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Posted to announcements@struts.apache.org by Martin Cooper <ma...@apache.org> on 2005/01/23 22:03:02 UTC
[ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework. The Shale codebase was
initiated by Craig McClanahan in the Struts sandbox, and development
traffic regarding Shale has steadily increased. As the product is heading
towards an initial release, the Struts PMC felt it time to formally adopt
Struts Shale as a subproject.
Today, Struts is comprised of eight subprojects: Core, Taglib, Tiles, El,
Faces, Scripting, Applications, and (now) Shale. An initiative is underway
to extract the Struts Tiles code into a standalone product. Several Struts
developers plan to apply to the ASF to incubate Tiles as a toplevel
project. [http://wiki.apache.org/struts/TilesTopLevel ]
Extracts from the FAQ
*Why are you offering both Struts Shale and Struts Classic? Don't they
compete for new development?*
We do offer Struts developers a choice, but, hey, choice is good. :)
People who want to create and maintain Struts Classic are welcome to do
so.
People who want to create and maintain Struts Shale are equally welcome.
As a volunteer organization, we are not constrained by the economics of
competition. All we need are volunteers who are ready, willing, and able
to do the work. So long as we have volunteers, we have work for them to
do. :)
Right now, we have volunteers who want to leverage the new JavaServer
Faces framework by using Struts Shale for new development. We also have
volunteers who prefer to leverage their existing investment in Struts
Classic. All are welcome.
For more about volunteering, visit our how to help page
[http://struts.apache.org/faqs/helping.html].
*Will Struts Shale become Struts 2.x?*
Right now, there are no concrete plans for a 2.x release of Struts
Classic. The people working on the 1.x series want to evolve the code base
without breaking backward compatibility. If we do our job right, then a
2.x release may never be needed.
Meanwhile, Struts Shale has its own identity and its own release cycle.
Struts Classic is one subproject, and Struts Shale is another.
We encourage you to choose the framework that works best for you. (Even if
it is not one of ours!)
* Is Struts Shale a fork?*
No. It's an entirely new codebase. Struts Shale is an MVC framework for
web applications, like Struts Classic, but it's a fresh start. Struts
Shale is the best choice for developers eager to leverage the latest
technologies, like JavaServer Faces.
Both frameworks will have a home here so long as there are volunteers
ready to contribute.
####
--
Martin Cooper
Re: OT Friday: Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
Struts Shale has no impact on Struts Classic or Jericho.
As mentioned elsewhere, we are not governed by the economics of scarcity.
Likewise, we are not governed by the economics of market share. There are several very active projects with thriving communities with a much smaller market share than Struts. The ASF doesn't care whether three hundred or three million developers use the framework. The foundation's only concern is whether there is a community that cares about the product, and volunteers who are willing to support the codebase and each other. Size doesn't matter. Caring does.
How do we show we care?
* By posting helpful replies to the list,
* By evolving the codebase through patches for bug fixes, refactorings, and new features, and
* By starting the occasional revolution, just to keep things interesting :)
A project could have a 100% market share, but if non one volunteered to do these things, the ASF would consider the project a failure.
The true measure of an open source project is not downloads *from* the project, it's posts and commits *to* the project.
-Ted.
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 17:04:53 -0800, Dakota Jack wrote:
>�I guess asking what the vote is does give good reason for this. �I
>�like you so much Vic that it would be hard to fault you. �But, I am
>�surprised that a mere question about the vote could engender this
>�sort of thing. �Interesting. �I am really interested in JERICHO.
>�What SHALE does is not important to me except insofar as that has
>�some impact on JERICHO. �There could be a million projects for all
>�I care.
>
>�Jack
>
>
>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:31:55 -0600, Vic <vi...@friendvu.com>�wrote:
>
>>�I hope you think this is funny Jack, sometimes I amuse myself:
>>
>>�I think the shortest answer is that anyone un-happy (with
>>�multiple projects?) can: A. fork any friendly license like ASF
>>�and refactor under the terms of license, maintain the source code
>>�or see if they can develop a user community, B: use another non
>>�Struts project that they like better.
