Fwd: Feature sponsorship proposal

[James Mitchell <jm...@gmail.com>]

That's a good question.  I have always heard this was the case and I think I
remember someone sending out a link in the past, but I don't keep up with
this kind of stuff.

Can anyone on legal point me to such a paragraph?  (sorry if this is the
wrong forum for this question)


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Rob Leland <le...@speakeasy.net>
Date: Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: Feature sponsorship proposal
To: Struts Developers List <de...@struts.apache.org>


James Mitchell wrote:

> I'm inclined to vote down anything mixing Community and Corporate agenda.
>  I
> think that's just a bad mix.  In fact, the ASF has specific
> rules/guidelines
> with respect to corporate involvement (employment) with too many project
>
>
Do you have that reference ?



 leads.
>
> There's a reason that Apache projects are so successful, in one word ...
> "community".  I hate it as much as the next guy when movement seems to
> stagnate for weeks/months, but that's never just cause to bring in
> money/free stuff as incentive.
>
> The folks who want to help when there's a prize at the end will be the
> first
> ones to dump your a## when you really need them, but don't have an
> incentive
> to offer.
>
> If Struts (or any project) doesn't have enough volunteers to keep the work
> going, then we have bigger issues.
>
> Just my $0.02!
>
>
>
> On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:47 AM, Robert Leland <rl...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Don I have a few questions
> >
> > 1) I agree that this contribution has to be valuable to the contributing
> > company
> > both technically and marketing. Back in 2003 when I obtained free
> > IntelliJ
> > licenses from Jetbrains for the Struts
> > Committers all they wanted was acknowledgment on our web page and that
> > was
> > voted down as too commercial.
> > To IntelliJ's credit they still provided the license and later expanded
> > it
> > to all of Apache.
> > How has the Struts PMC changed since then to allow what your proposing ?
> >
> > 2) What if a proposal isn't on the short list of features, however when
> > it
> > is proposed the Struts community
> > its viewed as a useful idea ?
> >
> > 3) What if it turns out that two competing companies have different
> > implementations, which is a great place to be in.
> >   Do we need to think this far ahead or using Agile methods do we not
> > want to over design this process  initially ?
> >
> >
> > -Rob
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Don Brown wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > > As more and more companies start using open source software, many,
> > > like mine, are looking for ways to give back to the community.  They
> > > want a way to contribute and ensure their contribution will be noticed
> > > and appreciated.  What if we had a feature sponsorship program that
> > > encouraged companies to donate engineering time to filling out needed
> > > features in Struts?
> > >
> > > I imagine it would work like this:
> > >  1. The Struts community comes up with a short list of desired
> > > features with high-level specs
> > >  2. Companies (or individuals) could "sign up" for a feature and
> > > donate internal engineering time to implementing the feature
> > >  3. The Struts community would review then commit the feature
> > >  4. The release notes for that version and perhaps somewhere on the
> > > website would note who gets credit for the feature
> > >
> > > This would help those that want to donate time what features are most
> > > needed by the community and give them a way to receive recognition for
> > > their work in a very public way.    A key component in this proposal
> > > is the way credit is given to the work, something that might encourage
> > > the marketing departments of the respective companies.  The list of
> > > desired features is also important as it ensures their effort will not
> > > be in vain, and it also implies the support of the Struts dev
> > > community to work to apply the patch in a timely manner.
> > >
> > > Thoughts?
> > >
> > > Don
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>




-- 
James Mitchell

Fwd: Feature sponsorship proposal

[James Mitchell <jm...@gmail.com>]

Thanks Henri for that clarification.


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Henri Yandell <ba...@apache.org>
Date: Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 8:50 PM
Subject: Re: Feature sponsorship proposal
To: James Mitchell <jm...@gmail.com>
Cc: legal-discuss@apache.org, leland@speakeasy.net


It's one of the Incubator criteria for consideration when graduating a
project - "how dominated by one entity is it?".

