You are viewing a plain text version of this content. The canonical link for it is here.
Posted to users@tapestry.apache.org by Geoff Callender <ge...@gmail.com> on 2008/05/01 14:01:01 UTC
[ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Hi all,
JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
this release:
* Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with components,
and with separate pages.
* Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back and
Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
* Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump to
them.
* Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
* Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
* The Select component - new and better examples.
You'll find JumpStart at:
http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
been used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
annotations. I pray that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look
forward to any contributions that will help it along.
As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
brutal - I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff
more useful.
Cheers,
Geoff Callender
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>.
Not a lot beyond JavaDoc; my blog has a little bit of detail; the rest
is "documented" via unit tests and the CommitAfterWorker (in
tapestry-hibernate).
Oh ... and at the risk of Feeding the Troll; features are added based
on YAGNI. Previously, there was not a compelling reason for AOP;
however, as the other Formos developers have been adding features,
they've strayed into more heavy use of Javassist. Javassist is too
powerful and finicky a tool (even wrapped via ClassTransformation or
ClassFab) for a casual developer. The Formos guys got things working,
but that's because I was available to give them some direct
assistance. On the other hand, the method advice approach is super
simple. In retrospect, several of the existing
ComponentClassTransformWorkers could be recoded using method advice.
I may, in 5.1, introduce field advice.
On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 3:20 PM, Geoff Callender
<ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Sounds interesting. Any doco in the nightlies?
>
>
>
> On 02/05/2008, at 5:17 AM, Howard Lewis Ship wrote:
>
>
> > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > annotations much, much easier.
> >
> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > > release:
> > >
> > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> components,
> > > and with separate pages.
> > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back
> and
> > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump
> to
> > > them.
> > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > >
> > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > >
> > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > >
> > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not been
> > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I
> pray
> > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > contributions that will help it along.
> > >
> > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or brutal
> -
> > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> useful.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Geoff Callender
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> >
> > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Geoff Callender <ge...@gmail.com>.
Sounds interesting. Any doco in the nightlies?
On 02/05/2008, at 5:17 AM, Howard Lewis Ship wrote:
> I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> annotations much, much easier.
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>>
>> JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
>> this
>> release:
>>
>> * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
>> components,
>> and with separate pages.
>> * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the
>> Back and
>> Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
>> * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
>> jump to
>> them.
>> * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
>> * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
>> * The Select component - new and better examples.
>>
>> You'll find JumpStart at:
>>
>> http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
>>
>> The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
>> been
>> used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
>> annotations. I pray
>> that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
>> contributions that will help it along.
>>
>> As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
>> brutal -
>> I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
>> useful.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Geoff Callender
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>
> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by SergeEby <sd...@hotmail.com>.
Hi,
Read the tips on Geoff website:
http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
/Serge
CG-6 wrote:
>
> Not sure whether this is the correct place to ask abt jumpstart or
> not, however, I really need some hints.
>
> Jumpstart is using the hsql embeded in JBoss, I would like to use
> mysql instead, and i saw the building process does download
> mysql-connector-java .
>
> I wonder how should I configure to use mysql in jumpstart. i'm a
> newbie in java, hibernate, tapestry , any explanation in detail is
> much appreciated, thanks.
>
> I did some search on google , and I think persistence.xml require
> modification , am I right ?
>
> CG
>
> On Sat, May 3, 2008 at 12:41 AM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>> It's rather anemic by AspectJ standards, but has a number of
>> advantages in terms of working consistently within the T5 IoC
>> framework. Currently, it's just method advice; for services, there is
>> a AspectDecorator service (which may be used from a decorate method).
>> For components, there's a new advise() method on ClassTransformation.
>> The other things you could already do using ClassTransformation (and
>> ComponentClassTransformWorker) also fall into the AOP category.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > Does that mean we'll have T5AOP in 5.0.12 ? Is this going to be a new
>> > module or built into core?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method
>> advice
>> > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods
>> and
>> > > annotations much, much easier.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
>> > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > Hi all,
>> > > >
>> > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New
>> in this
>> > > > release:
>> > > >
>> > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
>> components,
>> > > > and with separate pages.
>> > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle
>> the Back and
>> > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
>> > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets
>> you jump to
>> > > > them.
>> > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your
>> session.
>> > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
>> > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
>> > > >
>> > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
>> > > >
>> > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
>> > > >
>> > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has
>> not been
>> > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
>> annotations. I pray
>> > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
>> > > > contributions that will help it along.