>>
>>�Who cares what the votes are, if any, and who cares if they have
>>�no time to report on everything. The more projects the better,
>>�let Darwin decide. Right now Struts has a large % production
>>�market share, so unlikley that anything bad could happen. I used
>>�Struts when it was not #1, I don't care much for "popular"
>>�opinion, I use my own analysis. (A good read is chapter on
>>�lemings by Waren Buffet book).
>>�What was that platform where they tell us the "ONE" true way and
>>�their marketed "ONE" direction. Who knows where the market will
>>�go.
>>
>>�I have a request for the comitters: "What direction will the
>>�stock market go, and please send me a privately the ONE �stocks
>>�that will be largest % mover for the coming week every Monday
>>�before the market opens.". This would make me a happier Struts
>>�user and would keep Struts in good light in my eyes. If you don't
>>�do that, I will think less of you the developers, and I say ASF
>>�should not let you comit any more code as pumishment for not
>>�making me happy. You OWE me that, for the privilage of me linking
>>�to your jars.
>>�Else I will imeditley start using another MVC and tell all my
>>�friend to do the same! ;-)
>>
>>�Seriously gang, thanks for making it easy for us to have sucess
>>�full proejct. Thanks for all the Struts modules and your code
>>�donations to the community. �Source code = good.
>>
>>�.V
>>
>>�Dakota Jack wrote:
>>
>>>�Thanks for the answer. �My question is how the community was
>>>�taken into account and whether the details of the voting is
>>>�secret or open?
>>>
>>>�Are the votes public or is the issue raised publicly? �Or is
>>>�the community taken into account privately? �I am just trying
>>>�to get a feeling for what the direction of Struts is likely to
>>>�be and I cannot do this without knowing what the workings are.
>>>�If they are private, then they are. �If the votes are public, I
>>>�would like to know what they were.
>>>
>>>�Jack
>>>
>>>
>>>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:12:45 -0600, Eddie Bush
>>>�<ea...@gmail.com>�wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>�The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into
>>>>�account when making the decision.
>>>>
>>>>�--
>>>>�Eddie Bush
>>>>
>>>>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack
>>>>�<da...@gmail.com>�wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>�At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate,
>>>>>�vote, whatever was public or limited to the PMC? �And,
>>>>>�might I ask if this was sub rosa (so to speak), is that
>>>>>�typical? �I do not mean to suggest anything but merely to
>>>>>�gather information about the processes, since these
>>>>>�processes impact my use of Struts and my business
>>>>>�decisions. Thanks.
>>>>>
>>>>>�Jack
>>>>>
>>>>>�<snip>
>>>>>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
>>>>>�<ma...@apache.org>�wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>�The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the
>>>>>>�adoption of its latest subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-
>>>>>>�based framework.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>�</snip>
>>>
>>
>>�--
>>�RiA-SoA w/JDNC <http://www.SandraSF.com>�forums
>>�- help develop a community
>>�My blog <http://www.sandrasf.com/adminBlog>
>>
>>�------------------------------------------------------------------
>>�--- To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>>�For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
>>
>
>�--
>�------------------------------
>
>�"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
>�back."
>
>�~Dakota Jack~
>
>�"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
>
>�~Native Proverb~
>
>�"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to
>�be crows."
>
>�~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
>
>�-----------------------------------------------
>
>�"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged
>�information. If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive
>�this for the addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take
>�any action based on this message or any information herein. If you
>�have received this message in error, please advise the sender
>�immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message. Thank you for
>�your cooperation."
>
>�--------------------------------------------------------------------
>�- To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org For
>�additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
Re: OT Friday: Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com>.
