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Posted to derby-user@db.apache.org by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com> on 2005/12/21 19:01:35 UTC
Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
I uploaded draft images to
http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-747 . web-preview-20dec05.png
is a partial screen shot that shows derby-log-web-150x90.png in use with
a Firefox browser.
I'm afraid my graphics ability is limited to adding the word "derby"
with gimp. I'd invite anyone with time/talent to upload something nicer.
regards,
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Andrew McIntyre wrote:
>
> On Dec 21, 2005, at 7:57 PM, Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> We voted for more than just the one version of the logo with the text.
>> In any event, that specific logo is great for the Derby documentation,
>> but it's too wide for web site display. The screen shot at
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
>> doesn't show what it looks like when you expand/reduce the browser
>> window. The image displayed on the web site needs to be more narrow.
>>
>
> I realize this isn't the best solution, but couldn't we put the current
> logo in a fixed <div> as-is? And maybe swap the Derby and DB logos. Yes,
> that means one of them flows off screen while the rest of the website
> fits in the window width. But I wanted to point it out as another
> possible option.
>
> I just attached a version of the logo with the logo text at the current
> size, but rearranged to make it more
> narrow: http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321510/derby-logo-move.jpg
>
> I can also resize and adjust this text however you like, and I think it
> keeps more to the spirit of Roger's original submission to retain the
> typeface and use of bold text. I could make this prettier by reducing
> the size somewhat and right aligning the text, but I thought I would run
> this first version by you to see if that was sufficient, and to get your
> feedback on using a fixed <div> for the logos on the page (with either
> logo.)
if you could figure out a way to make a fixed <div> work in forrest,
that would open up another option -- I don't see how to make that work.
The best strategies so far seem to be:
- keep the image narrow enough to fit
- move the search box from the mast head to the nav bar on the left,
which fortunately turns out to be easy to do
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Andrew McIntyre <mc...@gmail.com>.
On Dec 21, 2005, at 7:57 PM, Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> We voted for more than just the one version of the logo with the
> text. In any event, that specific logo is great for the Derby
> documentation, but it's too wide for web site display. The screen
> shot at http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/
> web-preview-20dec05-2.png doesn't show what it looks like when you
> expand/reduce the browser window. The image displayed on the web
> site needs to be more narrow.
I realize this isn't the best solution, but couldn't we put the
current logo in a fixed <div> as-is? And maybe swap the Derby and DB
logos. Yes, that means one of them flows off screen while the rest of
the website fits in the window width. But I wanted to point it out as
another possible option.
I just attached a version of the logo with the logo text at the
current size, but rearranged to make it more narrow: http://
issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321510/derby-logo-move.jpg
I can also resize and adjust this text however you like, and I think
it keeps more to the spirit of Roger's original submission to retain
the typeface and use of bold text. I could make this prettier by
reducing the size somewhat and right aligning the text, but I thought
I would run this first version by you to see if that was sufficient,
and to get your feedback on using a fixed <div> for the logos on the
page (with either logo.)
andrew
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Daniel John Debrunner wrote:
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>>In other words, we should modify the variations of the logo Roger
>>donated under the ASL as needed to fit a particular purpose. I don't
>>believe that adding text to the logo fundamentally changes it.
>
>
> I guess it depends, I was thinking more along the lines where the very
> look and feel of the text is part of the logo/brand, not just something
> alongside it.
>
> For example with Mazda, the logo is the "wing M" but the font/style
> of the text is integral to the brand.
> http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayHomepage.action
>
> Maybe Nike is more a logo where the image is everything (the swoosh),
> and the text Nike can be in different fonts.
Roger's variations seem to be focused on the *hat* . The button
variations do have DERBY in them, but the font is different from the one
used for
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321023/derby_with_text.jpg
.
-- but I'll let Roger speak for himself.
> I do think that a variety of Derby logos with different text is not a
> desirable thing. Basically it reduces the impact of the logo, so that it
> is not instantly recognized, due to the subtle changes.
So maybe we need to enter a second phase here of designing the text to
go with the hat?
> Of course, I don't have the skill to modify images so maybe I should
> just stick to the code. :-)
>
> Dan.
> Ps. the feather comment was tongue in cheek.
