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Posted to dev@flex.apache.org by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com> on 2017/04/06 21:35:40 UTC
[FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Hi,
Yesterday I intended to merge the feature/chart_work branch into develop. After I ran some more tests with more complex container structures I found a problem with one of the layouts. I finally worked it out, so now I'm running through all of the examples to make sure they compile so the build completes.
I will not merge into develop until tomorrow, Friday 7 Apr 2017, in the afternoon EDT (after 6pm UTC). I will keep you posted.
Regards,
Peter Ent
Adobe Systems/Apache Flex Project
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>.
Hi Peter,
After couple of hours of investigation I have found the reason and fixed
bug. You can check it.
But still something is wrong in case when TabBar is using
TabsItemRendererFactoryForArrayData. If you could take a look that would be
great!
Thanks,
Piotr
-----
Apache Flex PMC
piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
--
View this message in context: http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp61035p61068.html
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Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
Thank you for your patience on this. I did run maven as well on my
directories and got a clean run.
On 4/10/17, 4:29 PM, "Christofer Dutz" <ch...@c-ware.de> wrote:
>+1 for merging as you say you tested FlexJSStore and it¹s working, we
>might get develop working again, which is a rather desirable thing ;-)
>
>Chris
>
>
>Am 10.04.17, 20:40 schrieb "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com>:
>
> I now have the feature/chart-work branch in good shape: the frameworks
> projects build and so do all of the examples; both ANT and maven
>builds
> ran. I'm much, much more confident in the changes and stability of
>this
> feature branch than I was last week.
>
> I ran the following examples successfully: ChartExample,
> DataBindingExample, DataGridExample, FlexJSStore, DesktopMap,
>DateChooser,
> MDLExample, and TreeExample. Several of the others need some
>reworking but
> I think they are just layout issues.
>
> The changes in this feature branch reduce the amount of HTML nodes
>created
> and reduce the number of times layouts are invoked upon component
> start-up. I found several cases of redundant events and shifted some
>code
> around to make things more consistent and streamlined.
>
> My next task is to write up a Wiki page on the FlexJS site (or amend
> existing pages, as needed). I will be writing about component
>creation,
> life cycle, and layout development.
>
> I would like to merge feature/chart-work into development tomorrow. I
>do
> not anticipate any further changes unless someone finds issues that
>would
> prevent this.
>
> If there are specific examples or build questions, I'll be happy to
>answer
> them as best I can.
>
> Regards,
> Peter
>
> On 4/10/17, 9:44 AM, "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com> wrote:
>
> >I know have MDLExample working.
> >
> >I think I did this unwittingly: The MaterialDesignLite project's
> >default.css has the IDateProviderItemRendererMapper for the Tabs and
> >TabBar components specified as
>TabsItemRendererFactoryForArrayListData.
> >But the dataProvider being supplied to the tab components were
>Arrays and
> >not ArrayLists.
> >
> >I changed the data models to supply ArrayLists for the dataProviders
>and
> >now the tabs are working. I think our changes together made this work
> >again.
> >
> >Perhaps MDL should have a single item renderer data factory that is
> >universal in that it can accept either Array or ArrayList data and
>help
> >prevent this from happening in the future. I set this type of thing
>up in
> >the Express package (which I still have to test, now that I write
>this).
> >
> >This is the feature/chart-work branch.
> >
> >Regards,
> >Peter
> >
> >On 4/9/17, 6:26 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >>Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into
> >>MDLExample.
> >>Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
> >>
> >>Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
> >>
> >>If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
> >>
> >>Piotr
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>-----
> >>Apache Flex PMC
> >>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> >>--
> >>View this message in context:
>
>>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-f
>>>l
> >>e
>
>>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-t
>>>p
> >>6
>
>>>1035p61069.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca87dd5981445498e7c8508d47f98cec9%7Cfa7
>>>b
> >>1
>
>>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636273741673604657&sdata=%2BiQ9rmO
>>>D
> >>B
> >>jFFdb9Ii3fx8Ci1OAWwUPUBiVbTK0RRrHY%3D&reserved=0
> >>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
>Nabble.com.
> >
>
>
>
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Christofer Dutz <ch...@c-ware.de>.
+1 for merging as you say you tested FlexJSStore and it’s working, we might get develop working again, which is a rather desirable thing ;-)
Chris
Am 10.04.17, 20:40 schrieb "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com>:
I now have the feature/chart-work branch in good shape: the frameworks
projects build and so do all of the examples; both ANT and maven builds
ran. I'm much, much more confident in the changes and stability of this
feature branch than I was last week.
I ran the following examples successfully: ChartExample,
DataBindingExample, DataGridExample, FlexJSStore, DesktopMap, DateChooser,
MDLExample, and TreeExample. Several of the others need some reworking but
I think they are just layout issues.
The changes in this feature branch reduce the amount of HTML nodes created
and reduce the number of times layouts are invoked upon component
start-up. I found several cases of redundant events and shifted some code
around to make things more consistent and streamlined.
My next task is to write up a Wiki page on the FlexJS site (or amend
existing pages, as needed). I will be writing about component creation,
life cycle, and layout development.
I would like to merge feature/chart-work into development tomorrow. I do
not anticipate any further changes unless someone finds issues that would
prevent this.
If there are specific examples or build questions, I'll be happy to answer
them as best I can.
Regards,
Peter
On 4/10/17, 9:44 AM, "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com> wrote:
>I know have MDLExample working.
>
>I think I did this unwittingly: The MaterialDesignLite project's
>default.css has the IDateProviderItemRendererMapper for the Tabs and
>TabBar components specified as TabsItemRendererFactoryForArrayListData.
>But the dataProvider being supplied to the tab components were Arrays and
>not ArrayLists.
>
>I changed the data models to supply ArrayLists for the dataProviders and
>now the tabs are working. I think our changes together made this work
>again.
>
>Perhaps MDL should have a single item renderer data factory that is
>universal in that it can accept either Array or ArrayList data and help
>prevent this from happening in the future. I set this type of thing up in
>the Express package (which I still have to test, now that I write this).
>
>This is the feature/chart-work branch.
>
>Regards,
>Peter
>
>On 4/9/17, 6:26 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into
>>MDLExample.