I guess asking what the vote is does give good reason for this. I
like you so much Vic that it would be hard to fault you. But, I am
surprised that a mere question about the vote could engender this sort
of thing. Interesting. I am really interested in JERICHO. What
SHALE does is not important to me except insofar as that has some
impact on JERICHO. There could be a million projects for all I care.
Jack
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 18:31:55 -0600, Vic <vi...@friendvu.com> wrote:
> I hope you think this is funny Jack, sometimes I amuse myself:
>
> I think the shortest answer is that anyone un-happy (with multiple
> projects?) can: A. fork any friendly license like ASF and refactor under
> the terms of license, maintain the source code or see if they can
> develop a user community, B: use another non Struts project that they
> like better.
>
> Who cares what the votes are, if any, and who cares if they have no time
> to report on everything. The more projects the better, let Darwin
> decide. Right now Struts has a large % production market share, so
> unlikley that anything bad could happen. I used Struts when it was not
> #1, I don't care much for "popular" opinion, I use my own analysis. (A
> good read is chapter on lemings by Waren Buffet book).
> What was that platform where they tell us the "ONE" true way and their
> marketed "ONE" direction. Who knows where the market will go.
>
> I have a request for the comitters: "What direction will the stock
> market go, and please send me a privately the ONE stocks that will be
> largest % mover for the coming week every Monday before the market opens.".
> This would make me a happier Struts user and would keep Struts in good
> light in my eyes. If you don't do that, I will think less of you the
> developers, and I say ASF should not let you comit any more code as
> pumishment for not making me happy. You OWE me that, for the privilage
> of me linking to your jars.
> Else I will imeditley start using another MVC and tell all my friend to
> do the same! ;-)
>
> Seriously gang, thanks for making it easy for us to have sucess full
> proejct. Thanks for all the Struts modules and your code donations to
> the community. Source code = good.
>
> .V
>
> Dakota Jack wrote:
>
> >Thanks for the answer. My question is how the community was taken
> >into account and whether the details of the voting is secret or open?
> >
> >Are the votes public or is the issue raised publicly? Or is the
> >community taken into account privately? I am just trying to get a
> >feeling for what the direction of Struts is likely to be and I cannot
> >do this without knowing what the workings are. If they are private,
> >then they are. If the votes are public, I would like to know what
> >they were.
> >
> >Jack
> >
> >
> >On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:12:45 -0600, Eddie Bush <ea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >>The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into account
> >>when making the decision.
> >>
> >>--
> >>Eddie Bush
> >>
> >>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
> >>>whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
> >>>was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
> >>>anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
> >>>these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
> >>>Thanks.
> >>>
> >>>Jack
> >>>
> >>><snip>
> >>>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
> >>><ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
> >>>>subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>></snip>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> RiA-SoA w/JDNC <http://www.SandraSF.com> forums
> - help develop a community
> My blog <http://www.sandrasf.com/adminBlog>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
>
>
--
------------------------------
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
~Native Proverb~
"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to be crows."
~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
-----------------------------------------------
"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information.
If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the
addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take any action based
on this message or any information herein. If you have received this
message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail
and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation."
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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OT Friday: Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Vic <vi...@friendvu.com>.
I hope you think this is funny Jack, sometimes I amuse myself:
I think the shortest answer is that anyone un-happy (with multiple
projects?) can: A. fork any friendly license like ASF and refactor under
the terms of license, maintain the source code or see if they can
develop a user community, B: use another non Struts project that they
like better.
Who cares what the votes are, if any, and who cares if they have no time
to report on everything. The more projects the better, let Darwin
decide. Right now Struts has a large % production market share, so
unlikley that anything bad could happen. I used Struts when it was not
#1, I don't care much for "popular" opinion, I use my own analysis. (A
good read is chapter on lemings by Waren Buffet book).
What was that platform where they tell us the "ONE" true way and their
marketed "ONE" direction. Who knows where the market will go.
I have a request for the comitters: "What direction will the stock
market go, and please send me a privately the ONE stocks that will be
largest % mover for the coming week every Monday before the market opens.".
