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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de> on 2020/09/09 18:00:13 UTC
we are a ASF-project
> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> discussed in June.
So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
Jörg
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Re: we are an ASF-project
Posted by Michele Denber <md...@gmx.com>.
On 09-12-2020 12:14 PM, Patricia Shanahan wrote:
>
>
> On 9/12/2020 12:37 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:
>> Hello Patricia,
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
>>> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:20 AM
>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>
>>> This is about the subject line, not the content.
>>
>> right, i have understood Marcus in the same way
>>
>>> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
>>
>> Excuse me, is it about the difference between "a" and "an"?
>>
>> If so, then I must say:
>> I don't think Marcus meant this spelling mistake, because he was
>> talking about _changing_ subject.
>> If he did mean it, I wonder why, because my posts are certainly full
>> of spelling mistakes all the time, so this single mistake can't have
>> any special relevance.
>
> As far as I can tell - I have not been following the thread - my
> objection to the substitution of "a" for "an" before a vowel sound has
> nothing to do with any content. It is just a frustration with seeing
> the same error over and over again.
There. Fixed.
- Michele
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Patricia Shanahan <pa...@acm.org>.
On 9/12/2020 12:37 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:
> Hello Patricia,
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
>> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:20 AM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> This is about the subject line, not the content.
>
> right, i have understood Marcus in the same way
>
>> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
>
> Excuse me, is it about the difference between "a" and "an"?
>
> If so, then I must say:
> I don't think Marcus meant this spelling mistake, because he was talking about _changing_ subject.
> If he did mean it, I wonder why, because my posts are certainly full of spelling mistakes all the time, so this single mistake can't have any special relevance.
As far as I can tell - I have not been following the thread - my
objection to the substitution of "a" for "an" before a vowel sound has
nothing to do with any content. It is just a frustration with seeing the
same error over and over again.
>
>
>
> Jörg
>
>
>
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12.09.20 um 09:37 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
>> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:20 AM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> This is about the subject line, not the content.
>
> right, i have understood Marcus in the same way
>
>> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
now I see it, too. I haven't seen it as I wrote my former mail.
It was indeed more about the new subject instead of this typo.
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
Hello Patricia,
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:20 AM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> This is about the subject line, not the content.
right, i have understood Marcus in the same way
> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
Excuse me, is it about the difference between "a" and "an"?
If so, then I must say:
I don't think Marcus meant this spelling mistake, because he was talking about _changing_ subject.
If he did mean it, I wonder why, because my posts are certainly full of spelling mistakes all the time, so this single mistake can't have any special relevance.
Jörg
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:53 AM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> On 9/12/2020 12:46 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
> >> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:36 AM
> >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> > Thanks, but I'm afraid my Enlish is not getting any better.
> I am linguistically untalented, not only regarding English.
>
> You are a lot more linguistically talented than I am.
not me, but:
www.deepl.com
J
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Patricia Shanahan <pa...@acm.org>.
On 9/12/2020 12:46 AM, Jörg Schmidt wrote:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
>> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:36 AM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>>
>>
>> On 9/12/2020 12:20 AM, Patricia Shanahan wrote:
>>> This is about the subject line, not the content. I don't usually do
>>> spelling and grammar, but that seems to be the main
>> content. As a native
>>> English speaker, that subject line makes me cringe every
>> time I see it.
>>>
>>> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
>>
>> Here's some documentation: Oxford English Dictionary entry
>> for "a, adj".
>> "Inflections: Before a vowel sound an ..."
>
> Thanks, but I'm afraid my Enlish is not getting any better. I am linguistically untalented, not only regarding English.
You are a lot more linguistically talented than I am.
I can struggle through reading French, know a little Latin, and have
picked up some Spanish, especially words and phrases used on public
signs and menus, just by living in a bilingual area. Otherwise, I am the
classic monolingual English speaker.
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Patricia Shanahan [mailto:pats@acm.org]
> Sent: Saturday, September 12, 2020 9:36 AM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
>
>
> On 9/12/2020 12:20 AM, Patricia Shanahan wrote:
> > This is about the subject line, not the content. I don't usually do
> > spelling and grammar, but that seems to be the main
> content. As a native
> > English speaker, that subject line makes me cringe every
> time I see it.
> >
> > It should be "we are an ASF-project".
