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Posted to dev@ant.apache.org by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> on 2014/04/28 05:02:37 UTC

[VOTE] migration to git

Hi,

Let's vote about migrating to git :

-  Ant

- Ivy 

- easyant

- Ivyde

- the antlibs

I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.

The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.

[] Yes
[] No


Let me start with my +1

Antoine



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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>.
In fact I have to correct this. I just contacted infra via freenode and I was told that
they have their own migration tools and that they do not need subgit.

There will certainly be other pre or post migration tasks :-)

Antoine
On Apr 28, 2014, at 10:46 PM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:

> Hello Charles,
> 
> On Apr 28, 2014, at 11:07 AM, Charles Duffy <ch...@dyfis.net> wrote:
> 
>> +1 for Ant and Ivy, +0 elsewhere.
>> 
>> If we wanted to do a history-preserving transform (with branches, merges
>> &c. faithfully preserved), I'd be happy to help with the configuration and
>> use of SubGit (which, while typically a commercially-licensed tool, has
>> zero-cost licenses available for OSS projects) for this purpose; in my
>> experience, it results in a considerably higher-quality transform than the
>> competing git-svn tooling. (SubGit also offers bidirectional translation
>> support, but I'm wary of the deployment requirements of same, and have
>> concerns as to whether making proprietary tooling a dependency of Apache's
>> ongoing infrastructure would be acceptable or wise).
> nice to offer that sure, we will certainly be interested.
> 
> Antoine
>> 
> 


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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>.
Hello Charles,

On Apr 28, 2014, at 11:07 AM, Charles Duffy <ch...@dyfis.net> wrote:

> +1 for Ant and Ivy, +0 elsewhere.
> 
> If we wanted to do a history-preserving transform (with branches, merges
> &c. faithfully preserved), I'd be happy to help with the configuration and
> use of SubGit (which, while typically a commercially-licensed tool, has
> zero-cost licenses available for OSS projects) for this purpose; in my
> experience, it results in a considerably higher-quality transform than the
> competing git-svn tooling. (SubGit also offers bidirectional translation
> support, but I'm wary of the deployment requirements of same, and have
> concerns as to whether making proprietary tooling a dependency of Apache's
> ongoing infrastructure would be acceptable or wise).
nice to offer that sure, we will certainly be interested.

Antoine
> 


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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Charles Duffy <ch...@dyfis.net>.
+1 for Ant and Ivy, +0 elsewhere.

If we wanted to do a history-preserving transform (with branches, merges
&c. faithfully preserved), I'd be happy to help with the configuration and
use of SubGit (which, while typically a commercially-licensed tool, has
zero-cost licenses available for OSS projects) for this purpose; in my
experience, it results in a considerably higher-quality transform than the
competing git-svn tooling. (SubGit also offers bidirectional translation
support, but I'm wary of the deployment requirements of same, and have
concerns as to whether making proprietary tooling a dependency of Apache's
ongoing infrastructure would be acceptable or wise).


On Sun, Apr 27, 2014 at 10:02 PM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>
> -  Ant
>
> - Ivy
>
> - easyant
>
> - Ivyde
>
> - the antlibs
>
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
>
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>
> [] Yes
> [] No
>
>
> Let me start with my +1
>
> Antoine
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@ant.apache.org
>
>

Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Matt Benson <gu...@gmail.com>.
On Apr 27, 2014 10:03 PM, "Antoine Levy Lambert" <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>
> -  Ant
>
> - Ivy
>
> - easyant
>
> - Ivyde
>
> - the antlibs
>
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
>
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>
> [] Yes
> [] No
>

+0 for all

Matt

>
> Let me start with my +1
>
> Antoine
>
>
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
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>

Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>.
On 2014-04-28, Antoine Levy Lambert wrote:

> Let's vote about migrating to git :

> -  Ant

> - the antlibs

+1

> - Ivy

> - easyant

> - Ivyde

+0 - I don't work on these

Stefan

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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Jean-Louis Boudart <je...@gmail.com>.
2014-04-28 5:02 GMT+02:00 Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>:

> Hi,
>
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>
> -  Ant
>
> - Ivy
>
> - easyant
>
> - Ivyde
>
> - the antlibs
>
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
>
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>
> [] Yes
> [] No
>

+1 on all :)


-- 
Jean Louis Boudart
Independent consultant
Apache EasyAnt commiter http://ant.apache.org/easyant/

migration to git and sandbox

Posted by Stefan Bodewig <bo...@apache.org>.
On 2014-04-28, Nicolas Lalevée wrote:

> Le 28 avr. 2014 à 07:29, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> a écrit :

>> Why not having one sandbox repo? New projects could be added there as
>> one directory, if creating a gitmodule would enforce infra to act.