>> > > >
>> > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful
>> or brutal -
>> > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff
>> more useful.
>> > > >
>> > > > Cheers,
>> > > >
>> > > > Geoff Callender
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > --
>> > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
>> > >
>> > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>>
>> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>>
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
>
--
View this message in context: http://www.nabble.com/-ANN--JumpStart-3.6%3A-Wizards%2C-Conversations%2C-and-more-tp17000326p17187311.html
Sent from the Tapestry - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by CG <le...@gmail.com>.
Not sure whether this is the correct place to ask abt jumpstart or
not, however, I really need some hints.
Jumpstart is using the hsql embeded in JBoss, I would like to use
mysql instead, and i saw the building process does download
mysql-connector-java .
I wonder how should I configure to use mysql in jumpstart. i'm a
newbie in java, hibernate, tapestry , any explanation in detail is
much appreciated, thanks.
I did some search on google , and I think persistence.xml require
modification , am I right ?
CG
On Sat, May 3, 2008 at 12:41 AM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's rather anemic by AspectJ standards, but has a number of
> advantages in terms of working consistently within the T5 IoC
> framework. Currently, it's just method advice; for services, there is
> a AspectDecorator service (which may be used from a decorate method).
> For components, there's a new advise() method on ClassTransformation.
> The other things you could already do using ClassTransformation (and
> ComponentClassTransformWorker) also fall into the AOP category.
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Does that mean we'll have T5AOP in 5.0.12 ? Is this going to be a new
> > module or built into core?
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > > annotations much, much easier.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > > > release:
> > > >
> > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with components,
> > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back and
> > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump to
> > > > them.
> > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > >
> > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > >
> > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > >
> > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not been
> > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I pray
> > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > >
> > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or brutal -
> > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more useful.
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > >
> > > > Geoff Callender
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > >
> > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>
> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>.
It's rather anemic by AspectJ standards, but has a number of
advantages in terms of working consistently within the T5 IoC
framework. Currently, it's just method advice; for services, there is
a AspectDecorator service (which may be used from a decorate method).
For components, there's a new advise() method on ClassTransformation.
The other things you could already do using ClassTransformation (and
ComponentClassTransformWorker) also fall into the AOP category.
On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 12:30 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Does that mean we'll have T5AOP in 5.0.12 ? Is this going to be a new
> module or built into core?
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > annotations much, much easier.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > > release:
> > >
> > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with components,
> > > and with separate pages.
> > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back and
> > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump to
> > > them.
> > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > >
> > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > >
> > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > >
> > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not been
> > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I pray
> > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > contributions that will help it along.
> > >
> > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or brutal -
> > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more useful.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Geoff Callender
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> >
> > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>.
Does that mean we'll have T5AOP in 5.0.12 ? Is this going to be a new
module or built into core?
On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 2:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> annotations much, much easier.
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > release:
> >
> > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with components,
> > and with separate pages.
> > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back and
> > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump to
> > them.
> > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> >
> > You'll find JumpStart at:
> >
> > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> >
> > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not been
> > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I pray
> > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > contributions that will help it along.
> >
> > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or brutal -
> > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more useful.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Geoff Callender
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>
> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>.
Rob,
I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods. Could
you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement this
using your solution.
Thanks,
-adam
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 4:14 AM, Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Howard,
>
> You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
> Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
> something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> implementation?
> This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By the time
> T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast we've ever
> seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
>
> Rob
>
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > annotations much, much easier.
> >
> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > > release:
> > >
> > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> > components,
> > > and with separate pages.
> > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back
> > and
> > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
> > jump to
> > > them.
> > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > >
> > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > >
> > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > >
> > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
> > been
> > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I
> > pray
> > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > contributions that will help it along.
> > >
> > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
> > brutal -
> > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> > useful.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Geoff Callender
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> >
> > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
RE: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Jonathan Barker <jo...@gmail.com>.
Rob,
Glad to see you're still alive and well. I'm still waiting for an answer to
my question: "Given that you have no intention of using Tapestry for serious
work, you do not give assistance to users, nor do you request assistance
from other users, why do you post to this list?"
I do wonder if you've ever taken CS101. I've taught a number of university
CS courses - second-year and above - so I have some experience here. Let's
cover some of the basics:
- Each assignment is different, so there is no backward compatibility to
break.