This would make me a happier Struts user and would keep Struts in good
light in my eyes. If you don't do that, I will think less of you the
developers, and I say ASF should not let you comit any more code as
pumishment for not making me happy. You OWE me that, for the privilage
of me linking to your jars.
Else I will imeditley start using another MVC and tell all my friend to
do the same! ;-)
Seriously gang, thanks for making it easy for us to have sucess full
proejct. Thanks for all the Struts modules and your code donations to
the community. Source code = good.
.V
Dakota Jack wrote:
>Thanks for the answer. My question is how the community was taken
>into account and whether the details of the voting is secret or open?
>
>Are the votes public or is the issue raised publicly? Or is the
>community taken into account privately? I am just trying to get a
>feeling for what the direction of Struts is likely to be and I cannot
>do this without knowing what the workings are. If they are private,
>then they are. If the votes are public, I would like to know what
>they were.
>
>Jack
>
>
>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:12:45 -0600, Eddie Bush <ea...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into account
>>when making the decision.
>>
>>--
>>Eddie Bush
>>
>>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
>>>whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
>>>was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
>>>anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
>>>these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
>>>Thanks.
>>>
>>>Jack
>>>
>>><snip>
>>>On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
>>><ma...@apache.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
>>>>subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
>>>>
>>>>
>>></snip>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
>
>
--
RiA-SoA w/JDNC <http://www.SandraSF.com> forums
- help develop a community
My blog <http://www.sandrasf.com/adminBlog>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
The vote was unanimous. They usually are. Otherwise, we would decide to do something else :)
No one knows what direction Struts will take, because no one person makes that decision.
The people who make that decision are the people who *volunteer* the time and energy to create code and documentation and share what they create with others.
It is obvious to the PMC that there is a growing community of developers interested in Shale. It is also obvious to the PMC that there is a vital community of developers interested in Struts Classic. The obvious decision is to do both.
Unlike a non-volunteer organization, we are not constrained by the economics of scarcity. Adding a subproject like Shale doesn't dilute our community, it enriches our community by giving people new scratches to itch.
Here are the true facts: Commits are the only decisions that matter. If you want to know where Struts is going, then watch the commits.
Whatever else anyone might say is just the sound of one hand clapping. :)
-Ted.
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 15:54:49 -0800, Dakota Jack wrote:
>�Thanks for the answer. �My question is how the community was taken
>�into account and whether the details of the voting is secret or
>�open?
>
>�Are the votes public or is the issue raised publicly? �Or is the
>�community taken into account privately? �I am just trying to get a
>�feeling for what the direction of Struts is likely to be and I
>�cannot do this without knowing what the workings are. �If they are
>�private, then they are. �If the votes are public, I would like to
>�know what they were.
>
>�Jack
>
>
>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:12:45 -0600, Eddie Bush <ea...@gmail.com>
>�wrote:
>
>>�The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into
>>�account when making the decision.
>>
>>�--
>>�Eddie Bush
>>
>>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack
>>�<da...@gmail.com>�wrote:
>>
>>>�At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
>>>�whatever was public or limited to the PMC? �And, might I ask if
>>>�this was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? �I do not
>>>�mean to suggest anything but merely to gather information about
>>>�the processes, since these processes impact my use of Struts
>>>�and my business decisions. Thanks.
>>>
>>>�Jack
>>>
>>>�<snip>
>>>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
>>>�<ma...@apache.org>�wrote:
>>>>�The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of
>>>>�its latest subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
>>>>
>>>�</snip>
>>
>
>�--
>�------------------------------
>
>�"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
>�back."
>
>�~Dakota Jack~
>
>�"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
>
>�~Native Proverb~
>
>�"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to
>�be crows."
>
>�~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
>
>�-----------------------------------------------
>
>�"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged
>�information. If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive
>�this for the addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take
>�any action based on this message or any information herein. If you
>�have received this message in error, please advise the sender
>�immediately by reply e-mail and delete this message. Thank you for
>�your cooperation."
