Amazon MQ

[Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu>]

Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ 5.x
to be run as a managed service in AWS:
https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-broker-service-for-activemq/

Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this announcement?

We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience with
the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate or
delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
service.

Tim

Re: Amazon MQ

[Jean-Baptiste Onofré <jb...@nanthrax.net>]

Hi Trevor,

welcome aboard !!

Regards
JB

On 12/11/2017 11:24 PM, trevdyck wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> 
> I am the product manager for Amazon MQ, and have just joined the list. We
> are excited to support ActiveMQ as it has a vibrant developer community and
> a large existing user base! The folks on this list have developed a great
> product that we are happy to be a part of.
> 
> I will also say we did work with many people throughout development, but
> their disclosing so would be a violation of their non-disclosure agreement
> with Amazon, so that might be why you aren't hearing a lot about it on this
> list.
> 
> Thanks & best regards,
> Trevor
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Sent from: http://activemq.2283324.n4.nabble.com/ActiveMQ-User-f2341805.html
> 

-- 
Jean-Baptiste Onofré
jbonofre@apache.org
http://blog.nanthrax.net
Talend - http://www.talend.com

Re: Amazon MQ

[trevdyck <tr...@amazon.com>]

Hi everyone,

I am the product manager for Amazon MQ, and have just joined the list. We
are excited to support ActiveMQ as it has a vibrant developer community and
a large existing user base! The folks on this list have developed a great
product that we are happy to be a part of.

I will also say we did work with many people throughout development, but
their disclosing so would be a violation of their non-disclosure agreement
with Amazon, so that might be why you aren't hearing a lot about it on this
list.

Thanks & best regards,
Trevor



--
Sent from: http://activemq.2283324.n4.nabble.com/ActiveMQ-User-f2341805.html

Re: Amazon MQ

[Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu>]

Sounds great, we appreciate that.

On Dec 4, 2017 3:32 AM, "khandelwalanuj" <an...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> I am planing to switch the in-house running ActiveMQ to the AWS provided
> one. I will keep this community informed about the experience in this and
> any issues around it. I will also be doing performance testing.
>
> Thanks,
> Anuj
>
>
>
> --
> Sent from: http://activemq.2283324.n4.nabble.com/ActiveMQ-User-
> f2341805.html
>

Re: Amazon MQ

[khandelwalanuj <an...@gmail.com>]

Hi All,

I am planing to switch the in-house running ActiveMQ to the AWS provided
one. I will keep this community informed about the experience in this and
any issues around it. I will also be doing performance testing.

Thanks,
Anuj



--
Sent from: http://activemq.2283324.n4.nabble.com/ActiveMQ-User-f2341805.html

Re: Amazon MQ

[Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>]

On 12/08/2017 10:39 AM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>> You can imagine that such organizations who make tons of investment in
> ActiveMQ are not impressed by claims of 'better architecture' or my
> 'journaling system is faster'.
> 
> Do you have a list of what these companies are, in fact, impressed with?  I
> tried to Google for it but it didn't turn up much.
Yes, it's hard to get a list, but you know people talk to each other. I 
don't have the 'list' but I have knowledge, like many others here. 
Companies don't advertise what technologies they use, when, how or why. 
And that is true for commercial software as well. For instance, I can 
say this, which may or may not be speculation: would it surprise you to 
find out that WalMart uses ActiveMQ 5.x and say, Oracle Database 12c?

At ApacheCon in 2009, Mike (tried hard to remember the last name, but I 
bet Bruce can tell you) explained how Sabre was successful with ActiveMQ 
with 0 (as in ZERO) downtime. 100% availability. Bruce worked with them. 
I cannot find the presentation, but I found this slide 11 in Adrian's 
presentation [1]. That mentions the FAA as well, a project I may know a 
thing or two about (or not, pure speculation). So, every time you think 
and you land safely, think of the traffic controllers and ActiveMQ that 
plays a part in that process.

So bottom line, you really need to know what you're looking for to find 
something on google, uhm bing.

> 
>> I think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
> 
> Which parts of Red Hat do I need to interact with more?  Please elaborate.
> I need your help here.
Willing to help and may be able to, but certainly not on this list.

