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Posted to dev@openoffice.apache.org by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de> on 2011/09/07 22:44:23 UTC
[repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build OpenOffice?)
Hi Pedro,
On Wednesday, 2011-09-07 14:24:26 -0500, Pedro Giffuni wrote:
> On Wed, 07 Sep 2011 20:46:17 +0200, Mathias Bauer
> <Ma...@gmx.net> wrote:
> >Am 07.09.2011 18:21, schrieb Pedro F. Giffuni:
> >>The external sources include a lot of stuff that is
> >>outdated and there may even be security risks involved.
> >
> >Sure, but replacing that with newer versions usually needs to
> >adjust or
> >at least test code. We shouldn't do that now, 3.4 should be releasesd
> >without too much noise in the code.
>
> OK, that's fine. We do have to update ICU though because
> your migration list includes some issues with headers and
> we need the regex code.
I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated, what "issues
with headers" are you referring?
Eike
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Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Mathias,
On Saturday, 2011-09-10 16:58:21 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> > Apparently yes, only all breakiterator data is based on ICU files.
> >
> > The collator data files were contributed either by the Sun Globalization
> > team (all CJK files) and have a Sun copyright header, or by OOo members,
> > in which case a comment only states for which language/script the data
> > is. Unfortunately hg log shows only the CWS integration commit comment,
> > not the real commits that happened on the CWS, otherwise one could even
> > dig out associated issue numbers and probably would find there the
> > original contributors. Anyway, all submissions should have happened
> > under JCA/SCA and thus are covered by the SGA.
> >
> > The indexentry data files were created by Karl Hong, working for the Sun
> > Globalization team at that time. IIRC he used the CLDR main
> > exemplarCharacters to generate them, see
> > http://unicode.org/repos/cldr-tmp/trunk/diff/summary/root.html and
> > individual language's charts, and added the index information. For CLDR
> > data the applicable license is the Unicode Terms of Use, see
> > http://cldr.unicode.org/index/downloads and
> > http://unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
> > The Unicode copyright notice is included in
> > readlicense_oo/html/THIRDPARTYLICENSEREADME.html
>
> Whatever the source of the data files in i18npool is, we should provide
> them with proper license information.
Well, yes, but what? I'll not come up with something I think would be
the correct legal mumbo jumbo.. I'll happily patch that in if someone
provided correct headers.
Eike
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Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Mathias Bauer <Ma...@gmx.net>.
Am 10.09.2011 16:54, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Mathias,
>
> On Saturday, 2011-09-10 00:11:55 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
>
>> >> If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at least add
>> >> copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we? Or put a license file into
>> >> the repository.
>> >
>> > I'm confused now. The breakiterator data files _have_ copyright headers.
>> > Copyright IBM. Wasn't this what it is all about? Or do you mean we
>> > should add where they originated from, ICU?
>>
>> Not all files in the module i18npool have copyright headers. For
>> example, see the data files in collator or indexentry. When we talked
>> about that some weeks ago you mentioned all of them came from ICU. Did I
>> misunderstand you?
>
> Apparently yes, only all breakiterator data is based on ICU files.
>
> The collator data files were contributed either by the Sun Globalization
> team (all CJK files) and have a Sun copyright header, or by OOo members,
> in which case a comment only states for which language/script the data
> is. Unfortunately hg log shows only the CWS integration commit comment,
> not the real commits that happened on the CWS, otherwise one could even
> dig out associated issue numbers and probably would find there the
> original contributors. Anyway, all submissions should have happened
> under JCA/SCA and thus are covered by the SGA.
>
> The indexentry data files were created by Karl Hong, working for the Sun
> Globalization team at that time. IIRC he used the CLDR main
> exemplarCharacters to generate them, see
> http://unicode.org/repos/cldr-tmp/trunk/diff/summary/root.html and
> individual language's charts, and added the index information. For CLDR
> data the applicable license is the Unicode Terms of Use, see
> http://cldr.unicode.org/index/downloads and
> http://unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
> The Unicode copyright notice is included in
> readlicense_oo/html/THIRDPARTYLICENSEREADME.html
Whatever the source of the data files in i18npool is, we should provide
them with proper license information.