>
> Here's some documentation: Oxford English Dictionary entry
> for "a, adj".
> "Inflections: Before a vowel sound an ..."
Thanks, but I'm afraid my Enlish is not getting any better. I am linguistically untalented, not only regarding English.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Patricia Shanahan <pa...@acm.org>.
On 9/12/2020 12:20 AM, Patricia Shanahan wrote:
> This is about the subject line, not the content. I don't usually do
> spelling and grammar, but that seems to be the main content. As a native
> English speaker, that subject line makes me cringe every time I see it.
>
> It should be "we are an ASF-project".
Here's some documentation: Oxford English Dictionary entry for "a, adj".
"Inflections: Before a vowel sound an ..."
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Patricia Shanahan <pa...@acm.org>.
This is about the subject line, not the content. I don't usually do
spelling and grammar, but that seems to be the main content. As a native
English speaker, that subject line makes me cringe every time I see it.
It should be "we are an ASF-project".
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2020 6:13 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 13.09.20 um 17:27 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2020 4:19 PM
> >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >
> >> OK, then you wanted to start a new thread. However, it
> >> doesn't make any
> >> difference as the formulation is still not suitable.
> >
> > Because of a spelling mistake? Then I can leave the project
> right away, because I cannot promise error-free spelling.
>
> no, because the subject text doesn't make sense for the thread.
I don't know why you say that. In any case the thread does not violate any rules.
> >>>> The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts
> >>>> that one of
> >>>> their countless projects is doing. J
> >>>
> >>> really?
> >>
> >> Yes
> >
> > Where can I find information about this?
>
> OK, do what you want but don't bother me with useless details.
Thanks for this answer which makes me understand how your previous "Yes" is to be understood.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 13.09.20 um 17:27 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2020 4:19 PM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
>> OK, then you wanted to start a new thread. However, it
>> doesn't make any
>> difference as the formulation is still not suitable.
>
> Because of a spelling mistake? Then I can leave the project right away, because I cannot promise error-free spelling.
no, because the subject text doesn't make sense for the thread.
>>>> The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts
>>>> that one of
>>>> their countless projects is doing. J
>>>
>>> really?
>>
>> Yes
>
> Where can I find information about this?
OK, do what you want but don't bother me with useless details.
For me it's EOM.
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2020 4:19 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> OK, then you wanted to start a new thread. However, it
> doesn't make any
> difference as the formulation is still not suitable.
Because of a spelling mistake? Then I can leave the project right away, because I cannot promise error-free spelling.
> >> The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts
> >> that one of
> >> their countless projects is doing. J
> >
> > really?
>
> Yes
Where can I find information about this?
Please keep in mind the difference between opinion and fact, because I don't think there will be an explicit rule for this, so you can (as I suspect) only orientate yourself on discussions, which might already exist.
> > I think that unity makes us strong and that a little
> uniformity in formal things also underlines that we all feel
> as part of the ASF community.
> >
> > However, I will try to discuss exactly this detail to find
> out what the general opinion is about it within the ASF community.
> > (This is why I asked for the 'mailing list for all projects').
>
> Fell free to waste your time to get the point for this
> single-character-problem.
OK.
> But please think of the value-add
> you can get
> our of this solution:
>
> - Either I'm right and you will see from others that the ASF doesn't
> carry about this problem.
> - Or I'm wrong and you will find some people that do care.
A problem of the ASF I absolutely cannot see in this context.
I am missing an information and I want to ask for this information.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 12.09.20 um 09:12 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>> Sent: Friday, September 11, 2020 7:26 PM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> Am 11.09.20 um 10:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 8:06 PM
>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>
>>>> Am 10.09.20 um 09:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
>>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
>>>>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>>>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>>>>>>>>>> discussed in June.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
>>>>>>>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
>>>>>> you want to
>>>>>>>> reach with this?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
>>>>>> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion
>>>> is closed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
>>>>>> procedure to discuss spelling.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [...]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
>>>>>> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
>>>>>> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
>>>>>> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> but you make it soooo complicated.
>>>>>
>>>>> No, I don't do that ...
>>>>
>>>> I think you don't imagine how your mails come across to
>>>> others and how
>>>> the mails could be understood by others.
>>>
>>> Thanks for this hint
>>>
>>>>> Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
>>>>
>>>> That is my feeling when I read your mail.
