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Posted to dev@netbeans.apache.org by Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com> on 2019/01/24 06:41:50 UTC
Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Yeah, let’s vote. 😊
Von: Laszlo Kishalmi
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 18:53
An: Apache NetBeans
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of them.
What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
got the most +1 in three days will win?
(I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
I suggest that those who're most in favor of more than 2 releases can start
making it happen right now -- evaluate some of the pull requests:
https://github.com/apache/incubator-netbeans/pulls
And help resolve the 600+ broken tests related to the introduction of
Graal.js parser:
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/d7a8738e6995ed51914fa42003c6eb750977d891603c4f0a81686203@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
If someone really wants more than 2 releases this year, then they really
need to take on at least the two activities above.
Gj
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 8:29 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 18:48, Geertjan Wielenga
> <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > In addition, there are two other months listed in the proposal above --
> for
> > the moment, I'd humbly suggest that we don't commit ourselves too
> strongly
> > to four releases, that is really a lot, though it is something to strive
> > for.
>
> The idea for quarterly releases came from a discussion on time-based
> releases that was probably (just checked!) my fault .. eek! :-\
>
>
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/dcedd394e49e81b4d71e761df25021c39240c8b0cc8cfd2717aa44a0@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
>
> Time-based is partly about reducing stress in volunteer projects by
> having more releases, not the other way around! :-) It was suggested
> based on releasing what was ready in master on a particular date, not
> on what features go in.
>
> Jan's comments there are good
>
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/a97e431227e971ee3f3b7e9583cb9abc7c2baf32739bb37e772ed131@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
> There was also John's suggested schedule at
>
> https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/4310ebf164f8ce97f4979b9b765ba1375285b89ba7498ce5c066d0a7@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
>
> IMO we missed fleshing that out properly and voting on it.
>
> If we stick to feature-based as on the current release page, then I
> wholeheartedly agree with you that two seems more realistic because
> you then need a lot more flexibility.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
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>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
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>
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>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 18:48, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> In addition, there are two other months listed in the proposal above -- for
> the moment, I'd humbly suggest that we don't commit ourselves too strongly
> to four releases, that is really a lot, though it is something to strive
> for.
The idea for quarterly releases came from a discussion on time-based
releases that was probably (just checked!) my fault .. eek! :-\
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/dcedd394e49e81b4d71e761df25021c39240c8b0cc8cfd2717aa44a0@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
Time-based is partly about reducing stress in volunteer projects by
having more releases, not the other way around! :-) It was suggested
based on releasing what was ready in master on a particular date, not
on what features go in.
Jan's comments there are good
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/a97e431227e971ee3f3b7e9583cb9abc7c2baf32739bb37e772ed131@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
There was also John's suggested schedule at
https://lists.apache.org/thread.html/4310ebf164f8ce97f4979b9b765ba1375285b89ba7498ce5c066d0a7@%3Cdev.netbeans.apache.org%3E
IMO we missed fleshing that out properly and voting on it.
If we stick to feature-based as on the current release page, then I
wholeheartedly agree with you that two seems more realistic because
you then need a lot more flexibility.
Best wishes,
Neil
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
I agree with march and september for major, but not for having „optional“ minor releases or not. I don’t know whether we need another thread for that or not, I mean we already had that.
I know we can handle it with less process for the minor releases, as I said it somewhere in the mailing list, the biggest problem is still the transition phase and it will be less work after the transition. We have now over 2000 tickets open. Some are nonsense maybe, user related Problems, invalid stuff, bugs, feature requests etc. So yes we should have minor releases and not think about to not having them. There is always work todo.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Geertjan Wielenga
Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 19:48
An: dev
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Absolutely agree.
However, we do need to release at specific points in the time/space
continuum, don't we?
Here is the proposal for when those points could be this year:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Apache+NetBeans+Release+Roadmap
March and September are two specific points in the time/space continuum. If
you disagree with those months, please suggest two other ones.
In addition, there are two other months listed in the proposal above -- for
the moment, I'd humbly suggest that we don't commit ourselves too strongly
to four releases, that is really a lot, though it is something to strive
for.
So, if, for the moment, we aim at two releases at least, with the first of
these already set for March, when would you like the other of the two to
be? How about 6 months later, for the one that we are sure about, let's say
September?
Now, it turns out that those are the months in which the JDK will be
released this year, JDK 11 and JDK 12. That's very convenient, since this
provides the opportunity for JDK vendors to consider the possibility of
co-operating or bundling with NetBeans in one way or another.
Hope the above makes sense, if not, please specify your points in the
time/space continuum of 2019 when you propose we should do our releases
this year.
Thanks,
Gj
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 7:40 PM Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans.
> NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. [...]
> > Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make
> sense anymore nowadays.
>
> +1
>
> --emi
>
> On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 8:28 PM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
> wrote:
> >
> > TLDR;
> > Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans.
> NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not
> anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than
> others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP
> very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular,
> React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle
> HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only
> for Java developer anymore.
> >
> > Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make
> sense anymore nowadays.
> >
> >
> > Major versions like 10.0, 11.0 or 12.0 (or which Version we will have
> later) will include a lot more features with NetCat and 11.1 and 12.1 will
> implement more new Features too but I think with less NetCat (I don’t know,
> only guessing, otherwise we will have no real gain for that). I only want
> to add, to this, that we want 4 releases a year, to be competitve. I only
> write this to make it clear that 11 is Major with Jakarta I think, C/C++
> (Maybe, don’t remember the Roadmap) Bug fixes and misc Features. And 11.1
> will have Features and bug fixes too and is not a patch. Patches where,
> from the history perspective different from 8.0 to 8.1. Please remember 8.2
> had 2 patches and we are not Talking About 8.3 or 8.4, because only
> critical bug fixes after the release.
> >
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Chris
> >
> >
> > Von: Neil C Smith
> > Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 19:03
> > An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >
> > On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 12:51, Geertjan Wielenga
> > <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > > Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
> > > interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach
> to
> > > follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having
> NetBeans
> > > bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to
> align
> > > if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could
> release in
> > > July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as
> any,
> > > and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
> >
> > Completely agree with you there - I was in favour of doing this and
> > keeping the version numbers synced for same reason.
> >
> > On the other hand, the major/minor thing seems odd from a time-based
> > release schedule, which is where the idea for quarterly releases came
> > from. The projects that I can think of that do that generally
> > publicise feature freeze and release dates well in advance (a year),
> > possibly have a "release-ready" master branch, don't guarantee
> > features until feature freeze date, and if a feature isn't ready it
> > misses that release. AFAIK the NB10 without .0 came from the idea
> > that 2019 releases would be NB11, NB12, NB13 and NB14 - no sense that
> > one is more important than another.
> >
> > At the moment, for example, NB11 mentions J2EE support, but playing
> > devils advocate what happens if that misses the release schedule?
> > Does that mean NB11 is delayed, or that J2EE now comes in a point
> > release, or that NB11.1 now becomes NB12? That's what I mean about
> > the release page feeling somewhere stuck between time-based and
> > feature-based.
> >
> > Anyway, as someone with not much time to put into the project right at
> > this moment, I'm not arguing either way - just saying that it still
> > appears a source of confusion.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Neil
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >
> > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Absolutely agree.
However, we do need to release at specific points in the time/space
continuum, don't we?
Here is the proposal for when those points could be this year:
https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Apache+NetBeans+Release+Roadmap
March and September are two specific points in the time/space continuum. If
you disagree with those months, please suggest two other ones.
In addition, there are two other months listed in the proposal above -- for
the moment, I'd humbly suggest that we don't commit ourselves too strongly
to four releases, that is really a lot, though it is something to strive
for.
So, if, for the moment, we aim at two releases at least, with the first of
these already set for March, when would you like the other of the two to
be? How about 6 months later, for the one that we are sure about, let's say
September?
Now, it turns out that those are the months in which the JDK will be
released this year, JDK 11 and JDK 12. That's very convenient, since this
provides the opportunity for JDK vendors to consider the possibility of
co-operating or bundling with NetBeans in one way or another.
Hope the above makes sense, if not, please specify your points in the
time/space continuum of 2019 when you propose we should do our releases
this year.
Thanks,
Gj
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 7:40 PM Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans.
> NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. [...]
> > Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make
> sense anymore nowadays.
