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Posted to general@incubator.apache.org by Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> on 2011/06/14 12:48:59 UTC

Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
> missing from the Wiki.

Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
podling?

>        --- Noel

- Sam Ruby

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Bertrand Delacretaz <bd...@apache.org>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 1:48 PM, Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
>> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
>> missing from the Wiki.
>
> Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
> time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
> podling?

I think so: no commits, almost no relevant discussion on the dev list,
and mentors don't seem to be really active.

-Bertrand

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 11:20 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
> Sam Ruby wrote:
>
>> All past struggles aside, if there are no credible plans to produce an
>> ASF project after 2.5 years, then IMHO it is time to begin the process
>> of terminating the incubation of this podling.
>
> I'm not arguing that point.  As I had replied, we can start the dormancy discussion with them.  Do you wish to do that, or ask Bill?

Not clear who Bill is in the context, but in any case, I encourage
everybody and anybody who believes that it is possible to create a
credible plan that they personally endorse for graduation for BlueSky
to do so and submit a report for BlueSky in time for inclusion in the
July board report.

If that can't be done, then, yes Noel, I would appreciate it if you
would start a discussion about dormancy at that time.

>        --- Noel

- Sam Ruby

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RE: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
Sam Ruby wrote:

> All past struggles aside, if there are no credible plans to produce an
> ASF project after 2.5 years, then IMHO it is time to begin the process
> of terminating the incubation of this podling.

I'm not arguing that point.  As I had replied, we can start the dormancy discussion with them.  Do you wish to do that, or ask Bill?

	--- Noel



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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Sam Ruby <ru...@intertwingly.net>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 10:38 AM, Bernd Fondermann
<be...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 16:15, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>> We can take that up with the community.  They've certainly had their struggles, but seem to come back sporadically.
>
> I've been following the mailing list for a while now and I don't see
> any progress towards what could become an Apache project eventually.

All past struggles aside, if there are no credible plans to produce an
ASF project after 2.5 years, then IMHO it is time to begin the process
of terminating the incubation of this podling.

- Sam Ruby

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Henri Yandell <fl...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 4:16 PM, Upayavira <uv...@odoko.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
> On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 00:34 +0200, "Bernd Fondermann"
> <be...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 20:00, Donald Whytock <dw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > What happens to a dormant podling?  Are its files still accessible,
>> > and does its licensing still apply?
>>
>> I'd guess that the files remain accessible. However...
>> Please use unreleased code, especially from the Incubator, with extreme
>> care.
>> Nobody, especially not the ASF, will grant for it.
>
> Specifically, it is during the process of releasing that an ASF project
> reviews the licenses included within a codebase. Taking code direct from
> ASF subversion (and more particularly unreleased code), the ASF will
> give no guarantees over licenses used. It would be legitimate to have
> incompatibly licensed code in SVN, so long as it is removed before the
> product is released.
>
> So yes, the code will be there, but no, the ASF will not be making any
> statements about the licensing credentials of that code. Do with it as
> you wish.

Agreed - the "Verify distribution rights" section of the incubation process.

However, Bluesky haven't managed to check off the two copyright items.
I think we should remove the source in svn rather than continuing to
assume that we have a license to the code.

Hen

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Upayavira <uv...@odoko.co.uk>.

On Wed, 15 Jun 2011 00:34 +0200, "Bernd Fondermann"
<be...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 20:00, Donald Whytock <dw...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > What happens to a dormant podling?  Are its files still accessible,
> > and does its licensing still apply?
> 
> I'd guess that the files remain accessible. However...
> Please use unreleased code, especially from the Incubator, with extreme
> care.
> Nobody, especially not the ASF, will grant for it.

Specifically, it is during the process of releasing that an ASF project
reviews the licenses included within a codebase. Taking code direct from
ASF subversion (and more particularly unreleased code), the ASF will
give no guarantees over licenses used. It would be legitimate to have
incompatibly licensed code in SVN, so long as it is removed before the
product is released.

So yes, the code will be there, but no, the ASF will not be making any
statements about the licensing credentials of that code. Do with it as
you wish.

