Re: The state of WebDAV Clients

[Roland Weber <os...@dubioso.net>]

Hello Jason,

Jason Harrop wrote:
> 
> My interest is in WebDAV enabling the filechooser in docx4all.
> 
> VFS has support for WebDAV.   See http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/commons/proper/vfs/trunk/sandbox/src/main/java/org/apache/commons/vfs/provider/webdav/
> 
> There is a file chooser:  http://vfsjfilechooser.sourceforge.net/
> and also an SWT implementation:  http://commons-vfs-ui.sourceforge.net/
> 
> VFS's WebdavFileObject imports org.apache.webdav, which is the Slide client library.
> 
> So I'm still interested in the Slide client library, and
> I would like it to remain alive, even though it probably  won't
> need to change much (if at all) until migration to HttpClient 4.0.

The Slide client library cannot "remain" alive, because it is
already dead. The definition of a project that is alive at
Apache is that there is a community that supports users.
Slide lost that community long ago. Without anyone working
actively on the codebase, no new community will gather.
Being alive and not needing much change is mutually exclusive
for the Slide client, IMHO.

If you don't need changes, you can get the last released
version from the archives, or you can pull the source from
the trunk and compile yourself. If you need minor changes,
you can modify the source after pulling it from trunk, and
you can create bug reports and attach your patches there
for others.

> Roland Weber wrote:
>> The slide-dev list is still open.
>> Bugzilla for Slide is still open. While it would certainly raise
>> some eyebrows if anyone started working on the trunk of a
>> retired project, I don't see why it should not be possible to
>> create a sandbox for the WebDAV client in the Slide repository.
>> As long as somebody's working there, we wouldn't lock the repository.
>> Jackrabbit probably wouldn't mind to get the Slide discussions
>> off their users list either ;-) Sooner or later, the activity
>> ceases or the project is taken to the Incubator. Then it is time
>> to lock the Slide repository.
> 
>> It would take a leader who is a Jakarta committer to create the
>> sandbox, move the initial code, and apply patches if any are sent.
> 
> I am not a Jakarta committer. Any idea how we might find a sympathetic one?

Jakarta committers still interested in Slide are probably
still subscribed to the slide-dev@jakarta mailing list.
Jakarta committers with a general cross-Jakarta interest
are supposed to be subscribed to general@jakarta.

> Alternatively, what about the vfs sandbox?

Why should Commons be interested in moving unsupported code without
a developer community from the Jakarta to the Commons repository?


For what it's worth, here's my view on your problem:
You want to use WebDAV support in VFS. The VFS WebDAV module is
in a sandbox and has no perspective of ever being promoted, since
it relies on the Slide WebDAV client which is retired for lack of
a community, and which in turn relies on HttpClient 2.0 which has
been unsupported for years because it is replaced by HttpClient 3.0
and more recently HC 3.1. You are riding a dead horse. Dismount.
Moving the corpse into a different stable won't help.
http://www.thehumorarchives.com/joke/Beating_a_Dead_Horse

If you're interested in WebDAV support for VFS, you should instead
be looking for volunteers that port the current Slide-based module
from Slide over to the Jackrabbit WebDAV client. The latter is based
on the current HttpClient 3.1 version, which will remain supported
for a few years. The effort is still worthwile, if you can find
interested developers. Places to look for those are the Commons and
Jackrabbit (dev) lists.

cheers,
   Roland

Re: The state of WebDAV Clients

[Jason Harrop <jh...@gmail.com>]

Jason Harrop wrote:
> Ultimately, I decided to create a new project out of the Slide WebDAV 
> client library, at https://sourceforge.net/projects/webdavclient4j/
> 
:
> 
> I'm not sure yet of the priority of migrating it to a newer version of 
> HttpClient - that will become clearer over time.
> 

webdavclient4j now uses commons-httpclient 3.0.1.

webdavclient4j also works with VFS WebDAV, provided you apply 
http://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/VFS-74

Re: The state of WebDAV Clients

[Jason Harrop <jh...@gmail.com>]

Hi Roland

Thank you for your considered and insightful advice.