>
well, I wouldn't protest if somebody wanted to add a feather -- they'd
just need to make sure they had the talent to do so. I sure don't!
Here's the screenshot that incorporates Susan's variation that splits
"Apache Derby" across two lines:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321508/web-preview-21dec05-5.png
And here's a screenshot that uses just the hat and nothing but the hat:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321509/web-preview-21dec05-6.png
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Daniel John Debrunner <dj...@debrunners.com>.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> In other words, we should modify the variations of the logo Roger
> donated under the ASL as needed to fit a particular purpose. I don't
> believe that adding text to the logo fundamentally changes it.
I guess it depends, I was thinking more along the lines where the very
look and feel of the text is part of the logo/brand, not just something
alongside it.
For example with Mazda, the logo is the "wing M" but the font/style
of the text is integral to the brand.
http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayHomepage.action
Maybe Nike is more a logo where the image is everything (the swoosh),
and the text Nike can be in different fonts.
I do think that a variety of Derby logos with different text is not a
desirable thing. Basically it reduces the impact of the logo, so that it
is not instantly recognized, due to the subtle changes.
Of course, I don't have the skill to modify images so maybe I should
just stick to the code. :-)
Dan.
Ps. the feather comment was tongue in cheek.
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by PageDeveloper <sp...@page-developer.net>.
I like this one.
Steven Pierce
Page-Developer
714-841-9246
> ------------Original Message------------
> From: Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>
> To: "Derby Discussion" <de...@db.apache.org>
> Date: Thu, Dec-22-2005 12:09 PM
> Subject: Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
>
> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>
> it's called masthead_derby.png
> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
> > Craig L Russell wrote:
> >
> >> ...
> >> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
> >> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used
>
> >> for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are
> needed?
> >
> >
> > Roger posted that he'll help:
> >
> >
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
> >
> >
> > thanks, Roger!
> >
> > -jean
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.0.371 / Virus Database: 267.14.3/209 - Release Date:
> 12/21/2005
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Roger Dudler wrote:
> ok, that's much better, try to use 16px instead of 20 I think that's
> enough.
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321539/masthead_derby5.png
decreases the white space and the screenshot includes more context
surrounding the masthead.
Reminder: this still uses the derby logo I cut&pasted from
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321532/masthead_derby2.png
, which is a little blurry. When people provide feedback, Roger can
produce a crisp final.
-jean
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>
>>> try to make the apache db project logo a little smaller like in my
>>> image. because of the main part is derby, so it should be more
>>> intensive. and make the whole head with a little more space overall,
>>> this means, give about 20px top and bottom.
>>
>>
>>
>> In this screenshot, the db project logo is shrunk by 25% , and white
>> space increases by 20 pixels top and bottom:
>>
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321536/masthead_derby4.png
>>
>>
>> thanks for the excellent suggestions,
>>
>> -jean
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
ok, that's much better, try to use 16px instead of 20 I think that's enough.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Roger Dudler wrote:
>
>> try to make the apache db project logo a little smaller like in my
>> image. because of the main part is derby, so it should be more
>> intensive. and make the whole head with a little more space overall,
>> this means, give about 20px top and bottom.
>
>
> In this screenshot, the db project logo is shrunk by 25% , and white
> space increases by 20 pixels top and bottom:
>
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321536/masthead_derby4.png
>
>
> thanks for the excellent suggestions,
>
> -jean
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Roger Dudler wrote:
> try to make the apache db project logo a little smaller like in my
> image. because of the main part is derby, so it should be more
> intensive. and make the whole head with a little more space overall,
> this means, give about 20px top and bottom.
In this screenshot, the db project logo is shrunk by 25% , and white
space increases by 20 pixels top and bottom:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321536/masthead_derby4.png
thanks for the excellent suggestions,
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
try to make the apache db project logo a little smaller like in my
image. because of the main part is derby, so it should be more
intensive. and make the whole head with a little more space overall,
this means, give about 20px top and bottom.
greets
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>
>>> What images do you need and in which sizes and how should they be
>>> named?
>>
>>
>>
>> Actually, let's avoid your having to do much more work before more
>> people provide feedback.