Regards,
Mathias
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Mathias,
On Saturday, 2011-09-10 00:11:55 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> >> If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at least add
> >> copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we? Or put a license file into
> >> the repository.
> >
> > I'm confused now. The breakiterator data files _have_ copyright headers.
> > Copyright IBM. Wasn't this what it is all about? Or do you mean we
> > should add where they originated from, ICU?
>
> Not all files in the module i18npool have copyright headers. For
> example, see the data files in collator or indexentry. When we talked
> about that some weeks ago you mentioned all of them came from ICU. Did I
> misunderstand you?
Apparently yes, only all breakiterator data is based on ICU files.
The collator data files were contributed either by the Sun Globalization
team (all CJK files) and have a Sun copyright header, or by OOo members,
in which case a comment only states for which language/script the data
is. Unfortunately hg log shows only the CWS integration commit comment,
not the real commits that happened on the CWS, otherwise one could even
dig out associated issue numbers and probably would find there the
original contributors. Anyway, all submissions should have happened
under JCA/SCA and thus are covered by the SGA.
The indexentry data files were created by Karl Hong, working for the Sun
Globalization team at that time. IIRC he used the CLDR main
exemplarCharacters to generate them, see
http://unicode.org/repos/cldr-tmp/trunk/diff/summary/root.html and
individual language's charts, and added the index information. For CLDR
data the applicable license is the Unicode Terms of Use, see
http://cldr.unicode.org/index/downloads and
http://unicode.org/copyright.html#Exhibit1
The Unicode copyright notice is included in
readlicense_oo/html/THIRDPARTYLICENSEREADME.html
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Mathias Bauer <Ma...@gmx.net>.
Am 09.09.2011 21:11, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Mathias,
>
> On Friday, 2011-09-09 20:21:19 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
>
>> If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at least add
>> copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we? Or put a license file into
>> the repository.
>
> I'm confused now. The breakiterator data files _have_ copyright headers.
> Copyright IBM. Wasn't this what it is all about? Or do you mean we
> should add where they originated from, ICU?
Not all files in the module i18npool have copyright headers. For
example, see the data files in collator or indexentry. When we talked
about that some weeks ago you mentioned all of them came from ICU. Did I
misunderstand you?
Regards,
Mathias
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Mathias,
On Friday, 2011-09-09 20:21:19 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at least add
> copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we? Or put a license file into
> the repository.
I'm confused now. The breakiterator data files _have_ copyright headers.
Copyright IBM. Wasn't this what it is all about? Or do you mean we
should add where they originated from, ICU?
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build OpenOffice?)
Posted by "Pedro F. Giffuni" <gi...@tutopia.com>.
Hi Mathias;
--- On Fri, 9/9/11, Mathias Bauer wrote:
...
>
> If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at
> least add copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we?
> Or put a license file into the repository.
>
The standard Apache policy seems to be to add them to the
NOTICE file:
http://www.apache.org/legal/src-headers.html
cheers,
Pedro.
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build OpenOffice?)
Posted by Mathias Bauer <Ma...@gmx.net>.
Am 09.09.2011 12:06, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Mathias,
>
> On Thursday, 2011-09-08 19:33:59 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
>
>> >> > I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated,
>> >> > what "issues with headers" are you referring?
>> >>
>> >> I am not sure exactly when the ICU license changed but
>> >> the first ICU versions had a restrictive license.
>> >
>> > Well, ICU 1.8.1 and later don't, see
>> > http://userguide.icu-project.org/icufaq#TOC-How-is-the-ICU-licensed-
>> >
>> >> We have some code from ICU in the tree, Matthias'
>> >> ApacheMigration list has:
>> >>
>> >> - get new break iterator data from current ICU
>> >
>> > That wouldn't change anything, our break iterator data has the same
>> > IBM copyright text as the current ICU's data, for example see
>> > http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/source/data/brkitr/char.txt
>> >
>> > In fact the entire ICU source is full of
>> > "Copyright IBM ... - All Rights Reserved" without mentioning any
>> > license, but ICU as a whole is licensed under that nonrestrictive
>> > license mentioned above. I don't see any issue with that.
