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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> on 2011/06/23 02:26:19 UTC
Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public mailing list. [1]
Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes transparent to the whole community. [2]
There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be sent to ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to email policy. It can be a different policy.
Regards,
Dave
[1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
[2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
[3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Andy Brown <an...@the-martin-byrd.net>.
Dave Fisher wrote:
> In light of this conversation I am changing the proposal to this:
>
> For both the Community Forum (OOOUSER) and the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I now propose sending an email with a daily digest to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> This way those who want to oversee changes can do so, and in the same place where svn change emails go. (FYI -a website change sends three emails to that list.)
>
> For those who want to see recent changes in confluence, this is possible. Here is how:
>
> (1) Go to the Dashboard.
> (2) On the left find "Spaces:" and click on the "Team" tab.
> (3) On the "View Spaces for Team" pop-up menu select "ooo"
>
> Recent changes for both Wikis appear on the right - a few, not 100.
>
> For those who want to get their own notifications - https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/users/viewmyemailsettings.action
>
> Since the proposal has changed I will wait an additional 36 hours (for a total of 72) to see if Consensus is achieved.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
I feel that this is the best idea. It will keep from flooding this list
with information that not all are interested in.
Andy
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Dick Groskamp <th...@quicknet.nl>.
On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 1:50 PM, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> In light of this conversation I am changing the proposal to this:
>>
>> For both the Community Forum (OOOUSER) and the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I now propose sending an email with a daily digest to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>>
>> This way those who want to oversee changes can do so, and in the same place where svn change emails go. (FYI -a website change sends three emails to that list.)
+1
--
DiGro
Windows 7 and OpenOffice.org 3.3
Scanned with Ziggo uitgebreide Internetbeveiliging (F-Secure)
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Rob Weir <ap...@robweir.com>.
On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 1:50 PM, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In light of this conversation I am changing the proposal to this:
>
> For both the Community Forum (OOOUSER) and the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I now propose sending an email with a daily digest to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> This way those who want to oversee changes can do so, and in the same place where svn change emails go. (FYI -a website change sends three emails to that list.)
>
+1
-Rob
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by "Pedro F. Giffuni" <gi...@tutopia.com>.
Sounds fine to me ...
I do like to review the commit archives, even when I don't
subscribe there directly.
Pedro.
--- On Thu, 6/23/11, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
...
> In light of this conversation I am
> changing the proposal to this:
>
> For both the Community Forum (OOOUSER) and the Developer
> Forum (OOODEV) I now propose sending an email with a daily
> digest to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> This way those who want to oversee changes can do so, and
> in the same place where svn change emails go. (FYI -a
> website change sends three emails to that list.)
>
> For those who want to see recent changes in confluence,
> this is possible. Here is how:
>
> (1) Go to the Dashboard.
> (2) On the left find "Spaces:" and click on the "Team"
> tab.
> (3) On the "View Spaces for Team" pop-up menu select "ooo"
>
> Recent changes for both Wikis appear on the right - a
> few, not 100.
>
> For those who want to get their own notifications - https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/users/viewmyemailsettings.action
>
> Since the proposal has changed I will wait an additional 36
> hours (for a total of 72) to see if Consensus is achieved.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
> On Jun 23, 2011, at 1:17 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
>
> > I second this to send all notifications to the commits
> mailing list.
> >
> > Marcus
> >
> >
> >
> > Am 06/23/2011 03:42 AM, schrieb Raphael Bircher:
> >> Hi
> >>
> >> Oh yes, I don't love "wiki change mails" on the
> discouss list. I think
> >> we have enough mails there.
> >>
> >> Greetings Raphael
> >> Am 23.06.11 03:29, schrieb Greg Stein:
> >>> I would suggest ooo-commits instead. That
> seems a better list for change
> >>> notifications.
> >>>
> >>> The digest/each setup sounds great.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> -g
> >>> On Jun 22, 2011 8:26 PM, "Dave Fisher"<da...@comcast.net>
> wrote:
> >>>> At the Apache Software Foundation
> everything should happen on a public
> >>> mailing list. [1]
> >>>> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we
> need take advantage of
> >>> confluences ability to email notifications.