- In rare cases where there are dependencies between assignments, you're the
only one it affects, because other students can't use your code.
- Everybody is doing the same thing that no-one will ever actually use,
because the purpose is to evaluate some aspect of the student's learning.
What you call "after-thoughts" others might call "progress". If you remove
"after-thoughts" from any project, you never get past version 1.0 and the
project stagnates.
If Tapestry is the result of giving beer to Howard, I have another reason to
like beer!
Jonathan
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rob Smeets [mailto:rb.smeets@gmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, May 02, 2008 10:59 AM
> To: Tapestry users
> Subject: Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
>
> At least in the environment where I work, non of my team members have ever
> violated CS101 like Howard constantly does. The guy doesn't even think and
> design before he codes. Much of his working routine are based on after
> thoughts. Thereby constantly breaking backwards compatibility. Probably
> most
> of his ideas pop up after he'd sipped some buckets of beer into his belly.
> They are just absurd ideas. I hope he releases T5 sooner and makes a
> release
> announcement at theserverside.com. I would then go there and put the final
> nail on Tapestry's coffin.
> Let Howard dare to ask me technical questions. I would answer it for free.
> I
> exempt him from payment because he badly needs help.
> So Howard, the ball is in your court. Adam, maybe you could advise him to
> come seek it.
>
> Regards,
>
> Rob
>
> On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 4:24 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > You pathetic troll. My challenge to you was just to show that you will
> > always avoid technical discussion because you're simply uneducated (if
> > you are educated, show us some proof - maybe we'll find out your true
> > identity), technically-challenged, loud & obnoxious spammer with
> > one-and-only agenda, to waste people's time. If I want the answer,
> > I'll get it right here, from people that actually know their stuff :)
> >
> > heh,heh
> >
> > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 9:12 AM, Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > Adam,
> > >
> > > Would you pay me after I give you the technical answers you desire?
> If
> > yes,
> > > then drop me a line off list and we could discuss rates, etc. Upon
> > agreement
> > > you'd receive high quality technical answers to your queries. Just
> keep
> > note
> > > that my services are not for free.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Rob
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > A typical trollish Smeets, avoiding technical discussion. I will
> ask
> > > > you again, since you seem to know SO MUCH about AOP:
> > > >
> > > > >You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> > insane.
> > > > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> > over-engineering
> > > > > something this simple.
> > > >
> > > > So I ask YOU AGAIN Rob:
> > > >
> > > > I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods.
> Could
> > > > you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
> > > > Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement
> this
> > > > using your solution.
> > > >
> > > > Please, give me a specific technical answer.
> > > >
> > > > -adam
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Christian Edward Gruber
> > > > <ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have
> been
> > on
> > > > this
> > > > > list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a
> separate
> > > > > sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely
> > independently
> > > > of
> > > > > the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by the web
> > framework,
> > > > but
> > > > > are part of the infrastructure. And even if it was in the web
> > framework,
> > > > > it's not bloat given the nature and size of the implementation.
> > > > >
> > > > > Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique.
> You
> > have
> > > > one
> > > > > or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on
> this
> > list
> > > > have
> > > > > agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda,
> which
> > should
> > > > be
> > > > > clear to all by a light reading of the history.
> > > > >
> > > > > As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using
> > Tapestry in
> > > > > apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it
> merely
> > > > doesn't
> > > > > have all the features some people want for it to be "done
> enough".
> > It's
> > > > > been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my customers
> see
> > it.
> > > > > You might argue with it, but who the heck are you? I'll go with
> my
> > own
> > > > and
> > > > > my clients' architects analysis of T5 vs. other (yes even more
> > "mature")
> > > > > frameworks. Do they have problems? Yes. But they have no more
> > problems
> > > > > than when they started using Struts back in the day. Mostly
> they're
> > not
> > > > > problems of T5, but of understanding how to properly use the new
> > > > framework
> > > > > given their old habits and assumptions. And they all agree that
> the
> > > > > learning curve on T5 is way shorter.
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > Christian.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Howard,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This
> is
> > > > insane.
> > > > > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> > > > over-engineering
> > > > > > something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a
> CORBA
> > > > > > implementation?
> > > > > > This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5.
> By
> > the
> > > > time
> > > > > > T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy
> beast
> > we've
> > > > > ever
> > > > > > seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Rob
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <
> > hlship@gmail.com>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new
> method
> > advice
> > > > > > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with
> > methods and
> > > > > > > annotations much, much easier.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > > > > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11.
