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Posted to jetspeed-dev@portals.apache.org by Mingfai Ma <mi...@hongkong.com> on 2003/02/23 05:56:09 UTC
[OT] Php portal server
hi,
I realize the portal servers or community systems that are written in Php
seem to be more mature. I browsed a few sites powered by Xoops and they're
powerful. And I also know about some good open source php cms.
I guess we can copy the features from those php portal, what do you think?
And what do you think about why php open source stuff is more mature?
(assume you think so)
Regards,
mingfai
http://www.xoops.org/modules/news/
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RE: [OT] Php portal server
Posted by Mark Orciuch <ma...@ngsltd.com>.
> One of the problems with Jetspeed (that the PHP based systems have a very
> nice solution for) is a module repository. This mailing list is full of
> comments from people mentioning a portlet they have written. But these
> portlets are not easily accessible to others (maybe they don't want them
> to be, but hopefully, someone does), there doesn't seem to be any
> Jetspeed Portlet Repository, the only easily accessible portlets are the
> ones commited in CVS. The PHP based portals often solve this by having a
Jetspeed Portlet Repository is a good idea which is coming up more and more
lately. IMHO current portlet deployment model doesn't support "portlet
plugins" very well. Ideally, you would want something similar to IBM's .par
files, which is something that may be supported in the next generation
jetspeed.
I suppose that you could currently packgage all required portlet resources
(.xreg, .jars, templates) into an archive which could be manually expanded.
> downloader-module, where you can upload and download files. Which I guess
> is another important point: The Jetspeed project page is not
> running Jetspeed
> itself. I guess it's just not quite there yet...
>
"Self-hosting" of Jetspeed is an idea I toyed with for a while, but
jakarta.apache project currently limits you to static html :(
Best regards,
Mark Orciuch - morciuch@apache.org
Jakarta Jetspeed - Enterprise Portal in Java
http://jakarta.apache.org/jetspeed/
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Re: [OT] Php portal server
Posted by Eivind Tagseth <ei...@multinet.no>.
* David Sean Taylor <da...@bluesunrise.com> [030224 21:41]:
> On Saturday, February 22, 2003, at 08:56 PM, Mingfai Ma wrote:
> >I realize the portal servers or community systems that are written in
> >Php
> >seem to be more mature. I browsed a few sites powered by Xoops and
> >they're
> >powerful. And I also know about some good open source php cms.
I've been trying to get a good overview on the different portal servers
lately, and have to agree. Most of the PHP-based portal/blog/forum-servers
seem very mature out of the box and have a thriving community writing lots
of modules (portlets). This, inspite of there not being a standard API
for modules between the different portal products. The products look really
well, and work very well out of the box.
I'm sure there are several reasons for this. Certainly, PHP is really easy
to get started with, IMO much easier than Java. The consequences are both
positive and negative. On the other hand, there are lots and lots of good
open source java developers out there, so why aren't these making lots of
cool portlets for Jetspeed?
> >I guess we can copy the features from those php portal, what do you
> >think?
> Or integrate directly with them.
That would be very interesting. If we could come up with a way to add a
e.g. xoops-module into Jetspeed as a Jetspeed portlet, the amount of
functionality in Jetspeed would increase enormously. I'm not sure if this
is possible though.
> Im not sure if you are writing to someone in particular, but I'd just
> like to say that with portlet standardization coming soon, Jetspeed
> will soon benefit from working in a standard-based world.
> As a committer, I am currently not interested in writing those portlets
> at this time. Im more interested in writing a solid engine to drive the
> standard portlets first.
And this is what makes Jetspeed really interesting IMO. The PHP-portals may
look nice and mature, but that's until you want to do specialized things with
them. They are not using a template based layout system, in order to change
the appearance you may end up changing code deep into the system (the theme
systems offers some easily accessible presentation logic, but I don't think
it's very pretty, and it was not enough to fulfill my needs.). A velocity-
based Jetspeed system seems much more tempting to me.