>
> +1
>
> --emi
>
> On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 8:28 PM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
> wrote:
> >
> > TLDR;
> > Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans.
> NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not
> anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than
> others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP
> very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular,
> React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle
> HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only
> for Java developer anymore.
> >
> > Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make
> sense anymore nowadays.
> >
> >
> > Major versions like 10.0, 11.0 or 12.0 (or which Version we will have
> later) will include a lot more features with NetCat and 11.1 and 12.1 will
> implement more new Features too but I think with less NetCat (I don’t know,
> only guessing, otherwise we will have no real gain for that). I only want
> to add, to this, that we want 4 releases a year, to be competitve. I only
> write this to make it clear that 11 is Major with Jakarta I think, C/C++
> (Maybe, don’t remember the Roadmap) Bug fixes and misc Features. And 11.1
> will have Features and bug fixes too and is not a patch. Patches where,
> from the history perspective different from 8.0 to 8.1. Please remember 8.2
> had 2 patches and we are not Talking About 8.3 or 8.4, because only
> critical bug fixes after the release.
> >
> >
> > Cheers
> >
> > Chris
> >
> >
> > Von: Neil C Smith
> > Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 19:03
> > An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >
> > On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 12:51, Geertjan Wielenga
> > <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > > Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
> > > interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach
> to
> > > follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having
> NetBeans
> > > bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to
> align
> > > if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could
> release in
> > > July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as
> any,
> > > and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
> >
> > Completely agree with you there - I was in favour of doing this and
> > keeping the version numbers synced for same reason.
> >
> > On the other hand, the major/minor thing seems odd from a time-based
> > release schedule, which is where the idea for quarterly releases came
> > from. The projects that I can think of that do that generally
> > publicise feature freeze and release dates well in advance (a year),
> > possibly have a "release-ready" master branch, don't guarantee
> > features until feature freeze date, and if a feature isn't ready it
> > misses that release. AFAIK the NB10 without .0 came from the idea
> > that 2019 releases would be NB11, NB12, NB13 and NB14 - no sense that
> > one is more important than another.
> >
> > At the moment, for example, NB11 mentions J2EE support, but playing
> > devils advocate what happens if that misses the release schedule?
> > Does that mean NB11 is delayed, or that J2EE now comes in a point
> > release, or that NB11.1 now becomes NB12? That's what I mean about
> > the release page feeling somewhere stuck between time-based and
> > feature-based.
> >
> > Anyway, as someone with not much time to put into the project right at
> > this moment, I'm not arguing either way - just saying that it still
> > appears a source of confusion.
> >
> > Best wishes,
> >
> > Neil
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >
> > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
> Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans. NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. [...]
> Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make sense anymore nowadays.
+1
--emi
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 8:28 PM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net> wrote:
>
> TLDR;
> Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans. NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular, React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only for Java developer anymore.
>
> Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make sense anymore nowadays.
>
>
> Major versions like 10.0, 11.0 or 12.0 (or which Version we will have later) will include a lot more features with NetCat and 11.1 and 12.1 will implement more new Features too but I think with less NetCat (I don’t know, only guessing, otherwise we will have no real gain for that). I only want to add, to this, that we want 4 releases a year, to be competitve. I only write this to make it clear that 11 is Major with Jakarta I think, C/C++ (Maybe, don’t remember the Roadmap) Bug fixes and misc Features. And 11.1 will have Features and bug fixes too and is not a patch. Patches where, from the history perspective different from 8.0 to 8.1. Please remember 8.2 had 2 patches and we are not Talking About 8.3 or 8.4, because only critical bug fixes after the release.
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Chris
>
>
> Von: Neil C Smith
> Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 19:03
> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 12:51, Geertjan Wielenga
> <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
> > interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach to
> > follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having NetBeans
> > bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to align
> > if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could release in
> > July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as any,
> > and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
>
> Completely agree with you there - I was in favour of doing this and
> keeping the version numbers synced for same reason.
>
> On the other hand, the major/minor thing seems odd from a time-based
> release schedule, which is where the idea for quarterly releases came
> from. The projects that I can think of that do that generally
> publicise feature freeze and release dates well in advance (a year),
> possibly have a "release-ready" master branch, don't guarantee
> features until feature freeze date, and if a feature isn't ready it
> misses that release. AFAIK the NB10 without .0 came from the idea
> that 2019 releases would be NB11, NB12, NB13 and NB14 - no sense that
> one is more important than another.
>
> At the moment, for example, NB11 mentions J2EE support, but playing
> devils advocate what happens if that misses the release schedule?
> Does that mean NB11 is delayed, or that J2EE now comes in a point
> release, or that NB11.1 now becomes NB12? That's what I mean about
> the release page feeling somewhere stuck between time-based and
> feature-based.
>
> Anyway, as someone with not much time to put into the project right at
> this moment, I'm not arguing either way - just saying that it still
> appears a source of confusion.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
➢ If someone really wants more than 2 releases this year, then they really
➢ need to take on at least the two activities above.
Yes, I know and I will, I Need to find some time to do it.
➢ Totally disagree. NB __IS__ Java -- not PHP, not JS. That plugins
➢ can be written to allow NB to do wonderful things for those other
➢ languages is irrelevant to NB versioning.
No, NetBeans not Java, NetBeans is everything what NetBeans supports out of the box. PHP, C/C++, JS, HTML/CSS etc. are core Plugins. Yes they are plugins but they are part of the core. And they are Plugins, because NetBeans is module based. Nothing of them is related to the Version. Neither the Java implementation nor the other core Plugins.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Chuck Davis
Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 22:42
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 10:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net> wrote:
>
> TLDR;
> Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans. NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular, React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only for Java developer anymore.
>
> Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make sense anymore nowadays.
Totally disagree. NB __IS__ Java -- not PHP, not JS. That plugins
can be written to allow NB to do wonderful things for those other
languages is irrelevant to NB versioning.
As a developer I want to know that with NB20 I can use all the
features of JDK20 in my code. Java will be changing significantly in
the future. We need to remember that code written for JDK 11 will not
run, in many instances, on JDK 8. Should that be reflected in NB
numbering? Me thinks so. At least I would like it so. Without that
relationship developers will be required to do research to find out
what features can be used with the version of NB they may be planning
to use.
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Chuck Davis <cj...@gmail.com>.
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 10:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net> wrote:
>
> TLDR;
> Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans. NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular, React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only for Java developer anymore.
>
> Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make sense anymore nowadays.
Totally disagree. NB __IS__ Java -- not PHP, not JS. That plugins
can be written to allow NB to do wonderful things for those other
languages is irrelevant to NB versioning.
As a developer I want to know that with NB20 I can use all the
features of JDK20 in my code. Java will be changing significantly in
the future. We need to remember that code written for JDK 11 will not
run, in many instances, on JDK 8. Should that be reflected in NB
numbering? Me thinks so. At least I would like it so. Without that
relationship developers will be required to do research to find out
what features can be used with the version of NB they may be planning
to use.
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
TLDR;
Please everyone, go away from Connection JDK/Java with NetBeans. NetBeans is for years an IDE for a lot more languages. Java should not anymore the main Language that is full featured supported in NetBeans than others that NetBeans supports out of the box. First NetBeans can handle PHP very well, better than JS or other Frameworks like Angularjs, Angular, React or unfortunately Vue which is not supported. It can handle HTML/CSS/LESS/SCSS and C/C++ and Assembler too. NetBeans is an IDE not only for Java developer anymore.
Yes, I can understand that binding was in the past but that doesn’t make sense anymore nowadays.
Major versions like 10.0, 11.0 or 12.0 (or which Version we will have later) will include a lot more features with NetCat and 11.1 and 12.1 will implement more new Features too but I think with less NetCat (I don’t know, only guessing, otherwise we will have no real gain for that). I only want to add, to this, that we want 4 releases a year, to be competitve. I only write this to make it clear that 11 is Major with Jakarta I think, C/C++ (Maybe, don’t remember the Roadmap) Bug fixes and misc Features. And 11.1 will have Features and bug fixes too and is not a patch. Patches where, from the history perspective different from 8.0 to 8.1. Please remember 8.2 had 2 patches and we are not Talking About 8.3 or 8.4, because only critical bug fixes after the release.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Sonntag, 27. Januar 2019 19:03
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 12:51, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
> interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach to
> follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having NetBeans
> bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to align
> if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could release in
> July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as any,
> and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
Completely agree with you there - I was in favour of doing this and
keeping the version numbers synced for same reason.