>>
>> I can do a really quick prototype with a cut&paste from
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321532/masthead_derby2.png
>> that will help determine sizing.
>>
>> back in a minute .....
>
>
>
> ok here's a screen shot of the cut&paste into the web site:
>
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321533/masthead_derby3.png
>
>
> People looking at this: the derby logo in this draft is a cut&paste
> from masthead_derby2.png, so is a little blurred. This is just a test.
> How do you like the logo and the placement?
>
> -jean
>
>
>> -jean
>>
>>
>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Just added the db-project logo.
>>>>>
>>>>> Check it out, please.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Roger, I like this.
>>>>
>>>> With the derby logo on the left and db logo on the right, the hat
>>>> and feather create a solid separation so the words don't dominate
>>>> the mast head,
>>>> which was the problem with
>>>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> What do others think?
>>>>
>>>> Roger, I'll assume you aren't familiar with forrest (though, in
>>>> fact, you might be). One piece of context is forrest generates the
>>>> masthead given information and images specified in a configuration
>>>> file. If you want to upload the new Derby logo image, I can do a
>>>> quick site build with it and post a screen shot of what that would
>>>> look like on the site.
>>>>
>>>> thanks,
>>>>
>>>> -jean
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira
>>>>>>> issue
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>>>>>>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the
>>>>>> "Open Source Database" subline.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain
>>>>>> the Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background
>>>>>> is at
>>>>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png
>>>>>> . (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB
>>>>>> PMC for permission.)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -jean
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time
>>>>>>>>> putting Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors
>>>>>>>>> that can be used for these purposes? Do we have a list of
>>>>>>>>> aspect ratios that are needed?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -jean
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Roger Dudler wrote:
>
>> What images do you need and in which sizes and how should they be named?
>
>
> Actually, let's avoid your having to do much more work before more
> people provide feedback.
>
> I can do a really quick prototype with a cut&paste from
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321532/masthead_derby2.png
> that will help determine sizing.
>
> back in a minute .....
ok here's a screen shot of the cut&paste into the web site:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321533/masthead_derby3.png
People looking at this: the derby logo in this draft is a cut&paste from
masthead_derby2.png, so is a little blurred. This is just a test. How do
you like the logo and the placement?
-jean
> -jean
>
>
>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>
>>>> Just added the db-project logo.
>>>>
>>>> Check it out, please.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Roger, I like this.
>>>
>>> With the derby logo on the left and db logo on the right, the hat and
>>> feather create a solid separation so the words don't dominate the
>>> mast head,
>>> which was the problem with
>>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
>>> .
>>>
>>> What do others think?
>>>
>>> Roger, I'll assume you aren't familiar with forrest (though, in fact,
>>> you might be). One piece of context is forrest generates the masthead
>>> given information and images specified in a configuration file. If
>>> you want to upload the new Derby logo image, I can do a quick site
>>> build with it and post a screen shot of what that would look like on
>>> the site.
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>>
>>> -jean
>>>
>>>
>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>>>>>>
>>>>>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>>>>>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
>>>>> Source Database" subline.
>>>>>
>>>>> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain
>>>>> the Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is
>>>>> at
>>>>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png .
>>>>> (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC
>>>>> for permission.)
>>>>>
>>>>> -jean
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time
>>>>>>>> putting Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that
>>>>>>>> can be used for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect
>>>>>>>> ratios that are needed?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -jean
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Roger Dudler wrote:
> What images do you need and in which sizes and how should they be named?
Actually, let's avoid your having to do much more work before more
people provide feedback.
I can do a really quick prototype with a cut&paste from
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321532/masthead_derby2.png
that will help determine sizing.
back in a minute .....
-jean
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>
>>> Just added the db-project logo.
>>>
>>> Check it out, please.
>>>
>>
>> Roger, I like this.
>>
>> With the derby logo on the left and db logo on the right, the hat and
>> feather create a solid separation so the words don't dominate the mast
>> head,
>> which was the problem with
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
>> .
>>
>> What do others think?
>>
>> Roger, I'll assume you aren't familiar with forrest (though, in fact,
>> you might be). One piece of context is forrest generates the masthead
>> given information and images specified in a configuration file. If you
>> want to upload the new Derby logo image, I can do a quick site build
>> with it and post a screen shot of what that would look like on the site.