Other thing to elaborate is this. The ASF is not biased towards one 
project or another. We want them all to succeed based on their own 
merits. That's what ASF members do (or should do, others drop out and 
pursue other interests). Also different members have different styles, 
something to be mindful of.

There is a narrative going on that some are -1s and stuff like that 
which creates distrust and well, doesn't help. You, hear things, see 
things, you believe what you want to believe. I will tell you this and I 
hope you'll believe it. ASF members are here to help. We try to help all 
the projects. If you need help ask for it and you will get it.

To sum it up, think of the power of a 100% uptime in 2.5 years coming 
from the Sabre CTO, not some geek, using open source (and in 2009, not 
2017). That's what gets a project successful. Bruce is definitely the 
guy who can talk more about this. Transitions are also possible and the 
names doesn't even matter that much: think MariaDB, Jenkins. It's all 
about value.

I'll stop here. Have fun.
Hadrian


> 
> 
> Justin
> 

[1] 
https://www.slideshare.net/trenaman/apache-coneu-2009adriantrenamanadoptingopensourceintheenterprise

Re: Amazon MQ

[Timothy Bish <ta...@gmail.com>]

On 12/08/2017 11:33 AM, Christopher Shannon wrote:
> Have you tried searching with bing?

given the context of the thread maybe it'd be better to ask Alexa ?

>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 10:39 AM, Justin Bertram <jb...@apache.org> wrote:
>
>>> You can imagine that such organizations who make tons of investment in
>> ActiveMQ are not impressed by claims of 'better architecture' or my
>> 'journaling system is faster'.
>>
>> Do you have a list of what these companies are, in fact, impressed with?  I
>> tried to Google for it but it didn't turn up much.
>>
>>> I think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
>> Which parts of Red Hat do I need to interact with more?  Please elaborate.
>> I need your help here.
>>
>>
>> Justin
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:27 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> What I know is exactly what I said: "effort was started part of the RH
>>> partnership". I know very little about a partnership. The little I know I
>>> cannot disclose and things change all the time anyway.
>>>
>>> RH's strategy, like any other business is driven by sales. What I can
>> tell
>>> you for instance that's public information is that the US (and other)
>>> governments are heavy users of ActiveMQ (see USGS Earthquake Early
>> Warning
>>> [1], bottom of page 12 or search for ActiveMQ). You can imagine that such
>>> organizations who make tons of investment in ActiveMQ are not impressed
>> by
>>> claims of 'better architecture' or my 'journaling system is faster'. It's
>>> costs, training, a lot of factors to consider if you want to be
>> successful
>>> (see why even the faster RabbitMQ struggles). ActiveMQ 5.x is very
>> reliable
>>> when configured well. So it's no surprise that companies like Amazon
>> decide
>>> the way they do.
>>>
>>> We can talk more about what I see as a path to success and all, but I
>>> think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
>>>
>>> My $0.02,
>>> Hadrian
>>>
>>> [1] https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2014/1097/pdf/ofr2014-1097.pdf
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 12/08/2017 09:38 AM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'm not clear on what you're saying.  Are you indicating that Amazon and
>>>> Red Hat are partnering on this venture for ActiveMQ 5.x in AWS?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Justin
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 8:21 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed
>>>>> ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while
>> the
>>>>> community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ
>>>>> expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't
>> know
>>>>> about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not aware
>> of
>>>>> that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions (regarding
>>>>> ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.
>>>>>
>>>>> Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of
>>>>> service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and
>>>>> increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka,
>>>>> RabbitMQ).
>>>>> People make serious investments in such systems and the credibility of
>>>>> the
>>>>> community is super important.
>>>>>
>>>>> Hadrian
>>>>>
>>>>> [1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of
>> any
>>>>>> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).
>>>>>> That
>>>>>> is, of course, their prerogative.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
>>>>>> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
>>>>>> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
>>>>>> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this
>>>>>> further
>>>>>> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
>>>>>> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
>>>>>> different announcement today.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Justin
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ
>>>>>> 5.x
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
>>>>>>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
>>>>>>> broker-service-for-activemq/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this
>>>>>>> announcement?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
>>>>>>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience
>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to
>> detailed
>>>>>>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate
>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may
>> be
>>>>>>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in
>> this
>>>>>>> service.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tim
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>

-- 
Tim Bish
twitter: @tabish121
blog: http://timbish.blogspot.com/

Re: Amazon MQ

[Christopher Shannon <ch...@gmail.com>]

Have you tried searching with bing?