On the other hand, the major/minor thing seems odd from a time-based
release schedule, which is where the idea for quarterly releases came
from. The projects that I can think of that do that generally
publicise feature freeze and release dates well in advance (a year),
possibly have a "release-ready" master branch, don't guarantee
features until feature freeze date, and if a feature isn't ready it
misses that release. AFAIK the NB10 without .0 came from the idea
that 2019 releases would be NB11, NB12, NB13 and NB14 - no sense that
one is more important than another.
At the moment, for example, NB11 mentions J2EE support, but playing
devils advocate what happens if that misses the release schedule?
Does that mean NB11 is delayed, or that J2EE now comes in a point
release, or that NB11.1 now becomes NB12? That's what I mean about
the release page feeling somewhere stuck between time-based and
feature-based.
Anyway, as someone with not much time to put into the project right at
this moment, I'm not arguing either way - just saying that it still
appears a source of confusion.
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Sun, 27 Jan 2019 at 12:51, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
> interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach to
> follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having NetBeans
> bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to align
> if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could release in
> July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as any,
> and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
Completely agree with you there - I was in favour of doing this and
keeping the version numbers synced for same reason.
On the other hand, the major/minor thing seems odd from a time-based
release schedule, which is where the idea for quarterly releases came
from. The projects that I can think of that do that generally
publicise feature freeze and release dates well in advance (a year),
possibly have a "release-ready" master branch, don't guarantee
features until feature freeze date, and if a feature isn't ready it
misses that release. AFAIK the NB10 without .0 came from the idea
that 2019 releases would be NB11, NB12, NB13 and NB14 - no sense that
one is more important than another.
At the moment, for example, NB11 mentions J2EE support, but playing
devils advocate what happens if that misses the release schedule?
Does that mean NB11 is delayed, or that J2EE now comes in a point
release, or that NB11.1 now becomes NB12? That's what I mean about
the release page feeling somewhere stuck between time-based and
feature-based.
Anyway, as someone with not much time to put into the project right at
this moment, I'm not arguing either way - just saying that it still
appears a source of confusion.
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Well, since there are two releases of the JDK this here, neatly
interspersed in March and September, it seems like a logical approach to
follow, with the benefit that we could potentially end up having NetBeans
bundles with a JDK, if the stars align. The stars are less likely to align
if we completely ignore those specific months -- sure, we could release in
July and December instead, but why? March and September are as good as any,
and better than most, because of the JDK release cycle.
Gj
On Sun, Jan 27, 2019 at 1:39 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 14:32, Geertjan Wielenga
> <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > Well, maybe I see it too simply, but the March and September releases are
> > in line with the JDK releases, hence these are major releases, call them
> > what you will, 11, 11.0, or whatever, I don't mind or see much
> difference,
> > and then there are two minor releases in between, depending on whether we
> > feel we need them or not, i.e., 11.1 and 12.1, with new features, though
> > not brand new support for a JDK release, like 11 and 12 (or 11.0 and
> 12.0).
>
> If the only difference between major and minor is JDK version, that
> doesn't seem very major / minor! I don't see it simply, mainly
> because it seems stuck halfway between a time-based release plan and a
> feature-based release plan, with downsides of both and benefits of
> neither. And the original discussion on release policy here had
> people arguing for disconnecting NB version number increments from JDK
> version. There have been multiple discussions on release policy,
> time-based and current halfway, and lots of views on how it might
> work, but there still seems to be a lack of consensus view on how it
> functions in practice. I'm just saying a clarified proposal and vote
> on that might be more useful than the version number ones! :-)
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
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>
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>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 14:32, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> Well, maybe I see it too simply, but the March and September releases are
> in line with the JDK releases, hence these are major releases, call them
> what you will, 11, 11.0, or whatever, I don't mind or see much difference,
> and then there are two minor releases in between, depending on whether we
> feel we need them or not, i.e., 11.1 and 12.1, with new features, though
> not brand new support for a JDK release, like 11 and 12 (or 11.0 and 12.0).
If the only difference between major and minor is JDK version, that
doesn't seem very major / minor! I don't see it simply, mainly
because it seems stuck halfway between a time-based release plan and a
feature-based release plan, with downsides of both and benefits of
neither. And the original discussion on release policy here had
people arguing for disconnecting NB version number increments from JDK
version. There have been multiple discussions on release policy,
time-based and current halfway, and lots of views on how it might
work, but there still seems to be a lack of consensus view on how it
functions in practice. I'm just saying a clarified proposal and vote
on that might be more useful than the version number ones! :-)
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Well, maybe I see it too simply, but the March and September releases are
in line with the JDK releases, hence these are major releases, call them
what you will, 11, 11.0, or whatever, I don't mind or see much difference,
and then there are two minor releases in between, depending on whether we
feel we need them or not, i.e., 11.1 and 12.1, with new features, though
not brand new support for a JDK release, like 11 and 12 (or 11.0 and 12.0).
Gj
On Sat, Jan 26, 2019 at 3:18 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 13:41, Geertjan Wielenga
> <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > I see the difference between 11.0 and 11.1 being the same kind of
> > difference as between 8.0 and 8.1.
> ..
> > A patch release would, in my understanding, never be 8.1 or 11.1 or
> > anything like that.
>
> But that is different to the original time-based release suggestion
> which had continually incrementing version numbers NB10, NB11, NB12 -
> in which case the 11.0 to 11.1 you're talking about would have been 11
> and 12, and a patch would have been 11.1. And that's how the the zero
> in NB10 was dropped AFAIK - there was a reason! Personally I preferred
> that, but don't mind either way. But it really feels unclear to me
> where the criteria for increasing either number now sits. There seems
> to now be a shift to major / minor quarterly releases on the roadmap?
> In which case it would have to be 11.0 and 11.1, and presented as
> such. But it still feels very unclear to me what the difference
> between going from 11.0 to 11.1 and then 11.1 to 12.0 is meant to be?!
> A discussion and vote on that seems more useful. This whole
> presentation argument seems to come out of very different ideas of how
> the release schedule is/should work because that was never really
> settled, and if we can't explain it to each other it's even harder
> when someone outside asks! :-)
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
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>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 13:41, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> I see the difference between 11.0 and 11.1 being the same kind of
> difference as between 8.0 and 8.1.
..
> A patch release would, in my understanding, never be 8.1 or 11.1 or
> anything like that.
But that is different to the original time-based release suggestion
which had continually incrementing version numbers NB10, NB11, NB12 -
in which case the 11.0 to 11.1 you're talking about would have been 11
and 12, and a patch would have been 11.1. And that's how the the zero
in NB10 was dropped AFAIK - there was a reason! Personally I preferred
that, but don't mind either way. But it really feels unclear to me
where the criteria for increasing either number now sits. There seems
to now be a shift to major / minor quarterly releases on the roadmap?
In which case it would have to be 11.0 and 11.1, and presented as
such. But it still feels very unclear to me what the difference
between going from 11.0 to 11.1 and then 11.1 to 12.0 is meant to be?!
A discussion and vote on that seems more useful. This whole
presentation argument seems to come out of very different ideas of how
the release schedule is/should work because that was never really
settled, and if we can't explain it to each other it's even harder
when someone outside asks! :-)
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
I see the difference between 11.0 and 11.1 being the same kind of
difference as between 8.0 and 8.1.
But no one I know of talked about "NetBeans 8.0", everyone talked about
"NetBeans 8".
A patch release would, in my understanding, never be 8.1 or 11.1 or
anything like that.
Gj
On Sat, Jan 26, 2019 at 2:13 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
> On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 08:30, Geertjan Wielenga
> <ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> > Thanks for taking the lead and setting up the vote threads.
>
> Sorry, I'm abstaining from voting on this until someone can articulate
> a consensus viewpoint on what the difference between 11.1 and 12.0
> would be.
>
> If the intention is that the difference between 11.0 and 11.1 could be
> as big as the difference between 8.0 and 8.1, with a whole separate
> release branch / process / update centre, then that definitely needs
> communicating.
>
> If 11.1 is a patch release (and absolutely no new features!) on top of
> the 11.0 release branch then that tells a quite different picture to
> end users and platform developers on what to expect in upgrading.