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>> -jean
>>
>>
>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>>>>>
>>>>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>>>>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
>>>> Source Database" subline.
>>>>
>>>> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain
>>>> the Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is
>>>> at https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png
>>>> . (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC
>>>> for permission.)
>>>>
>>>> -jean
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time
>>>>>>> putting Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that
>>>>>>> can be used for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect
>>>>>>> ratios that are needed?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -jean
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
What images do you need and in which sizes and how should they be named?
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Roger Dudler wrote:
>
>> Just added the db-project logo.
>>
>> Check it out, please.
>>
>
> Roger, I like this.
>
> With the derby logo on the left and db logo on the right, the hat and
> feather create a solid separation so the words don't dominate the mast
> head,
> which was the problem with
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
> .
>
> What do others think?
>
> Roger, I'll assume you aren't familiar with forrest (though, in fact,
> you might be). One piece of context is forrest generates the masthead
> given information and images specified in a configuration file. If you
> want to upload the new Derby logo image, I can do a quick site build
> with it and post a screen shot of what that would look like on the site.
>
> thanks,
>
> -jean
>
>
>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>>>>
>>>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>>>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
>>> Source Database" subline.
>>>
>>> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain
>>> the Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is
>>> at https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png
>>> . (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC
>>> for permission.)
>>>
>>> -jean
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time
>>>>>> putting Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that
>>>>>> can be used for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect
>>>>>> ratios that are needed?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>>>
>>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>>>
>>>>> -jean
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Roger Dudler wrote:
> Just added the db-project logo.
>
> Check it out, please.
>
Roger, I like this.
With the derby logo on the left and db logo on the right, the hat and
feather create a solid separation so the words don't dominate the mast head,
which was the problem with
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
.
What do others think?
Roger, I'll assume you aren't familiar with forrest (though, in fact,
you might be). One piece of context is forrest generates the masthead
given information and images specified in a configuration file. If you
want to upload the new Derby logo image, I can do a quick site build
with it and post a screen shot of what that would look like on the site.
thanks,
-jean
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Roger Dudler wrote:
>>
>>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>>>
>>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
>> Source Database" subline.
>>
>> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain the
>> Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is at
>> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png .
>> (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC for
>> permission.)
>>
>> -jean
>>
>>>
>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> ...
>>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
>>>>> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be
>>>>> used for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that
>>>>> are needed?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>>
>>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>>
>>>> -jean
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
Just added the db-project logo.
Check it out, please.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Roger Dudler wrote:
>
>> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>>
>> it's called masthead_derby.png
>> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
>
>
>
> Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
> Source Database" subline.
>
> Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain the
> Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is at
> https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png .
> (If we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC for
> permission.)
>
> -jean
>
>>
>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>>
>>>> ...
>>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
>>>> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be
>>>> used for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that
>>>> are needed?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>>
>>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>>
>>>
>>> thanks, Roger!
>>>
>>> -jean
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Roger Dudler wrote:
> I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
>
> it's called masthead_derby.png
> <http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
Thanks, Roger! This looks very nice and I especially like the "Open
Source Database" subline.
Since Derby is a subproject of Apache DB I would prefer to retain the
Apache DB logo -- the image with the transparent background is at
https://svn.apache.org/repos/asf/db/site/xdocs/images/db-logo.png . (If
we wanted to change this logo, we would need to ask the DB PMC for
permission.)
-jean
>
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Craig L Russell wrote:
>>
>>> ...
>>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
>>> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used
>>> for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are needed?
>>
>>
>>
>> Roger posted that he'll help:
>>
>> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>>
>>
>> thanks, Roger!
>>
>> -jean
>>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
I've attached one masthead proposal. Take a look at it at jira issue
it's called masthead_derby.png
<http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321531/masthead_derby.png>
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Craig L Russell wrote:
>
>> ...
>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
>> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used
>> for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are needed?
>
>
> Roger posted that he'll help:
>
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>
>
> thanks, Roger!
>
> -jean
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Roger Dudler <rd...@iframe.ch>.
Is anyone of you interested to give me some feedback and discuss about
logo usage today evening (my time CET) in a messenger like msn? just
write me your msn, aim, skype or whatever please.