>>>
>>> How can I avoid this impression without giving up my opinion?
>>>
>>> What I see as a problem is something completely different,
>> namely that there is less and less joint discussion, but the
>> discussion is replaced by "deals", which are called 'I don't
>> criticize your actions if you don't criticize my actions' ...
>> but this leads to a juxtaposition and to mediocrity (imho).
>>>
>>> I myself perceive criticism as something constructive, as
>> something that lays the foundation for improvement and not as
>> something negative.
>>
>> it starts with the mail subject:
>>
>> There is no need to change
>
> I did _not_ change the subject, but opened a new topic.
> (If I had changed the subject I would have used "was:...")
OK, then you wanted to start a new thread. However, it doesn't make any
difference as the formulation is still not suitable.
>> The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts
>> that one of
>> their countless projects is doing. J
>
> really?
Yes
> I think that unity makes us strong and that a little uniformity in formal things also underlines that we all feel as part of the ASF community.
>
> However, I will try to discuss exactly this detail to find out what the general opinion is about it within the ASF community.
> (This is why I asked for the 'mailing list for all projects').
Fell free to waste your time to get the point for this
single-character-problem. But please think of the value-add you can get
our of this solution:
- Either I'm right and you will see from others that the ASF doesn't
carry about this problem.
- Or I'm wrong and you will find some people that do care.
In any case the outcome is worth less than 2 ct.
So, is it really worth for you to follow this way any longer? ;-)
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Friday, September 11, 2020 7:26 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 11.09.20 um 10:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 8:06 PM
> >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>
> >> Am 10.09.20 um 09:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
> >>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>>>
> >>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
> >>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >>>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>>>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> >>>>>>>> discussed in June.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
> >>>>>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
> >>>> you want to
> >>>>>> reach with this?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
> >>>> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion
> >> is closed.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
> >>>> procedure to discuss spelling.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [...]
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
> >>>> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
> >>>> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
> >>>> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
> >>>>
> >>>> but you make it soooo complicated.
> >>>
> >>> No, I don't do that ...
> >>
> >> I think you don't imagine how your mails come across to
> >> others and how
> >> the mails could be understood by others.
> >
> > Thanks for this hint
> >
> >>> Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
> >>
> >> That is my feeling when I read your mail.
> >
> > How can I avoid this impression without giving up my opinion?
> >
> > What I see as a problem is something completely different,
> namely that there is less and less joint discussion, but the
> discussion is replaced by "deals", which are called 'I don't
> criticize your actions if you don't criticize my actions' ...
> but this leads to a juxtaposition and to mediocrity (imho).
> >
> > I myself perceive criticism as something constructive, as
> something that lays the foundation for improvement and not as
> something negative.
>
> it starts with the mail subject:
>
> There is no need to change
I did _not_ change the subject, but opened a new topic.
(If I had changed the subject I would have used "was:...")
And I did this because in other places, I am regularly asked to open new threads in case of doubt, in order not to mix up anything.
(By the way, if we want to discuss questions of netiquette, I would be very glad, because the compliance with general netiquette on this list here is very bad. e.g. the list is drowning in "tofu" in places so that an efficient use is not possible.)
> With your formulation "So you think it is in the interest of the ASF
> ..." you imply that someone declines to correct an error and
> therefore
> is doing something bad.
I ask (indirectly) whether the person believes to have made a mistake at all.
> "
> I suggest to change the text of "open-source" in the logo to
> remove the
> dash as I think it's a spelling error.
OK, I can understand that
> I'm not a native
> speaker but when
> looking at other places in other ASF projects it looks like
> it should be
> "open source".
>
> Furthermore, when searching at Google:
> "open source has 158,000,00 hits
> "open-source has just 3,570,00 hits
> "
>
> Yes, it's longer than yours. However, it delivers also some facts.
Und because I have listed other facts I am now criticized (="However, it delivers also some facts.") for not having listed any facts?
(What was my fact --> The explanation of the difference between adjective and non-adjective use of "open-source".)
> The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts
> that one of
> their countless projects is doing. J
really?
I think that unity makes us strong and that a little uniformity in formal things also underlines that we all feel as part of the ASF community.
However, I will try to discuss exactly this detail to find out what the general opinion is about it within the ASF community.