> That was how we ended up with NB10 in the first place.
>
> The answer to this would probably change how I would vote.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
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>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Sat, 26 Jan 2019 at 08:30, Geertjan Wielenga
<ge...@googlemail.com.invalid> wrote:
> Thanks for taking the lead and setting up the vote threads.
Sorry, I'm abstaining from voting on this until someone can articulate
a consensus viewpoint on what the difference between 11.1 and 12.0
would be.
If the intention is that the difference between 11.0 and 11.1 could be
as big as the difference between 8.0 and 8.1, with a whole separate
release branch / process / update centre, then that definitely needs
communicating.
If 11.1 is a patch release (and absolutely no new features!) on top of
the 11.0 release branch then that tells a quite different picture to
end users and platform developers on what to expect in upgrading.
That was how we ended up with NB10 in the first place.
The answer to this would probably change how I would vote.
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Thanks for taking the lead and setting up the vote threads.
Gj
On Saturday, January 26, 2019, Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Well, all I am wishing for is clarity and consistency.
>
> Though as humans, naming a baby creates a real active discussion, however
> the most important thing is that it should be healthy.
>
> There were a few attempts on this list to bring up the topic every attempt
> died with time without actually having this issue resolved.
>
> I do understand everyone's opinion, but after all, we need to settle this
> one and focus on other tasks, and while I can read through every email on
> this topic here, I see that either we act like a community and vote or just
> let somebody to make a decision for us. See:
> https://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#reasons-for-votes
>
> So the top tree option usually are:
>
> 1. Keep it simple one number: 11
> 2. Keep the tradition, have a minor version: 11.0
> 3. Use calendar versioning: 2019.03
>
> Using codenames, like moons or chemical elements, or using codenames at
> all is another topic. Let's not deal with that now.
>
> Well Apache does not say anything about multi-option votes, though I think
> we can handle 3 threads.
>
>
> On 1/24/19 11:35 AM, Emilian Bold wrote:
>
>> Seems so odd to have multiple voting threads because Apache rules
>> can't allow multiple options voting...
>>
>> I also want to include calendar versioning aka 'NetBeans 2019.03' on
>> the voting list. So that makes 3 voting threads?
>>
>> --emi
>>
>> http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
>>
>> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 7:53 PM Laszlo Kishalmi
>> <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of
>>> them.
>>>
>>> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
>>> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>>>
>>> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>>>
>>> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>>>
>>>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>>>
>>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>>
>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>
>>
>>
>>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>.
Well, all I am wishing for is clarity and consistency.
Though as humans, naming a baby creates a real active discussion,
however the most important thing is that it should be healthy.
There were a few attempts on this list to bring up the topic every
attempt died with time without actually having this issue resolved.
I do understand everyone's opinion, but after all, we need to settle
this one and focus on other tasks, and while I can read through every
email on this topic here, I see that either we act like a community and
vote or just let somebody to make a decision for us. See:
https://www.apache.org/foundation/voting.html#reasons-for-votes
So the top tree option usually are:
1. Keep it simple one number: 11
2. Keep the tradition, have a minor version: 11.0
3. Use calendar versioning: 2019.03
Using codenames, like moons or chemical elements, or using codenames at
all is another topic. Let's not deal with that now.
Well Apache does not say anything about multi-option votes, though I
think we can handle 3 threads.
On 1/24/19 11:35 AM, Emilian Bold wrote:
> Seems so odd to have multiple voting threads because Apache rules
> can't allow multiple options voting...
>
> I also want to include calendar versioning aka 'NetBeans 2019.03' on
> the voting list. So that makes 3 voting threads?
>
> --emi
>
> http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 7:53 PM Laszlo Kishalmi
> <la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of them.
>>
>> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
>> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>>
>> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>>
>> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>>
>> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
>> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
Seems so odd to have multiple voting threads because Apache rules
can't allow multiple options voting...
I also want to include calendar versioning aka 'NetBeans 2019.03' on
the voting list. So that makes 3 voting threads?
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 7:53 PM Laszlo Kishalmi
<la...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of them.
>
> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>
> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>
> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> > Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
> >
>
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>
>
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
So whatever we did for the previous release, can we do that for the next
release? Purely from the point of view of consistency, since at least IMHO
there’s not much difference.
Gj
On Thursday, January 24, 2019, Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
wrote:
> And we also have a commit About it: https://github.com/apache/
> incubator-netbeans/pull/911/commits/9c9e4fb0ab6a3cd26161d2c0880575
> 81f8bd995f
>
> Message: [NETBEANS-1067] Release number should be 10, not 10.0, so new
> commit
>
>
>
> Von: Christian Lenz
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 19:18
> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Betreff: AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> 10.0 was not used for the Images like the Splash screen and the About
> Dialog.
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Chris
>
>
>
> Von: Geertjan Wielenga
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 19:09
> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> Well, we used 10.0 the last time, so why not 11.0 now. I still don’t really
> understand why though, or why it matters, but I’ll support either way.
>
> Gj
>
> On Thursday, January 24, 2019, Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of
> > them.
> >
> > What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
> > got the most +1 in three days will win?
> >
> > (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
> >
> > On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> >
> >> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
> >>
> >>
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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> >
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
And we also have a commit About it: https://github.com/apache/incubator-netbeans/pull/911/commits/9c9e4fb0ab6a3cd26161d2c088057581f8bd995f
Message: [NETBEANS-1067] Release number should be 10, not 10.0, so new commit
Von: Christian Lenz
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 19:18
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
10.0 was not used for the Images like the Splash screen and the About Dialog.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Geertjan Wielenga
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 19:09
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Well, we used 10.0 the last time, so why not 11.0 now. I still don’t really
understand why though, or why it matters, but I’ll support either way.
Gj
On Thursday, January 24, 2019, Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of
> them.
>
> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>
> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>
> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>
>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>>
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
10.0 was not used for the Images like the Splash screen and the About Dialog.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Geertjan Wielenga
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 19:09
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Well, we used 10.0 the last time, so why not 11.0 now. I still don’t really
understand why though, or why it matters, but I’ll support either way.
Gj
On Thursday, January 24, 2019, Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of
> them.
>
> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>
> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>
> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>
>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>>
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>
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>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Well, we used 10.0 the last time, so why not 11.0 now. I still don’t really
understand why though, or why it matters, but I’ll support either way.
Gj
On Thursday, January 24, 2019, Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of
> them.
>
> What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
> got the most +1 in three days will win?
>
> (I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
>
> On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
>
>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
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>
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>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>.
Well, all I'm seeking is the consensus here. I have pro-s for both of them.
What about, if I start two voting threads on each version and whichever
got the most +1 in three days will win?
(I know it is a kind of pity, but sometimes small things matter.)
On 1/23/19 10:41 PM, Laszlo Kishalmi wrote:
> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>.
<just for fun on>
Just to increase the insanity level, one of my former projects used
codnames from the periodic table of elements.
So what would you say on: Apache NetBeans Natrium? or just Apache
NetBeans Na, and when the patch version comes: Apache NetBeans Na+
</just for fun off>
On 1/24/19 12:31 PM, Emilian Bold wrote:
> But then we need 51 voting threads!
>
> --emi
>
> http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 9:44 PM Kenneth Fogel
> <kf...@dawsoncollege.qc.ca> wrote:
>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51 named moons:
>>
>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
>> Carme Helike Mneme
>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
>> Dia Io Praxidike
>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>>
>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>>
>> Ken
>>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
But then we need 51 voting threads!
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 9:44 PM Kenneth Fogel
<kf...@dawsoncollege.qc.ca> wrote:
>
> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51 named moons:
>
> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> Carme Helike Mneme
> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> Dia Io Praxidike
> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>
> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>
> Ken
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
I think this is something to discuss and we could probably reach consensus
around it without a vote. I’m in favor of it for its simplicity and indeed
alignment with other tools.
Gj
On Friday, January 25, 2019, Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So now, both IntelliJ and Eclipse use calendar versioning (2019.03)
> but it seems crazy to suggest this for NetBeans?
>
> I guess this is also a branding strategy: be against the trends.
>
> --emi
>
> http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 10:58 PM Christian Bourque
> <ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Just so you know, Eclipse stopped using this nomenclature recently!