Greets Roger
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Craig L Russell wrote:
>
>> ...
>> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
>> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used
>> for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are needed?
>
>
> Roger posted that he'll help:
>
> http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
>
>
> thanks, Roger!
>
> -jean
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Craig L Russell wrote:
>...
> Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
> Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used for
> these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are needed?
Roger posted that he'll help:
http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/db-derby-user/200512.mbox/%3c7821F143EA9CCE4CB155A55E6B8814BE011F9CC4@sax10226.bia.abraxas.ch%3e
thanks, Roger!
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Craig L Russell <Cr...@Sun.COM>.
Hi Jean,
On Dec 21, 2005, at 7:57 PM, Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> We voted for more than just the one version of the logo with the
> text. In any event, that specific logo is great for the Derby
> documentation, but it's too wide for web site display. The screen
> shot at http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/
> web-preview-20dec05-2.png doesn't show what it looks like when you
> expand/reduce the browser window. The image displayed on the web
> site needs to be more narrow.
>
> I'm looking at Susan's variation and I believe it very nicely
> encapsulates what Roger did in a more narrow space. --I'll post a
> screenshot of what that looks like.
>
> We could of course, simply use the hat without any wording at all:
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321265/
> logo_320x200.png . However, that particular image is too large for
> the web site, so thus requires resizing. I don't believe that
> resizing it creates a new variation.
I agree that resizing it proportionally does not create a new
variation of the logo.
>
> In other words, we should modify the variations of the logo Roger
> donated under the ASL as needed to fit a particular purpose. I
> don't believe that adding text to the logo fundamentally changes it.
I don't agree. Removing some legally offending text from the logo
might be seen as not changing it, but changing the font and bold
characteristics does change it IMHO. If we're filling a box in a web
page, it's a logo.
Could we ask Roger if he's willing to spend a bit more time putting
Apache Derby with the hat into various form factors that can be used
for these purposes? Do we have a list of aspect ratios that are needed?
Craig
Craig Russell
Architect, Sun Java Enterprise System http://java.sun.com/products/jdo
408 276-5638 mailto:Craig.Russell@sun.com
P.S. A good JDO? O, Gasp!
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Daniel John Debrunner wrote:
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>>I found the right forrest incantation to put the search box on the nav
>>bar:
>>http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321505/web-preview-20dec05-4.png
>> .
>
>
> Susan Cline wrote:
>
>> Attachment: derby_logo_small_dec21.png
>>
>>Here's another option for consideration on our web site. The font is *fairly* closely matched with the Apache DB Project Font.
>
>
> I'm a little lost here, Jean and Susan seem to be proposing new versions
> of the logo that we voted on a couple of weeks ago.
>
> Is that the case? Do we have to vote to accept these? Or could they be
> seen as variations on a theme and acceptable. [which means, what would
> make it different, adding a feather :-)]
We voted on Roger's logo, which he split out into the various components
at http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-747 .
> Is there some reason for not using the logo with the text that was voted
> upon? For legal (trademark) reasons we would need to remove the "Pure
> Java Database" tag, but apart from that it is what I thought was voted on.
We voted for more than just the one version of the logo with the text.
In any event, that specific logo is great for the Derby documentation,
but it's too wide for web site display. The screen shot at
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
doesn't show what it looks like when you expand/reduce the browser
window. The image displayed on the web site needs to be more narrow.
I'm looking at Susan's variation and I believe it very nicely
encapsulates what Roger did in a more narrow space. --I'll post a
screenshot of what that looks like.
We could of course, simply use the hat without any wording at all:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321265/logo_320x200.png
. However, that particular image is too large for the web site, so thus
requires resizing. I don't believe that resizing it creates a new variation.
In other words, we should modify the variations of the logo Roger
donated under the ASL as needed to fit a particular purpose. I don't
believe that adding text to the logo fundamentally changes it.
> Jean wrote:
>
>>Unless I hear objections or better suggestions, I'll go ahead and commit this change to the web site Friday mid day (Pacific time).
>
> Is that just moving the search bar, adding a logo (which?) or both?