> This will make Wiki changes
> >>> transparent to the whole community. [2]
> >>>> There are two options. An email with every
> change or a daily digest.
> >>>>
> >>>> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I
> propose that a daily digest be
> >>>> sent to
> >>> ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
> >>>> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose
> sending an email with every
> >>> change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
> >>>> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
> >>>>
> >>>> In consideration of our world wide
> audience I'll wait at least 36 hours
> >>> before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator
> to help implement a
> >>> wiki to
> >>> email policy. It can be a different policy.
> >>>> Regards,
> >>>> Dave
> >>>>
> >>>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
> >>>> [2]
> >>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
> >>>> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>
>
> hk
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net>.
In light of this conversation I am changing the proposal to this:
For both the Community Forum (OOOUSER) and the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I now propose sending an email with a daily digest to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
This way those who want to oversee changes can do so, and in the same place where svn change emails go. (FYI -a website change sends three emails to that list.)
For those who want to see recent changes in confluence, this is possible. Here is how:
(1) Go to the Dashboard.
(2) On the left find "Spaces:" and click on the "Team" tab.
(3) On the "View Spaces for Team" pop-up menu select "ooo"
Recent changes for both Wikis appear on the right - a few, not 100.
For those who want to get their own notifications - https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/users/viewmyemailsettings.action
Since the proposal has changed I will wait an additional 36 hours (for a total of 72) to see if Consensus is achieved.
Regards,
Dave
On Jun 23, 2011, at 1:17 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote:
> I second this to send all notifications to the commits mailing list.
>
> Marcus
>
>
>
> Am 06/23/2011 03:42 AM, schrieb Raphael Bircher:
>> Hi
>>
>> Oh yes, I don't love "wiki change mails" on the discouss list. I think
>> we have enough mails there.
>>
>> Greetings Raphael
>> Am 23.06.11 03:29, schrieb Greg Stein:
>>> I would suggest ooo-commits instead. That seems a better list for change
>>> notifications.
>>>
>>> The digest/each setup sounds great.
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>> -g
>>> On Jun 22, 2011 8:26 PM, "Dave Fisher"<da...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>>> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public
>>> mailing list. [1]
>>>> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of
>>> confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes
>>> transparent to the whole community. [2]
>>>> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>>>>
>>>> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be
>>>> sent to
>>> ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>>>> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every
>>> change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>>>> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>>>>
>>>> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours
>>> before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a
>>> wiki to
>>> email policy. It can be a different policy.
>>>> Regards,
>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
>>>> [2]
>>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
>>>> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by "Marcus (OOo)" <ma...@wtnet.de>.
I second this to send all notifications to the commits mailing list.
Marcus
Am 06/23/2011 03:42 AM, schrieb Raphael Bircher:
> Hi
>
> Oh yes, I don't love "wiki change mails" on the discouss list. I think
> we have enough mails there.
>
> Greetings Raphael
> Am 23.06.11 03:29, schrieb Greg Stein:
>> I would suggest ooo-commits instead. That seems a better list for change
>> notifications.
>>
>> The digest/each setup sounds great.
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -g
>> On Jun 22, 2011 8:26 PM, "Dave Fisher"<da...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public
>> mailing list. [1]
>>> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of
>> confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes
>> transparent to the whole community. [2]
>>> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>>>
>>> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be
>>> sent to
>> ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>>> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every
>> change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>>> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>>>
>>> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours
>> before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a
>> wiki to
>> email policy. It can be a different policy.
>>> Regards,
>>> Dave
>>>
>>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
>>> [2]
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
>>> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Raphael Bircher <r....@gmx.ch>.
Hi
Oh yes, I don't love "wiki change mails" on the discouss list. I think
we have enough mails there.
Greetings Raphael
Am 23.06.11 03:29, schrieb Greg Stein:
> I would suggest ooo-commits instead. That seems a better list for change
> notifications.
>
> The digest/each setup sounds great.
>
> Cheers,
> -g
> On Jun 22, 2011 8:26 PM, "Dave Fisher"<da...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public
> mailing list. [1]
>> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of
> confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes
> transparent to the whole community. [2]
>> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>>
>> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be sent to
> ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every
> change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>>
>> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours
> before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to
> email policy. It can be a different policy.