> >
> > From now on, it's going to simply be the year and month of release (e.g.:
> > Eclipse IDE 2018-12)!
> >
> > C.
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 2:44 PM Kenneth Fogel <
> kfogel@dawsoncollege.qc.ca>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one
> knows
> > > what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names
> of the
> > > 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> > > randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the
> 51
> > > named moons:
> > >
> > > Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> > > Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> > > Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> > > Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> > > Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> > > Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> > > Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> > > Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> > > Callisto Hegemone Metis
> > > Carme Helike Mneme
> > > Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> > > Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> > > Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> > > Dia Io Praxidike
> > > Elara Iocaste Sinope
> > >
> > > There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
> > >
> > > Ken
> > >
> > >
>
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>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
So now, both IntelliJ and Eclipse use calendar versioning (2019.03)
but it seems crazy to suggest this for NetBeans?
I guess this is also a branding strategy: be against the trends.
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 10:58 PM Christian Bourque
<ch...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Just so you know, Eclipse stopped using this nomenclature recently!
>
> From now on, it's going to simply be the year and month of release (e.g.:
> Eclipse IDE 2018-12)!
>
> C.
>
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 2:44 PM Kenneth Fogel <kf...@dawsoncollege.qc.ca>
> wrote:
>
> > We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows
> > what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the
> > 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> > randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51
> > named moons:
> >
> > Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> > Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> > Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> > Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> > Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> > Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> > Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> > Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> > Callisto Hegemone Metis
> > Carme Helike Mneme
> > Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> > Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> > Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> > Dia Io Praxidike
> > Elara Iocaste Sinope
> >
> > There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
> >
> > Ken
> >
> >
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Bourque <ch...@gmail.com>.
Just so you know, Eclipse stopped using this nomenclature recently!
From now on, it's going to simply be the year and month of release (e.g.:
Eclipse IDE 2018-12)!
C.
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 2:44 PM Kenneth Fogel <kf...@dawsoncollege.qc.ca>
wrote:
> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows
> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the
> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51
> named moons:
>
> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> Carme Helike Mneme
> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> Dia Io Praxidike
> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>
> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>
> Ken
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
>
> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
> > therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
>
> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
> continue for quite a while before I run out :)
>
Which suggestions were in jest? No, this is an extremely lengthy discussion
where everyone is very serious -- and I'm not sure this intervention is
helpful.
Yes, version numbers are free. OK.
Gj
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
> > therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
>
> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
> continue for quite a while before I run out :)
>
> >
> > We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
> > else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> >
> > Gj
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
> >> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead
> of or.
> >>
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Chris
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> >> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> >> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >>
> >> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one
> knows
> >> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of
> the
> >> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> >> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the
> 51
> >> named moons:
> >>
> >> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> >> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> >> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> >> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> >> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> >> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> >> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> >> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> >> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> >> Carme Helike Mneme
> >> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> >> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> >> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> >> Dia Io Praxidike
> >> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> >>
> >> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
> >>
> >> Ken
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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>
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
+1 for calver. (Yearh.month)
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Freitag, 25. Januar 2019 10:41
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Fri, 25 Jan 2019 at 09:12, Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It is
> more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next version
> 2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
>
> So +1 for 11.0
Yes, +1 for 11.0, 12.0, 13.0 for me, for the same reasons. And just
referring to it as NetBeans 11, NetBeans 12, etc. on website, splash,
etc. I really don't understand the argument this caused with NetBeans
10 here if .1, .2, etc. are only intended to be patch releases? And
that's the question I don't think we've really answered yet - if we're
moving to time-based releases are all releases treated equal? Are all
point releases just bug fixes *on the release branch*?
-0 on date releases - not against it, but have a few questions if that
went ahead. Can all our infrastructure manage that well? eg. do we
use that in publishing platform artefacts to Maven, or do we end up
using multiple version schemes? What happens when like NB 10 we need
to delay a release for a blocker - do we end up having to rename
2018-10-rc to 2018-12? Is there any significance to a change from
2019.x to 2020.x? Does it change how we integrate NetCAT?
I can't decide whether this thread is cosmetic bike-shedding or quite
fundamental at the moment! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Fri, 25 Jan 2019 at 09:12, Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It is
> more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next version
> 2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
>
> So +1 for 11.0
Yes, +1 for 11.0, 12.0, 13.0 for me, for the same reasons. And just
referring to it as NetBeans 11, NetBeans 12, etc. on website, splash,
etc. I really don't understand the argument this caused with NetBeans
10 here if .1, .2, etc. are only intended to be patch releases? And
that's the question I don't think we've really answered yet - if we're
moving to time-based releases are all releases treated equal? Are all
point releases just bug fixes *on the release branch*?
-0 on date releases - not against it, but have a few questions if that
went ahead. Can all our infrastructure manage that well? eg. do we
use that in publishing platform artefacts to Maven, or do we end up
using multiple version schemes? What happens when like NB 10 we need
to delay a release for a blocker - do we end up having to rename
2018-10-rc to 2018-12? Is there any significance to a change from
2019.x to 2020.x? Does it change how we integrate NetCAT?
I can't decide whether this thread is cosmetic bike-shedding or quite
fundamental at the moment! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
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RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Eric Barboni <sk...@apache.org>.
Just to know, the format YYYYY.0M is a standard to do this kind of versioning ?
Maybe for maven we can have also do the release as 2019.03-RELEASE (and for the old one 2018.09-RELEASE for (9.0),2018.12-RELEASE for (10)) so it may help know if there is a new version from a maven point of view. We are not bind to RELEASE... version I guess.
Anyway I will follow the decision.
Eric
-----Message d'origine-----
De : Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>
Envoyé : vendredi 25 janvier 2019 11:01
À : NetBeans Dev@ <de...@netbeans.incubator.apache.org>
Objet : Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> Or should we change the apidocs, the maven artefacts ?
Normally module versions are unrelated to the NetBeans version. So a NetBeans Platform app doesn't update versions the same way a Maven-based NetBeans Platform app (where for convenience we have only major versions like RELEASE82, whatever).
So it's actually the Maven support that's the odd one. I don't see a problem with using RELEASE201903.
> What if a release has to be released in a short period because of security fixes? Append calendar with day, use another moon or new element?
I believe Ubuntu just adds another number for patches. So 2018.10.1,
2018.10.2 -- thus the end number is not a day but the patch level.
calver.org calls this 'micro' or 'patch' segment.
> Is this only for branding?
Primordially yes. The version number is something end users see and remember. The actual module versions are for programmers and we don't change them all when we do another release (except for Maven I guess?).
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 11:37 AM Eric Barboni <sk...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Is this only for branding?
> Or should we change the apidocs, the maven artefacts ?
> What if a release has to be released in a short period because of security fixes? Append calendar with day, use another moon or new element?
>
> Regards
> Eric
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com> Envoyé : vendredi 25 janvier
> 2019 10:12 À : dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org Objet : Re: Apache
> NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> Hi,
> I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It
> is more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next
> version
> 2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
>
> So +1 for 11.0
> Tomas
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 10:09 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > > Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03,
> > > calendar versioning?
> >
> > I'm not against it at all :)
> > My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something
> > where users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than
> > version B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using
> > nicknames would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
> >
> > >
> > > No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen
> > > whether we can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely
> > > new. I like it, a lot. Let's see what others say first and then if
> > > we cannot reach
> > consensus,
> > > we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach
> > > consensus
> > around
> > > calendar versioning.
> > >
> > > Gj
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno
> > > <hu...@apache.org>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > >>> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do
> > >>> and therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
> > >>
> > >> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> > >> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I
> > >> could continue for quite a while before I run out :)
> > >>
> > >>>
> > >>> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than
> > anything
> > >>> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> > >>>
> > >>> Gj
> > >>>
> > >>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz
> > >>> <christian.lenz@gmx.net
> > >
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon
> > >>>> chemical thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to
> > >>>> say and, instead
> > >> of or.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Cheers
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Chris
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> > >>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> > >>>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >>>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> > >>>>
> > >>>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that
> > >>>> no one
> > >> knows
> > >>>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the
> > >>>> names
> > of
> > >> the
> > >>>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also,
> > >>>> select them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically.