Mostly I was planning to commit what I did today, unless I could
generate some interest, which I apparently did -- excellent! I'm open
to suggestions of how to incorporate the Derby logo into the web site;
however, I need to make it clear that my own graphics abilities are
limited to the ability to erase wording and add (some) wording.
If people want to keep solely to what Roger donated, then I would choose
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321265/logo_320x200.png
resized to fit the web site.
If you want to discuss adding a feather to it -- sure, we can discuss
that as well.
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Daniel John Debrunner <dj...@debrunners.com>.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> I found the right forrest incantation to put the search box on the nav
> bar:
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321505/web-preview-20dec05-4.png
> .
Susan Cline wrote:
> Attachment: derby_logo_small_dec21.png
>
> Here's another option for consideration on our web site. The font is *fairly* closely matched with the Apache DB Project Font.
I'm a little lost here, Jean and Susan seem to be proposing new versions
of the logo that we voted on a couple of weeks ago.
Is that the case? Do we have to vote to accept these? Or could they be
seen as variations on a theme and acceptable. [which means, what would
make it different, adding a feather :-)]
Is there some reason for not using the logo with the text that was voted
upon? For legal (trademark) reasons we would need to remove the "Pure
Java Database" tag, but apart from that it is what I thought was voted on.
Jean wrote:
> Unless I hear objections or better suggestions, I'll go ahead and commit this change to the web site Friday mid day (Pacific time).
Is that just moving the search bar, adding a logo (which?) or both?
Dan.
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Michelle Caisse wrote:
> IMHO, this one is quite fine. There is room on the left navbar for a
> search box, if you can get it to show up there and if you can get the
> search button under the text box instead of adjacent to it.
I found the right forrest incantation to put the search box on the nav
bar:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321505/web-preview-20dec05-4.png
.
This provides a convenient opportunity to restrict site search to just
db.apache.org. So far it has been set to apache.org and somebody
complained. But since the change requires regenerating all pages, it was
best to wait until all pages needed to be regenerated anyhow.
Unless I hear objections or better suggestions, I'll go ahead and commit
this change to the web site Friday mid day (Pacific time).
btw, I printed off the new logo and taped it to the back of my laptop
during ApacheCon last week. Everyone loves it. Roger, your contribution
is appreciated very much.
-jean
> -- Michelle
>
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>>
>>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>>
>>>> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I think it might be best to leave
>>>>> the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the
>>>>> header in place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> So down in the page text itself?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yes, that's what I was thinking.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Good idea, but it didn't work. Forrest lets you include the image in
>> the tag controlling that text (i.e., it passes xml validation), but it
>> excludes the image from the built page.
>>
>> Also, I understand the ojb table usage you mentioned -- they use
>> forrest 0.6. Derby uses forrest 0.7, which renders pages without using
>> tables.
>>
>> I liked your suggestion to eliminate the search box (we could include
>> tips on how to search the derby site in an FAQ), so here's another
>> attempt using the logo with shorter text (and shrunk a little) and no
>> search box:
>>
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321501/web-preview-20dec05-3.png
>>
>>
>> -jean
>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Michelle Caisse <Mi...@Sun.COM>.
IMHO, this one is quite fine. There is room on the left navbar for a
search box, if you can get it to show up there and if you can get the
search button under the text box instead of adjacent to it.
-- Michelle
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>
>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>>>
>>>> I think it might be best to leave
>>>> the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the
>>>> header in place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
>>>
>>>
>>> So down in the page text itself?
>>
>>
>> Yes, that's what I was thinking.
>
>
>
> Good idea, but it didn't work. Forrest lets you include the image in
> the tag controlling that text (i.e., it passes xml validation), but it
> excludes the image from the built page.
>
> Also, I understand the ojb table usage you mentioned -- they use
> forrest 0.6. Derby uses forrest 0.7, which renders pages without using
> tables.
>
> I liked your suggestion to eliminate the search box (we could include
> tips on how to search the derby site in an FAQ), so here's another
> attempt using the logo with shorter text (and shrunk a little) and no
> search box:
>
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321501/web-preview-20dec05-3.png
>
>
> -jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Michelle Caisse wrote:
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>>
>>> I think it might be best to leave
>>> the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the header
>>> in place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
>>
>> So down in the page text itself?