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 10:39 AM, Justin Bertram <jb...@apache.org> wrote:

> > You can imagine that such organizations who make tons of investment in
> ActiveMQ are not impressed by claims of 'better architecture' or my
> 'journaling system is faster'.
>
> Do you have a list of what these companies are, in fact, impressed with?  I
> tried to Google for it but it didn't turn up much.
>
> > I think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
>
> Which parts of Red Hat do I need to interact with more?  Please elaborate.
> I need your help here.
>
>
> Justin
>
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:27 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> > What I know is exactly what I said: "effort was started part of the RH
> > partnership". I know very little about a partnership. The little I know I
> > cannot disclose and things change all the time anyway.
> >
> > RH's strategy, like any other business is driven by sales. What I can
> tell
> > you for instance that's public information is that the US (and other)
> > governments are heavy users of ActiveMQ (see USGS Earthquake Early
> Warning
> > [1], bottom of page 12 or search for ActiveMQ). You can imagine that such
> > organizations who make tons of investment in ActiveMQ are not impressed
> by
> > claims of 'better architecture' or my 'journaling system is faster'. It's
> > costs, training, a lot of factors to consider if you want to be
> successful
> > (see why even the faster RabbitMQ struggles). ActiveMQ 5.x is very
> reliable
> > when configured well. So it's no surprise that companies like Amazon
> decide
> > the way they do.
> >
> > We can talk more about what I see as a path to success and all, but I
> > think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
> >
> > My $0.02,
> > Hadrian
> >
> > [1] https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2014/1097/pdf/ofr2014-1097.pdf
> >
> >
> >
> > On 12/08/2017 09:38 AM, Justin Bertram wrote:
> >
> >> I'm not clear on what you're saying.  Are you indicating that Amazon and
> >> Red Hat are partnering on this venture for ActiveMQ 5.x in AWS?
> >>
> >>
> >> Justin
> >>
> >> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 8:21 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >> I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed
> >>> ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while
> the
> >>> community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ
> >>> expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't
> know
> >>> about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not aware
> of
> >>> that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions (regarding
> >>> ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.
> >>>
> >>> Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of
> >>> service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and
> >>> increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka,
> >>> RabbitMQ).
> >>> People make serious investments in such systems and the credibility of
> >>> the
> >>> community is super important.
> >>>
> >>> Hadrian
> >>>
> >>> [1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of
> any
> >>>> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).
> >>>> That
> >>>> is, of course, their prerogative.
> >>>>
> >>>> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
> >>>> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
> >>>> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
> >>>> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this
> >>>> further
> >>>> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
> >>>> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
> >>>> different announcement today.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Justin
> >>>>
> >>>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ
> >>>> 5.x
> >>>>
> >>>>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
> >>>>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
> >>>>> broker-service-for-activemq/
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this
> >>>>> announcement?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
> >>>>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience
> >>>>> with
> >>>>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to
> detailed
> >>>>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate
> >>>>> or
> >>>>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may
> be
> >>>>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in
> this
> >>>>> service.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Tim
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>
>

Re: Amazon MQ

[Justin Bertram <jb...@apache.org>]

> You can imagine that such organizations who make tons of investment in
ActiveMQ are not impressed by claims of 'better architecture' or my
'journaling system is faster'.

Do you have a list of what these companies are, in fact, impressed with?  I
tried to Google for it but it didn't turn up much.

> I think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.

Which parts of Red Hat do I need to interact with more?  Please elaborate.
I need your help here.