> New in
> > > > > this
> > > > > > > > release:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments,
> with
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > components,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > > > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to
> handle
> > the
> > > > Back
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > and
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > > > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and
> lets
> > you
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > jump to
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > them.
> > > > > > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your
> > session.
> > > > > > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > > > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and
> > has not
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > been
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
> > > > annotations.
> > > > > I
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > pray
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to
> > any
> > > > > > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be
> helpful
> > or
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > brutal -
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this
> stuff
> > more
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > useful.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Geoff Callender
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> > > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-
> unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-
> help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------
> --
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com>.
At least in the environment where I work, non of my team members have ever
violated CS101 like Howard constantly does. The guy doesn't even think and
design before he codes. Much of his working routine are based on after
thoughts. Thereby constantly breaking backwards compatibility. Probably most
of his ideas pop up after he'd sipped some buckets of beer into his belly.
They are just absurd ideas. I hope he releases T5 sooner and makes a release
announcement at theserverside.com. I would then go there and put the final
nail on Tapestry's coffin.
Let Howard dare to ask me technical questions. I would answer it for free. I
exempt him from payment because he badly needs help.
So Howard, the ball is in your court. Adam, maybe you could advise him to
come seek it.
Regards,
Rob
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 4:24 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You pathetic troll. My challenge to you was just to show that you will
> always avoid technical discussion because you're simply uneducated (if
> you are educated, show us some proof - maybe we'll find out your true
> identity), technically-challenged, loud & obnoxious spammer with
> one-and-only agenda, to waste people's time. If I want the answer,
> I'll get it right here, from people that actually know their stuff :)
>
> heh,heh
>
> On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 9:12 AM, Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Adam,
> >
> > Would you pay me after I give you the technical answers you desire? If
> yes,
> > then drop me a line off list and we could discuss rates, etc. Upon
> agreement
> > you'd receive high quality technical answers to your queries. Just keep
> note
> > that my services are not for free.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Rob
> >
> >
> >
> > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > A typical trollish Smeets, avoiding technical discussion. I will ask
> > > you again, since you seem to know SO MUCH about AOP:
> > >
> > > >You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> insane.
> > > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> over-engineering
> > > > something this simple.
> > >
> > > So I ask YOU AGAIN Rob:
> > >
> > > I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods. Could
> > > you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
> > > Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement this
> > > using your solution.
> > >
> > > Please, give me a specific technical answer.
> > >
> > > -adam
> > >
> > > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Christian Edward Gruber
> > > <ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have been
> on
> > > this
> > > > list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a separate
> > > > sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely
> independently
> > > of
> > > > the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by the web
> framework,
> > > but
> > > > are part of the infrastructure. And even if it was in the web
> framework,
> > > > it's not bloat given the nature and size of the implementation.
> > > >
> > > > Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique. You
> have
> > > one
> > > > or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on this
> list
> > > have
> > > > agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda, which
> should
> > > be
> > > > clear to all by a light reading of the history.
> > > >
> > > > As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using
> Tapestry in
> > > > apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it merely
> > > doesn't
> > > > have all the features some people want for it to be "done enough".
> It's
> > > > been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my customers see
> it.
> > > > You might argue with it, but who the heck are you? I'll go with my
> own
> > > and
> > > > my clients' architects analysis of T5 vs. other (yes even more
> "mature")
> > > > frameworks. Do they have problems? Yes. But they have no more
> problems
> > > > than when they started using Struts back in the day. Mostly they're
> not
> > > > problems of T5, but of understanding how to properly use the new
> > > framework
> > > > given their old habits and assumptions. And they all agree that the
> > > > learning curve on T5 is way shorter.
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > Christian.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Howard,
> > > > >
> > > > > You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> > > insane.
> > > > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> > > over-engineering
> > > > > something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> > > > > implementation?
> > > > > This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By
> the
> > > time
> > > > > T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast
> we've
> > > > ever
> > > > > seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
> > > > >
> > > > > Rob
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <
> hlship@gmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method
> advice
> > > > > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with
> methods and
> > > > > > annotations much, much easier.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > > > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
> > > > this
> > > > > > > release:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > components,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle
> the
> > > Back
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > and
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets
> you
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > jump to
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > them.
> > > > > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your
> session.
> > > > > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and
> has not
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > been
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
> > > annotations.
> > > > I
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > pray
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to
> any
> > > > > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful
> or
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > brutal -
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff
> more
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > useful.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Geoff Callender
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail:
> users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>.
You pathetic troll. My challenge to you was just to show that you will
always avoid technical discussion because you're simply uneducated (if
you are educated, show us some proof - maybe we'll find out your true
identity), technically-challenged, loud & obnoxious spammer with
one-and-only agenda, to waste people's time. If I want the answer,
I'll get it right here, from people that actually know their stuff :)
heh,heh
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 9:12 AM, Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Adam,
>
> Would you pay me after I give you the technical answers you desire? If yes,
> then drop me a line off list and we could discuss rates, etc. Upon agreement
> you'd receive high quality technical answers to your queries. Just keep note
> that my services are not for free.
>
> Regards,
> Rob
>
>
>
> On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > A typical trollish Smeets, avoiding technical discussion. I will ask
> > you again, since you seem to know SO MUCH about AOP:
> >
> > >You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
> > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
> > > something this simple.
> >
> > So I ask YOU AGAIN Rob:
> >
> > I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods. Could
> > you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
> > Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement this
> > using your solution.
> >
> > Please, give me a specific technical answer.
> >
> > -adam
> >
> > On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Christian Edward Gruber
> > <ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have been on
> > this
> > > list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a separate
> > > sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely independently
> > of
> > > the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by the web framework,
> > but
> > > are part of the infrastructure. And even if it was in the web framework,
> > > it's not bloat given the nature and size of the implementation.
> > >
> > > Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique. You have
> > one
> > > or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on this list
> > have
> > > agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda, which should
> > be
> > > clear to all by a light reading of the history.
> > >
> > > As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using Tapestry in
> > > apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it merely
> > doesn't
> > > have all the features some people want for it to be "done enough". It's
> > > been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my customers see it.
> > > You might argue with it, but who the heck are you? I'll go with my own
> > and
> > > my clients' architects analysis of T5 vs. other (yes even more "mature")
> > > frameworks. Do they have problems? Yes. But they have no more problems
> > > than when they started using Struts back in the day. Mostly they're not
> > > problems of T5, but of understanding how to properly use the new
> > framework
> > > given their old habits and assumptions. And they all agree that the
> > > learning curve on T5 is way shorter.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Christian.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > Howard,
> > > >
> > > > You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> > insane.
> > > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> > over-engineering
> > > > something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> > > > implementation?
> > > > This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By the
> > time
> > > > T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast we've
> > > ever
> > > > seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
> > > >
> > > > Rob
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > > > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > > > > annotations much, much easier.
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hi all,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
> > > this
> > > > > > release:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> > > > > >
> > > > > components,
> > > > >
> > > > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the
> > Back
> > > > > >
> > > > > and
> > > > >
> > > > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
> > > > > >
> > > > > jump to
> > > > >
> > > > > > them.
> > > > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > > > >
> > > > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
> > > > > >
> > > > > been
> > > > >
> > > > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
> > annotations.
> > > I
> > > > > >
> > > > > pray
> > > > >
> > > > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
> > > > > >
> > > > > brutal -
> > > > >
> > > > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> > > > > >
> > > > > useful.
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Geoff Callender
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > > > >
> > > > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com>.
Adam,
Would you pay me after I give you the technical answers you desire? If yes,
then drop me a line off list and we could discuss rates, etc. Upon agreement
you'd receive high quality technical answers to your queries. Just keep note
that my services are not for free.
Regards,
Rob
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 2:21 PM, Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> A typical trollish Smeets, avoiding technical discussion. I will ask
> you again, since you seem to know SO MUCH about AOP:
>
> >You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
> > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
> > something this simple.
>
> So I ask YOU AGAIN Rob:
>
> I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods. Could
> you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
> Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement this
> using your solution.
>
> Please, give me a specific technical answer.
>
> -adam
>
> On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Christian Edward Gruber
> <ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have been on
> this
> > list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a separate
> > sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely independently
> of
> > the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by the web framework,
> but
> > are part of the infrastructure. And even if it was in the web framework,
> > it's not bloat given the nature and size of the implementation.
> >
> > Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique. You have
> one
> > or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on this list
> have
> > agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda, which should
> be
> > clear to all by a light reading of the history.