Ultimately, I decided to create a new project out of the Slide WebDAV 
client library, at https://sourceforge.net/projects/webdavclient4j/

This seems to me to meet several objectives:

- be able to commit changes to the code

- provide a webdavclient which is seen to be independent from any 
particular WebDAV server implementation (and ultimately may work with 
several)

I'm not sure yet of the priority of migrating it to a newer version of 
HttpClient - that will become clearer over time.

kind regards

Jason


Roland Weber wrote:
> Hello Jason,
> 
> Jason Harrop wrote:
>>
>> My interest is in WebDAV enabling the filechooser in docx4all.
>>
>> VFS has support for WebDAV.   See 
>> http://svn.apache.org/viewvc/commons/proper/vfs/trunk/sandbox/src/main/java/org/apache/commons/vfs/provider/webdav/ 
>>
>>
>> There is a file chooser:  http://vfsjfilechooser.sourceforge.net/
>> and also an SWT implementation:  http://commons-vfs-ui.sourceforge.net/
>>
>> VFS's WebdavFileObject imports org.apache.webdav, which is the Slide 
>> client library.
>>
>> So I'm still interested in the Slide client library, and
>> I would like it to remain alive, even though it probably  won't
>> need to change much (if at all) until migration to HttpClient 4.0.
> 
> The Slide client library cannot "remain" alive, because it is
> already dead. The definition of a project that is alive at
> Apache is that there is a community that supports users.
> Slide lost that community long ago. Without anyone working
> actively on the codebase, no new community will gather.
> Being alive and not needing much change is mutually exclusive
> for the Slide client, IMHO.
> 
> If you don't need changes, you can get the last released
> version from the archives, or you can pull the source from
> the trunk and compile yourself. If you need minor changes,
> you can modify the source after pulling it from trunk, and
> you can create bug reports and attach your patches there
> for others.
> 
>> Roland Weber wrote:
>>> The slide-dev list is still open.
>>> Bugzilla for Slide is still open. While it would certainly raise
>>> some eyebrows if anyone started working on the trunk of a
>>> retired project, I don't see why it should not be possible to
>>> create a sandbox for the WebDAV client in the Slide repository.
>>> As long as somebody's working there, we wouldn't lock the repository.
>>> Jackrabbit probably wouldn't mind to get the Slide discussions
>>> off their users list either ;-) Sooner or later, the activity
>>> ceases or the project is taken to the Incubator. Then it is time
>>> to lock the Slide repository.
>>
>>> It would take a leader who is a Jakarta committer to create the
>>> sandbox, move the initial code, and apply patches if any are sent.
>>
>> I am not a Jakarta committer. Any idea how we might find a sympathetic 
>> one?
> 
> Jakarta committers still interested in Slide are probably
> still subscribed to the slide-dev@jakarta mailing list.
> Jakarta committers with a general cross-Jakarta interest
> are supposed to be subscribed to general@jakarta.
> 
>> Alternatively, what about the vfs sandbox?
> 
> Why should Commons be interested in moving unsupported code without
> a developer community from the Jakarta to the Commons repository?
> 
> 
> For what it's worth, here's my view on your problem:
> You want to use WebDAV support in VFS. The VFS WebDAV module is
> in a sandbox and has no perspective of ever being promoted, since
> it relies on the Slide WebDAV client which is retired for lack of
> a community, and which in turn relies on HttpClient 2.0 which has
> been unsupported for years because it is replaced by HttpClient 3.0
> and more recently HC 3.1. You are riding a dead horse. Dismount.
> Moving the corpse into a different stable won't help.
> http://www.thehumorarchives.com/joke/Beating_a_Dead_Horse
> 
> If you're interested in WebDAV support for VFS, you should instead
> be looking for volunteers that port the current Slide-based module
> from Slide over to the Jackrabbit WebDAV client. The latter is based
> on the current HttpClient 3.1 version, which will remain supported
> for a few years. The effort is still worthwile, if you can find
> interested developers. Places to look for those are the Commons and
> Jackrabbit (dev) lists.
> 
> cheers,
>   Roland
> 
> 
> 
> 
>