>>
>> So YAAL? :-)
>
> I'm glad I'm not ;-)
>
>> Honestly, we shouldn't have files in our repository without a copyright
>> header. And if these files are under IBM's copyright, we should fix that.
>
> Please read again: the breakiterator data files were copied from ICU's
> source and modified and contain an IBM copyright. All source files of
> ICU contain an IBM copyright. Just pick any file under
> icu/$INPATH/misc/build/icu/source/ and see. ICU's license is
> http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/license.html
> What exactly would not be permissible with the breakiterator files given
> that the license grants you "the rights to use, copy, modify, merge,
> publish, distribute"?
If we can be sure about the IP situation, we should at least add
copyright headers to the files, shouldn't we? Or put a license file into
the repository.
Regards,
Mathias
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build
OpenOffice?)
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Mathias,
On Thursday, 2011-09-08 19:33:59 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> >> > I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated,
> >> > what "issues with headers" are you referring?
> >>
> >> I am not sure exactly when the ICU license changed but
> >> the first ICU versions had a restrictive license.
> >
> > Well, ICU 1.8.1 and later don't, see
> > http://userguide.icu-project.org/icufaq#TOC-How-is-the-ICU-licensed-
> >
> >> We have some code from ICU in the tree, Matthias'
> >> ApacheMigration list has:
> >>
> >> - get new break iterator data from current ICU
> >
> > That wouldn't change anything, our break iterator data has the same
> > IBM copyright text as the current ICU's data, for example see
> > http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/source/data/brkitr/char.txt
> >
> > In fact the entire ICU source is full of
> > "Copyright IBM ... - All Rights Reserved" without mentioning any
> > license, but ICU as a whole is licensed under that nonrestrictive
> > license mentioned above. I don't see any issue with that.
>
> So YAAL? :-)
I'm glad I'm not ;-)
> Honestly, we shouldn't have files in our repository without a copyright
> header. And if these files are under IBM's copyright, we should fix that.
Please read again: the breakiterator data files were copied from ICU's
source and modified and contain an IBM copyright. All source files of
ICU contain an IBM copyright. Just pick any file under
icu/$INPATH/misc/build/icu/source/ and see. ICU's license is
http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/license.html
What exactly would not be permissible with the breakiterator files given
that the license grants you "the rights to use, copy, modify, merge,
publish, distribute"?
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
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Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build OpenOffice?)
Posted by Mathias Bauer <Ma...@gmx.net>.
Am 08.09.2011 02:41, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Pedro,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-09-07 14:19:50 -0700, Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
>
>> > I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated,
>> > what "issues with headers" are you referring?
>>
>> I am not sure exactly when the ICU license changed but
>> the first ICU versions had a restrictive license.
>
> Well, ICU 1.8.1 and later don't, see
> http://userguide.icu-project.org/icufaq#TOC-How-is-the-ICU-licensed-
>
>> We have some code from ICU in the tree, Matthias'
>> ApacheMigration list has:
>>
>> - get new break iterator data from current ICU
>
> That wouldn't change anything, our break iterator data has the same
> IBM copyright text as the current ICU's data, for example see
> http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/source/data/brkitr/char.txt
>
> In fact the entire ICU source is full of
> "Copyright IBM ... - All Rights Reserved" without mentioning any
> license, but ICU as a whole is licensed under that nonrestrictive
> license mentioned above. I don't see any issue with that.
So YAAL? :-)
Honestly, we shouldn't have files in our repository without a copyright
header. And if these files are under IBM's copyright, we should fix that.
Regards,
Mathias
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build
OpenOffice?)
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Pedro,
On Wednesday, 2011-09-07 14:19:50 -0700, Pedro F. Giffuni wrote:
> > I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated,
> > what "issues with headers" are you referring?
>
> I am not sure exactly when the ICU license changed but
> the first ICU versions had a restrictive license.