> What would be the process of a sandbox project becoming "mainstream"
> with a one for all ? In the "upgrade", we would want a standalone repo
> for it. Cloning the sandbox would mean having the full history of
> every other sandbox project in there. Would that work well ?

I'd rather keep the sandboxes in svn and only migrate to git once they
are promoted.  We haven't promoted any sandbox in years, so we are
likely saving work by not migrating the repo at all :-)

Stefan

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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Nicolas Lalevée <ni...@hibnet.org>.
Le 28 avr. 2014 à 07:29, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> a écrit :

>> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>> -  Ant
> 
> +1
> 
>> - Ivy
> 
> +0, because I dont work on that codebase and therefore dont want to
> influence these committers.
> 
>> - easyant
> 
> +0, same as for Ivy
> 
> 
>> - Ivyde
> 
> +0, dito
> 
> 
>> - the antlibs
> 
> +1
> 
> 
> 
>> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
> 
> Why not having one sandbox repo? New projects could be added there as one
> directory, if creating a gitmodule would enforce infra to act.

What would be the process of a sandbox project becoming "mainstream" with a one for all ? In the "upgrade", we would want a standalone repo for it. Cloning the sandbox would mean having the full history of every other sandbox project in there. Would that work well ?

Nicolas


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Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Matt Sicker <bo...@gmail.com>.
You can use git submodules similarly. I just don't think it stays
automatically up to date with the HEAD of a branch. If you want that, I
believe you need to use a 3rd party plugin.


On 29 April 2014 10:10, Jean-Louis Boudart <je...@gmail.com>wrote:

> Then this could be an issue with while migrating to git for Ivy / EasyAnt
> as they both use xooki to create website and project documentation (website
> contains version of each releassed documentation through svn:external).
>
> I thought gitpubsub could be used for website.
>
>
> 2014-04-29 5:00 GMT+02:00 Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>:
>
> > Hello Jan,
> >
> > On Apr 28, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de>
> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
> > >> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
> > >
> > > I havent looked at the current svnpubsub, but there is also one with
> that
> > > name for git
> > > https://www.apache.org/dev/gitpubsub.html
> > >
> > > I would appreciate to have the same scm.
> > > Could we start a new git repo for tests and vote later after the
> > > git/gitpubsub is working?
> >
> >  Apache Infra does not support gitpubsub for the purpose of maintaining
> an
> > Apache web site.
> > I asked confirmation of that on the #asfinfra
> > All Apache web sites are in svn and use svnpubsub.
> > git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones
> on
> > dist.apache.org.
> > That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web
> > site.
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Jan
> > >
> > >
> > Antoine
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@ant.apache.org
> >
> >
>
>
> --
> Jean Louis Boudart
> Independent consultant
> Apache EasyAnt commiter http://ant.apache.org/easyant/
>



-- 
Matt Sicker <bo...@gmail.com>

Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Jean-Louis Boudart <je...@gmail.com>.
Then this could be an issue with while migrating to git for Ivy / EasyAnt
as they both use xooki to create website and project documentation (website
contains version of each releassed documentation through svn:external).

I thought gitpubsub could be used for website.


2014-04-29 5:00 GMT+02:00 Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>:

> Hello Jan,
>
> On Apr 28, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> >
> >> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
> >> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
> >
> > I havent looked at the current svnpubsub, but there is also one with that
> > name for git
> > https://www.apache.org/dev/gitpubsub.html
> >
> > I would appreciate to have the same scm.
> > Could we start a new git repo for tests and vote later after the
> > git/gitpubsub is working?
>
>  Apache Infra does not support gitpubsub for the purpose of maintaining an
> Apache web site.
> I asked confirmation of that on the #asfinfra
> All Apache web sites are in svn and use svnpubsub.
> git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones on
> dist.apache.org.
> That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web
> site.
>
> >
> >
> > Jan
> >
> >
> Antoine
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@ant.apache.org
>
>


-- 
Jean Louis Boudart
Independent consultant
Apache EasyAnt commiter http://ant.apache.org/easyant/

Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Johan Corveleyn <jc...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 9:32 AM, Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>
wrote:
>> On Apr 28, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> wrote:
>>>> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
>>>> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>>> [...] git/gitpubsub is working?
>>
>>  Apache Infra does not support gitpubsub for [...] web site.
>
>> git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones
on dist.apache.org.
>> That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web
site.
>
> Just for info, what makes you say that? Why would git be worse than
> SVN for large files?
>
> Is that because all clones must "copy" all versions (compressed deltas
> I guess) of those large files? --DD