> > >>>> Here are the
> > >> 51
> > >>>> named moons:
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> > >>>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> > >>>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> > >>>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> > >>>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> > >>>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> > >>>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> > >>>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> > >>>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> > >>>> Carme Helike Mneme
> > >>>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> > >>>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> > >>>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> > >>>> Dia Io Praxidike
> > >>>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> > >>>>
> > >>>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting
> > >>>> formal
> > names.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Ken
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -----------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> --
> > >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >>
> > >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+list
> > >> s
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> > --------------------------------------------------------------------
> > - To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
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> >
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> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
> Or should we change the apidocs, the maven artefacts ?
Normally module versions are unrelated to the NetBeans version. So a
NetBeans Platform app doesn't update versions the same way a
Maven-based NetBeans Platform app (where for convenience we have only
major versions like RELEASE82, whatever).
So it's actually the Maven support that's the odd one. I don't see a
problem with using RELEASE201903.
> What if a release has to be released in a short period because of security fixes? Append calendar with day, use another moon or new element?
I believe Ubuntu just adds another number for patches. So 2018.10.1,
2018.10.2 -- thus the end number is not a day but the patch level.
calver.org calls this 'micro' or 'patch' segment.
> Is this only for branding?
Primordially yes. The version number is something end users see and
remember. The actual module versions are for programmers and we don't
change them all when we do another release (except for Maven I
guess?).
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 11:37 AM Eric Barboni <sk...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> Is this only for branding?
> Or should we change the apidocs, the maven artefacts ?
> What if a release has to be released in a short period because of security fixes? Append calendar with day, use another moon or new element?
>
> Regards
> Eric
> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com>
> Envoyé : vendredi 25 janvier 2019 10:12
> À : dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Objet : Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> Hi,
> I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It is more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next version
> 2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
>
> So +1 for 11.0
> Tomas
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 10:09 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> > On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > > Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03,
> > > calendar versioning?
> >
> > I'm not against it at all :)
> > My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something
> > where users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than
> > version B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using
> > nicknames would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
> >
> > >
> > > No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen
> > > whether we can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely
> > > new. I like it, a lot. Let's see what others say first and then if
> > > we cannot reach
> > consensus,
> > > we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach consensus
> > around
> > > calendar versioning.
> > >
> > > Gj
> > >
> > >
> > > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > >> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > >>> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do
> > >>> and therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
> > >>
> > >> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> > >> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I
> > >> could continue for quite a while before I run out :)
> > >>
> > >>>
> > >>> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than
> > anything
> > >>> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> > >>>
> > >>> Gj
> > >>>
> > >>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz
> > >>> <christian.lenz@gmx.net
> > >
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon
> > >>>> chemical thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say
> > >>>> and, instead
> > >> of or.
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Cheers
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Chris
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> > >>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> > >>>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >>>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> > >>>>
> > >>>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no
> > >>>> one
> > >> knows
> > >>>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the
> > >>>> names
> > of
> > >> the
> > >>>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select
> > >>>> them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically.
> > >>>> Here are the
> > >> 51
> > >>>> named moons:
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> > >>>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> > >>>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> > >>>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> > >>>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> > >>>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> > >>>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> > >>>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> > >>>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> > >>>> Carme Helike Mneme
> > >>>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> > >>>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> > >>>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> > >>>> Dia Io Praxidike
> > >>>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> > >>>>
> > >>>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal
> > names.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Ken
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> > >> dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> > >> dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > >>
> > >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> > For additional commands, e-mail:
> > dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >
> > For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> > https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Eric Barboni <sk...@apache.org>.
Hi,
Is this only for branding?
Or should we change the apidocs, the maven artefacts ?
What if a release has to be released in a short period because of security fixes? Append calendar with day, use another moon or new element?
Regards
Eric
-----Message d'origine-----
De : Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com>
Envoyé : vendredi 25 janvier 2019 10:12
À : dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Objet : Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Hi,
I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It is more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next version
2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
So +1 for 11.0
Tomas
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 10:09 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03,
> > calendar versioning?
>
> I'm not against it at all :)
> My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something
> where users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than
> version B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using
> nicknames would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
>
> >
> > No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen
> > whether we can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely
> > new. I like it, a lot. Let's see what others say first and then if
> > we cannot reach
> consensus,
> > we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach consensus
> around
> > calendar versioning.
> >
> > Gj
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >
> >> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> >>> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do
> >>> and therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
> >>
> >> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> >> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I
> >> could continue for quite a while before I run out :)
> >>
> >>>
> >>> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than
> anything
> >>> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> >>>
> >>> Gj
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz
> >>> <christian.lenz@gmx.net
> >
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon
> >>>> chemical thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say
> >>>> and, instead
> >> of or.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Cheers
> >>>>
> >>>> Chris
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> >>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> >>>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >>>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >>>>
> >>>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no
> >>>> one
> >> knows
> >>>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the
> >>>> names
> of
> >> the
> >>>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select
> >>>> them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically.
> >>>> Here are the
> >> 51
> >>>> named moons:
> >>>>
> >>>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> >>>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> >>>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> >>>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> >>>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> >>>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> >>>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> >>>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> >>>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> >>>> Carme Helike Mneme
> >>>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> >>>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> >>>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> >>>> Dia Io Praxidike
> >>>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> >>>>
> >>>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal
> names.
> >>>>
> >>>> Ken
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> -- To unsubscribe, e-mail:
> >> dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail:
> >> dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Tomas Poledny <sa...@gmail.com>.
Hi,
I don't like calendar versioning. I have problem with remember it. It is
more easy to remember 11 or 11.0 than 2019.03. What will be next version
2019.02 or 2019.03 or 2019.04 and what was previous version?
So +1 for 11.0
Tomas
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 10:09 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03, calendar
> > versioning?
>
> I'm not against it at all :)
> My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something where
> users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than version
> B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using nicknames
> would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
>
> >
> > No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen whether we
> > can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely new. I like it, a
> > lot. Let's see what others say first and then if we cannot reach
> consensus,
> > we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach consensus
> around
> > calendar versioning.
> >
> > Gj
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org>
> wrote:
> >
> >> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> >>> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
> >>> therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
> >>
> >> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> >> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
> >> continue for quite a while before I run out :)
> >>
> >>>
> >>> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than
> anything
> >>> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> >>>
> >>> Gj
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net
> >
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
> >>>> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead
> >> of or.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Cheers
> >>>>
> >>>> Chris
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> >>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> >>>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >>>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >>>>
> >>>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one
> >> knows
> >>>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names
> of
> >> the
> >>>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> >>>> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the
> >> 51
> >>>> named moons:
> >>>>
> >>>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> >>>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> >>>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> >>>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> >>>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> >>>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> >>>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> >>>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> >>>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> >>>> Carme Helike Mneme
> >>>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> >>>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> >>>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> >>>> Dia Io Praxidike
> >>>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> >>>>
> >>>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal
> names.
> >>>>
> >>>> Ken
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >>
> >> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> >> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Antonio <an...@vieiro.net>.
+1 to calendar versioning.
+1 to NOT using nicknames. I still have to learn if Debian Wheezy is
older or newer than Debian WhateverTheFlippingName
El 25/01/2019 a las 10:02, Daniel Gruno escribió:
> On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
>> Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03, calendar
>> versioning?
>
> I'm not against it at all :)
> My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something where
> users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than version
> B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using nicknames
> would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org>.
On 1/25/19 9:48 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03, calendar
> versioning?
I'm not against it at all :)
My only suggestion or opinion would be that it should be something where
users can quickly see whether version A is newer or older than version
B. Both numerical and calendar versioning solve that. Using nicknames
would complicate matters, even if just slightly.
>
> No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen whether we
> can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely new. I like it, a
> lot. Let's see what others say first and then if we cannot reach consensus,
> we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach consensus around
> calendar versioning.
>
> Gj
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
>>> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
>>> therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
>>
>> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
>> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
>> continue for quite a while before I run out :)
>>
>>>
>>> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
>>> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
>>>
>>> Gj
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
>>>> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead
>> of or.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers
>>>>
>>>> Chris
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
>>>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
>>>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>>>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>>>>
>>>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one
>> knows
>>>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of
>> the
>>>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
>>>> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the
>> 51
>>>> named moons:
>>>>
>>>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
>>>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
>>>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
>>>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
>>>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
>>>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
>>>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
>>>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
>>>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
>>>> Carme Helike Mneme
>>>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
>>>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
>>>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
>>>> Dia Io Praxidike
>>>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>>>>
>>>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>>>>
>>>> Ken
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
>>
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>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
Are you saying you're against Emilian's proposal, i.e., 2019.03, calendar
versioning?