Well, ICU 1.8.1 and later don't, see
http://userguide.icu-project.org/icufaq#TOC-How-is-the-ICU-licensed-
> We have some code from ICU in the tree, Matthias'
> ApacheMigration list has:
>
> - get new break iterator data from current ICU
That wouldn't change anything, our break iterator data has the same
IBM copyright text as the current ICU's data, for example see
http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/source/data/brkitr/char.txt
In fact the entire ICU source is full of
"Copyright IBM ... - All Rights Reserved" without mentioning any
license, but ICU as a whole is licensed under that nonrestrictive
license mentioned above. I don't see any issue with that.
> There is also interest in using icu-regex for
> replacing the copyleft regex and the latest
> versions seem to have improved a lot.
Of course, but upgrading ICU at this stage for a 3.4 release IMHO is not
an option.
Eike
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Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Eike Rathke <oo...@erack.de>.
Hi Mathias,
On Wednesday, 2011-09-07 23:49:51 +0200, Mathias Bauer wrote:
> > I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated, what "issues
> > with headers" are you referring?
>
> The IP of some of our i18n files is unclear and someone (you?) pointed
> out that they have been copied from ICU. We should clean that up.
The copyright is not unclear, it's the same as in current ICU, see for
example
http://source.icu-project.org/repos/icu/icu/trunk/source/data/brkitr/char.txt
What makes this appear unclear is that ICU does not include any license
information in individual source files, for the ICU license see
http://userguide.icu-project.org/icufaq#TOC-How-is-the-ICU-licensed-
Eike
--
PGP/OpenPGP/GnuPG encrypted mail preferred in all private communication.
Key ID: 0x293C05FD - 997A 4C60 CE41 0149 0DB3 9E96 2F1A D073 293C 05FD
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by "Pedro F. Giffuni" <gi...@tutopia.com>.
--- On Wed, 9/7/11, Mathias Bauer wrote:
...
>
> The IP of some of our i18n files is unclear and someone
> (you?) pointed out that they have been copied from ICU.
> We should clean that up. But that is not related to the
> ICU external tarball.
>
Hmm.. I thought we could use the same headers
internally since it's clear ICU will be mandatory.
Pedro.
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU
Posted by Mathias Bauer <Ma...@gmx.net>.
Am 07.09.2011 22:44, schrieb Eike Rathke:
> Hi Pedro,
>
> On Wednesday, 2011-09-07 14:24:26 -0500, Pedro Giffuni wrote:
>
>> On Wed, 07 Sep 2011 20:46:17 +0200, Mathias Bauer
>> <Ma...@gmx.net> wrote:
>> >Am 07.09.2011 18:21, schrieb Pedro F. Giffuni:
>> >>The external sources include a lot of stuff that is
>> >>outdated and there may even be security risks involved.
>> >
>> >Sure, but replacing that with newer versions usually needs to
>> >adjust or
>> >at least test code. We shouldn't do that now, 3.4 should be releasesd
>> >without too much noise in the code.
>>
>> OK, that's fine. We do have to update ICU though because
>> your migration list includes some issues with headers and
>> we need the regex code.
>
> I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated, what "issues
> with headers" are you referring?
The IP of some of our i18n files is unclear and someone (you?) pointed
out that they have been copied from ICU. We should clean that up. But
that is not related to the ICU external tarball.
Regards,
Mathias
Re: [repo] External sources, ICU (was: Who wants to build OpenOffice?)
Posted by "Pedro F. Giffuni" <gi...@tutopia.com>.
--- On Wed, 9/7/11, Eike Rathke wrote:
>
> I don't see why the current ICU 4.0.1 needed to be updated,
> what "issues with headers" are you referring?
>
> Eike
>
I am not sure exactly when the ICU license changed but
the first ICU versions had a restrictive license.
We have some code from ICU in the tree, Matthias'
ApacheMigration list has:
- get new break iterator data from current ICU
There is also interest in using icu-regex for
replacing the copyleft regex and the latest
versions seem to have improved a lot.
While here, we should also be doing these
"easy" tasks from Matthias' list ASAP:
- get new ksc5601.h file from XFree86
- get new odma.h file with suitable license
- sync unixODBC header files with opensource.apple.com
cheers,
Pedro.