>>Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
>>
>>Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
>>
>>If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
>>
>>Piotr
>>
>>
>>
>>-----
>>Apache Flex PMC
>>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>>--
>>View this message in context:
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>e
>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp
>>6
>>1035p61069.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca87dd5981445498e7c8508d47f98cec9%7Cfa7b
>>1
>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636273741673604657&sdata=%2BiQ9rmOD
>>B
>>jFFdb9Ii3fx8Ci1OAWwUPUBiVbTK0RRrHY%3D&reserved=0
>>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
I now have the feature/chart-work branch in good shape: the frameworks
projects build and so do all of the examples; both ANT and maven builds
ran. I'm much, much more confident in the changes and stability of this
feature branch than I was last week.
I ran the following examples successfully: ChartExample,
DataBindingExample, DataGridExample, FlexJSStore, DesktopMap, DateChooser,
MDLExample, and TreeExample. Several of the others need some reworking but
I think they are just layout issues.
The changes in this feature branch reduce the amount of HTML nodes created
and reduce the number of times layouts are invoked upon component
start-up. I found several cases of redundant events and shifted some code
around to make things more consistent and streamlined.
My next task is to write up a Wiki page on the FlexJS site (or amend
existing pages, as needed). I will be writing about component creation,
life cycle, and layout development.
I would like to merge feature/chart-work into development tomorrow. I do
not anticipate any further changes unless someone finds issues that would
prevent this.
If there are specific examples or build questions, I'll be happy to answer
them as best I can.
Regards,
Peter
On 4/10/17, 9:44 AM, "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com> wrote:
>I know have MDLExample working.
>
>I think I did this unwittingly: The MaterialDesignLite project's
>default.css has the IDateProviderItemRendererMapper for the Tabs and
>TabBar components specified as TabsItemRendererFactoryForArrayListData.
>But the dataProvider being supplied to the tab components were Arrays and
>not ArrayLists.
>
>I changed the data models to supply ArrayLists for the dataProviders and
>now the tabs are working. I think our changes together made this work
>again.
>
>Perhaps MDL should have a single item renderer data factory that is
>universal in that it can accept either Array or ArrayList data and help
>prevent this from happening in the future. I set this type of thing up in
>the Express package (which I still have to test, now that I write this).
>
>This is the feature/chart-work branch.
>
>Regards,
>Peter
>
>On 4/9/17, 6:26 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into
>>MDLExample.
>>Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
>>
>>Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
>>
>>If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
>>
>>Piotr
>>
>>
>>
>>-----
>>Apache Flex PMC
>>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>>--
>>View this message in context:
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>e
>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp
>>6
>>1035p61069.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca87dd5981445498e7c8508d47f98cec9%7Cfa7b
>>1
>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636273741673604657&sdata=%2BiQ9rmOD
>>B
>>jFFdb9Ii3fx8Ci1OAWwUPUBiVbTK0RRrHY%3D&reserved=0
>>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
I know have MDLExample working.
I think I did this unwittingly: The MaterialDesignLite project's
default.css has the IDateProviderItemRendererMapper for the Tabs and
TabBar components specified as TabsItemRendererFactoryForArrayListData.
But the dataProvider being supplied to the tab components were Arrays and
not ArrayLists.
I changed the data models to supply ArrayLists for the dataProviders and
now the tabs are working. I think our changes together made this work
again.
Perhaps MDL should have a single item renderer data factory that is
universal in that it can accept either Array or ArrayList data and help
prevent this from happening in the future. I set this type of thing up in
the Express package (which I still have to test, now that I write this).
This is the feature/chart-work branch.
Regards,
Peter
On 4/9/17, 6:26 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into
>MDLExample.
>Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
>
>Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
>
>If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
>
>Piotr
>
>
>
>-----
>Apache Flex PMC
>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>--
>View this message in context:
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp6
>1035p61069.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca87dd5981445498e7c8508d47f98cec9%7Cfa7b1
>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636273741673604657&sdata=%2BiQ9rmODB
>jFFdb9Ii3fx8Ci1OAWwUPUBiVbTK0RRrHY%3D&reserved=0
>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
I will look into it and let you know. I changed the life cycle for lists
just a little. I found that the item renderers were being created more
than once (sometimes) and the layouts were being run several times
(sometimes) so I tracked down redundant event dispatches and eliminated
them. Then I went back through examples to see what was depending on the
eliminated events and adjusted them. This is probably the same case. Once
this works out the event flow should be consistent.
‹peter
On 4/9/17, 6:26 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into
>MDLExample.
>Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
>
>Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
>
>If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
>
>Piotr
>
>
>
>-----
>Apache Flex PMC
>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>--
>View this message in context:
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp6
>1035p61069.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ca87dd5981445498e7c8508d47f98cec9%7Cfa7b1
>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636273741673604657&sdata=%2BiQ9rmODB
>jFFdb9Ii3fx8Ci1OAWwUPUBiVbTK0RRrHY%3D&reserved=0
>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>.
Ahh I forgot to mention that you can see issue when you look into MDLExample.
Main TabBar do not display Tabs.
Basically in TabBarView itemsCreated method has not been called.
If you lost in there I will put some basic example.
Piotr
-----
Apache Flex PMC
piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
--
View this message in context: http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp61035p61069.html
Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
Thanks. I'm having trouble understanding what code is changing the active
tab panel. I can see in the DOM, a tab with is-active set and a
corresponding tab panel has is-active set.
After I add a new tab, things look normal in the DOM. I can now select the
new tab and see that the new tab gets is-active set and the new panel gets
is-active set; no other tab or panel has is-active set.
Then I click from the new tab to a previous tab and the new tab has
is-active removed and the other tab has is-active set. But the new panel
is still is-active while the panel corresponding to the tab I clicked also
has is-active set. I'm trying to figure out where that is happening, but
the tab selection code isn't being called as far as I can tell. Is it now
just happening in CSS?
There is also a number of extra events happening, but I don't think that
is specific to the MDL code. Since a lot of this code is reused for
multiple components, its a little difficult to tell what is actually
happening.
Thanks for any help or advice you can give.
‹peter
On 4/7/17, 2:46 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Peter,
>
>If you stack on something let me know I will have some free cycles on
>Sunday.