>
> Yes, that's what I was thinking.
Good idea, but it didn't work. Forrest lets you include the image in the
tag controlling that text (i.e., it passes xml validation), but it
excludes the image from the built page.
Also, I understand the ojb table usage you mentioned -- they use forrest
0.6. Derby uses forrest 0.7, which renders pages without using tables.
I liked your suggestion to eliminate the search box (we could include
tips on how to search the derby site in an FAQ), so here's another
attempt using the logo with shorter text (and shrunk a little) and no
search box:
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321501/web-preview-20dec05-3.png
-jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Michelle Caisse <Mi...@Sun.COM>.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Michelle Caisse wrote:
>
>> I think it might be best to leave
>> the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the header
>> in place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
>
>
> So down in the page text itself?
Yes, that's what I was thinking.
-- Michelle
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Michelle Caisse wrote:
> Too crowded, I'm afraid. It's going to be hard to make anything look
> good competing with the Apache banner and logo in the same page header.
> I notice that the two other DB projects with logos, OJB and DdlUtils,
> dispense with the search box in the header, which helps some.
Dispensing with the search box is easily done.
> Additionally, OJB puts the two header images (Apache and OJB) in a table
> so that when you decrease the window width the two logos remain on the
> same line. The logo gets cut off with a narrow window, but it prevents
> even uglier things from happening.
I'll look at how ojb did that. derby also uses forrest -- and with the
default set up you don't have good control over exactly what goes where
because the skin is supposed to handle that. I'll look at how ojb did it.
> I think it might be best to leave
> the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the header in
> place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
So down in the page text itself?
thanks for the suggestions,
-jean
> My $.02.
>
> -- Michelle
>
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> I uploaded draft images to
>>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-747 .
>>> web-preview-20dec05.png is a partial screen shot that shows
>>> derby-log-web-150x90.png in use with a Firefox browser.
>>>
>>> I'm afraid my graphics ability is limited to adding the word "derby"
>>> with gimp. I'd invite anyone with time/talent to upload something nicer.
>>
>>
>>
>> I uploaded another screen shot --
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
>> incorporates
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321023/derby_with_text.jpg
>> , but without the 'Pure Java Database' subline.
>>
>> suggestions?
>>
>> -jean
>
>
>
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by Michelle Caisse <Mi...@Sun.COM>.
Too crowded, I'm afraid. It's going to be hard to make anything look
good competing with the Apache banner and logo in the same page header.
I notice that the two other DB projects with logos, OJB and DdlUtils,
dispense with the search box in the header, which helps some.
Additionally, OJB puts the two header images (Apache and OJB) in a table
so that when you decrease the window width the two logos remain on the
same line. The logo gets cut off with a narrow window, but it prevents
even uglier things from happening. I think it might be best to leave
the page header to Apache DB and use the Derby logo below the header in
place of the text "The Apache Derby Project".
My $.02.
-- Michelle
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> Jean T. Anderson wrote:
>
>> I uploaded draft images to
>> http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-747 .
>> web-preview-20dec05.png is a partial screen shot that shows
>> derby-log-web-150x90.png in use with a Firefox browser.
>>
>> I'm afraid my graphics ability is limited to adding the word "derby"
>> with gimp. I'd invite anyone with time/talent to upload something nicer.
>
>
> I uploaded another screen shot --
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
> incorporates
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321023/derby_with_text.jpg
> , but without the 'Pure Java Database' subline.
>
> suggestions?
>
> -jean
Re: Incorporating the new derby logo into the web site
Posted by "Jean T. Anderson" <jt...@bristowhill.com>.
Jean T. Anderson wrote:
> I uploaded draft images to
> http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/DERBY-747 . web-preview-20dec05.png
> is a partial screen shot that shows derby-log-web-150x90.png in use with
> a Firefox browser.
>
> I'm afraid my graphics ability is limited to adding the word "derby"
> with gimp. I'd invite anyone with time/talent to upload something nicer.
I uploaded another screen shot --
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321496/web-preview-20dec05-2.png
incorporates
http://issues.apache.org/jira/secure/attachment/12321023/derby_with_text.jpg
, but without the 'Pure Java Database' subline.
suggestions?
-jean