I quite like it.
>
> "extension point" cannot make me not think about Eclipse's ones. In
> Eclipse the extender is called the "extension", and the extended is called
> the "extension point". So I am +1 for "extension-point" in replacement of
> "target-group". And for the attribute on the target I would suggest
> "extensionOf".
>
> Nicolas
>
>
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Nicolas Lalevée <ni...@hibnet.org>.
On Mon, 21 Dec 2009 14:00:53 -0500, Sandu Turcan <at...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> On the other hand the term extension point sounds generic and appears
> to accept anything the system operates on, like tasks, types, targets,
> dependencies etc.
> In this case we're only talking about targets.
> I think a more explicit term that has the word target in it would work
> better.
Well, the main use case I see of target groups is about using them between
different build scripts, as also noted in the documentation Stefan just
wrote. So the "extension point" is more an extension point of the build
script, more than a extension point of a particular target.
So finally I quite like it.
"extension point" cannot make me not think about Eclipse's ones. In
Eclipse the extender is called the "extension", and the extended is called
the "extension point". So I am +1 for "extension-point" in replacement of
"target-group". And for the attribute on the target I would suggest
"extensionOf".
Nicolas
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 9:59 AM, Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>>
>> On Dec 20, 2009, at 11:10 PM, Stefan Bodewig wrote:
>>
>>> On 2009-12-19, Gilles Scokart <gs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a
>>>> brainstorming
>>>> :
>>>
>>> absolutely.
>>>
>>>> What about extension-point ?
>>>
>>> Sounds good.
>>
>> I don't think I weighed in on "extension-point" yet, but I like it as
>> well.
>> It's very direct as to its meaning and yet doesn't make assumptions
>> about
>> the buildfile's structure the way e.g. "phase" does.
>>
>> -Matt
>>
>>>
>>> Stefan
>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
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>>
>
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Sandu Turcan <at...@gmail.com>.
On the other hand the term extension point sounds generic and appears
to accept anything the system operates on, like tasks, types, targets,
dependencies etc.
In this case we're only talking about targets.
I think a more explicit term that has the word target in it would work better.
On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 9:59 AM, Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> On Dec 20, 2009, at 11:10 PM, Stefan Bodewig wrote:
>
>> On 2009-12-19, Gilles Scokart <gs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a brainstorming
>>> :
>>
>> absolutely.
>>
>>> What about extension-point ?
>>
>> Sounds good.
>
> I don't think I weighed in on "extension-point" yet, but I like it as well.
> It's very direct as to its meaning and yet doesn't make assumptions about
> the buildfile's structure the way e.g. "phase" does.
>
> -Matt
>
>>
>> Stefan
>>
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>>
>
>
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com>.
On Dec 20, 2009, at 11:10 PM, Stefan Bodewig wrote:
> On 2009-12-19, Gilles Scokart <gs...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a
>> brainstorming :
>
> absolutely.
>
>> What about extension-point ?
>
> Sounds good.
I don't think I weighed in on "extension-point" yet, but I like it as
well. It's very direct as to its meaning and yet doesn't make
assumptions about the buildfile's structure the way e.g. "phase" does.
-Matt
>
> Stefan
>
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>.
On 2009-12-19, Gilles Scokart <gs...@gmail.com> wrote:
> But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a brainstorming :
absolutely.
> What about extension-point ?
Sounds good.
Stefan
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com>.
On Dec 19, 2009, at 8:00 AM, Gilles Scokart wrote:
> 2009/12/18 Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>
>
>> Hi all
>>
>> I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to
>> come up
>> with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall
>> being
>> proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
>> anyway.
>>
>> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>>
>> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
>> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
>>
>> (a) target-group
>>
>> (b) phase
>>
>> (c) goal
>>
>> (d - z) anything else
>>
>
>
> I like target-group.
> But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a
> brainstorming :
> What about extension-point ?
>
I like it. -Matt
> Gilles Scokart
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Gilles Scokart <gs...@gmail.com>.
2009/12/18 Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>
> Hi all
>
> I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to come up
> with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall being
> proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
> anyway.
>
> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>
> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
>
> (a) target-group
>
> (b) phase
>
> (c) goal
>
> (d - z) anything else
>
I like target-group.
But still I would take the risk to turn this thread into a brainstorming :
What about extension-point ?
Gilles Scokart
Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>.
Stefan Bodewig wrote:
> Hi all
>
> I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to come up
> with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall being
> proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
> anyway.
>
> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>
> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
>
> (a) target-group
>
I am fine with target-group. We can explain in the doc whether this
concept is similar to maven goals.
> (b) phase
>
> (c) goal
>
> (d - z) anything else
>
> (2) What do we want to call the attribute of <target> that is used to
> add a target to a depends-list of (1)?
>
> (a) group
>
I am fine with this or target-group as in the current code base.
> (b - z) anything else
>
> Stefan
>
>
Regards,
Antoine
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Re: Naming of target-group
Posted by Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com>.
I have to say, I think "goal" is semantically reasonable--that said I
would want to use it. Let's just say I'd like to emphasize the
dissimiliarities between Ant and Maven. ;) "phase" is not terrible,
but seems to imply that a buildfile represents a single "story" which
is not always the case. I might recommend a name that evokes the
"concern" concept... any ideas down that path?
-Matt
On Dec 18, 2009, at 9:12 AM, Stefan Bodewig wrote:
> Hi all
>
> I've been responsible for too many bad naming choices to try to
> come up
> with something new here. I've collected the names that I recall being
> proposed, but I may have missed some and the choices may not be good
> anyway.
>
> I understand that (2) is very dependent on (1).
>
> (1) What do we want to call the new element that behaves quite a bit
> like a target but has a dependency list that can be extended?
>
> (a) target-group
>
> (b) phase
>
> (c) goal
>
> (d - z) anything else
>
> (2) What do we want to call the attribute of <target> that is used to
> add a target to a depends-list of (1)?
>
> (a) group
>
> (b - z) anything else
>
> Stefan
>
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