>
>Piotr
>
>
>
>-----
>Apache Flex PMC
>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>--
>View this message in context:
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp6
>1035p61041.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cc624155aceee4a08d1b608d47de7b1ad%7Cfa7b1
>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636271881449970250&sdata=K4snMf9mXOg
>z7a80ci98IBhOckcZxWuv1LxhhOP3P0M%3D&reserved=0
>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>.
Peter,
If you stack on something let me know I will have some free cycles on
Sunday.
Piotr
-----
Apache Flex PMC
piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
--
View this message in context: http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp61035p61041.html
Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
I've been working on this most of the day. I think there is something more
fundamental going on that this example has uncovered. There appear to be
duplicate events happening causing event handlers to be registered
multiple times. I'm not comfortable releasing this yet into develop.
I'll continue to work on it over the weekend and we'll see where I get by
Monday.
Regards,
Peter
On 4/7/17, 7:41 AM, "Peter Ent" <pe...@adobe.com> wrote:
>I see that. I thought I fixed that. I'll look it while I'm building the
>examples.
>‹peter
>
>On 4/6/17, 5:55 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Hi Peter,
>>
>>I just tried MDLExample and it look good, but MDLDynamicTabsExample has
>>same
>>problem. Something is going wrong when Tab is being added.
>>
>>Piotr
>>
>>
>>
>>-----
>>Apache Flex PMC
>>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>>--
>>View this message in context:
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fl
>>e
>>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp
>>6
>>1035p61036.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ceab9e55a09c44c3abba808d47d38ecc1%7Cfa7b
>>1
>>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636271130849952954&sdata=WQwjZQCjhY
>>E
>>ugbdoLNyqOtuIJX%2FtAh94muXgCW9GKIs%3D&reserved=0
>>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by Peter Ent <pe...@adobe.com>.
I see that. I thought I fixed that. I'll look it while I'm building the
examples.
‹peter
On 4/6/17, 5:55 PM, "piotrz" <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Hi Peter,
>
>I just tried MDLExample and it look good, but MDLDynamicTabsExample has
>same
>problem. Something is going wrong when Tab is being added.
>
>Piotr
>
>
>
>-----
>Apache Flex PMC
>piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>--
>View this message in context:
>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapache-fle
>x-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com%2FFlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp6
>1035p61036.html&data=02%7C01%7C%7Ceab9e55a09c44c3abba808d47d38ecc1%7Cfa7b1
>b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636271130849952954&sdata=WQwjZQCjhYE
>ugbdoLNyqOtuIJX%2FtAh94muXgCW9GKIs%3D&reserved=0
>Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
yes because LLVM to LLVM is sooooo difficult... You have actually have anything constructive to contribute?
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:09 PM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Yeah the life in Mars could be very exciting, let me know when you are there ...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 3:17 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> WebAssembly is officially supported in both Chrome and Firefox right
> now, and in the rest very soon.
> WebAssembly can take LLVM and compiles to a binary format that works
> cross browser at near native speeds without any plugin.
> LightSpark is an open source implemention of the flash player written
> in
> C++ that can compile to LLVM. Potentionally we can compile LightSpark
> C++ to
> LLVM and be able to run all flash apps in all browsers without any plugin
> and completely bypass the death of the flash player. Thoughts?
> ~ JT
>
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>.
I still don't like these references to aliens. Please, let's focus on the
technical aspects.
IMO, Apache Flex is about components and not about platforms. That is why
FlexJS is attempting to be platform agnostic. It supports SWF and
HTML/JS/CSS today. Maybe some other platform in the future.
Apache projects are about communities of people with similar interests. I
personally would not want to work on any emulation of Flash. The problem
space is too big. There will be expectations that non-Flex content will
run on these emulations. When something goes wrong, you can't just use an
AS-only project or JSFiddle to test whether it is Flex code or the
platform. Once you are responsible for a platform, you have to deal with
lots more configuration issues that are abstracted away from Flex.
But that doesn't mean that folks can't discuss these topics here, although
extended discussion should probably happen in the communities that are
actually building out the code (W3C, skia, Flutter). And those
communities are welcome to discuss their work here in order to draw
attention and recruit for their communities. And I wish all of them luck,
and hope that our components work on their platforms.
My 2 cents,
-Alex
On 4/11/17, 7:53 AM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Great! when you guy enjoying wherever it is, please do mind people still
>on
>earth can't bypass FP, begging for next release of Flex.
>
>On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 6:48 AM, Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> It's a known fact that Flutter is already doing that, only releases at
>>the
>> moment for ios/android, but I believe that in a 1 year span it will be
>> possible to deploy to desktop too...
>>
>> No comments? too much work? Am I living on Jupiter? ^^
>>
>> 2017-04-11 10:35 GMT+01:00 Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>:
>>
>> > If drawing on gpu is possible, I would go even further and also add
>>skia
>> > to the discussion.
>> >
>> > My vision is, use skia to render everywhere.. Having then different
>> > "falcon" to compile for webgl/ios/android/win/osx/unix/raspi
>> >
>> > Now.. what would be needed? I think a transpiler of "stage3d" to
>>"skia"
>> > could be a 1st attempt..
>> >
>> > Thoughts?
>> >
>> > 2017-04-11 7:32 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>> >
>> >> Gary,
>> >>
>> >> Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who
>>want to
>> >> try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is a
>> long
>> >> shot as well.
>> >>
>> >> I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read
>>today, I
>> >> think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
>> >> WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen.
>>It
>> >> sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
>> >>
>> >> -Alex
>> >>
>> >> On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started
>> designing
>> >> >HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player
>>now,
>> >> >maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
>> >> >
>> >> >On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
>> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should
>>check
>> >> >>out
>> >> >> some articles on it:
>> >> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
>> >> 3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
>> >> >>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C9587
>> >> 71644c3444d5448
>> >> >>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>> >> 7C63627474370530
>> >> >>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%
>> >> 2FgJY%3D&reserved=0
>> >> >> master/FAQ.md,
>> >> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
>> >> 3A%2F%2Fdevelope
>> >> >>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=02%
>> >> 7C01%7C%7C958771644
>> >> >>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1
>> >> %7C0%7C0%7C6362
>> >> >>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQ
>> >> ahTmV06%2FAc%3D
>> >> >>&reserved=0
>> >> >> Concepts
>> >> >>
>> >> >> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS
>>will
>> >> >>never
>> >> >> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser,
>> and
>> >> >>thus
>> >> >> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that
>> >> included
>> >> >> all the major browser vendors.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you
>> spread
>> >> >> mis-information.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> >> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
>> >> >> To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> >> >> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>> >> >>
>> >> >> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash
>>Player
>> >> >>stable
>> >> >> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved
>>a
>> lot
>> >> >> still crash all the time.