The board ask the same question when reviewing TLPs. I don't believe
there's anything legal to it - it's about community risk. Having one
entity as the resource provider is a danger to the healthy of a
community.

Hen

On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 1:06 PM, James Mitchell <jm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> That's a good question.  I have always heard this was the case and I think
I
> remember someone sending out a link in the past, but I don't keep up with
> this kind of stuff.
>
> Can anyone on legal point me to such a paragraph?  (sorry if this is the
> wrong forum for this question)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Rob Leland <le...@speakeasy.net>
> Date: Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 3:44 PM
>  Subject: Re: Feature sponsorship proposal
> To: Struts Developers List <de...@struts.apache.org>
>
>
> James Mitchell wrote:
>
> > I'm inclined to vote down anything mixing Community and Corporate
agenda.
> I
> > think that's just a bad mix.  In fact, the ASF has specific
> rules/guidelines
> > with respect to corporate involvement (employment) with too many project
> >
> >
>  Do you have that reference ?
>
>
>
>
>
> > leads.
> >
> > There's a reason that Apache projects are so successful, in one word ...
> > "community".  I hate it as much as the next guy when movement seems to
> > stagnate for weeks/months, but that's never just cause to bring in
> > money/free stuff as incentive.
> >
> > The folks who want to help when there's a prize at the end will be the
> first
> > ones to dump your a## when you really need them, but don't have an
> incentive
> > to offer.
> >
> > If Struts (or any project) doesn't have enough volunteers to keep the
work
> > going, then we have bigger issues.
> >
> > Just my $0.02!
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:47 AM, Robert Leland <rl...@apache.org>
wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > > Don I have a few questions
> > >
> > > 1) I agree that this contribution has to be valuable to the
contributing
> > > company
> > > both technically and marketing. Back in 2003 when I obtained free
> IntelliJ
> > > licenses from Jetbrains for the Struts
> > > Committers all they wanted was acknowledgment on our web page and that
> was
> > > voted down as too commercial.
> > > To IntelliJ's credit they still provided the license and later
expanded
> it
> > > to all of Apache.
> > > How has the Struts PMC changed since then to allow what your proposing
?
> > >
> > > 2) What if a proposal isn't on the short list of features, however
when
> it
> > > is proposed the Struts community
> > > its viewed as a useful idea ?
> > >
> > > 3) What if it turns out that two competing companies have different
> > > implementations, which is a great place to be in.
> > >   Do we need to think this far ahead or using Agile methods do we not
> > > want to over design this process  initially ?
> > >
> > >
> > > -Rob
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Don Brown wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > As more and more companies start using open source software, many,
> > > > like mine, are looking for ways to give back to the community.  They
> > > > want a way to contribute and ensure their contribution will be
noticed
> > > > and appreciated.  What if we had a feature sponsorship program that
> > > > encouraged companies to donate engineering time to filling out
needed
> > > > features in Struts?
> > > >
> > > > I imagine it would work like this:
> > > >  1. The Struts community comes up with a short list of desired
> > > > features with high-level specs
> > > >  2. Companies (or individuals) could "sign up" for a feature and
> > > > donate internal engineering time to implementing the feature
> > > >  3. The Struts community would review then commit the feature
> > > >  4. The release notes for that version and perhaps somewhere on the
> > > > website would note who gets credit for the feature
> > > >
> > > > This would help those that want to donate time what features are
most
> > > > needed by the community and give them a way to receive recognition
for
> > > > their work in a very public way.    A key component in this proposal
> > > > is the way credit is given to the work, something that might
encourage
> > > > the marketing departments of the respective companies.  The list of
> > > > desired features is also important as it ensures their effort will
not
> > > > be in vain, and it also implies the support of the Struts dev
> > > > community to work to apply the patch in a timely manner.
> > > >
> > > > Thoughts?
> > > >
> > > > Don
> > > >
> > > >
---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> --
> James Mitchell



-- 
James Mitchell

Re: Feature sponsorship proposal

[Henri Yandell <ba...@apache.org>]

It's one of the Incubator criteria for consideration when graduating a
project - "how dominated by one entity is it?".