No, we're not going to start any vote at all, until we've seen whether we
can reach consensus. Emilian's proposal is completely new. I like it, a
lot. Let's see what others say first and then if we cannot reach consensus,
we'll do a vote. But I have a feeling we're able to reach consensus around
calendar versioning.
Gj
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:32 AM Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org> wrote:
> On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> > I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
> > therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
>
> I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
> Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
> continue for quite a while before I run out :)
>
> >
> > We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
> > else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
> >
> > Gj
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
> >> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead
> of or.
> >>
> >>
> >> Cheers
> >>
> >> Chris
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> >> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> >> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> >> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
> >>
> >> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one
> knows
> >> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of
> the
> >> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> >> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the
> 51
> >> named moons:
> >>
> >> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> >> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> >> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> >> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> >> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> >> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> >> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> >> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> >> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> >> Carme Helike Mneme
> >> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> >> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> >> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> >> Dia Io Praxidike
> >> Elara Iocaste Sinope
> >>
> >> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
> >>
> >> Ken
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscribe@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-help@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Daniel Gruno <hu...@apache.org>.
On 1/25/19 9:30 AM, Geertjan Wielenga wrote:
> I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
> therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
I think (hope?!) some of these suggestions were in jest.
Let's keep it simple - version numbers are free, 1,2,3,4,5,6....I could
continue for quite a while before I run out :)
>
> We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
> else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
>
> Gj
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
> wrote:
>
>> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
>> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead of or.
>>
>>
>> Cheers
>>
>> Chris
>>
>>
>>
>> Von: Kenneth Fogel
>> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
>> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
>> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows
>> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the
>> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
>> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51
>> named moons:
>>
>> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
>> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
>> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
>> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
>> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
>> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
>> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
>> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
>> Callisto Hegemone Metis
>> Carme Helike Mneme
>> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
>> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
>> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
>> Dia Io Praxidike
>> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>>
>> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>>
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Sure, but as you can see, we have different opinions about that. I mean if it is that simple, we can now start a vote for the suggestions?
Cheers
Chris
Von: Geertjan Wielenga
Gesendet: Freitag, 25. Januar 2019 09:30
An: dev
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
Gj
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
wrote:
> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead of or.
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Chris
>
>
>
> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows
> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the
> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51
> named moons:
>
> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> Carme Helike Mneme
> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> Dia Io Praxidike
> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>
> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Geertjan Wielenga <ge...@googlemail.com.INVALID>.
I think whatever is super simple and clear is what we should do and
therefore I really like Emilian's suggestion.
We spend more time and energy discussing release numbering than anything
else and the sooner that can stop the better. :-)
Gj
On Fri, Jan 25, 2019 at 9:28 AM Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>
wrote:
> And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical
> thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead of or.
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Chris
>
>
>
> Von: Kenneth Fogel
> Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
> An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
> Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
>
> We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows
> what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the
> 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them
> randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51
> named moons:
>
> Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
> Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
> Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
> Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
> Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
> Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
> Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
> Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
> Callisto Hegemone Metis
> Carme Helike Mneme
> Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
> Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
> Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
> Dia Io Praxidike
> Elara Iocaste Sinope
>
> There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
>
> Ken
>
>
>
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
And for the codenames, I mean 2019.03 could have also a moon chemical thing like Natrium or whatever. For me it is more to say and, instead of or.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Kenneth Fogel
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 20:44
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51 named moons:
Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
Callisto Hegemone Metis
Carme Helike Mneme
Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
Dia Io Praxidike
Elara Iocaste Sinope
There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
Ken
RE: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Kenneth Fogel <kf...@dawsoncollege.qc.ca>.
We could use seemingly random words like Eclipse does so that no one knows what the most recent version is. For example, we could use the names of the 63 moons of Jupiter, the planet with the most moons. Also, select them randomly, users will catch on if we do it alphabetically. Here are the 51 named moons:
Adrastea Erinome Isonoe Sponde
Aitne Euanthe Kale Taygete
Amalthea Eukelade Kallichore Thebe
Ananke Euporie Kalyke Thelxinoe
Aoede Europa Kore Themisto
Arche Eurydome Leda Thyone
Autonoe Ganymede Lysithea
Callirrhoe Harpalyke Megaclite
Callisto Hegemone Metis
Carme Helike Mneme
Carpo Hermippe Orthosie
Chaldene Herse Pasiphae
Cyllene Himalia Pasithee
Dia Io Praxidike
Elara Iocaste Sinope
There are about 12 more moons with numeric names awaiting formal names.
Ken
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
I’m also fine with calender, I only wanted to say if we decide using the 0 at the end or not, we should be consistent. This was the point until 10. Sometimes we spoke About 10 sometimes we spoke About 10.0 there is written 10 there is written 10.0. Whatever we decide of 11, 11.0 or 2019.03 we should be consistent everywhere.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Emilian Bold
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 18:01
An: NetBeans Dev@
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
From a branding perspective, 10 and 11 sound better. 'NetBeans 10',
'NetBeans 11' is like a big, memorable release.
'NetBeans 11.0' underlines the work-in-progress nature of it. (Of
course, after 11.0 there must be a 11.1?)
I think calendar versioning (there's even a site for it
https://calver.org/ ) is a much better approach. IntelliJ is using it
and I'm also using it for CoolBeans.
Semantic versioning (https://semver.org/ ) is also good, but too
technical in a way.
Speaking of calendar versioning, it wouldn't have been good for
NetBeans 8.2. How would users feel about still using in 2019 'NetBeans
2016.12'? Doesn't sound very fresh, right? But if you *do* want to
show that this is new, using 'NetBeans 2019.03' sounds really good!
Of course, my 2c, no strong feelings about it. Just have a vote, and
whatever wins wins.
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 6:42 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
>
> > Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> > to 10 (and not to 10.0).
> >
>
> In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
> reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
> There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
> just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
> style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
> have just been NB10 patch 1.
>
> Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
> another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
> of that. Maybe a vote is required?
>
> Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
> explain it when asked! ;-)
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> >
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Emilian Bold <em...@gmail.com>.
From a branding perspective, 10 and 11 sound better. 'NetBeans 10',
'NetBeans 11' is like a big, memorable release.
'NetBeans 11.0' underlines the work-in-progress nature of it. (Of
course, after 11.0 there must be a 11.1?)
I think calendar versioning (there's even a site for it
https://calver.org/ ) is a much better approach. IntelliJ is using it
and I'm also using it for CoolBeans.
Semantic versioning (https://semver.org/ ) is also good, but too
technical in a way.
Speaking of calendar versioning, it wouldn't have been good for
NetBeans 8.2. How would users feel about still using in 2019 'NetBeans
2016.12'? Doesn't sound very fresh, right? But if you *do* want to
show that this is new, using 'NetBeans 2019.03' sounds really good!
Of course, my 2c, no strong feelings about it. Just have a vote, and
whatever wins wins.
--emi
http://coolbeans.xyz/ - CoolBeans: An IDE for Java, JavaEE, PHP and more!
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019 at 6:42 PM Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org> wrote:
>
> On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
>
> > Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> > to 10 (and not to 10.0).
> >
>
> In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
> reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
> There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
> just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
> style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
> have just been NB10 patch 1.
>
> Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
> another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
> of that. Maybe a vote is required?
>
> Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
> explain it when asked! ;-)
>
> Best wishes,
>
> Neil
>
> >
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Sry for adding 3 mails in a row and not adding it into one, but smth else came into my mind. IntelliJ makes it different. They have 4 releases a year and they call it like the quarterly releases 2019.1, 2019.2 etc. I don’t want to say that I would prefer this way, I only wanted to say they don’t release only 2019 (patch 1 or whatever).
Cheers
Chris
Von: Christian Lenz
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 17:52
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Hey Neil,
There was no 8, there was 8.0 and it was not a minor, it was the major release after 7.3. 8.1 was minor but still with new features + bug fixes etc. So no patch. 8.2 had 2 patches which were 8.2 patch 1 and 8.2 patch 2.