>> >> >> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let
>>anything
>> >> our
>> >> >> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only
>> >> >>exception,
>> >> >> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> The only chance to implement high performance application across
>>main
>> >> >> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved
>> it, I
>> >> >> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually
>>it,
>> >> >>most
>> >> >> just follow what others say.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from
>>the
>> >> >>very
>> >> >> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala
>><joshtynjala@gmail.com
>> >
>> >> >> wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to
>> WebAssembly.
>> >> >> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious
>>modification to
>> >> be
>> >> >> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native
>> APIs
>> >> >> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > - Josh
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor
>><ja...@dedoose.com>
>> >> >>wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about
>>taking
>> >> >> > LightSpark
>> >> >> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using
>>that
>> >> >> > > input
>> >> >> > for
>> >> >> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
>> >> >> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has
>>nothing to
>> >> do
>> >> >> > > with the
>> >> >> > existing
>> >> >> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to
>>run
>> >> in
>> >> >> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on
>> iOS).
>> >> >> Not
>> >> >> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will
>> never
>> >> >> > > give
>> >> >> > us
>> >> >> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life
>>cycle of
>> >> >> > > the
>> >> >> > flash
>> >> >> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete
>>rewrite
>> in
>> >> >> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
>> >> >> > > ~ JT
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> >> >> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
>> >> >> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> >> >> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in
>>WebAssembly
>> >> >> > > feels
>> >> >> > just
>> >> >> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with
>>HTML/Javascript/CSS
>> >> >> > regardless
>> >> >> > > of performance, after so many years ...
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <
>> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> >> >
>> >> >> > wrote:
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> > > > Hi Gary,
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache
>>Flex is
>> >> an
>> >> >> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some
>>idea
>> >> >> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > Piotr
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > > > -----
>> >> >> > > > Apache Flex PMC
>> >> >> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> >> >> > > > --
>> >> >> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
>> >> >> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
>> >> >> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
>> >> >> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive
>>at
>> >> >> > Nabble.com.
>> >> >> > > >
>> >> >> > >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Gary Yang <fl...@gmail.com>.
Great! when you guy enjoying wherever it is, please do mind people still on
earth can't bypass FP, begging for next release of Flex.
On Tue, Apr 11, 2017 at 6:48 AM, Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's a known fact that Flutter is already doing that, only releases at the
> moment for ios/android, but I believe that in a 1 year span it will be
> possible to deploy to desktop too...
>
> No comments? too much work? Am I living on Jupiter? ^^
>
> 2017-04-11 10:35 GMT+01:00 Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>:
>
> > If drawing on gpu is possible, I would go even further and also add skia
> > to the discussion.
> >
> > My vision is, use skia to render everywhere.. Having then different
> > "falcon" to compile for webgl/ios/android/win/osx/unix/raspi
> >
> > Now.. what would be needed? I think a transpiler of "stage3d" to "skia"
> > could be a 1st attempt..
> >
> > Thoughts?
> >
> > 2017-04-11 7:32 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
> >
> >> Gary,
> >>
> >> Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who want to
> >> try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is a
> long
> >> shot as well.
> >>
> >> I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read today, I
> >> think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
> >> WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen. It
> >> sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
> >>
> >> -Alex
> >>
> >> On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> >Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started
> designing
> >> >HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player now,
> >> >maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
> >> >
> >> >On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check
> >> >>out
> >> >> some articles on it:
> >> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
> >> 3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
> >> >>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C9587
> >> 71644c3444d5448
> >> >>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
> >> 7C63627474370530
> >> >>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%
> >> 2FgJY%3D&reserved=0
> >> >> master/FAQ.md,
> >> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
> >> 3A%2F%2Fdevelope
> >> >>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=02%
> >> 7C01%7C%7C958771644
> >> >>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1
> >> %7C0%7C0%7C6362
> >> >>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQ
> >> ahTmV06%2FAc%3D
> >> >>&reserved=0
> >> >> Concepts
> >> >>
> >> >> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will
> >> >>never
> >> >> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser,
> and
> >> >>thus
> >> >> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that
> >> included
> >> >> all the major browser vendors.
> >> >>
> >> >> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you
> spread
> >> >> mis-information.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> >> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
> >> >> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> >> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >> >>
> >> >> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player
> >> >>stable
> >> >> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a
> lot
> >> >> still crash all the time.
> >> >> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything
> >> our
> >> >> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only
> >> >>exception,
> >> >> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
> >> >>
> >> >> The only chance to implement high performance application across main
> >> >> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved
> it, I
> >> >> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it,
> >> >>most
> >> >> just follow what others say.
> >> >>
> >> >> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the
> >> >>very
> >> >> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <joshtynjala@gmail.com
> >
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to
> WebAssembly.
> >> >> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to
> >> be
> >> >> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native
> APIs
> >> >> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > - Josh
> >> >> >
> >> >> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
> >> >>wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> >> >> > LightSpark
> >> >> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
> >> >> > > input
> >> >> > for
> >> >> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
> >> >> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to
> >> do
> >> >> > > with the
> >> >> > existing
> >> >> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run
> >> in
> >> >> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on
> iOS).
> >> >> Not
> >> >> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will
> never
> >> >> > > give
> >> >> > us
> >> >> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
> >> >> > > the
> >> >> > flash
> >> >> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite
> in
> >> >> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> >> >> > > ~ JT
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> >> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> >> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> >> >> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> >> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
> >> >> > > feels
> >> >> > just
> >> >> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
> >> >> > regardless
> >> >> > > of performance, after so many years ...