> >
> > As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using Tapestry in
> > apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it merely
> doesn't
> > have all the features some people want for it to be "done enough". It's
> > been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my customers see it.
> > You might argue with it, but who the heck are you? I'll go with my own
> and
> > my clients' architects analysis of T5 vs. other (yes even more "mature")
> > frameworks. Do they have problems? Yes. But they have no more problems
> > than when they started using Struts back in the day. Mostly they're not
> > problems of T5, but of understanding how to properly use the new
> framework
> > given their old habits and assumptions. And they all agree that the
> > learning curve on T5 is way shorter.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Christian.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
> >
> >
> > > Howard,
> > >
> > > You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> insane.
> > > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on
> over-engineering
> > > something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> > > implementation?
> > > This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By the
> time
> > > T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast we've
> > ever
> > > seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
> > >
> > > Rob
> > >
> > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > > > annotations much, much easier.
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
> > this
> > > > > release:
> > > > >
> > > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> > > > >
> > > > components,
> > > >
> > > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the
> Back
> > > > >
> > > > and
> > > >
> > > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
> > > > >
> > > > jump to
> > > >
> > > > > them.
> > > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > > >
> > > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > > >
> > > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > > >
> > > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
> > > > >
> > > > been
> > > >
> > > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
> annotations.
> > I
> > > > >
> > > > pray
> > > >
> > > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > > >
> > > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
> > > > >
> > > > brutal -
> > > >
> > > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> > > > >
> > > > useful.
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > >
> > > > > Geoff Callender
> > > > >
> > > > >
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > > >
> > > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Adam Zimowski <zi...@gmail.com>.
A typical trollish Smeets, avoiding technical discussion. I will ask
you again, since you seem to know SO MUCH about AOP:
>You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
> Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
> something this simple.
So I ask YOU AGAIN Rob:
I'm on 5.0.11 right now, and I need to advice my page methods. Could
you help me with this? Can you tell me exactly how to do it with
Spring AOP? Please, be technical enough so that I can implement this
using your solution.
Please, give me a specific technical answer.
-adam
On Fri, May 2, 2008 at 6:55 AM, Christian Edward Gruber
<ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have been on this
> list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a separate
> sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely independently of
> the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by the web framework, but
> are part of the infrastructure. And even if it was in the web framework,
> it's not bloat given the nature and size of the implementation.
>
> Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique. You have one
> or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on this list have
> agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda, which should be
> clear to all by a light reading of the history.
>
> As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using Tapestry in
> apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it merely doesn't
> have all the features some people want for it to be "done enough". It's
> been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my customers see it.
> You might argue with it, but who the heck are you? I'll go with my own and
> my clients' architects analysis of T5 vs. other (yes even more "mature")
> frameworks. Do they have problems? Yes. But they have no more problems
> than when they started using Struts back in the day. Mostly they're not
> problems of T5, but of understanding how to properly use the new framework
> given their old habits and assumptions. And they all agree that the
> learning curve on T5 is way shorter.
>
> Cheers,
> Christian.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
>
>
> > Howard,
> >
> > You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
> > Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
> > something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> > implementation?
> > This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By the time
> > T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast we've
> ever
> > seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
> >
> > Rob
> >
> > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> >
> > > I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> > > support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> > > annotations much, much easier.
> > >
> > > On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> > > <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
> this
> > > > release:
> > > >
> > > > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> > > >
> > > components,
> > >
> > > > and with separate pages.
> > > > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back
> > > >
> > > and
> > >
> > > > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > > > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
> > > >
> > > jump to
> > >
> > > > them.
> > > > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > > > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > > > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> > > >
> > > > You'll find JumpStart at:
> > > >
> > > > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> > > >
> > > > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
> > > >
> > > been
> > >
> > > > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations.
> I
> > > >
> > > pray
> > >
> > > > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > > > contributions that will help it along.
> > > >
> > > > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
> > > >
> > > brutal -
> > >
> > > > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> > > >
> > > useful.
> > >
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > >
> > > > Geoff Callender
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Howard M. Lewis Ship
> > >
> > > Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Christian Edward Gruber <ch...@gmail.com>.
You're being deliberately obtuse and Trollish, Rob. You have been on
this list long enough to know that the IoC infrastructure is a
separate sub-project. I use it in a framework of my own, completely
independently of the web-framework. The AOP features are are used by
the web framework, but are part of the infrastructure. And even if it
was in the web framework, it's not bloat given the nature and size of
the implementation.