Various people indicate that git doesn't work well with large binary files:
https://www.google.com/#q=git+large+binary+files

-- 
Johan

Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Matt Sicker <bo...@gmail.com>.
It's good to use a separate git repository (or svn repository or whatever
works best for you) for storing large assets. You can use it as a git
submodule to pull in a specific revision ID (so it's somewhat similar to
svn:external, except you have to update it yourself and commit changes to
the pointer in the parent repository). That way it only takes up a tiny
text file in the main git repo.


On 29 April 2014 07:50, Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>
> wrote:
> > On Apr 29, 2014, at 3:32 AM, Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >> Just for info, what makes you say that? Why would git be worse than
> >> SVN for large files?
> >
> > Below see some references found in google, the first one says that each
> version of a large file is stored
> > (or maybe each version with a different md5).
>
> [DD] Read this old thread [1], I get the impression that git supports
> deltas both during network transfers, and in the remote repo, but
> chooses performance by default over disk-space, by keeping full copies
> of files. But git does support delta-compression, even across "files"
> apparently. So I guess it's more the matter of DCVS' in general
> forcing you to get the whole repos, that is the main drawback of
> storing large files in them. But I'm definitely out of my depth here,
> so I'll stop here :). --DD
>
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> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
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>
>


-- 
Matt Sicker <bo...@gmail.com>

Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 12:15 PM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
> On Apr 29, 2014, at 3:32 AM, Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Just for info, what makes you say that? Why would git be worse than
>> SVN for large files?
>
> Below see some references found in google, the first one says that each version of a large file is stored
> (or maybe each version with a different md5).

[DD] Read this old thread [1], I get the impression that git supports
deltas both during network transfers, and in the remote repo, but
chooses performance by default over disk-space, by keeping full copies
of files. But git does support delta-compression, even across "files"
apparently. So I guess it's more the matter of DCVS' in general
forcing you to get the whole repos, that is the main drawback of
storing large files in them. But I'm definitely out of my depth here,
so I'll stop here :). --DD

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Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>.
Hello Dominique,

On Apr 29, 2014, at 3:32 AM, Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
>> git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones on dist.apache.org.
>> That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web site.
> 
> Just for info, what makes you say that? Why would git be worse than
> SVN for large files?
> 
> Is that because all clones must "copy" all versions (compressed deltas
> I guess) of those large files? —D

> D
> 

Below see some references found in google, the first one says that each version of a large file is stored
(or maybe each version with a different md5).

So cloning a plain vanilla git repository containing several versions of a large file would fill up one’s disk.

That makes me think that the Ant git module will be a bit fat already from all the versions of xercesImpl and of jUnit that we have checked in over the years.

The stack overflow article mentions add-ons to git to manage large files.

Antoine

http://www.altdevblogaday.com/2013/09/05/git-off-my-lawn-large-and-unmergable-assets/
http://stackoverflow.com/questions/540535/managing-large-binary-files-with-git
https://help.github.com/articles/working-with-large-files


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Re: migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com>.
On Tue, Apr 29, 2014 at 5:00 AM, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
> On Apr 28, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> wrote:
>>> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
>>> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>> [...] git/gitpubsub is working?
>
>  Apache Infra does not support gitpubsub for [...] web site.

> git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones on dist.apache.org.
> That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web site.

Just for info, what makes you say that? Why would git be worse than
SVN for large files?

Is that because all clones must "copy" all versions (compressed deltas
I guess) of those large files? --DD

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migration to git and web site publication

Posted by Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>.
Hello Jan,

On Apr 28, 2014, at 1:29 AM, Jan Matèrne (jhm) <ap...@materne.de> wrote:

> 
> 
> 
>> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
>> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
> 
> I havent looked at the current svnpubsub, but there is also one with that
> name for git
> https://www.apache.org/dev/gitpubsub.html
> 
> I would appreciate to have the same scm. 
> Could we start a new git repo for tests and vote later after the
> git/gitpubsub is working?

 Apache Infra does not support gitpubsub for the purpose of maintaining an Apache web site.
I asked confirmation of that on the #asfinfra 
All Apache web sites are in svn and use svnpubsub.
git is not the tool of choice to deal with large files such as the ones on dist.apache.org.
That might be part of the reason why infra supports only svn for the web site.