(This is why I asked for the 'mailing list for all projects').
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 11.09.20 um 10:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 8:06 PM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> Am 10.09.20 um 09:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>
>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
>>>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>>>>>>>> discussed in June.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
>>>>>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
>>>> you want to
>>>>>> reach with this?
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
>>>> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion
>> is closed.
>>>>>
>>>>> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
>>>> procedure to discuss spelling.
>>>>>
>>>>> [...]
>>>>>
>>>>> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
>>>>>
>>>>> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
>>>> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
>>>> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
>>>> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
>>>>
>>>> but you make it soooo complicated.
>>>
>>> No, I don't do that ...
>>
>> I think you don't imagine how your mails come across to
>> others and how
>> the mails could be understood by others.
>
> Thanks for this hint
>
>>> Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
>>
>> That is my feeling when I read your mail.
>
> How can I avoid this impression without giving up my opinion?
>
> What I see as a problem is something completely different, namely that there is less and less joint discussion, but the discussion is replaced by "deals", which are called 'I don't criticize your actions if you don't criticize my actions' ... but this leads to a juxtaposition and to mediocrity (imho).
>
> I myself perceive criticism as something constructive, as something that lays the foundation for improvement and not as something negative.
it starts with the mail subject:
There is no need to change it and it doesn't belong to this mail thread.
And everybody knows that we are a project of the ASF.
There is also no need to remind us of this fact.
With your formulation "So you think it is in the interest of the ASF
..." you imply that someone declines to correct an error and therefore
is doing something bad.
To give you an example that shows a more constructive feedback:
So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its projects
uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
"
I suggest to change the text of "open-source" in the logo to remove the
dash as I think it's a spelling error. I'm not a native speaker but when
looking at other places in other ASF projects it looks like it should be
"open source".
Furthermore, when searching at Google:
"open source has 158,000,00 hits
"open-source has just 3,570,00 hits
"
Yes, it's longer than yours. However, it delivers also some facts.
BTW:
The ASF doesn't care if there is a spelling error in texts that one of
their countless projects is doing. ;-)
PS:
And as always, this is just my opinion and my 2 ct.
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 8:06 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 10.09.20 um 09:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
> >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>
> >> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
> >>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>>>
> >>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> >>>>>> discussed in June.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
> >>>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
> >>>>
> >>>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
> >> you want to
> >>>> reach with this?
> >>>
> >>> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
> >> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion
> is closed.
> >>>
> >>> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
> >> procedure to discuss spelling.
> >>>
> >>> [...]
> >>>
> >>> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
> >>>
> >>> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
> >> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
> >> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
> >> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
> >>
> >> but you make it soooo complicated.
> >
> > No, I don't do that ...
>
> I think you don't imagine how your mails come across to
> others and how
> the mails could be understood by others.
Thanks for this hint
> > Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
>
> That is my feeling when I read your mail.
How can I avoid this impression without giving up my opinion?
What I see as a problem is something completely different, namely that there is less and less joint discussion, but the discussion is replaced by "deals", which are called 'I don't criticize your actions if you don't criticize my actions' ... but this leads to a juxtaposition and to mediocrity (imho).
I myself perceive criticism as something constructive, as something that lays the foundation for improvement and not as something negative.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 10.09.20 um 09:55 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
>>>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>>>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>>>
>>>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>>>>>> discussed in June.
>>>>>
>>>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
>>>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>>>>
>>>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
>> you want to
>>>> reach with this?
>>>
>>> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
>> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion is closed.
>>>
>>> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
>> procedure to discuss spelling.
>>>
>>> [...]
>>>
>>> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
>>>
>>> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
>> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
>> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
>> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
>>
>> but you make it soooo complicated.
>
> No, I don't do that ...
I think you don't imagine how your mails come across to others and how
the mails could be understood by others.
> Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
That is my feeling when I read your mail.
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 12:06 AM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> >> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
> >> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
> >>
> >> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> >>>> discussed in June.
> >>>
> >>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
> >> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
> >>
> >> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
> you want to
> >> reach with this?
> >
> > I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't
> achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion is closed.
> >
> > I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange
> procedure to discuss spelling.
> >
> > [...]
> >
> > Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
> >
> > I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs.
> "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far
> less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the
> spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
>
> but you make it soooo complicated.