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>>
>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
>> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
>> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>>
--
My private Homepage: http://www.raphaelbircher.ch/
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Greg Stein <gs...@gmail.com>.
I would suggest ooo-commits instead. That seems a better list for change
notifications.
The digest/each setup sounds great.
Cheers,
-g
On Jun 22, 2011 8:26 PM, "Dave Fisher" <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public
mailing list. [1]
>
> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of
confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes
transparent to the whole community. [2]
>
> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>
> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be sent to
ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>
> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every
change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>
> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours
before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to
email policy. It can be a different policy.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Ross Gardler <rg...@opendirective.com>.
On 23 June 2011 01:26, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to email policy. It can be a different policy.
There are no rules on these things but we usually allow 72 hours to
allow people to be busy on other things. However, in a case like this
one, which is very easily reversible and not likely to cause any harm
whatsoever if it needs to be reversed less than 72 hours is fine.
Ross
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Andy Brown <an...@the-martin-byrd.net>.
TJ Frazier wrote:
> On 6/22/2011 21:35, Rob Weir wrote:
>> Could we do daily digests for both?
>>
>> I realize that there may be some project members who want to get every
>> update, as it happens, from the wiki. But that is already available
>> to us individually, by the "watch" feature in Confluence. Any of us
>> can subscribe to updates of a given page, or even all updates in an
>> entire space.
>>
>> I think that would give a better balance.
>>
>> Maybe someone familiar with the OOo website can give some sense of the
>> number of wiki updates they get per day?
>>
>> -Rob
> The current OO.o wiki is MediaWiki-powered. As a sysop, I spend some
> time reviewing the "Recent Changes" list. A setting of "most recent 100"
> usually lets me see all of today's and some of yesterday's changes.
>
> Lately (since the Apache announcement) the traffic has fallen way off,
> but we still see an average of six or eight new user sign-ups every day.
> Most of those never make any contributions.
>
> (I would offer my services over here as a sysop, but I don't know much
> about Confusion wikis and Meltdown syntax – well, something like that...
> I suppose I can learn.) --/tj/
Hi TJ, glsd to see you here. :)
Andy
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by C <sm...@gmail.com>.
On Thu, Jun 23, 2011 at 04:59, TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com> wrote:
>> Maybe someone familiar with the OOo website can give some sense of the
>> number of wiki updates they get per day?
>>
>> -Rob
>
> The current OO.o wiki is MediaWiki-powered. As a sysop, I spend some time
> reviewing the "Recent Changes" list. A setting of "most recent 100" usually
> lets me see all of today's and some of yesterday's changes.
I do the same. It's a very nice way to "pull" the changes rather than
pushing out all changes to everyone on a mailing list. Can't
Confluence provide the same?
> Lately (since the Apache announcement) the traffic has fallen way off, but
> we still see an average of six or eight new user sign-ups every day. Most of
> those never make any contributions.
And of those average 6 or 8 new users, it seems to break down to 4 who
are likely spammers (but are usually blocked by the spam traps), 1 is
a legit user, and 3 are new to OOo who think they need a Wiki account
to read Wiki content.
Clayton
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by TJ Frazier <tj...@cfl.rr.com>.
On 6/22/2011 21:35, Rob Weir wrote:
> Could we do daily digests for both?
>
> I realize that there may be some project members who want to get every
> update, as it happens, from the wiki. But that is already available
> to us individually, by the "watch" feature in Confluence. Any of us
> can subscribe to updates of a given page, or even all updates in an
> entire space.
>
> I think that would give a better balance.
>
> Maybe someone familiar with the OOo website can give some sense of the
> number of wiki updates they get per day?
>
> -Rob
The current OO.o wiki is MediaWiki-powered. As a sysop, I spend some
time reviewing the "Recent Changes" list. A setting of "most recent 100"
usually lets me see all of today's and some of yesterday's changes.
Lately (since the Apache announcement) the traffic has fallen way off,
but we still see an average of six or eight new user sign-ups every day.
Most of those never make any contributions.
(I would offer my services over here as a sysop, but I don't know much
about Confusion wikis and Meltdown syntax – well, something like that...