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <
> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> >> >
> >> >> > wrote:
> >> >> > >
> >> >> > > > Hi Gary,
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is
> >> an
> >> >> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
> >> >> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > Piotr
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > > > -----
> >> >> > > > Apache Flex PMC
> >> >> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> >> >> > > > --
> >> >> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> >> >> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> >> >> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> >> >> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> >> >> > Nabble.com.
> >> >> > > >
> >> >> > >
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>.
It's a known fact that Flutter is already doing that, only releases at the
moment for ios/android, but I believe that in a 1 year span it will be
possible to deploy to desktop too...
No comments? too much work? Am I living on Jupiter? ^^
2017-04-11 10:35 GMT+01:00 Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>:
> If drawing on gpu is possible, I would go even further and also add skia
> to the discussion.
>
> My vision is, use skia to render everywhere.. Having then different
> "falcon" to compile for webgl/ios/android/win/osx/unix/raspi
>
> Now.. what would be needed? I think a transpiler of "stage3d" to "skia"
> could be a 1st attempt..
>
> Thoughts?
>
> 2017-04-11 7:32 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
>
>> Gary,
>>
>> Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who want to
>> try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is a long
>> shot as well.
>>
>> I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read today, I
>> think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
>> WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen. It
>> sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
>>
>> -Alex
>>
>> On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started designing
>> >HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player now,
>> >maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
>> >
>> >On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check
>> >>out
>> >> some articles on it:
>> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
>> 3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
>> >>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C9587
>> 71644c3444d5448
>> >>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%
>> 7C63627474370530
>> >>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%
>> 2FgJY%3D&reserved=0
>> >> master/FAQ.md,
>> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%
>> 3A%2F%2Fdevelope
>> >>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=02%
>> 7C01%7C%7C958771644
>> >>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1
>> %7C0%7C0%7C6362
>> >>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQ
>> ahTmV06%2FAc%3D
>> >>&reserved=0
>> >> Concepts
>> >>
>> >> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will
>> >>never
>> >> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser, and
>> >>thus
>> >> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that
>> included
>> >> all the major browser vendors.
>> >>
>> >> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you spread
>> >> mis-information.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
>> >> To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> >> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>> >>
>> >> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player
>> >>stable
>> >> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot
>> >> still crash all the time.
>> >> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything
>> our
>> >> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only
>> >>exception,
>> >> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
>> >>
>> >> The only chance to implement high performance application across main
>> >> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I
>> >> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it,
>> >>most
>> >> just follow what others say.
>> >>
>> >> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the
>> >>very
>> >> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
>> >> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to
>> be
>> >> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs
>> >> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
>> >> >
>> >> > - Josh
>> >> >
>> >> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
>> >>wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
>> >> > LightSpark
>> >> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
>> >> > > input
>> >> > for
>> >> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
>> >> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to
>> do
>> >> > > with the
>> >> > existing
>> >> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run
>> in
>> >> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS).
>> >> Not
>> >> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never
>> >> > > give
>> >> > us
>> >> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
>> >> > > the
>> >> > flash
>> >> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in
>> >> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
>> >> > > ~ JT
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > -----Original Message-----
>> >> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> >> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
>> >> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> >> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>> >> > >
>> >> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
>> >> > > feels
>> >> > just
>> >> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
>> >> > regardless
>> >> > > of performance, after so many years ...
>> >> > >
>> >> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> >
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> > >
>> >> > > > Hi Gary,
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is
>> an
>> >> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
>> >> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > Piotr
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > >
>> >> > > > -----
>> >> > > > Apache Flex PMC
>> >> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> >> > > > --
>> >> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
>> >> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
>> >> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
>> >> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
>> >> > Nabble.com.
>> >> > > >
>> >> > >
>> >> >
>> >>
>>
>>
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>.
On 4/12/17, 11:37 AM, "Jason Taylor" <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>Would be really nice if somehow we could get a lot of votes on this
>issue, the flash player team would be the best group to work on this, and
>this would hugely benefit a all flash/flex/air/flex js people. Alex,
>any chance you could help this vote get more attention?
I do not have influence in that arena.
-Alex
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
Would be really nice if somehow we could get a lot of votes on this issue, the flash player team would be the best group to work on this, and this would hugely benefit a all flash/flex/air/flex js people. Alex, any chance you could help this vote get more attention?
~ JT
-----Original Message-----
From: Bernhard Schleicher [mailto:bernhard.schleicher@emmgt.at]
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2017 3:23 AM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
There is an issue by adobe to implement a HTML Target for Air (WebGL /
WebAssembly)
https://tracker.adobe.com/#/view/AIR-4178275
Please vote for this issue if you are interested.
Regards,
Bernhard
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Chiverton [mailto:tc@extravision.com]
Sent: Mittwoch, 12. April 2017 09:53
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
I certainly look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
Sounds like you relish the challenge !
Tom
On 11/04/17 20:09, Jason Taylor wrote:
> problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit of
> experience in the area.
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Bernhard Schleicher <be...@emmgt.at>.
There is an issue by adobe to implement a HTML Target for Air (WebGL /
WebAssembly)
https://tracker.adobe.com/#/view/AIR-4178275
Please vote for this issue if you are interested.
Regards,
Bernhard
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Chiverton [mailto:tc@extravision.com]
Sent: Mittwoch, 12. April 2017 09:53
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
I certainly look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
Sounds like you relish the challenge !
Tom
On 11/04/17 20:09, Jason Taylor wrote:
> problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit of
> experience in the area.
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>.
About Skia, there are a lot of port's on github..
2017-04-12 8:52 GMT+01:00 Tom Chiverton <tc...@extravision.com>:
> I certainly look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
>
> Sounds like you relish the challenge !
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> On 11/04/17 20:09, Jason Taylor wrote:
>
>> problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit
>> of experience in the area.
>>
>
>
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
lol yes, currently WebAssembly dosen't include the bindings to WebGL, so still have to hack things around a bit, but yes essentially we would have to rewrite the main rendering engine to WebGL, still haven't made it deep into LightSpark's rendering engine, but assuming they are mimicking the native flash renderer which is an absolutely beast
-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Chiverton [mailto:tc@extravision.com]
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2017 12:53 AM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
I certainly look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
Sounds like you relish the challenge !