Upayavira 

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Bernd Fondermann <be...@googlemail.com>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 20:00, Donald Whytock <dw...@gmail.com> wrote:
> What happens to a dormant podling?  Are its files still accessible,
> and does its licensing still apply?

I'd guess that the files remain accessible. However...
Please use unreleased code, especially from the Incubator, with extreme care.
Nobody, especially not the ASF, will grant for it.

  Bernd

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Donald Whytock <dw...@gmail.com>.
What happens to a dormant podling?  Are its files still accessible,
and does its licensing still apply?

Don

On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:21 PM, Luciano Resende <lu...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 7:38 AM, Bernd Fondermann
> <be...@googlemail.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 16:15, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>>> We can take that up with the community.  They've certainly had their struggles, but seem to come back sporadically.
>>>
>>>        --- Noel
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: sa3ruby@gmail.com [mailto:sa3ruby@gmail.com]On Behalf Of Sam Ruby
>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 6:49
>>> To: general@incubator.apache.org
>>> Subject: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>>>> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
>>>> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
>>>> missing from the Wiki.
>>>
>>> Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
>>> time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
>>> podling?
>>
>> I've been following the mailing list for a while now and I don't see
>> any progress towards what could become an Apache project eventually.
>>
>>  Bernd
>>
>
> +1, At the beginning I was really trying to help and be a non-official
> mentor for the Bluesky podling and I now tend to agree with Bernd that
> no really progress has been made and I don't see that changing in the
> near/medium future.
>
>
> --
> Luciano Resende
> http://people.apache.org/~lresende
> http://twitter.com/lresende1975
> http://lresende.blogspot.com/
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscribe@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-help@incubator.apache.org
>
>

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Luciano Resende <lu...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 7:38 AM, Bernd Fondermann
<be...@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 16:15, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>> We can take that up with the community.  They've certainly had their struggles, but seem to come back sporadically.
>>
>>        --- Noel
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: sa3ruby@gmail.com [mailto:sa3ruby@gmail.com]On Behalf Of Sam Ruby
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 6:49
>> To: general@incubator.apache.org
>> Subject: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>>> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
>>> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
>>> missing from the Wiki.
>>
>> Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
>> time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
>> podling?
>
> I've been following the mailing list for a while now and I don't see
> any progress towards what could become an Apache project eventually.
>
>  Bernd
>

+1, At the beginning I was really trying to help and be a non-official
mentor for the Bluesky podling and I now tend to agree with Bernd that
no really progress has been made and I don't see that changing in the
near/medium future.


-- 
Luciano Resende
http://people.apache.org/~lresende
http://twitter.com/lresende1975
http://lresende.blogspot.com/

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Re: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by Bernd Fondermann <be...@googlemail.com>.
On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 16:15, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
> We can take that up with the community.  They've certainly had their struggles, but seem to come back sporadically.
>
>        --- Noel
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: sa3ruby@gmail.com [mailto:sa3ruby@gmail.com]On Behalf Of Sam Ruby
> Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 6:49
> To: general@incubator.apache.org
> Subject: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
>> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
>> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
>> missing from the Wiki.
>
> Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
> time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
> podling?

I've been following the mailing list for a while now and I don't see
any progress towards what could become an Apache project eventually.

  Bernd

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RE: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)

Posted by "Noel J. Bergman" <no...@devtech.com>.
We can take that up with the community.  They've certainly had their struggles, but seem to come back sporadically.

	--- Noel

-----Original Message-----
From: sa3ruby@gmail.com [mailto:sa3ruby@gmail.com]On Behalf Of Sam Ruby
Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 6:49
To: general@incubator.apache.org
Subject: Bluesky status and plans (was: Monthly reports missing)


On Tue, Jun 14, 2011 at 12:58 AM, Noel J. Bergman <no...@devtech.com> wrote:
> I know that it is early (as in the earliest that the meeting could possibly
> happen), but we're late.  BeanValidation, Bluesky, Isis, and Wave are all
> missing from the Wiki.

Bluesky entered incubation nearly three and half years ago.  It is
time to decide that incubation is not going to succeed for this
podling?

>        --- Noel

- Sam Ruby



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