Justin

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 9:27 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com> wrote:

> What I know is exactly what I said: "effort was started part of the RH
> partnership". I know very little about a partnership. The little I know I
> cannot disclose and things change all the time anyway.
>
> RH's strategy, like any other business is driven by sales. What I can tell
> you for instance that's public information is that the US (and other)
> governments are heavy users of ActiveMQ (see USGS Earthquake Early Warning
> [1], bottom of page 12 or search for ActiveMQ). You can imagine that such
> organizations who make tons of investment in ActiveMQ are not impressed by
> claims of 'better architecture' or my 'journaling system is faster'. It's
> costs, training, a lot of factors to consider if you want to be successful
> (see why even the faster RabbitMQ struggles). ActiveMQ 5.x is very reliable
> when configured well. So it's no surprise that companies like Amazon decide
> the way they do.
>
> We can talk more about what I see as a path to success and all, but I
> think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.
>
> My $0.02,
> Hadrian
>
> [1] https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2014/1097/pdf/ofr2014-1097.pdf
>
>
>
> On 12/08/2017 09:38 AM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>
>> I'm not clear on what you're saying.  Are you indicating that Amazon and
>> Red Hat are partnering on this venture for ActiveMQ 5.x in AWS?
>>
>>
>> Justin
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 8:21 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed
>>> ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while the
>>> community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ
>>> expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't know
>>> about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not aware of
>>> that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions (regarding
>>> ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.
>>>
>>> Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of
>>> service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and
>>> increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka,
>>> RabbitMQ).
>>> People make serious investments in such systems and the credibility of
>>> the
>>> community is super important.
>>>
>>> Hadrian
>>>
>>> [1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/
>>>
>>>
>>> On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>>>
>>> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of any
>>>> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).
>>>> That
>>>> is, of course, their prerogative.
>>>>
>>>> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
>>>> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
>>>> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
>>>> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this
>>>> further
>>>> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
>>>> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
>>>> different announcement today.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Justin
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ
>>>> 5.x
>>>>
>>>>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
>>>>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
>>>>> broker-service-for-activemq/
>>>>>
>>>>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this
>>>>> announcement?
>>>>>
>>>>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
>>>>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience
>>>>> with
>>>>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
>>>>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate
>>>>> or
>>>>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
>>>>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
>>>>> service.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tim
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>

Re: Amazon MQ

[Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>]

What I know is exactly what I said: "effort was started part of the RH 
partnership". I know very little about a partnership. The little I know 
I cannot disclose and things change all the time anyway.

RH's strategy, like any other business is driven by sales. What I can 
tell you for instance that's public information is that the US (and 
other) governments are heavy users of ActiveMQ (see USGS Earthquake 
Early Warning [1], bottom of page 12 or search for ActiveMQ). You can 
imagine that such organizations who make tons of investment in ActiveMQ 
are not impressed by claims of 'better architecture' or my 'journaling 
system is faster'. It's costs, training, a lot of factors to consider if 
you want to be successful (see why even the faster RabbitMQ struggles). 
ActiveMQ 5.x is very reliable when configured well. So it's no surprise 
that companies like Amazon decide the way they do.

We can talk more about what I see as a path to success and all, but I 
think it would be good for you to interact more with other parts of RH.

My $0.02,
Hadrian

[1] https://pubs.usgs.gov/of/2014/1097/pdf/ofr2014-1097.pdf


On 12/08/2017 09:38 AM, Justin Bertram wrote:
> I'm not clear on what you're saying.  Are you indicating that Amazon and
> Red Hat are partnering on this venture for ActiveMQ 5.x in AWS?
> 
> 
> Justin
> 
> On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 8:21 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed
>> ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while the
>> community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ
>> expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't know
>> about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not aware of
>> that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions (regarding
>> ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.
>>
>> Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of
>> service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and
>> increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka, RabbitMQ).
>> People make serious investments in such systems and the credibility of the
>> community is super important.
>>
>> Hadrian
>>
>> [1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/
>>
>>
>> On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>>
>>> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of any
>>> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).  That
>>> is, of course, their prerogative.
>>>
>>> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
>>> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
>>> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
>>> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this further
>>> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
>>> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
>>> different announcement today.
>>>
>>>
>>> Justin
>>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu> wrote:
>>>
>>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ 5.x
>>>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
>>>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
>>>> broker-service-for-activemq/
>>>>
>>>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this announcement?
>>>>
>>>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
>>>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience
>>>> with
>>>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
>>>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate or
>>>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
>>>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
>>>> service.
>>>>
>>>> Tim
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
> 

Re: Amazon MQ

[Justin Bertram <jb...@apache.org>]

I'm not clear on what you're saying.  Are you indicating that Amazon and
Red Hat are partnering on this venture for ActiveMQ 5.x in AWS?