Tom
On 11/04/17 20:09, Jason Taylor wrote:
> problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit of experience in the area.
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Tom Chiverton <tc...@extravision.com>.
I certainly look forward to seeing what comes out of it.
Sounds like you relish the challenge !
Tom
On 11/04/17 20:09, Jason Taylor wrote:
> problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit of experience in the area.
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
That's a really great idea! Just starting to get LightSpark and WebAssembly building separately, so a lot of stuff to digest and tear through before I'll be able to even wrap my head around it, but yes the problem area is obviously the rendering engine, but I do have quite a bit of experience in the area. Hopefully I'll have more information in a month or so. I'm not quite convinced this idea is as crazy as others are making it out to be when many others have done most of the difficult work already. In an ideal world it would allow the Falcon swf output to be bundled into Lightspark compiled to WebAssembly and run in browser with massive performance gains over the html/js version.
Gary, long shots and out of the box thinking have never scared me, and I wouldn't be nearly as successful if I had blindly followed the masses.
~ JT
-----Original Message-----
From: Dev LFM [mailto:developerlfm@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2017 2:35 AM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
If drawing on gpu is possible, I would go even further and also add skia to the discussion.
My vision is, use skia to render everywhere.. Having then different "falcon" to compile for webgl/ios/android/win/osx/unix/raspi
Now.. what would be needed? I think a transpiler of "stage3d" to "skia"
could be a 1st attempt..
Thoughts?
2017-04-11 7:32 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
> Gary,
>
> Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who want
> to try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is
> a long shot as well.
>
> I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read today,
> I think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
> WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen. It
> sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
>
> -Alex
>
> On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started
> >designing
> >HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player
> >now, maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
> >
> >On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should
> >>check out some articles on it:
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
> >>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%
> 7C958771644c3444d5448
> >>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> cee1%7C0%7C0%7C63627474370530
> >>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%2FgJY%3D&reserv
> >>ed=0
> >> master/FAQ.md,
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fdevelope
> >>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=
> 02%7C01%7C%7C958771644
> >>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> cee1%7C0%7C0%7C6362
> >>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQahTm
> V06%2FAc%3D
> >>&reserved=0
> >> Concepts
> >>
> >> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS
> >>will never be efficent enough to implement complex software/games
> >>in browser, and thus WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the
> >>W3C committee that included all the major browser vendors.
> >>
> >> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you
> >> spread mis-information.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
> >> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >>
> >> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player
> >>stable enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time,
> >>improved a lot still crash all the time.
> >> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let
> >>anything our of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is
> >>the only exception, it came too early and too important to the web
> >>to be killed.
> >>
> >> The only chance to implement high performance application across
> >>main stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has
> >>proved it, I don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this
> >>is usually it, most just follow what others say.
> >>
> >> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from
> >>the very beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging
> >>edge...
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala
> >> <jo...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
> >> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification
> >> > to be able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever
> >> > native APIs it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
> >> >
> >> > - Josh
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
> >>wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> >> > LightSpark
> >> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using
> >> > > that input
> >> > for
> >> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
> >> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing
> >> > > to do with the
> >> > existing
> >> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to
> >> > > run in browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS).
> >> Not
> >> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will
> >> > > never give
> >> > us
> >> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle
> >> > > of the
> >> > flash
> >> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete
> >> > > rewrite in a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> >> > > ~ JT
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> >> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >> > >
> >> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
> >> > > feels
> >> > just
> >> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with
> >> > > HTML/Javascript/CSS
> >> > regardless
> >> > > of performance, after so many years ...
> >> > >
> >> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz
> >> > > <pi...@gmail.com>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > Hi Gary,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex
> >> > > > is an open source project and if Jason would like to bring
> >> > > > some idea here he is very welcome, same as you.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Piotr
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > -----
> >> > > > Apache Flex PMC
> >> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> >> > > > --
> >> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> >> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> >> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> >> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> >> > Nabble.com.
> >> > > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Dev LFM <de...@gmail.com>.
If drawing on gpu is possible, I would go even further and also add skia to
the discussion.
My vision is, use skia to render everywhere.. Having then different
"falcon" to compile for webgl/ios/android/win/osx/unix/raspi
Now.. what would be needed? I think a transpiler of "stage3d" to "skia"
could be a 1st attempt..
Thoughts?
2017-04-11 7:32 GMT+01:00 Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>:
> Gary,
>
> Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who want to
> try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is a long
> shot as well.
>
> I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read today, I
> think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
> WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen. It
> sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
>
> -Alex
>
> On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started designing
> >HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player now,
> >maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
> >
> >On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check
> >>out
> >> some articles on it:
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
> >>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%
> 7C958771644c3444d5448
> >>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> cee1%7C0%7C0%7C63627474370530
> >>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%2FgJY%3D&reserved=0
> >> master/FAQ.md,
> >>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=
> https%3A%2F%2Fdevelope
> >>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=
> 02%7C01%7C%7C958771644
> >>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178de
> cee1%7C0%7C0%7C6362
> >>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQahTm
> V06%2FAc%3D
> >>&reserved=0
> >> Concepts
> >>
> >> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will
> >>never
> >> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser, and
> >>thus
> >> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that included
> >> all the major browser vendors.
> >>
> >> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you spread
> >> mis-information.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
> >> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >>
> >> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player
> >>stable
> >> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot
> >> still crash all the time.
> >> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything our
> >> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only
> >>exception,
> >> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
> >>
> >> The only chance to implement high performance application across main
> >> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I
> >> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it,
> >>most
> >> just follow what others say.
> >>
> >> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the
> >>very
> >> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
> >>
> >>
> >> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
> >> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be
> >> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs
> >> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
> >> >
> >> > - Josh
> >> >
> >> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
> >>wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> >> > LightSpark
> >> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
> >> > > input
> >> > for
> >> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
> >> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do
> >> > > with the
> >> > existing
> >> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
> >> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS).
> >> Not
> >> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never
> >> > > give
> >> > us
> >> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
> >> > > the
> >> > flash
> >> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in
> >> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> >> > > ~ JT
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> > > -----Original Message-----
> >> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> >> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> >> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> >> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >> > >
> >> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
> >> > > feels
> >> > just
> >> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
> >> > regardless
> >> > > of performance, after so many years ...