I don’t remember which other software does this but if patch means 8.2.1 and 8.2.2 Im more welcome because everyone should know about the versioning in Software. 10 is 10.0 but 10 is not 10.1 and not 10 patch 1. Maybe it could be 10.1 patch 1 or 10.1.1 if we are only talking About bug fixes.
Will point a link to wiki, for versioning here: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versionsnummer (german version).
And Chrome also have this: 71.0.3578.98
So if we will have critical bug fixes for NB 10, it will be 10.0.1 IMHO.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 17:42
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
> Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> to 10 (and not to 10.0).
>
In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
have just been NB10 patch 1.
Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
of that. Maybe a vote is required?
Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
explain it when asked! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
>
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Firefox is doing the same: 64.0.2. And I can remember, that they have FireFox 64.0 and not 64: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/64.0/releasenotes/
Cheers
Chris
Von: Christian Lenz
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 17:52
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Hey Neil,
There was no 8, there was 8.0 and it was not a minor, it was the major release after 7.3. 8.1 was minor but still with new features + bug fixes etc. So no patch. 8.2 had 2 patches which were 8.2 patch 1 and 8.2 patch 2.
I don’t remember which other software does this but if patch means 8.2.1 and 8.2.2 Im more welcome because everyone should know about the versioning in Software. 10 is 10.0 but 10 is not 10.1 and not 10 patch 1. Maybe it could be 10.1 patch 1 or 10.1.1 if we are only talking About bug fixes.
Will point a link to wiki, for versioning here: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versionsnummer (german version).
And Chrome also have this: 71.0.3578.98
So if we will have critical bug fixes for NB 10, it will be 10.0.1 IMHO.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 17:42
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
> Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> to 10 (and not to 10.0).
>
In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
have just been NB10 patch 1.
Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
of that. Maybe a vote is required?
Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
explain it when asked! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 16:52 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
> There was no 8, there was 8.0 and it was not a minor, it was the major
> release after 7.3.
>
You're still missing my point! ;-) IMO 7.3, 8.0, 8.1, 8.2 were all the same
level of release. They're only major / minor if you assume the intention is
semantic versioning, rather than mirroring Java compatibility. But for
building anything on top you could usually assume same or more things would
break between "minor" versions. At least that's been my experience, even if
NetBeans generally is pretty good with backward compatibility.
A vote would be a good thing, but it's not necessarily a minor cosmetic
issue. It could affect how / when certain changes go in. Or how
compatibility for plugins or platform is defined and communicated.
Best wishes,
Neil
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Hey Neil,
There was no 8, there was 8.0 and it was not a minor, it was the major release after 7.3. 8.1 was minor but still with new features + bug fixes etc. So no patch. 8.2 had 2 patches which were 8.2 patch 1 and 8.2 patch 2.
I don’t remember which other software does this but if patch means 8.2.1 and 8.2.2 Im more welcome because everyone should know about the versioning in Software. 10 is 10.0 but 10 is not 10.1 and not 10 patch 1. Maybe it could be 10.1 patch 1 or 10.1.1 if we are only talking About bug fixes.
Will point a link to wiki, for versioning here: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Versionsnummer (german version).
And Chrome also have this: 71.0.3578.98
So if we will have critical bug fixes for NB 10, it will be 10.0.1 IMHO.
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 17:42
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
> Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> to 10 (and not to 10.0).
>
In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
have just been NB10 patch 1.
Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
of that. Maybe a vote is required?
Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
explain it when asked! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
>
Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019, 14:45 Christian Lenz <christian.lenz@gmx.net wrote:
> Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0
> to 10 (and not to 10.0).
>
In which case you missed the point I was trying to make. There *was* a
reason! 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were hardly minor - the 8 just referred to Java 8.
There was a discussion about moving away from sync with Java versions and
just incrementing the number for every release (Firefox, Chrome, JDK
style). That was the reason for dropping the zero, because 10.1 could also
have just been NB10 patch 1.
Now whether everyone is on the same page about that versioning scheme is
another matter. Don't think you can answer this thread without being sure
of that. Maybe a vote is required?
Either seems fine to me, as long as we can all have the same answer to
explain it when asked! ;-)
Best wishes,
Neil
>
AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
Maybe I missunderstand smth but we are talking only about removing the 0 or keep it. So like we have it until 10 now.
Still from my point of view, there was no reason from switching from 9.0 to 10 (and not to 10.0). So why now? We already have to change the number to 11.1 if we implement new features. Don’t forget we already had 7.2.1 and I think it was not the patch. I mean I don’t care About with or w/o but if we decide to remove it, we should remove it everywhere and not only for the end customer. If we will keep it, then we should Keep it everywhere and not talking about internal and external.
Here is, what I can say of the history:
7.0 Major
7.1 Minor (With some Features)
7.2 Minor (With some Features)
7.2.1 Patch (Fixes
For 8, we have:
8.0 Major
8.1 Minor (With some Features)
8.2 Minor (With some Features)
8.2 Patch 1 (Still 8.2, not 8.2.1)
8.2 Patch 2 (Still 8.2, not 8.2.2)
Now under Apache, we have
9.0 (Major, w/ 0)
10 (Major, w/o 0)
11 (Open discussion for 11 or 11.0)
Cheers
Chris
Von: Neil C Smith
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 15:33
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019 at 13:56, Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net> wrote:
>
> +1 for 11.0 for almost everything. No Need to Change it from 7.0, 8.0, 9.0 to 10 or 11. There was no reason for that of changing it. My 2 cents
>
Sorry, I disagree with that point. NetBeans 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were
quite distinct releases with additions in functionality. There was a
reason for changing it, with the idea of just incrementing the major
number for each release with additional functionality. If that's
going to be the case then I don't think the patch number should be in
the splash, on the website, other public places etc. because that
means it has to be updated every time there's a bug fix release.
Personally, I have no strong opinion either way, but if a possible NB
11.1 in June is intended to be literally just a minor release, then
makes sense to keep the workload down and call this NB11 in a lot of
places.
2c
Best wishes,
Neil
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Neil C Smith <ne...@apache.org>.
On Thu, 24 Jan 2019 at 13:56, Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net> wrote:
>
> +1 for 11.0 for almost everything. No Need to Change it from 7.0, 8.0, 9.0 to 10 or 11. There was no reason for that of changing it. My 2 cents
>
Sorry, I disagree with that point. NetBeans 8.0, 8.1 and 8.2 were
quite distinct releases with additions in functionality. There was a
reason for changing it, with the idea of just incrementing the major
number for each release with additional functionality. If that's
going to be the case then I don't think the patch number should be in
the splash, on the website, other public places etc. because that
means it has to be updated every time there's a bug fix release.
Personally, I have no strong opinion either way, but if a possible NB
11.1 in June is intended to be literally just a minor release, then
makes sense to keep the workload down and call this NB11 in a lot of
places.
2c
Best wishes,
Neil
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AW: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Christian Lenz <ch...@gmx.net>.
+1 for 11.0 for almost everything. No Need to Change it from 7.0, 8.0, 9.0 to 10 or 11. There was no reason for that of changing it. My 2 cents
Cheers
Chris
Von: Laszlo Kishalmi
Gesendet: Donnerstag, 24. Januar 2019 08:00
An: dev@netbeans.incubator.apache.org
Betreff: Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Yes we might have a first minor/patch release inside of Apache as 11.1
in June.
On 1/23/19 10:44 PM, Vano Beridze wrote:
> 11 patch 1,2,...?
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019, 10:42 AM Laszlo Kishalmi <laszlo.kishalmi@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Laszlo Kishalmi <la...@gmail.com>.
Yes we might have a first minor/patch release inside of Apache as 11.1
in June.
On 1/23/19 10:44 PM, Vano Beridze wrote:
> 11 patch 1,2,...?
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2019, 10:42 AM Laszlo Kishalmi <laszlo.kishalmi@gmail.com
> wrote:
>
>> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>>
>>
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>>
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>>
>>
>>
>>
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Re: Apache NetBeans 11 or 11.0 ?
Posted by Vano Beridze <va...@gmail.com>.
11 patch 1,2,...?
On Thu, Jan 24, 2019, 10:42 AM Laszlo Kishalmi <laszlo.kishalmi@gmail.com
wrote:
> Well, probably it is the right time to decide: 11 or 11.0 ?
>
>
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>
> For further information about the NetBeans mailing lists, visit:
> https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/NETBEANS/Mailing+lists
>
>
>
>