I suppose I can learn.) --/tj/
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 8:26 PM, Dave Fisher<da...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public mailing list. [1]
>>
>> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes transparent to the whole community. [2]
>>
>> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>>
>> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be sent to ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>>
>> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>>
>> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>>
>> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to email policy. It can be a different policy.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Dave
>>
>> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
>> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
>> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>>
>>
>
>
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Rob Weir <ap...@robweir.com>.
Could we do daily digests for both?
I realize that there may be some project members who want to get every
update, as it happens, from the wiki. But that is already available
to us individually, by the "watch" feature in Confluence. Any of us
can subscribe to updates of a given page, or even all updates in an
entire space.
I think that would give a better balance.
Maybe someone familiar with the OOo website can give some sense of the
number of wiki updates they get per day?
-Rob
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 8:26 PM, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
> At the Apache Software Foundation everything should happen on a public mailing list. [1]
>
> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take advantage of confluences ability to email notifications. This will make Wiki changes transparent to the whole community. [2]
>
> There are two options. An email with every change or a daily digest.
>
> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily digest be sent to ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>
> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email with every change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>
> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at least 36 hours before asking Infrastructure and the Incubator to help implement a wiki to email policy. It can be a different policy.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>
>
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Rob Weir <ap...@robweir.com>.
I appreciate that. But I also suspect that with 1,000 change
notifications per day, no oversight at all will occur.
So given the scale of the anticipated wiki, how do we get the maximum
actual oversight?
-Rob
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 10:20 PM, Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 10:09 PM, Andy Brown <an...@the-martin-byrd.net> wrote:
>> Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
>>> I personally would prefer not to receive them.
>>> Please make sure they are easy to filter: some
>>> header like [Wiki digest] ..., at least.
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>>
>>> Pedro.
>>
>> Agreed.
>
> Not directed an anyone in particular, but the essential difference
> between the role of committer and the role of a member of a PMC is
> that a committer does his or her own thing, but a PMC member is
> responsible for oversight:
>
> http://www.apache.org/dev/pmc.html#audience
>
>> Andy
>
> - Sam Ruby
>
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>.
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 10:09 PM, Andy Brown <an...@the-martin-byrd.net> wrote:
> Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
>> I personally would prefer not to receive them.
>> Please make sure they are easy to filter: some
>> header like [Wiki digest] ..., at least.
>>
>> cheers,
>>
>> Pedro.
>
> Agreed.
Not directed an anyone in particular, but the essential difference
between the role of committer and the role of a member of a PMC is
that a committer does his or her own thing, but a PMC member is
responsible for oversight:
http://www.apache.org/dev/pmc.html#audience
> Andy
- Sam Ruby
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by Andy Brown <an...@the-martin-byrd.net>.
Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
> I personally would prefer not to receive them.
> Please make sure they are easy to filter: some
> header like [Wiki digest] ..., at least.
>
> cheers,
>
> Pedro.
Agreed.
Andy
Re: Sending Wiki Notifications to Mailing Lists
Posted by "Pedro F. Giffuni" <gi...@yahoo.com>.
I personally would prefer not to receive them.
Please make sure they are easy to filter: some
header like [Wiki digest] ..., at least.
cheers,
Pedro.
--- On Wed, 6/22/11, Dave Fisher <da...@comcast.net> wrote:
...
> At the Apache Software Foundation
> everything should happen on a public mailing list. [1]
>
> Since the wikis are not mailing lists we need take
> advantage of confluences ability to email notifications.
> This will make Wiki changes transparent to the whole
> community. [2]
>
> There are two options. An email with every change or a
> daily digest.
>
> For the Community Forum (OOOUSER) I propose that a daily
> digest be sent to ooo-dev@incubator.a.o.
>
> For the Developer Forum (OOODEV) I propose sending an email
> with every change to ooo-commits@incubator.a.o.
>
> Lazy Consensus [3] will apply.
>
> In consideration of our world wide audience I'll wait at
> least 36 hours before asking Infrastructure and the
> Incubator to help implement a wiki to email policy. It can
> be a different policy.
>
> Regards,
> Dave
>
> [1] http://incubator.apache.org/guides/lists.html
> [2] https://cwiki.apache.org/CWIKI/#Index-Postingemailalertstoamailinglist
> [3] http://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#LazyConsensus
>
>
> .n