> >> > >
> >> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>
> >> > wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > > Hi Gary,
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> >> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
> >> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Piotr
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > >
> >> > > > -----
> >> > > > Apache Flex PMC
> >> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> >> > > > --
> >> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> >> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> >> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> >> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> >> > Nabble.com.
> >> > > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >>
>
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Alex Harui <ah...@adobe.com>.
Gary,
Please try to focus on actual technical issues and let those who want to
try, try it. Some people think making Flex/FlexJS popular again is a long
shot as well.
I'm not that familiar with WebAssembly, but from what I've read today, I
think Josh has hit on the main technical challenge, which is that
WebAssembly doesn't appear to let you draw directly to the screen. It
sort of reminds me of Alchemy/FlasCC.
-Alex
On 4/10/17, 7:26 PM, "Gary Yang" <fl...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started designing
>HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player now,
>maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
>
>On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>
>> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check
>>out
>> some articles on it:
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.c
>>om%2FWebAssembly%2Fdesign%2Fblob%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C958771644c3444d5448
>>308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C63627474370530
>>2509&sdata=roF8%2B3Z2KOZAW7NVE8QJ3OSFAraX8ViFl179cVi%2FgJY%3D&reserved=0
>> master/FAQ.md,
>>https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdevelope
>>r.mozilla.org%2Fen-US%2Fdocs%2FWebAssembly%2F&data=02%7C01%7C%7C958771644
>>c3444d5448308d480821d4b%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C6362
>>74743705302509&sdata=sf%2FmlA5b%2FvU79NgnjPu1tdhbF3sJ1FAoQahTmV06%2FAc%3D
>>&reserved=0
>> Concepts
>>
>> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will
>>never
>> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser, and
>>thus
>> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that included
>> all the major browser vendors.
>>
>> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you spread
>> mis-information.
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
>> To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>>
>> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player
>>stable
>> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot
>> still crash all the time.
>> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything our
>> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only
>>exception,
>> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
>>
>> The only chance to implement high performance application across main
>> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I
>> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it,
>>most
>> just follow what others say.
>>
>> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the
>>very
>> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
>> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be
>> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs
>> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
>> >
>> > - Josh
>> >
>> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>
>>wrote:
>> >
>> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
>> > LightSpark
>> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
>> > > input
>> > for
>> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
>> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do
>> > > with the
>> > existing
>> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
>> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS).
>> Not
>> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never
>> > > give
>> > us
>> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
>> > > the
>> > flash
>> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in
>> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
>> > > ~ JT
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > -----Original Message-----
>> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
>> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
>> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
>> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>> > >
>> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
>> > > feels
>> > just
>> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
>> > regardless
>> > > of performance, after so many years ...
>> > >
>> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > Hi Gary,
>> > > >
>> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
>> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
>> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
>> > > >
>> > > > Piotr
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > -----
>> > > > Apache Flex PMC
>> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> > > > --
>> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
>> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
>> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
>> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
>> > Nabble.com.
>> > > >
>> > >
>> >
>>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Gary Yang <fl...@gmail.com>.
Thanks, I would love to see how you can get there, W3C started designing
HTML5 in 2009, Firefox is still making exception for Flash Player now,
maybe you can help them get rid of it and unify the web truly.
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:24 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check out
> some articles on it: https://github.com/WebAssembly/design/blob/
> master/FAQ.md, https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/WebAssembly/
> Concepts
>
> In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will never
> be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser, and thus
> WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that included
> all the major browser vendors.
>
> Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you spread
> mis-information.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>
> 1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player stable
> enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot
> still crash all the time.
> 2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything our
> of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only exception,
> it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
>
> The only chance to implement high performance application across main
> stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I
> don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it, most
> just follow what others say.
>
> Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the very
> beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
> > I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be
> > able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs
> > it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
> >
> > - Josh
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> > LightSpark
> > > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
> > > input
> > for
> > > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
> > > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do
> > > with the
> > existing
> > > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
> > > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS).
> Not
> > > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never
> > > give
> > us
> > > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
> > > the
> > flash
> > > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in
> > > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> > > ~ JT
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> > > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> > > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> > >
> > > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
> > > feels
> > just
> > > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
> > regardless
> > > of performance, after so many years ...
> > >
> > > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi Gary,
> > > >
> > > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> > > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
> > > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
> > > >
> > > > Piotr
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----
> > > > Apache Flex PMC
> > > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> > > > --
> > > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> > > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> > > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> > > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> > Nabble.com.
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
Gary, do you even have any idea what WebAssembly is? You should check out some articles on it: https://github.com/WebAssembly/design/blob/master/FAQ.md, https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/WebAssembly/Concepts
In a nutshell the browser vendors finally realized that HTML+JS will never be efficent enough to implement complex software/games in browser, and thus WebAssembly was born. It was designed by the W3C committee that included all the major browser vendors.
Please do yourself a favor and research your opinion before you spread mis-information.
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 2:21 PM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player stable enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot still crash all the time.
2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything our of their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only exception, it came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
The only chance to implement high performance application across main stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it, most just follow what others say.
Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the very beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly.
> I suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be
> able to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs
> it uses now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
>
> - Josh
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>
> > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> LightSpark
> > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that
> > input
> for
> > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a
> > LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do
> > with the
> existing
> > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
> > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS). Not
> > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never
> > give
> us
> > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of
> > the
> flash
> > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in
> > a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> > ~ JT
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >
> > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly
> > feels
> just
> > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
> regardless
> > of performance, after so many years ...
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Gary,
> > >
> > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea
> > > here he is very welcome, same as you.
> > >
> > > Piotr
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----
> > > Apache Flex PMC
> > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> > > --
> > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
> > >
> >
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Gary Yang <fl...@gmail.com>.
1) It takes a long time to make a powerful system like Flash Player stable
enough, Google Map has been using webGL for a long time, improved a lot
still crash all the time.
2) Politically, none of the major browser vendors would let anything our of
their control grow bigger anymore, Flash Player is the only exception, it
came too early and too important to the web to be killed.