Go away. All you do is complain without providing critique. You have
one or two good "meta" critiques, and you have made them, most on this
list have agreed, and you never shut up about it. You have an agenda,
which should be clear to all by a light reading of the history.
As to T5's releasability, I already have three clients using Tapestry
in apps nearing production. It's stable enough for release, it merely
doesn't have all the features some people want for it to be "done
enough". It's been "releasable quality" for two versions now, as my
customers see it. You might argue with it, but who the heck are
you? I'll go with my own and my clients' architects analysis of T5
vs. other (yes even more "mature") frameworks. Do they have
problems? Yes. But they have no more problems than when they started
using Struts back in the day. Mostly they're not problems of T5, but
of understanding how to properly use the new framework given their old
habits and assumptions. And they all agree that the learning curve on
T5 is way shorter.
Cheers,
Christian.
On 2-May-08, at 05:14 , Rob Smeets wrote:
> Howard,
>
> You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is
> insane.
> Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-
> engineering
> something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
> implementation?
> This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By
> the time
> T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast
> we've ever
> seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
>
> Rob
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
>> support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
>> annotations much, much easier.
>>
>> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
>> <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in
>>> this
>>> release:
>>>
>>> * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
>> components,
>>> and with separate pages.
>>> * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the
>>> Back
>> and
>>> Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
>>> * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
>> jump to
>>> them.
>>> * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
>>> * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
>>> * The Select component - new and better examples.
>>>
>>> You'll find JumpStart at:
>>>
>>> http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
>>>
>>> The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
>> been
>>> used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with
>>> annotations. I
>> pray
>>> that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
>>> contributions that will help it along.
>>>
>>> As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
>> brutal -
>>> I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
>> useful.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Geoff Callender
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>>
>> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>>
>>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Rob Smeets <rb...@gmail.com>.
Howard,
You're bundling an AOP into T5 core- a mere webframework? This is insane.
Howard, Webframework is simple and it seems you keep on over-engineering
something this simple. Well, when are you going to bundle a CORBA
implementation?
This guy is always coming up with an excuse not to release T5. By the time
T5 goes final, maybe in 3 years, it'll be the biggest hairy beast we've ever
seen. This is all insanity to the power 64.
Rob
On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 9:17 PM, Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
> support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
> annotations much, much easier.
>
> On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
> <ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> > release:
> >
> > * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with
> components,
> > and with separate pages.
> > * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back
> and
> > Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> > * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you
> jump to
> > them.
> > * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> > * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> > * The Select component - new and better examples.
> >
> > You'll find JumpStart at:
> >
> > http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
> >
> > The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not
> been
> > used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I
> pray
> > that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> > contributions that will help it along.
> >
> > As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or
> brutal -
> > I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more
> useful.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Geoff Callender
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Howard M. Lewis Ship
>
> Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
Re: [ANN] JumpStart 3.6: Wizards, Conversations, and more
Posted by Howard Lewis Ship <hl...@gmail.com>.
I can't wait to see what you put together using the new method advice
support in 5.0.12; it makes doing interesting things with methods and
annotations much, much easier.
On Thu, May 1, 2008 at 5:01 AM, Geoff Callender
<ge...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> JumpStart 3.6 is now available. It's for Tapestry 5.0.11. New in this
> release:
>
> * Wizards - 3 styles explored: with form fragments, with components,
> and with separate pages.
> * Conversations - implemented in the wizards to handle the Back and
> Reload buttons and sessions shared by new windows.
> * Conversations List - shows your conversations and lets you jump to
> them.
> * Session Display - see what objects are in your session.
> * Autocomplete Mixin - see it in action.
> * The Select component - new and better examples.
>
> You'll find JumpStart at:
>
> http://files.doublenegative.com.au/jumpstart
>
> The implementation of conversations is my own invention and has not been
> used in anger. I'm sure it could be improved, eg. with annotations. I pray
> that it doesn't have any holes in it, and I look forward to any
> contributions that will help it along.
>
> As always, comments and suggestions are encouraged. Be helpful or brutal -
> I don't care which - because it all helps to make this stuff more useful.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Geoff Callender
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org
>
>
--
Howard M. Lewis Ship
Creator Apache Tapestry and Apache HiveMind
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: users-unsubscribe@tapestry.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: users-help@tapestry.apache.org