[mentors] updates.netbeans.org

[Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com>]

Hi all, especially our mentors,

When we donate netbeans.org and related properties to Apache, there's one
area that's important to be aware of and hopefully find an answer to and
that is the following URL:

updates.netbeans.org

When everything becomes netbeans.apache.org, the above URL will need to
stay the way it is, it cannot become 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.

The reason for that is that the above is hardcoded into NetBeans IDE. It
points to the official NetBeans update center, where plugins are found.

Although the URL is not hardcoded in the sense that it is in a Java source
file, it is in a Properties file and can be changed in the Plugin Manager
in NetBeans by any user. However, we don't believe the majority of people
will apply such an update to NetBeans, therefore if  the URL were to change
under Apache, the majority of NetBeans users will still have "
updates.netbeans.org" applied and will be not be able to receive updates.

For example, what can happen, once in a while, is that security updates
need to be applied to NetBeans, based on Oracle requirements and demands,
on previous versions of NetBeans, i.e., from before the donation to Apache.

Therefore, 'updates.netbeans.org' must stay 'updates.netbeans.org' and not
change to 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.

Two possible solutions:

1. We donate all of netbeans.org to Apache, but Apache accepts that '
updates.netbeans.org' will not be changed to 'updated.netbeans.apache.org'.

2. We do not donate 'updates.netbeans.org' to Apache, i.e., we exclude it
from the donation.

Thoughts welcome.

Thanks,

Geertjan

Re: [mentors] updates.netbeans.org

[Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>]

I think it's simpler if per the donation agreement updates.netbeans.org
will resolve to an Oracle IP address until a given date, say 2020.


--emi

On Wed, Apr 5, 2017 at 10:55 PM, Simon IJskes <si...@ijskes.org> wrote:

> My thoughts: I think you should strive for transfer of the domain to
> apache.
>
> As oracle will continue to handle the updates of the non-apache versions,
> it will need to keep a webservice for providing these updates.
>
> A webserver @ apache listening to updates.netbeans.org kan forward the
> requests to netbeans.oracle.com. Or the updates.netbeans.org domainname
> can point to a service within oracle infra. The responsibility to keep up
> this server/lookup can be agreed in the transfer contract.
>
> This way the netbeans.org domain can be transfered to apache, and old
> installations in the field can keep receiving the updates.
>
> For new (apache) installations in the field, they can query another url,
> for instance 'updates.netbeans.apache.org', but they can also query
> updates.netbeans.org with an other path, which can be used to distinguish
> between different forwards. It all depends on the updates service
> capabilities (thinking of CDN solutions).
>
> Maybe serving non-apache data from an apache owned domain, needs to be
> checked by apache-legal.
>
> Also apache-infra needs to know what kind of load to expect on
> updates.netbeans.org.
>
> G. Simon
>
>
>
> On 05-04-17 16:17, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
>
>> Hi all, especially our mentors,
>>
>> When we donate netbeans.org and related properties to Apache, there's one
>> area that's important to be aware of and hopefully find an answer to and
>> that is the following URL:
>>
>> updates.netbeans.org
>>
>> When everything becomes netbeans.apache.org, the above URL will need to
>> stay the way it is, it cannot become 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.
>>
>> The reason for that is that the above is hardcoded into NetBeans IDE. It
>> points to the official NetBeans update center, where plugins are found.
>>
>> Although the URL is not hardcoded in the sense that it is in a Java source
>> file, it is in a Properties file and can be changed in the Plugin Manager
>> in NetBeans by any user. However, we don't believe the majority of people
>> will apply such an update to NetBeans, therefore if  the URL were to
>> change
>> under Apache, the majority of NetBeans users will still have "
>> updates.netbeans.org" applied and will be not be able to receive updates.
>>
>> For example, what can happen, once in a while, is that security updates
>> need to be applied to NetBeans, based on Oracle requirements and demands,
>> on previous versions of NetBeans, i.e., from before the donation to
>> Apache.
>>
>> Therefore, 'updates.netbeans.org' must stay 'updates.netbeans.org' and
>> not
>> change to 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.
>>
>> Two possible solutions:
>>
>> 1. We donate all of netbeans.org to Apache, but Apache accepts that '
>> updates.netbeans.org' will not be changed to 'updated.netbeans.apache.org
>> '.
>>
>> 2. We do not donate 'updates.netbeans.org' to Apache, i.e., we exclude it
>> from the donation.
>>
>> Thoughts welcome.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Geertjan
>>
>>
>

Re: [mentors] updates.netbeans.org

[Simon IJskes <si...@ijskes.org>]

My thoughts: I think you should strive for transfer of the domain to apache.

As oracle will continue to handle the updates of the non-apache 
versions, it will need to keep a webservice for providing these updates.

A webserver @ apache listening to updates.netbeans.org kan forward the 
requests to netbeans.oracle.com. Or the updates.netbeans.org domainname 
can point to a service within oracle infra. The responsibility to keep 
up this server/lookup can be agreed in the transfer contract.

This way the netbeans.org domain can be transfered to apache, and old 
installations in the field can keep receiving the updates.

For new (apache) installations in the field, they can query another url, 
for instance 'updates.netbeans.apache.org', but they can also query 
updates.netbeans.org with an other path, which can be used to 
distinguish between different forwards. It all depends on the updates 
service capabilities (thinking of CDN solutions).

Maybe serving non-apache data from an apache owned domain, needs to be 
checked by apache-legal.

Also apache-infra needs to know what kind of load to expect on 
updates.netbeans.org.

G. Simon


On 05-04-17 16:17, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> Hi all, especially our mentors,
>
> When we donate netbeans.org and related properties to Apache, there's one
> area that's important to be aware of and hopefully find an answer to and
> that is the following URL:
>
> updates.netbeans.org
>
> When everything becomes netbeans.apache.org, the above URL will need to
> stay the way it is, it cannot become 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.
>
> The reason for that is that the above is hardcoded into NetBeans IDE. It
> points to the official NetBeans update center, where plugins are found.
>
> Although the URL is not hardcoded in the sense that it is in a Java source
> file, it is in a Properties file and can be changed in the Plugin Manager
> in NetBeans by any user. However, we don't believe the majority of people
> will apply such an update to NetBeans, therefore if  the URL were to change
> under Apache, the majority of NetBeans users will still have "
> updates.netbeans.org" applied and will be not be able to receive updates.
>
> For example, what can happen, once in a while, is that security updates
> need to be applied to NetBeans, based on Oracle requirements and demands,
> on previous versions of NetBeans, i.e., from before the donation to Apache.
>
> Therefore, 'updates.netbeans.org' must stay 'updates.netbeans.org' and not
> change to 'updates.netbeans.apache.org'.
>
> Two possible solutions:
>
> 1. We donate all of netbeans.org to Apache, but Apache accepts that '
> updates.netbeans.org' will not be changed to 'updated.netbeans.apache.org'.
>
> 2. We do not donate 'updates.netbeans.org' to Apache, i.e., we exclude it
> from the donation.
>
> Thoughts welcome.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Geertjan
>

Re: [mentors] updates.netbeans.org

[Neil C Smith <ne...@neilcsmith.net>]

On Wed, 5 Apr 2017, 15:17 Geertjan Wielenga, <
geertjan.wielenga@googlemail.com> wrote:

> When everything becomes netbeans.apache.org,
>

Out of interest, why would it? There are other Apache projects with their
own domains.

Best wishes,

Neil

> --
Neil C Smith
Artist & Technologist
www.neilcsmith.net

Praxis LIVE - hybrid visual IDE for creative coding - www.praxislive.org