The only chance to implement high performance application across main
stream browsers is still Flash with stage3D AGAL, time has proved it, I
don't the majority get it, when it comes to tech, this is usually it, most
just follow what others say.
Sad haaa? What if spent time in implementing Flex with AGAL from the very
beginning? Flash platform might not be on the hanging edge...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 5:16 PM, Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly. I
> suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be able
> to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs it uses
> now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
>
> - Josh
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>
> > Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking
> LightSpark
> > as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that input
> for
> > the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a LightSpark
> > WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do with the
> existing
> > FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
> > browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS). Not
> > quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never give
> us
> > the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of the
> flash
> > player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in a
> > performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> > ~ JT
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> > Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> > To: dev@flex.apache.org
> > Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
> >
> > No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly feels
> just
> > like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS
> regardless
> > of performance, after so many years ...
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi Gary,
> > >
> > > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> > > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he
> > > is very welcome, same as you.
> > >
> > > Piotr
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----
> > > Apache Flex PMC
> > > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> > > --
> > > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> > > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> > > status-tp61035p61082.html
> > > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
> > >
> >
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Josh Tynjala <jo...@gmail.com>.
I don't think you can simply compile LightSpark as-is to WebAssembly. I
suspect that its rendering code will need serious modification to be able
to draw to HTML Canvas or WebGL instead of whatever native APIs it uses
now. This part probably wouldn't be trivial.
- Josh
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 1:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking LightSpark
> as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that input for
> the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a LightSpark
> WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do with the existing
> FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in
> browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS). Not
> quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never give us
> the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of the flash
> player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in a
> performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> ~ JT
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>
> No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly feels just
> like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS regardless
> of performance, after so many years ...
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hi Gary,
> >
> > Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> > open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he
> > is very welcome, same as you.
> >
> > Piotr
> >
> >
> >
> > -----
> > Apache Flex PMC
> > piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> > --
> > View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> > development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> > status-tp61035p61082.html
> > Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
> >
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Harbs <ha...@gmail.com>.
I would be very interested in hearing how an experiment like that would work out.
> On Apr 10, 2017, at 4:52 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
>
> Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking LightSpark as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that input for the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do with the existing FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS). Not quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never give us the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of the flash player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
> ~ JT
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
> To: dev@flex.apache.org
> Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
>
> No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly feels just like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS regardless of performance, after so many years ...
>
> On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi Gary,
>>
>> Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
>> open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he
>> is very welcome, same as you.
>>
>> Piotr
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Apache Flex PMC
>> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
>> --
>> View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
>> development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
>> status-tp61035p61082.html
>> Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>
RE: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
Why would we be implementing anything? I'm talking about taking LightSpark as is (with their 252 open bugs) compiling it to LLVM, using that input for the WebAssembly compiler and compiling the output binary as a LightSpark WebAssembly drop in flash player. This has nothing to do with the existing FlexJS work and is merely to allow the existing flash apps to run in browser, cross platform without a plug-in (such as Safari on iOS). Not quite sure what exactly is so crazy here. Sorry, FlexJS will never give us the performance we (Dedoose) need, so extending the life cycle of the flash player a couple more years to buy us time for a complete rewrite in a performant client technology is pretty important to us.
~ JT
-----Original Message-----
From: Gary Yang [mailto:flashflexpro@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, April 10, 2017 1:46 PM
To: dev@flex.apache.org
Subject: Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly feels just like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS regardless of performance, after so many years ...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Gary,
>
> Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an
> open source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he
> is very welcome, same as you.
>
> Piotr
>
>
>
> -----
> Apache Flex PMC
> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> --
> View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> status-tp61035p61082.html
> Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Gary Yang <fl...@gmail.com>.
No mean to be offensive, implementing everything in WebAssembly feels just
like talking about living in Mars, even with HTML/Javascript/CSS regardless
of performance, after so many years ...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 4:18 PM, piotrz <pi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi Gary,
>
> Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an open
> source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he is very
> welcome, same as you.
>
> Piotr
>
>
>
> -----
> Apache Flex PMC
> piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
> --
> View this message in context: http://apache-flex-
> development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-
> status-tp61035p61082.html
> Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>.
Hi Gary,
Please be tolerant to Jason's opinion and ideas. Apache Flex is an open
source project and if Jason would like to bring some idea here he is very
welcome, same as you.
Piotr
-----
Apache Flex PMC
piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
--
View this message in context: http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp61035p61082.html
Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
Re: WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Gary Yang <fl...@gmail.com>.
Yeah the life in Mars could be very exciting, let me know when you are
there ...
On Mon, Apr 10, 2017 at 3:17 PM, Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com> wrote:
> WebAssembly is officially supported in both Chrome and Firefox right now,
> and in the rest very soon.
> WebAssembly can take LLVM and compiles to a binary format that works cross
> browser at near native speeds without any plugin.
> LightSpark is an open source implemention of the flash player written in
> C++ that can compile to LLVM. Potentionally we can compile LightSpark to
> LLVM and be able to run all flash apps in all browsers without any plugin
> and completely bypass the death of the flash player. Thoughts?
> ~ JT
>
>
WebAssembly Flash ByPass
Posted by Jason Taylor <ja...@dedoose.com>.
WebAssembly is officially supported in both Chrome and Firefox right now, and in the rest very soon.
WebAssembly can take LLVM and compiles to a binary format that works cross browser at near native speeds without any plugin.
LightSpark is an open source implemention of the flash player written in C++ that can compile to LLVM. Potentionally we can compile LightSpark to LLVM and be able to run all flash apps in all browsers without any plugin and completely bypass the death of the flash player. Thoughts?
~ JT
Re: [FlexJS] feature/chart_work status
Posted by piotrz <pi...@gmail.com>.
Hi Peter,
I just tried MDLExample and it look good, but MDLDynamicTabsExample has same
problem. Something is going wrong when Tab is being added.
Piotr
-----
Apache Flex PMC
piotrzarzycki21@gmail.com
--
View this message in context: http://apache-flex-development.2333347.n4.nabble.com/FlexJS-feature-chart-work-status-tp61035p61036.html
Sent from the Apache Flex Development mailing list archive at Nabble.com.