One of the problems with Jetspeed (that the PHP based systems have a very
nice solution for) is a module repository. This mailing list is full of
comments from people mentioning a portlet they have written. But these
portlets are not easily accessible to others (maybe they don't want them
to be, but hopefully, someone does), there doesn't seem to be any
Jetspeed Portlet Repository, the only easily accessible portlets are the
ones commited in CVS. The PHP based portals often solve this by having a
downloader-module, where you can upload and download files. Which I guess
is another important point: The Jetspeed project page is not running Jetspeed
itself. I guess it's just not quite there yet...
Eivind
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RE: [OT] Php portal server
Posted by Mingfai Ma <mi...@hongkong.com>.
hi,
I see one of the difference between Java-based and php-based systems is
that, the Java ones are more focus on infrastructure, following standard, oo
design, flexible open for integration, but less focus on functionalities.
(this could be too subjective as I only know Java but not Php) The term
'mature' may be not correct. My thought is based on my understanding in some
Java and php open source projects in the areas like: portal, weblog, cms,
wiki etc. The php counterparts are generally provide better "out-of-the-box"
functionalities.
Indeed, I posted the previous msg so that, in case any of you are not aware
of the functionalities or ideas of the php portal, you can take a look.
Hopefully, it help very slightly to make Jetspeed better in the future.
Besides, I really want to know why there are such difference. I think Java
and J2EE provide better fundamental to build more powerful and scalable
systems than php. I sure the php one doesn't have a standard-based portlet
API (i wonder they don't use portlet or equivalent at all), but it provides
more functionalities that attracts many people. For example, on the
technical side, it provides live hit statistics, a headline/news publishing
mechanism, site statisitcs *[1] etc.
Maybe it is the case that there are more php ppl than Java developers?! Let
me post a message to the Struts list later to discuss this OT issue.
Regards,
mingfai
*[1] - not the portal one. but a php cms.
Sample statistics page:
http://216.239.57.100/search?q=cache:oQWRMyWI2UkC:www.geotrail.no/mmbportal/
modules/visitors2/index.php%3Ftopicpath%3D1%257C4%257C+FAST-WebCrawler/3.6+(
atw-crawler+at+fast+dot+n+geotrail.no/+&hl=en&ie=UTF-8
product: http://www.mamboserver.com/
btw another famous one is http://phpnuke.org/
> > I guess we can copy the features from those php portal, what do you
> > think?
> >
> Or integrate directly with them.
>
> > And what do you think about why php open source stuff is more mature?
> > (assume you think so)
> >
>
> Im not sure if you are writing to someone in particular, but I'd just
> like to say that with portlet standardization coming soon, Jetspeed
> will soon benefit from working in a standard-based world.
> As a committer, I am currently not interested in writing those portlets
> at this time. Im more interested in writing a solid engine to drive the
> standard portlets first.
>
> --
> David Sean Taylor
> Bluesunrise Software
> david@bluesunrise.com
> +01 707 773-4646
>
>
>
>
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>
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Re: [OT] Php portal server
Posted by David Sean Taylor <da...@bluesunrise.com>.
On Saturday, February 22, 2003, at 08:56 PM, Mingfai Ma wrote:
> hi,
>
> I realize the portal servers or community systems that are written in
> Php
> seem to be more mature. I browsed a few sites powered by Xoops and
> they're
> powerful. And I also know about some good open source php cms.
>
Cool
> I guess we can copy the features from those php portal, what do you
> think?
>
Or integrate directly with them.
> And what do you think about why php open source stuff is more mature?
> (assume you think so)
>
Im not sure if you are writing to someone in particular, but I'd just
like to say that with portlet standardization coming soon, Jetspeed
will soon benefit from working in a standard-based world.
As a committer, I am currently not interested in writing those portlets
at this time. Im more interested in writing a solid engine to drive the
standard portlets first.
--
David Sean Taylor
Bluesunrise Software
david@bluesunrise.com
+01 707 773-4646
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