Justin

On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 8:21 AM, Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed
> ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while the
> community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ
> expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't know
> about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not aware of
> that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions (regarding
> ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.
>
> Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of
> service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and
> increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka, RabbitMQ).
> People make serious investments in such systems and the credibility of the
> community is super important.
>
> Hadrian
>
> [1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/
>
>
> On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
>
>> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of any
>> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).  That
>> is, of course, their prerogative.
>>
>> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
>> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
>> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
>> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this further
>> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
>> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
>> different announcement today.
>>
>>
>> Justin
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu> wrote:
>>
>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ 5.x
>>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
>>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
>>> broker-service-for-activemq/
>>>
>>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this announcement?
>>>
>>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
>>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience
>>> with
>>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
>>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate or
>>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
>>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
>>> service.
>>>
>>> Tim
>>>
>>>
>>

Re: Amazon MQ

[Hadrian Zbarcea <hz...@gmail.com>]

I made some inquiries and have it on good authority that the AWS Managed 
ActiveMQ effort was started part of the RH partnership [1]. So while the 
community was not contacted, AWS did talk to people with ActiveMQ 
expertise. Now I am surprised that the RH people on this list didn't 
know about it (and given the inquiries I really believe they were not 
aware of that). RH is a large company and it looks like opinions 
(regarding ActiveMQ) are as diverse as they are in this community.

Related to AWS, this was not a whim, an "it would be nice" sort of 
service. They have serious interest from users. There is massive (and 
increasing) interest in asynchronous messaging (see also Kafka, 
RabbitMQ). People make serious investments in such systems and the 
credibility of the community is super important.

Hadrian

[1] https://aws.amazon.com/partners/redhat/

On 11/28/2017 10:51 PM, Justin Bertram wrote:
> I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of any
> involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).  That
> is, of course, their prerogative.
> 
> Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
> might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
> road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
> interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this further
> highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
> road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
> different announcement today.
> 
> 
> Justin
> 
> On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu> wrote:
> 
>> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ 5.x
>> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
>> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
>> broker-service-for-activemq/
>>
>> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this announcement?
>>
>> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
>> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience with
>> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
>> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate or
>> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
>> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
>> service.
>>
>> Tim
>>
> 

Re: Amazon MQ

[Justin Bertram <jb...@redhat.com>]

I saw that announcement as well and was a bit puzzled by the lack of any
involvement by Amazon in the community (at least that I could tell).  That
is, of course, their prerogative.

Since it's so unclear at this point how this potentially new user-base
might impact the community I don't see how it can factor in to the
road-map.  It may complicate things; it may not.  There may be renewed
interest in 5.x; there may not.  Who's to say?  In my opinion this further
highlights the need to clearly define a project road-map.  If such a
road-map had been defined 6-12 months ago maybe Amazon is making a
different announcement today.


Justin

On Tue, Nov 28, 2017 at 9:32 PM, Tim Bain <tb...@alumni.duke.edu> wrote:

> Amazon announced today a service called Amazon MQ that allows ActiveMQ 5.x
> to be run as a managed service in AWS:
> https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/aws/amazon-mq-managed-message-
> broker-service-for-activemq/
>
> Was anyone on this list aware of that effort prior to this announcement?
>
> We should all be aware that there may be additional users coming to
> ActiveMQ as a result of this service, who may have minimal experience with
> the configuration details of the broker and limited access to detailed
> troubleshooting information such as logs and JMX. This may complicate or
> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
> service.
>
> Tim
>

Re: Amazon MQ

[Clebert Suconic <cl...@gmail.com>]

> This may complicate or
> delay the eventual sunsetting of 5.x in favor of Artemis; there may be
> interest in keeping 5.x alive for longer as a result of its use in this
> service.

no one ever had the intention to discontinue 5.x... (or sunsetting
like you said).

Look for instance at tomcat.. they have 3 active versions... that goes
along with other apache projects doing the same.

If you make ActiveMQ Artemis a better project, other users will
benefit from it.. and users would still be welcome to use ActiveMQ
5.x.