>
>�--------------------------------------------------------------------
>�- To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
>�For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com>.
Thanks for the answer. My question is how the community was taken
into account and whether the details of the voting is secret or open?
Are the votes public or is the issue raised publicly? Or is the
community taken into account privately? I am just trying to get a
feeling for what the direction of Struts is likely to be and I cannot
do this without knowing what the workings are. If they are private,
then they are. If the votes are public, I would like to know what
they were.
Jack
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:12:45 -0600, Eddie Bush <ea...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into account
> when making the decision.
>
> --
> Eddie Bush
>
> On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
> > whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
> > was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
> > anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
> > these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Jack
> >
> > <snip>
> > On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
> > <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> > > The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
> > > subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
> > </snip>
> >
>
--
------------------------------
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
~Native Proverb~
"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to be crows."
~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
-----------------------------------------------
"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information.
If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the
addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take any action based
on this message or any information herein. If you have received this
message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail
and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation."
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
For additional commands, e-mail: user-help@struts.apache.org
Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Eddie Bush <ea...@gmail.com>.
The PMC makes such decisions, but takes the community into account
when making the decision.
--
Eddie Bush
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com> wrote:
> At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
> whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
> was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
> anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
> these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
> Thanks.
>
> Jack
>
> <snip>
> On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
> <ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> > The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
> > subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
> </snip>
>
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Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Ted Husted <hu...@apache.org>.
Yes, it's typical. The same thing happened with Scripting.
All technical decisions regarding code are made on the dev list, and always will be.
We sometimes choose to make non-technical decisions on the PMC list.
-Ted.
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:13:15 -0800, Dakota Jack wrote:
>�At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
>�whatever was public or limited to the PMC? �And, might I ask if
>�this was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? �I do not mean to
>�suggest anything but merely to gather information about the
>�processes, since these processes impact my use of Struts and my
>�business decisions. Thanks.
>
>�Jack
>
>�<snip>
>�On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
>�<ma...@apache.org>�wrote:
>>�The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its
>>�latest subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
>>
>�</snip>
>
>�--
>�------------------------------
>
>�"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its
>�back."
>
>�~Dakota Jack~
>
>�"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
>
>�~Native Proverb~
>
>�"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to
>�be crows."
>
>�~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
>
>�-----------------------------------------------
>
>�"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged
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Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com>.
At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
Thanks.
Jack
<snip>
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
<ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
> subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
</snip>
--
------------------------------
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
~Native Proverb~
"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to be crows."
~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
-----------------------------------------------
"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information.
If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the
addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take any action based
on this message or any information herein. If you have received this
message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail
and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation."
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Re: [ANNOUNCEMENT] New Struts subproject: Shale
Posted by Dakota Jack <da...@gmail.com>.
At the risk of being flamed, might I ask if this debate, vote,
whatever was public or limited to the PMC? And, might I ask if this
was sub rosa (so to speak), is that typical? I do not mean to suggest
anything but merely to gather information about the processes, since
these processes impact my use of Struts and my business decisions.
Thanks.
Jack
<snip>
On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:03:02 -0800 (PST), Martin Cooper
<ma...@apache.org> wrote:
> The Apache Struts team is pleased to announce the adoption of its latest
> subproject, Struts Shale, a JSF-based framework.
</snip>
--
------------------------------
"You can lead a horse to water but you cannot make it float on its back."
~Dakota Jack~
"You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep."
~Native Proverb~
"Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to be crows."
~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~
-----------------------------------------------
"This message may contain confidential and/or privileged information.
If you are not the addressee or authorized to receive this for the
addressee, you must not use, copy, disclose, or take any action based
on this message or any information herein. If you have received this
message in error, please advise the sender immediately by reply e-mail
and delete this message. Thank you for your cooperation."
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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