The board ask the same question when reviewing TLPs. I don't believe
there's anything legal to it - it's about community risk. Having one
entity as the resource provider is a danger to the healthy of a
community.

Hen

On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 1:06 PM, James Mitchell <jm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> That's a good question.  I have always heard this was the case and I think I
> remember someone sending out a link in the past, but I don't keep up with
> this kind of stuff.
>
> Can anyone on legal point me to such a paragraph?  (sorry if this is the
> wrong forum for this question)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Rob Leland <le...@speakeasy.net>
> Date: Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 3:44 PM
>  Subject: Re: Feature sponsorship proposal
> To: Struts Developers List <de...@struts.apache.org>
>
>
> James Mitchell wrote:
>
> > I'm inclined to vote down anything mixing Community and Corporate agenda.
> I
> > think that's just a bad mix.  In fact, the ASF has specific
> rules/guidelines
> > with respect to corporate involvement (employment) with too many project
> >
> >
>  Do you have that reference ?
>
>
>
>
>
> > leads.
> >
> > There's a reason that Apache projects are so successful, in one word ...
> > "community".  I hate it as much as the next guy when movement seems to
> > stagnate for weeks/months, but that's never just cause to bring in
> > money/free stuff as incentive.
> >
> > The folks who want to help when there's a prize at the end will be the
> first
> > ones to dump your a## when you really need them, but don't have an
> incentive
> > to offer.
> >
> > If Struts (or any project) doesn't have enough volunteers to keep the work
> > going, then we have bigger issues.
> >
> > Just my $0.02!
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Apr 7, 2008 at 10:47 AM, Robert Leland <rl...@apache.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > > Don I have a few questions
> > >
> > > 1) I agree that this contribution has to be valuable to the contributing
> > > company
> > > both technically and marketing. Back in 2003 when I obtained free
> IntelliJ
> > > licenses from Jetbrains for the Struts
> > > Committers all they wanted was acknowledgment on our web page and that
> was
> > > voted down as too commercial.
> > > To IntelliJ's credit they still provided the license and later expanded
> it
> > > to all of Apache.
> > > How has the Struts PMC changed since then to allow what your proposing ?
> > >
> > > 2) What if a proposal isn't on the short list of features, however when
> it
> > > is proposed the Struts community
> > > its viewed as a useful idea ?
> > >
> > > 3) What if it turns out that two competing companies have different
> > > implementations, which is a great place to be in.
> > >   Do we need to think this far ahead or using Agile methods do we not
> > > want to over design this process  initially ?
> > >
> > >
> > > -Rob
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Don Brown wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > As more and more companies start using open source software, many,
> > > > like mine, are looking for ways to give back to the community.  They
> > > > want a way to contribute and ensure their contribution will be noticed
> > > > and appreciated.  What if we had a feature sponsorship program that
> > > > encouraged companies to donate engineering time to filling out needed
> > > > features in Struts?
> > > >
> > > > I imagine it would work like this:
> > > >  1. The Struts community comes up with a short list of desired
> > > > features with high-level specs
> > > >  2. Companies (or individuals) could "sign up" for a feature and
> > > > donate internal engineering time to implementing the feature
> > > >  3. The Struts community would review then commit the feature
> > > >  4. The release notes for that version and perhaps somewhere on the
> > > > website would note who gets credit for the feature
> > > >
> > > > This would help those that want to donate time what features are most
> > > > needed by the community and give them a way to receive recognition for
> > > > their work in a very public way.    A key component in this proposal
> > > > is the way credit is given to the work, something that might encourage
> > > > the marketing departments of the respective companies.  The list of
> > > > desired features is also important as it ensures their effort will not
> > > > be in vain, and it also implies the support of the Struts dev
> > > > community to work to apply the patch in a timely manner.
> > > >
> > > > Thoughts?
> > > >
> > > > Don
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@struts.apache.org
> > > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@struts.apache.org
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> --
> James Mitchell

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