No, I don't do that and that I don't do that is already evident from the fact that I first cast my vote (which formally closed the whole thing) and only then made the remark about the "-".
Did you really think it was right to accuse me of "provocation"(?)
I understand very well that time is short (of all participants), I just don't think it is appropriate to react angry to every unforeseen speech.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 09.09.20 um 20:39 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
>> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>>
>> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>>>> discussed in June.
>>>
>>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
>> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>>
>> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do you want to
>> reach with this?
>
> I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion is closed.
>
> I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange procedure to discuss spelling.
>
> [...]
>
> Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
>
> I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs. "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
but you make it soooo complicated. Also the lenght of your mail is not
suitable just to express that a single character - the dash ( - ) - is
in your eye too much or not correct.
Marcus
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Marcus [mailto:marcus.mail@wtnet.de]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:15 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> >> discussed in June.
> >
> > So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its
> projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>
> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do you want to
> reach with this?
I don't want to achieve anything with it, because I can't achieve anything formally with it, because the discussion is closed.
I just point out to all of us that it seems to me a strange procedure to discuss spelling.
I had also provided prominent examples that show that the spelling that is normally used in the English-speaking world is "open source". I did this to make it clear that _if_ the correct spelling could be disputed at all, it seems reasonable to me to use the usual spelling.
> The ASF is an international organization. IMHO for the most people
> English not their native language. So, there will be always language
> problems.
Right, but that is not the problem at this point.
> Therefore I'm sure that - in this case - the ASF is
> not that
> nitpicking as others. J
This is correct.
Marcus, things are much easier than you think.
I know that in German the spelling of "Open Source" vs. "Open-Source" vs. "OpenSource" is quite controversial. Far less is (or: seems to me) controversial in English and so the spelling "open-source" caught my eye.
Jörg
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RE: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Jörg Schmidt <jo...@j-m-schmidt.de>.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Matthias Seidel [mailto:matthias.seidel@hamburg.de]
> Sent: Wednesday, September 09, 2020 8:21 PM
> To: dev@openoffice.apache.org
> Subject: Re: we are a ASF-project
>
> Am 09.09.20 um 20:15 schrieb Marcus:
> > Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
> >>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
> >>> discussed in June.
> >>
> >> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of
> its projects
> >> uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
> >
> > I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do
> you want to
> > reach with this?
> >
> > The ASF is an international organization. IMHO for the most people
> > English not their native language. So, there will be always language
> > problems. Therefore I'm sure that - in this case - the ASF
> is not that
> > nitpicking as others. ;-)
>
> Besides, we already have discussed this, see:
>
> https://www.mail-archive.com/dev@openoffice.apache.org/msg38219.html
thanks for this information.
My comment is a question:
did really nobody notice the "adjective" in https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/open-source?
Does anyone think that the use in "open-source for 20 Years" is really "adjective"?
imho for exemple:
the use in "open-source office for 20 years" would be adjective, but this case is not present.
Jörg
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Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Matthias Seidel <ma...@hamburg.de>.
Am 09.09.20 um 20:15 schrieb Marcus:
> Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>>> discussed in June.
>>
>> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its projects
>> uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
>
> I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do you want to
> reach with this?
>
> The ASF is an international organization. IMHO for the most people
> English not their native language. So, there will be always language
> problems. Therefore I'm sure that - in this case - the ASF is not that
> nitpicking as others. ;-)
Besides, we already have discussed this, see:
https://www.mail-archive.com/dev@openoffice.apache.org/msg38219.html
Regards,
Matthias
>
> BTW:
> When I follow your own claim then your subject is also not free of
> errors.
>
> Marcus
>
>
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>
Re: we are a ASF-project
Posted by Marcus <ma...@wtnet.de>.
Am 09.09.20 um 20:00 schrieb Jörg Schmidt:
>> Even "open source" vs. "open-source" has already been
>> discussed in June.
>
> So you think it is in the interest of the ASF if one of its projects uses a different spelling than the ASF itself?
I understand your statement as a provocation. So, what do you want to
reach with this?
The ASF is an international organization. IMHO for the most people
English not their native language. So, there will be always language
problems. Therefore I'm sure that - in this case - the ASF is not that
nitpicking as others. ;-)
BTW:
When I follow your own claim then your subject is also not free of errors.
Marcus
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