> 
> 
> Jan
> 
> 
Antoine


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AW: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by "Jan Matèrne (jhm)" <ap...@materne.de>.
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
> -  Ant

+1

> - Ivy

+0, because I dont work on that codebase and therefore dont want to
influence these committers.

> - easyant

+0, same as for Ivy


> - Ivyde

+0, dito


> - the antlibs

+1


 
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.

Why not having one sandbox repo? New projects could be added there as one
directory, if creating a gitmodule would enforce infra to act.


 
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the
> only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.

I havent looked at the current svnpubsub, but there is also one with that
name for git
https://www.apache.org/dev/gitpubsub.html

I would appreciate to have the same scm. 
Could we start a new git repo for tests and vote later after the
git/gitpubsub is working?


Jan


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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Per Arnold Blaasmo <pe...@atmel.com>.
On 28. april 2014 05:02, Antoine Levy Lambert wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
> 
> -  Ant
> 
> - Ivy 
> 
> - easyant
> 
> - Ivyde
> 
> - the antlibs
> 
> 
> [] Yes
> [] No
> 
+1 on all.


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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Michael Clarke <mi...@gmail.com>.
+1 from me for Ant, +0 for the other associated projects.

I'm happy to help with any migration or post migration cleanup of
docs/processes, but am only properly familiar with the Ant core so may
not be much help with the likes of Ivy but can give it a shot if
needed.

> On 28 Apr 2014, at 13:32, "Nicolas Lalevée" <ni...@hibnet.org> wrote:
>
>
>> Le 28 avr. 2014 à 05:02, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> a écrit :
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>>
>> -  Ant
>>
>> - Ivy
>>
>> - easyant
>>
>> - Ivyde
>>
>> - the antlibs
>>
>> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
>>
>> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>>
>> [] Yes
>> [] No
>
> +0 for all.
>
> It's not a +1 because even if I like git more than svn, I am not sure of the amount of work required afterwards (documentation update, CI, release scripts, etc…), so I don't want my vote to be counted as important as the vote of someone who doesn't want to make the transition.
>
> But it's a positive 0 as I would gladly follow any decision taken by the PMC, especially on IvyDE.
>
> Nicolas
>
>
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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Nicolas Lalevée <ni...@hibnet.org>.
Le 28 avr. 2014 à 05:02, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> a écrit :

> Hi,
> 
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
> 
> -  Ant
> 
> - Ivy 
> 
> - easyant
> 
> - Ivyde
> 
> - the antlibs
> 
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
> 
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
> 
> [] Yes
> [] No

+0 for all.

It's not a +1 because even if I like git more than svn, I am not sure of the amount of work required afterwards (documentation update, CI, release scripts, etc…), so I don't want my vote to be counted as important as the vote of someone who doesn't want to make the transition.

But it's a positive 0 as I would gladly follow any decision taken by the PMC, especially on IvyDE.

Nicolas


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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Dominique Devienne <dd...@gmail.com>.
On Mon, Apr 28, 2014 at 8:54 AM, Conor MacNeill <co...@apache.org> wrote:
> On 28 April 2014 13:02, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
>> Let's vote about migrating to git :

+0 on all. --DD

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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Conor MacNeill <co...@apache.org>.
+1

Conor


On 28 April 2014 13:02, Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Let's vote about migrating to git :
>
> -  Ant
>
> - Ivy
>
> - easyant
>
> - Ivyde
>
> - the antlibs
>
> I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.
>
> The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.
>
> [] Yes
> [] No
>
>
> Let me start with my +1
>
> Antoine
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@ant.apache.org
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>

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Re: [VOTE] migration to git

Posted by Maarten Coene <ma...@yahoo.com>.
Probably because I don't know much about git, but I don't see the real advantage of the switch from SVN to git.
In addition, I don't have the time to help adapting the Ivy release process/scripts.
But I don't want to stand in the way if everyone thinks this should be done.


So, my vote is:
for Ivy: -0
for the rest: +0

Maarten



________________________________
 Van: Antoine Levy Lambert <an...@gmx.de>
Aan: Ant Developers List <de...@ant.apache.org> 
Verzonden: maandag 28 april 5:02 2014
Onderwerp: [VOTE] migration to git
 

Hi,

Let's vote about migrating to git :

-  Ant

- Ivy 

- easyant

- Ivyde

- the antlibs

I am not including the sandbox in the thread intentionally.

The web sites will remain in svn in any event because svnpubsub is the only supported mechanism to maintain web sites AFAIK.

[] Yes
[] No


Let me start with my +1

Antoine



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